XPost: talk.politics.misc, soc.culture.usa, talk.politics.guns
XPost: alt.religion.christian.roman-catholic

by JACK MIRKINSON

Since Israel�s campaign of death began, President Joe Biden has
perfected the art of cognitive dissonance, planting story after story
about his ever-increasing �frustration� with Israeli Prime Minister
Benjamin Netanyahu while continuing to send Israel the bombs it is
using against the people of Gaza. But the past seven days have taken
this absurdity to new levels. That�s because this was the week when we
saw both Biden�s most dramatic attempts to appear to be radically
shifting his approach and the most dramatic evidence of just how
deeply the United States is helping to perpetuate this war.

First, the attempts to telegraph that change is happening: Biden used
his State of the Union address to announce that the United States
would be building a pier off the Gaza coast so that it could deliver
aid to the millions of people who are either being massacred or left
to starve to death due to Israel�s unceasing bombardment and total
siege of the region. He was then filmed telling Senator Michael Bennet
that he was going to have a �come to Jesus meeting� with Netanyahu,
though he immediately undercut the seemingly accidental nature of the
broadcast by adding, �I�m on a hot mic here. Good.�

On Saturday, Biden went further, telling MSNBC�s Jonathan Capehart
that Netanyahu was �hurting Israel more than helping Israel� and that
an Israeli invasion of the southern Gaza city of Rafah, where 1.4
million Palestinians are trapped, would be a �red line.� All of this
was enough to prompt some of the White House�s more sycophantic
chroniclers, such as Axios reporter Barak Ravid, to proclaim that
Biden was �breaking� with Netanyahu.

And it�s true that these moves could seem like an encouraging signal
about his willingness to put some kind of pressure on Israel.

But wait, what�s that sound? That would be the other shoe dropping.
The most important news about the American handling of the war in the
past week could be found not in any of the aforementioned, highly
choreographed moments, but in a pair of reports on Tuesday in The
Washington Post and The Wall Street Journal, in which the outlets
revealed that not only has the United States been transferring vast
amounts of weapons to Israel, but that it has been doing so in a way deliberately designed to evade public scrutiny.

According to the reports, the US has approved more than 100 arms sales
to Israel since October 7, constituting what the Journal called �tens
of thousands� of weapons. But the Biden administration has revealed
only two of those deals to Congress. The rest have been masked by one
of the oldest shady financial tricks in the books, as the Post
explained:

[Th]e weapons transfers were processed without any public debate
because each fell under a specific dollar amount that requires the
executive branch to individually notify Congress, according to U.S.
officials and lawmakers who, like others, spoke on the condition of
anonymity to discuss a sensitive military matter.

[�] �That�s an extraordinary number of sales over the course of a
pretty short amount of time, which really strongly suggests that the
Israeli campaign would not be sustainable without this level of U.S.
support,� said Jeremy Konyndyk, a former senior Biden administration
official and current president of Refugees International.

So let�s recap. Biden is publicly lamenting the scale of death in
Gaza, going after Netanyahu, and pledging to build a maritime aid
corridor to get around Israel�s siege. But Netanyahu�s ability to
carry out that level of carnage, and impose such an inhumane siege, is dependent on the continued flow of weapons to Israel from the
government headed by� Biden. Or, to put it more succinctly: The US
government is now making elaborate plans to ameliorate a humanitarian catastrophe that would not exist without its own bombs.

When you add the fact that Biden�s government is not only sending
Israel weapons but is so eager to do so that it is purposefully
skirting congressional oversight and public accountability, it all
gets even more ludicrous. We�re no longer in a simple �this makes no
sense� situation. Instead, we�ve arrived at a Twilight Zone �if I try
to rationalize this, it will tear a hole in the fabric of space and
time� situation. It�s as if you kept secretly handing an arsonist
gasoline and matches, then showed up five minutes later with the
firefighters, read out a statement about how unconscionable arson is,
and announced that you were taking major steps to help the survivors.

Things get more maddening when you look at the nature of the American
aid effort. That pier Biden announced? The Pentagon says it could take
up to two months to build. There is a famine happening right now in
Gaza, not two months from now. And the US won�t even give assurances
that Israel will be prevented from firing on Palestinians trying to
retrieve American aid. There are other agencies on the ground, but the
US is in the way there too. It has cut off funding to UNWRA, the main
relief organization in Gaza, on dubious evidence that the UN now
claims was based in part on evidence obtained through torture.

These loopholes and contradictions have become so glaring that people
you might normally expect to overlook them are unable to. A recent
report in The New York Times, for instance, delicately noted that �the
United States finds itself on both sides of the war in a way, arming
the Israelis while trying to care for those hurt as a result.� And
Democratic Senator Chris Van Hollen told The New Yorker, �I really
haven�t heard a good response to the question of why we should not
apply existing U.S. law�to insure that U.S. military assistance is
used in accordance with our values.�

Nobody has heard a good response�and that�s because there isn�t one!
It�s shameless hypocrisy from Biden all the way down.

--- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
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XPost: alt.religion.christian.roman-catholic, talk.politics.misc, soc.culture.usa
XPost: talk.politics.guns

Given the biblical text: "NOW WHEN JESUS WAS BORN IN BETHLEHEM OF *JUDAEA*-G2449 IN THE DAYS OF HEROD THE KING, BEHOLD, THERE CAME WISE MEN
FROM THE EAST TO JERUSALEM, SAYING, WHERE IS HE THAT IS BORN KING OF THE
JEWS?

FOR WE HAVE SEEN HIS STAR IN THE EAST, AND ARE COME TO WORSHIP HIM:

WHEN HEROD THE KING HAD HEARD THESE THINGS, HE WAS TROUBLED, AND ALL
JERUSALEM WITH HIM." [Matthew 2:1-3]

#496 as [#10, #70, #400, #4, #1, #10, #1] = Ioudaía (G2449): {UMBRA: #496 % #41 = #4} 0) *JUDAEA* = 'he shall be praised'; 1) in a narrower sense, to
the southern portion of Palestine lying on this side of the Jordan and the
Dead Sea, to distinguish it from Samaria, Galilee, Peraea, and Idumaea; 2)
*IN* *A* *BROADER* *SENSE*, *REFERRING* *TO* *ALL* *PALESTINE*;

From what year as anchor in history is your objection made?

Does such standing constitute historical revisionism?

The absence of answers implies that it's a blasphemy for ISLAM to make any prerogative claim to the CELESTIAL HIERARCHY ANCHORED FROM 1 AD AS 19 YEAR LUNAR METONIC CYCLE / TROPICAL YEAR -- SUCH AS THE POPE WELL KNOWS IS A SECTARIAN / SECULAR CRIME AGAINST HUMANITY GIVEN THE LUNAR GRAND INCEPTION
OF 21 DECEMBER 104 BCE / 2025.

Because the biblical text suggests that in 4 BCE as before any colonial
mindset of ISLAM, the notion of JUDAEA included ALL PALESTINE even when it
was a vassal sovereignty under ROMAN RULE and known to the ARABIC worldview
as such) the PALESTINIAN PROTESTORS are not only anti-Christ as KING OF THE JEWS but antagonistic towards democracy.

<http://www.grapple369.com/x-files/Lawyer%20Notes%2020240320%20%28public%29.pdf>

NefeshBarYochai <void@invalid.noy> wrote:

by JACK MIRKINSON

Since Israel’s campaign of death began, President Joe Biden has
perfected the art of cognitive dissonance, planting story after story
about his ever-increasing “frustration” with Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu while continuing to send Israel the bombs it is
using against the people of Gaza. But the past seven days have taken
this absurdity to new levels. That’s because this was the week when we
saw both Biden’s most dramatic attempts to appear to be radically
shifting his approach and the most dramatic evidence of just how
deeply the United States is helping to perpetuate this war.

First, the attempts to telegraph that change is happening: Biden used
his State of the Union address to announce that the United States
would be building a pier off the Gaza coast so that it could deliver
aid to the millions of people who are either being massacred or left
to starve to death due to Israel’s unceasing bombardment and total
siege of the region. He was then filmed telling Senator Michael Bennet
that he was going to have a “come to Jesus meeting” with Netanyahu,
though he immediately undercut the seemingly accidental nature of the broadcast by adding, “I’m on a hot mic here. Good.”

On Saturday, Biden went further, telling MSNBC’s Jonathan Capehart
that Netanyahu was “hurting Israel more than helping Israel” and that
an Israeli invasion of the southern Gaza city of Rafah, where 1.4
million Palestinians are trapped, would be a “red line.” All of this
was enough to prompt some of the White House’s more sycophantic
chroniclers, such as Axios reporter Barak Ravid, to proclaim that
Biden was “breaking” with Netanyahu.

And it’s true that these moves could seem like an encouraging signal
about his willingness to put some kind of pressure on Israel.

But wait, what’s that sound? That would be the other shoe dropping.
The most important news about the American handling of the war in the
past week could be found not in any of the aforementioned, highly choreographed moments, but in a pair of reports on Tuesday in The
Washington Post and The Wall Street Journal, in which the outlets
revealed that not only has the United States been transferring vast
amounts of weapons to Israel, but that it has been doing so in a way deliberately designed to evade public scrutiny.

According to the reports, the US has approved more than 100 arms sales
to Israel since October 7, constituting what the Journal called “tens
of thousands” of weapons. But the Biden administration has revealed
only two of those deals to Congress. The rest have been masked by one
of the oldest shady financial tricks in the books, as the Post
explained:

[Th]e weapons transfers were processed without any public debate
because each fell under a specific dollar amount that requires the
executive branch to individually notify Congress, according to U.S.
officials and lawmakers who, like others, spoke on the condition of
anonymity to discuss a sensitive military matter.

[…] “That’s an extraordinary number of sales over the course of a
pretty short amount of time, which really strongly suggests that the
Israeli campaign would not be sustainable without this level of U.S. support,” said Jeremy Konyndyk, a former senior Biden administration official and current president of Refugees International.

So let’s recap. Biden is publicly lamenting the scale of death in
Gaza, going after Netanyahu, and pledging to build a maritime aid
corridor to get around Israel’s siege. But Netanyahu’s ability to
carry out that level of carnage, and impose such an inhumane siege, is dependent on the continued flow of weapons to Israel from the
government headed by… Biden. Or, to put it more succinctly: The US government is now making elaborate plans to ameliorate a humanitarian catastrophe that would not exist without its own bombs.

When you add the fact that Biden’s government is not only sending
Israel weapons but is so eager to do so that it is purposefully
skirting congressional oversight and public accountability, it all
gets even more ludicrous. We’re no longer in a simple “this makes no sense” situation. Instead, we’ve arrived at a Twilight Zone “if I try
to rationalize this, it will tear a hole in the fabric of space and
time” situation. It’s as if you kept secretly handing an arsonist
gasoline and matches, then showed up five minutes later with the firefighters, read out a statement about how unconscionable arson is,
and announced that you were taking major steps to help the survivors.

Things get more maddening when you look at the nature of the American
aid effort. That pier Biden announced? The Pentagon says it could take
up to two months to build. There is a famine happening right now in
Gaza, not two months from now. And the US won’t even give assurances
that Israel will be prevented from firing on Palestinians trying to
retrieve American aid. There are other agencies on the ground, but the
US is in the way there too. It has cut off funding to UNWRA, the main
relief organization in Gaza, on dubious evidence that the UN now
claims was based in part on evidence obtained through torture.

These loopholes and contradictions have become so glaring that people
you might normally expect to overlook them are unable to. A recent
report in The New York Times, for instance, delicately noted that “the United States finds itself on both sides of the war in a way, arming
the Israelis while trying to care for those hurt as a result.” And Democratic Senator Chris Van Hollen told The New Yorker, “I really
haven’t heard a good response to the question of why we should not
apply existing U.S. law…to insure that U.S. military assistance is
used in accordance with our values.”

Nobody has heard a good response—and that’s because there isn’t one!
It’s shameless hypocrisy from Biden all the way down.

X-FILES (@GuardianAus) @ 1501 HRS ON 28 MARCH 2024: "RAAF CHAPLAINCY
CULTURE A ‘WOLF PACK’, SAYS WHISTLEBLOWER WHO FOUGHT FOR YEARS TO CLEAR HIS NAME:

<https://x.com/guardianaus/status/1773198722715004955>

A US marine who became a Catholic lay chaplain, Johns joined the Royal Australian Air Force with his wife, Jean, in 2008 from Canada, where they
had also worked in military pastoral care. There they had advocated for Canadian soldiers deployed in Afghanistan who believed they were being
ordered to ignore the alleged abuse of young boys by local men.

In 2010 he raised concerns within the RAAF about the alleged actions of a fellow chaplain deployed in the Middle East. The allegations were examined
but he alleges key witnesses were not interviewed. He was never told the result.

Johns then approached his federal MP, pressing for an inquiry into the
handling of his report.

The then defence minister, Stephen Smith, ordered an inquiry in 2011.

It found the handling “somewhat clumsy” but said the chaplaincy branch had acted “in good faith”, afforded Johns procedural fairness and upheld Defence policy. It made no criticism of Johns for his original report.

“On the contrary, it is clear that, as a result of you bringing these allegations to light, more can be done to facilitate the complaints process where a genuine concern about the behaviour of a chaplain is held,” the report said.

Despite this, damaging rumours about him began to spread through the chaplaincy.
In 2017 he wrote to the then defence force chief, Air Marshal Mark Binskin.

“Your account of the lack of support provided to you in the wake of
reporting the unacceptable behaviour is disappointing,” Binskin wrote in reply, praising Johns’ integrity and calling him a highly regarded role model.

Johns was assured his complaint about how he had been treated was being investigated and he would be debriefed. Neither occurred. In 2018 he
complained about what he alleged was “intimidatory” correspondence from a senior chaplain. An examination found against him.

Johns then wrote to Binskin’s successor, Gen Angus Campbell, who ordered
the inspector general of the Australian defence force to investigate his treatment. Johns said its report endorsed his actions in raising his
original concerns. But he was prevented from revealing its contents.

“In October of 2020, I finally get all the answers to all my questions,” Johns recounted. “I can’t say what they are, but … I was gobsmacked.”

Johns said the years of stress had tested, though not broken, his faith in
God. But it had destroyed his faith in military chaplains.

“I don’t trust chaplains,” he said. “I particularly don’t trust chaplains
who are in leadership – who wear rank. Categorically, I don’t.”

The former air force chaplain [had] fought for a decade to clear his name
after being obstructed and smeared for trying to report serious allegations about a colleague’s behaviour has spoken out about his treatment for the first time, describing the chaplaincy culture as a “wolf pack”.

Ahead of Thursday’s final hearing of the royal commission into defence and veteran suicide, Joe Johns told Guardian Australia about his years-long experience after he tried in 2010 to report allegations about another male chaplain’s behaviour – particularly with women – on operations in the Middle East.

Johns, who gave evidence to the royal commission in a private session, said after he had tried to report alleged sexual harassment and irregular
behaviour, the chaplaincy closed ranks and turned on him, trashing his reputation and seriously damaging his health. At least one other chaplain outlined a similar experience to the royal commission.

“What makes this the most critical and most concerning is these are people who are supposed to be the kindest, the best, the most ethical, the most caring, the go-to people when you are in trouble,” Johns said this week. “And they’re not. They’re a wolf pack.” <https://www.theguardian.com/australia-news/2024/mar/28/raaf-chaplain-culture-joe-johns-royal-commission-defence-veteran-suicide>

TWEET:

WOLF PACK?

There is an implicit BOER WAR MEMORIAL ANTAGONISM by ROMAN CATHOLICISM
directed towards the COMMONWEALTH (CAESAROPAPISM), given that EASTER SUNDAY occurs between the TETRA / RANGE Sunday dates #21 - 22 MARCH through #28 - ANZAC DAY: 25 APRIL (whereas PENTECOST SUNDAY as 49 days thereafter occurs within Sunday ranges #31 - 10 MAY through #39 - 13 JUNE) within the
Gregorian calendar and may be the 81st through 115th day of common years or 82nd through 116th day of leap years.

<http://www.grapple369.com/Groundwork/Liturgical%20Calendar%202004-2040.pdf>

PENTECOST SUNDAY AS JUPITER (#38 - SATOR / #33 - TENET (#33 ... #1933 -
metonic cycle) / #34 - ROTAS) PRINCIPLE

[#38 - 8 JUNE 1930, #35 - 24 MAY 1931, #33 - 15 MAY 1932, #37 - 4 JUNE
1933, #34 - 20 MAY 1934]

[#38 - 8 JUNE 2014, #35 - 24 MAY 2015, #33 - 15 MAY 2016, #37 - 4 JUNE 2017 [🎯], #34 - 20 MAY 2018]

[#38 - 8 JUNE 2025, #35 - 24 MAY 2026, #33 - 16 MAY 2027, #37 - 4 JUNE
2028, #34 - 20 MAY 2029]

Note that this #38 - SATOR (#249) / #33 - TENET (#205) / #34 - ROTAS (#161) PAGAN PRIESTLY CYCLE (ie. the JEWISH / CHRISTIAN cycle is 24x7x13 = 6 x
#364 days x 49 = 6J as 293 x 365.2423 tropical year) TO WHICH THE CATHOLIC CHURCH HAS EMBODIMENT is then contextually relevant to the Reichskonkordat.

Which ignores the historical precedents (ie. ROMAN CASE LAW BY DECREE OF
CAESAR CLAUDIUS DATED 10 NOVEMBER 41 AD: “… not be disrespectful of the customs used in the ritual of their GOD, but let [the Jews] USE THEIR
CUSTOMS AS IN THE TIME OF THE GOD AUGUSTUS [#38, #71, #14], even as I
myself, after hearing both sides, have confirmed.”)

In Spring 44 AD, during the Feast of Unleavened Bread, King Herod Agrippa I
had Peter arrested and imprisoned during such time such APOSTLE was still observing JEWISH CUSTOMS of PASSOVER (1 to 5 APRIL #33 AD): "AND BECAUSE HE
SAW IT PLEASED THE JEWS, HE PROCEEDED FURTHER TO TAKE PETER ALSO. (THEN
WERE THE DAYS OF UNLEAVENED BREAD.)" [Acts 12:3 (KJV)]

THE ABOMINATION OF DESOLATION WHICH YOU CALL EASTER IS A CHRISTIAN FICTION
AND IS MORE PROPERLY A PAGAN PRIESTLY #249 - SATOR (#38) / #205 - TENET
(#33) / #161 - ROTAS (#34) CYCLE RITUAL WHICH UNDENIABLY IS BABYLONIAN
WHOREDOM [Revelation 17:5]

LUOSHU ORDER [5x5 CENTRE] #369 MATRIX REFERENCE OBJECT

49 72 9 54 65
12 32 77 14 34
57 23 41 59 25
48 68 5 50 70
17 28 73 10 33

32 77 14
23 41 59
68 5 50

5
37
96
110

REDUCTIO AD HITLERUM AS IDEA #110 - 16 JANUARY 1942: "[Dietrich] Eckart introduced me to the Büchners: "This is my young friend, Herr *WOLF*."
Nobody could think of forming any connection between this person and that
crazy monster Adolf Hitler. Eckart was known at the boarding-house under
the name of Dr. Hoffmann. At midday he took me to the Türken inn, promising
me a genuine goulash. He was addressed there as "Herr Doktor", but I saw at once that everybody knew his real identity." [pages 212]

Eckart was a participant in the failed Beer Hall Putsch in 1923 and died
from a heart attack on 26 December of that year, shortly after his release
from Landsberg Prison. He was elevated to the status of a major thinker
upon the establishment of Nazi Germany in 1933. He was acknowledged by
Hitler to be the spiritual co-founder of Nazism and "a guiding light of the early National Socialist movement."

#33 - TENET OF BELIEF / LUO SHU REFERENCE OBJECT: #205 = [#57, #23, #41,
#59, #25] / [#9, #77, #41, #5, #75] AS ITS AESTHETIC PRINCIPLE OF
PERSISTENCE: In the circumstance of PYTHAGOREAN #135 / #405 / #540 / #1080
- HETEROS BIPARTITE NUMBER paradigm equivalence (ie. NAZISM is a faith
without RITUAL and CATHOLICISM / AUSTRALIAN ANGLICANS as a DOGMA of inconsequential RITUAL) given the year 1939 of WWII commencement was a
lunar metonic 19 year cycle anchored to 1 AD that similarly purveys a
supernal construct of conformity to COGITO: #40 - LAW / MODEL (FA) - 𝌭法 = #491 / [#7, #78, #35, #80, #10] as RANGE: noon 15 to 19 JUNE which it
alluded to as a transcendent IDEAL.

<http://www.grapple369.com/x-files/Lawyer%20Notes%2020240320%20%28public%29.pdf>

2ND TWEET:

NO GIRLS A DOUBLE ENTENDRE IS NOT AN OPPORTUNITY FOR ADULT SERVICES AS
EASTER PROMOTION AND YOU WILL BE BLOCKED (like 100's prior) FOR BEING SACRILEGIOUS

Whilst the news of the week has been AFL recreational drug testing rorts
and a failure to convey any truth about their alleged groin injuries.

Such pales into insignificance concerning the 90 years of sycophantic lip
👄 service which the Anglican Church has given to the British monarchy.

Speaking of an implied affable avoidance of injury: "In his first public message since his cancer diagnosis, King Charles III reaffirmed his
Coronation pledge “not to be served but to serve”, and called on people to “prioritise care and friendship”. [courtesy: Sky News]

Compare sacrilege, Latin sacrilegus. From Latin sacer + legō (“steal something sacred”).

sacer (feminine sacra, neuter sacrum, superlative sacerrimus); first/second-declension adjective (nominative masculine singular in -er)

sacred, holy, dedicated (to a divinity), consecrated, hallowed (translating Greek ἱερός)
devoted (to a divinity for sacrifice), fated (to destruction), forfeited, accursed
divine, celestial
(only poetic and in post-Augustan prose) execrable, detestable, horrible, infamous; criminal, impious, wicked, abominable, cursed

From Proto-Italic *legō, from Proto-Indo-European *léǵ-e-ti, from Proto-Indo-European *leǵ-. Cognates include Ancient Greek λέγω (légō, “I
speak, I choose, I mean”) and Albanian mbledh. May be related to lēx.

to choose, select
to appoint distribuō, attribuō, discrībō, addīcō
to collect, gather, bring together
to take out, pick out, extract, remove
to take to one's self unjustly, carry off, steal, purloin, plunder,
abstract

#385 as [#10, #5, #100, #70, #200] = hierós (G2413): {UMBRA: #385 % #41 =
#16} 1) sacred, consecrated to the deity, pertaining to God; 1a) sacred Scriptures, because inspired by God, treating of divine things and
therefore to be devoutly revered;

#62 - 𝍃疑 = #513
COGITO: [#35, #48, #25, #33, #33] as #62 - DOUBT (YI)
RANGE: noon 22 to 26 SEPTEMBER

<http://www.grapple369.com/Savvy/?run:Mystery&tetra:62>

[#35 {@1: Sup: 35 - GATHERING: LIEN (#35); Ego: 35 - GATHERING: LIEN (#35)}
#48 {@2: Sup: 2 - FULL CIRCLE: CHOU (#37); Ego: 48 - RITUAL: LI (#83)}
#25 {@3: Sup: 27 - DUTIES: SHIH (#64); Ego: 25 - CONTENTION: CHENG (#108 -
MALE DEME IS UNNAMED {%25})}
#33 {@4: Sup: 60 - ACCUMULATION: CHI (#124); Ego: 33 - CLOSENESS: MI (#141
- MALE DEME IS UNNAMED {%31})}
#33] {@5: Sup: 12 - YOUTHFULNESS: T'UNG (#136 - MALE DEME IS UNNAMED
{%36}); Ego: 33 - CLOSENESS: MI (#174)}
TELOS TOTAL: #174

DEME CHECKSUM TOTAL: #385

#348 - NOUMENON RESONANCE FOR GOOD FRIDAY 29 MARCH 2024 as [#30, #5,
#3, #5, #300, #5] = légō (G3004): {UMBRA: #838 % #41 = #18} 1) to say, to speak; 1a) affirm over, maintain; 1b) to teach; 1c) to exhort, advise, to command, direct; 1d) to point out with words, intend, mean, mean to say;
1e) to call by name, to call, name; 1f) to speak out, speak of, mention;

#38 - 𝌫盛 = #489
COGITO: [#14, #18, #38, #68, #26] as #38 - FULLNESS (SHENG)
RANGE: noon 06 to 10 JUNE

<http://www.grapple369.com/Savvy/?run:Mystery&tetra:38>

[#14 {@1: Sup: 14 - PENETRATION: JUI (#14); Ego: 14 - PENETRATION: JUI
(#14)}
#18 {@2: Sup: 32 - LEGION: CHUANG (#46); Ego: 18 - WAITING: HSI (#32)}
#38 {@3: Sup: 70 - SEVERANCE: KE (#116); Ego: 38 - FULLNESS: SHENG (#70)}
#68 {@4: Sup: 57 - GUARDEDNESS: SHOU (#173 - I AM NOT GIVEN TO UNNATURAL
LUST {%27}); Ego: 68 - DIMMING: MENG (#138)}
#26] {@5: Sup: 2 - FULL CIRCLE: CHOU (#175 - I AM NOT A TRANSGRESSOR
{%22}); Ego: 26 - ENDEAVOUR: WU (#164)}

TELOS TOTAL: #164

ONTIC CHECKSUM TOTAL: #348



--

Check out our SAVVY module prototype that facilitates a movable / resizable DIALOG and complex dropdown MENU interface deploying the third party d3 library.

<http://www.grapple369.com/Savvy/?heuristic>

<http://www.grapple369.com/Savvy/Savvy.zip> (Download resources)

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"NefeshBarYochai" <void@invalid.noy> wrote in message news:gg3c0jd388dj34fi1ibgmq1dc02nkccibd@4ax.com...

by JACK MIRKINSON

Since Israel's campaign of death began

We need to stop right here and correct that false assertion...

Since Hamas' deadly terrorist attacks on Israel began....

--- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
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XPost: talk.politics.misc, soc.culture.usa, talk.politics.guns
XPost: alt.religion.christian.roman-catholic

On Fri, 29 Mar 2024 07:30:07 -0400, "Scout" <me4guns@verizon.removeme.this2.nospam.net> wrote:

"NefeshBarYochai" <void@invalid.noy> wrote in message >news:gg3c0jd388dj34fi1ibgmq1dc02nkccibd@4ax.com...

by JACK MIRKINSON

Since Israel's campaign of death began

We need to stop right here and correct that false assertion...

Since Hamas' deadly terrorist attacks on Israel began...

�and Israel's gross over reaction to same, 30 thousand plus so far vs.
12 hundred. That's 25 Gazans (note, mostly not Hamas agents) killed
for every Israeli killed.
--

Qualified immunity = virtual impunity.

Tim Merrigan

--
This email has been checked for viruses by AVG antivirus software.
www.avg.com

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XPost: talk.politics.misc, soc.culture.usa, talk.politics.guns
XPost: alt.religion.christian.roman-catholic

On 2024-03-29, NefeshBarYochai <void@invalid.noy> opined as follows:

by JACK MIRKINSON

Since Israel’s campaign of death began, President Joe Biden has
perfected the art of cognitive dissonance, planting story after story
about his ever-increasing “frustration” with Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu while continuing to send Israel the bombs it is
using against the people of Gaza. But the past seven days have taken
this absurdity to new levels. That’s because this was the week when we
saw both Biden’s most dramatic attempts to appear to be radically
shifting his approach and the most dramatic evidence of just how
deeply the United States is helping to perpetuate this war.

First, the attempts to telegraph that change is happening: Biden used
his State of the Union address to announce that the United States
would be building a pier off the Gaza coast so that it could deliver
aid to the millions of people who are either being massacred or left
to starve to death due to Israel’s unceasing bombardment and total
siege of the region. He was then filmed telling Senator Michael Bennet
that he was going to have a “come to Jesus meeting” with Netanyahu,
though he immediately undercut the seemingly accidental nature of the broadcast by adding, “I’m on a hot mic here. Good.”

On Saturday, Biden went further, telling MSNBC’s Jonathan Capehart
that Netanyahu was “hurting Israel more than helping Israel” and that
an Israeli invasion of the southern Gaza city of Rafah, where 1.4
million Palestinians are trapped, would be a “red line.” All of this
was enough to prompt some of the White House’s more sycophantic
chroniclers, such as Axios reporter Barak Ravid, to proclaim that
Biden was “breaking” with Netanyahu.

And it’s true that these moves could seem like an encouraging signal
about his willingness to put some kind of pressure on Israel.

But wait, what’s that sound? That would be the other shoe dropping.
The most important news about the American handling of the war in the
past week could be found not in any of the aforementioned, highly choreographed moments, but in a pair of reports on Tuesday in The
Washington Post and The Wall Street Journal, in which the outlets
revealed that not only has the United States been transferring vast
amounts of weapons to Israel, but that it has been doing so in a way deliberately designed to evade public scrutiny.

According to the reports, the US has approved more than 100 arms sales
to Israel since October 7, constituting what the Journal called “tens
of thousands” of weapons. But the Biden administration has revealed
only two of those deals to Congress. The rest have been masked by one
of the oldest shady financial tricks in the books, as the Post
explained:

[Th]e weapons transfers were processed without any public debate
because each fell under a specific dollar amount that requires the
executive branch to individually notify Congress, according to U.S.
officials and lawmakers who, like others, spoke on the condition of
anonymity to discuss a sensitive military matter.

[…] “That’s an extraordinary number of sales over the course of a
pretty short amount of time, which really strongly suggests that the
Israeli campaign would not be sustainable without this level of U.S. support,” said Jeremy Konyndyk, a former senior Biden administration official and current president of Refugees International.

So let’s recap. Biden is publicly lamenting the scale of death in
Gaza, going after Netanyahu, and pledging to build a maritime aid
corridor to get around Israel’s siege. But Netanyahu’s ability to
carry out that level of carnage, and impose such an inhumane siege, is dependent on the continued flow of weapons to Israel from the
government headed by… Biden. Or, to put it more succinctly: The US government is now making elaborate plans to ameliorate a humanitarian catastrophe that would not exist without its own bombs.

When you add the fact that Biden’s government is not only sending
Israel weapons but is so eager to do so that it is purposefully
skirting congressional oversight and public accountability, it all
gets even more ludicrous. We’re no longer in a simple “this makes no sense” situation. Instead, we’ve arrived at a Twilight Zone “if I try
to rationalize this, it will tear a hole in the fabric of space and
time” situation. It’s as if you kept secretly handing an arsonist
gasoline and matches, then showed up five minutes later with the firefighters, read out a statement about how unconscionable arson is,
and announced that you were taking major steps to help the survivors.

Things get more maddening when you look at the nature of the American
aid effort. That pier Biden announced? The Pentagon says it could take
up to two months to build. There is a famine happening right now in
Gaza, not two months from now. And the US won’t even give assurances
that Israel will be prevented from firing on Palestinians trying to
retrieve American aid. There are other agencies on the ground, but the
US is in the way there too. It has cut off funding to UNWRA, the main
relief organization in Gaza, on dubious evidence that the UN now
claims was based in part on evidence obtained through torture.

These loopholes and contradictions have become so glaring that people
you might normally expect to overlook them are unable to. A recent
report in The New York Times, for instance, delicately noted that “the United States finds itself on both sides of the war in a way, arming
the Israelis while trying to care for those hurt as a result.” And Democratic Senator Chris Van Hollen told The New Yorker, “I really
haven’t heard a good response to the question of why we should not
apply existing U.S. law…to insure that U.S. military assistance is
used in accordance with our values.”

Nobody has heard a good response—and that’s because there isn’t one!
It’s shameless hypocrisy from Biden all the way down.

Yes, we must vote for Trump in November and send Biden a clear lesson. Thank you for posting this important article.

--
'Many have sought in vain to tell joyously of the Most Joyous. Now at last It declares
Itself to me, now in this misery.' - Holderlin
____
/. \
___________< |___________
\___________ ___________/
\___________ ___________/
\___________ ___________/
| |
^^^ ^^^
_________
| R W |
| (*) |
|____U____|

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On Mar 29, 2024, Tim Merrigan wrote
(in article<a15e0jt7fn19h6ks9miod2n945r6jrcdb7@4ax.com>):

On Fri, 29 Mar 2024 07:30:07 -0400, "Scout" <me4guns@verizon.removeme.this2.nospam.net> wrote:

"NefeshBarYochai" <void@invalid.noy> wrote in message news:gg3c0jd388dj34fi1ibgmq1dc02nkccibd@4ax.com...

by JACK MIRKINSON

Since Israel's campaign of death began

We need to stop right here and correct that false assertion...

Since Hamas' deadly terrorist attacks on Israel began...

…and Israel's gross over reaction to same, 30 thousand plus so far vs.
12 hundred. That's 25 Gazans (note, mostly not Hamas agents) killed
for every Israeli killed.

Hamas can stop the killing at any time. Just release the hostages. Oh? They won’t do that? Bombs away, lads. Keep it up until either there are no more targets or no more hostages.

Hunt them down. Kill them all. Every last one... unless they release the hostages. Which they never will.

And if ‘innocent’ (yeah, right) ‘Palestinians’ (yeah, right) get
caught innthe process... how sad. Too bad. Hamas could have avoided this
whole thing. Easily. Fuck them.

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"Tim Merrigan" <tppm@ca.rr.com> wrote in message news:a15e0jt7fn19h6ks9miod2n945r6jrcdb7@4ax.com...

On Fri, 29 Mar 2024 07:30:07 -0400, "Scout" <me4guns@verizon.removeme.this2.nospam.net> wrote:

"NefeshBarYochai" <void@invalid.noy> wrote in message >>news:gg3c0jd388dj34fi1ibgmq1dc02nkccibd@4ax.com...

by JACK MIRKINSON

Since Israel's campaign of death began

We need to stop right here and correct that false assertion...

Since Hamas' deadly terrorist attacks on Israel began...

.and Israel's gross over reaction to same

How would you expect a government to react to such acts of terrorism?

I challenge you to show that their reaction to such terrorism was a "gross
over reaction".

--- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
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On Sat, 30 Mar 2024 09:56:55 -0400, "Scout" <me4guns@verizon.removeme.this2.nospam.net> wrote:

"Tim Merrigan" <tppm@ca.rr.com> wrote in message >news:a15e0jt7fn19h6ks9miod2n945r6jrcdb7@4ax.com...

On Fri, 29 Mar 2024 07:30:07 -0400, "Scout"
<me4guns@verizon.removeme.this2.nospam.net> wrote:

"NefeshBarYochai" <void@invalid.noy> wrote in message >>>news:gg3c0jd388dj34fi1ibgmq1dc02nkccibd@4ax.com...

by JACK MIRKINSON

Since Israel's campaign of death began

We need to stop right here and correct that false assertion...

Since Hamas' deadly terrorist attacks on Israel began...

.and Israel's gross over reaction to same

How would you expect a government to react to such acts of terrorism?

Not by carpet bombing the country they came from, nor by specifically
targeting hospitals and historic monuments.

Maybe have Masada do their thing and surgically strike the specific perpetrators.

I challenge you to show that their reaction to such terrorism was a "gross >over reaction".

--

Qualified immunity = virtual impunity.

Tim Merrigan

--
This email has been checked for viruses by AVG antivirus software.
www.avg.com

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"Tim Merrigan" <tppm@ca.rr.com> wrote in message news:i9vg0jh25hue8sia67clfba0qi1bqgh85j@4ax.com...

On Sat, 30 Mar 2024 09:56:55 -0400, "Scout" <me4guns@verizon.removeme.this2.nospam.net> wrote:

"Tim Merrigan" <tppm@ca.rr.com> wrote in message >>news:a15e0jt7fn19h6ks9miod2n945r6jrcdb7@4ax.com...

On Fri, 29 Mar 2024 07:30:07 -0400, "Scout"
<me4guns@verizon.removeme.this2.nospam.net> wrote:

"NefeshBarYochai" <void@invalid.noy> wrote in message >>>>news:gg3c0jd388dj34fi1ibgmq1dc02nkccibd@4ax.com...

by JACK MIRKINSON

Since Israel's campaign of death began

We need to stop right here and correct that false assertion...

Since Hamas' deadly terrorist attacks on Israel began...

.and Israel's gross over reaction to same

How would you expect a government to react to such acts of terrorism?

Not by carpet bombing the country they came from

Cite they did so

nor by specifically
targeting hospitals and historic monuments.

Well when they are sheltering in or near such... I mean even we go where the terrorists are.

Maybe have Masada do their thing and surgically strike the specific perpetrators.

Nice if they had time to do so, but in the middle of a mass conflict, you
have to decide whether they will cause more death and destruction if you
allow them to safely shelter there, or whether it's better to take the causalities and eliminate the issue.

I challenge you to show that their reaction to such terrorism was a "gross >>over reaction".

--

I take that to mean you can't.

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On Mon, 1 Apr 2024 08:01:38 -0400, "Scout" <me4guns@verizon.removeme.this2.nospam.net> wrote:

I take that to mean you can't.

Not to someone who's convinced the Israel can do no wrong.

To convince a moderate all I have to do is point to the unvarnished
news.

--

Qualified immunity = virtual impunity.

Tim Merrigan

--
This email has been checked for viruses by AVG antivirus software.
www.avg.com

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"Tim Merrigan" <tppm@ca.rr.com> wrote in message news:0kdl0jd3ai5f4l6ogka8pk7kvnflnltilu@4ax.com...

On Mon, 1 Apr 2024 08:01:38 -0400, "Scout" <me4guns@verizon.removeme.this2.nospam.net> wrote:

I take that to mean you can't.

Not to someone who's convinced the Israel can do no wrong.

On the contrary, Israel can and has done wrong. They are hardly perfect.
Indeed one of their regular mistakes seems to be thinking that they can live
in peace with others.

To convince a moderate all I have to do is point to the unvarnished
news.

Yes, if the truth were actually on your side, that would do.

But look at the current conflict. Who started it and how?

Hamas.. firing explosive rockets into Jewish target indiscriminately without cause or warning and the use of innocent civilians has "human shields".

That's called terrorism.

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On 2024-03-29, WolfFan <akwolffan@zoho.com> opined as follows:

On Mar 29, 2024, Tim Merrigan wrote
(in article<a15e0jt7fn19h6ks9miod2n945r6jrcdb7@4ax.com>):

On Fri, 29 Mar 2024 07:30:07 -0400, "Scout"
<me4guns@verizon.removeme.this2.nospam.net> wrote:

"NefeshBarYochai" <void@invalid.noy> wrote in message
news:gg3c0jd388dj34fi1ibgmq1dc02nkccibd@4ax.com...

by JACK MIRKINSON

Since Israel's campaign of death began

We need to stop right here and correct that false assertion...

Since Hamas' deadly terrorist attacks on Israel began...

…and Israel's gross over reaction to same, 30 thousand plus so far vs.
12 hundred. That's 25 Gazans (note, mostly not Hamas agents) killed
for every Israeli killed.

Hamas can stop the killing at any time. Just release the hostages. Oh? They won’t do that? Bombs away, lads. Keep it up until either there are no more targets or no more hostages.

Hunt them down. Kill them all. Every last one... unless they release the hostages. Which they never will.

Or simply surrender. That would do as well. Do it for the children.

And if ‘innocent’ (yeah, right) ‘Palestinians’ (yeah, right) get caught innthe process... how sad. Too bad. Hamas could have avoided this whole thing. Easily. Fuck them.

--
'Many have sought in vain to tell joyously of the Most Joyous. Now at last It declares
Itself to me, now in this misery.' - Holderlin
____
/. \
___________< |___________
\___________ ___________/
\___________ ___________/
\___________ ___________/
| |
^^^ ^^^
_________
| R W |
| (*) |
|____U____|

--- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
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On Mon, 1 Apr 2024 11:05:42 -0400, "Scout" <me4guns@verizon.removeme.this2.nospam.net> wrote:

"Tim Merrigan" <tppm@ca.rr.com> wrote in message >news:0kdl0jd3ai5f4l6ogka8pk7kvnflnltilu@4ax.com...

On Mon, 1 Apr 2024 08:01:38 -0400, "Scout"
<me4guns@verizon.removeme.this2.nospam.net> wrote:

I take that to mean you can't.

Not to someone who's convinced the Israel can do no wrong.

On the contrary, Israel can and has done wrong. They are hardly perfect. >Indeed one of their regular mistakes seems to be thinking that they can live >in peace with others.

To convince a moderate all I have to do is point to the unvarnished
news.

Yes, if the truth were actually on your side, that would do.

But look at the current conflict. Who started it and how?

Hamas.. firing explosive rockets into Jewish target indiscriminately without >cause or warning and the use of innocent civilians has "human shields".

That's called terrorism.

I'm not denying that Hamas are terrorists, nor that the October 7
attacks weren't terrible. I'm saying that what Israel has done since
October 7 puts them to shame.
--

Qualified immunity = virtual impunity.

Tim Merrigan

--
This email has been checked for viruses by AVG antivirus software.
www.avg.com

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"Tim Merrigan" <tppm@ca.rr.com> wrote in message news:53no0jt2u9fhtp1aemv35qro0p15r6orbg@4ax.com...

On Mon, 1 Apr 2024 11:05:42 -0400, "Scout" <me4guns@verizon.removeme.this2.nospam.net> wrote:

"Tim Merrigan" <tppm@ca.rr.com> wrote in message >>news:0kdl0jd3ai5f4l6ogka8pk7kvnflnltilu@4ax.com...

On Mon, 1 Apr 2024 08:01:38 -0400, "Scout"
<me4guns@verizon.removeme.this2.nospam.net> wrote:

I take that to mean you can't.

Not to someone who's convinced the Israel can do no wrong.

On the contrary, Israel can and has done wrong. They are hardly perfect. >>Indeed one of their regular mistakes seems to be thinking that they can >>live
in peace with others.

To convince a moderate all I have to do is point to the unvarnished
news.

Yes, if the truth were actually on your side, that would do.

But look at the current conflict. Who started it and how?

Hamas.. firing explosive rockets into Jewish target indiscriminately >>without
cause or warning and the use of innocent civilians has "human shields".

That's called terrorism.

I'm not denying that Hamas are terrorists, nor that the October 7
attacks weren't terrible. I'm saying that what Israel has done since
October 7 puts them to shame.

Are you saying they can't act to defend themselves from terrorists, that
such criminals should remain at large to continue their rein of terror?

So tell me, how would you go about dealing with these terrorists?

Because allowing them to continue.. isn't a valid option.

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Scout <me4guns@verizon.removeme.this2.nospam.net> wrote:

Are you saying they can't act to defend themselves from terrorists, that
such criminals should remain at large to continue their rein of terror?

So tell me, how would you go about dealing with these terrorists?

Because allowing them to continue.. isn't a valid option.

And killing civilians doesn't help matters.

You've got crazy idealogues on both sides promoting the war. Neither
Netanyahu nor Haniyeh care anything about peace, they just want to win (whatever that means to them). Then you have thousands of innocent people
on both sides being caught in the crossfire. It's not the fault of any
of those people and they don't deserve what is happening to them.

I don't have a solution to this... but I also think that continuing to
toss bombs isn't going to fix anything. And I think that if people keep
doing the same thing they have been doing for the past sixty years that
they will get the same result that they have been getting for the past
sixty years.
--scott
--
"C'est un Nagra. C'est suisse, et tres, tres precis."

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On Wed, 3 Apr 2024 11:29:00 -0400, Cryptoengineer
<petertrei@gmail.com> wrote:

* Deliberate demolition of cleared buildings.

They're mostly not "cleared" buildings, they're occupied buildings.
--

Qualified immunity = virtual impunity.

Tim Merrigan

--
This email has been checked for viruses by AVG antivirus software.
www.avg.com

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"Scott Dorsey" <kludge@panix.com> wrote in message news:uujk9k$6jk$1@panix2.panix.com...

Scout <me4guns@verizon.removeme.this2.nospam.net> wrote:

Are you saying they can't act to defend themselves from terrorists, that >>such criminals should remain at large to continue their rein of terror?

So tell me, how would you go about dealing with these terrorists?

Because allowing them to continue.. isn't a valid option.

And killing civilians doesn't help matters.

Sometimes necessary to address the terrorists.

Otherwise, their "human shield" works and they will continue to place
innocent lives in danger to avoid the consequences of their terrorism.

Sorry, but the main objective need to be the elimination of such terrorists, save what lives you can, but don't halt your primary mission the
apprehension or death of the terrorists.

It is Hamas that put those people's lives in danger by using them as part of their defense.

You've got crazy idealogues on both sides promoting the war.

Probably, but Hamas with it's terrorist actions are the ones that started
it, and have several times before.

Neither
Netanyahu nor Haniyeh care anything about peace, they just want to win (whatever that means to them).

Sure they do.. but experience has taught them that's not going to happen
until the terrorists who keep breaking the peace are dealt with.

Then you have thousands of innocent people
on both sides being caught in the crossfire.

Put there by Hamas.

It's not the fault of any
of those people and they don't deserve what is happening to them.

No they don't... but Hamas doesn't care, otherwise they wouldn't have and
are hiding behind them.

I don't have a solution to this...

I so. Kill or capture every Hamas terrorist you can.. then do the same to
any others on sight.

but I also think that continuing to
toss bombs isn't going to fix anything.

That sort of depends on who is tossing the bombs and why. If one is tossing them to start conflict we can blame them. The one looking to end the
conflict that was started by the other side, is probably in the right.

And I think that if people keep
doing the same thing they have been doing for the past sixty years that
they will get the same result that they have been getting for the past
sixty years.
--scott

Well, unless you can come up with a solution to the Hamas terrorists, I
don't see one either.

But you eliminate the Hamas terrorists, then that threat at least will cease
to exist.

We have had peace, time and time again Hamas started the conflict.

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On 3/29/2024 3:35 PM, Rockinghorse Winner scribbled:

On 2024-03-29, NefeshBarYochai<void@invalid.noy> opined as follows:

by JACK MIRKINSON

Since Israel’s campaign of death began, President Joe Biden has
perfected the art of cognitive dissonance, planting story after story
about his ever-increasing “frustration” with Israeli Prime Minister
Benjamin Netanyahu while continuing to send Israel the bombs it is
using against the people of Gaza. But the past seven days have taken
this absurdity to new levels. That’s because this was the week when we
saw both Biden’s most dramatic attempts to appear to be radically
shifting his approach and the most dramatic evidence of just how
deeply the United States is helping to perpetuate this war.

First, the attempts to telegraph that change is happening: Biden used
his State of the Union address to announce that the United States
would be building a pier off the Gaza coast so that it could deliver
aid to the millions of people who are either being massacred or left
to starve to death due to Israel’s unceasing bombardment and total
siege of the region. He was then filmed telling Senator Michael Bennet
that he was going to have a “come to Jesus meeting” with Netanyahu,
though he immediately undercut the seemingly accidental nature of the
broadcast by adding, “I’m on a hot mic here. Good.”

On Saturday, Biden went further, telling MSNBC’s Jonathan Capehart
that Netanyahu was “hurting Israel more than helping Israel” and that
an Israeli invasion of the southern Gaza city of Rafah, where 1.4
million Palestinians are trapped, would be a “red line.” All of this
was enough to prompt some of the White House’s more sycophantic
chroniclers, such as Axios reporter Barak Ravid, to proclaim that
Biden was “breaking” with Netanyahu.

And it’s true that these moves could seem like an encouraging signal
about his willingness to put some kind of pressure on Israel.

But wait, what’s that sound? That would be the other shoe dropping.
The most important news about the American handling of the war in the
past week could be found not in any of the aforementioned, highly
choreographed moments, but in a pair of reports on Tuesday in The
Washington Post and The Wall Street Journal, in which the outlets
revealed that not only has the United States been transferring vast
amounts of weapons to Israel, but that it has been doing so in a way
deliberately designed to evade public scrutiny.

According to the reports, the US has approved more than 100 arms sales
to Israel since October 7, constituting what the Journal called “tens
of thousands” of weapons. But the Biden administration has revealed
only two of those deals to Congress. The rest have been masked by one
of the oldest shady financial tricks in the books, as the Post
explained:

[Th]e weapons transfers were processed without any public debate
because each fell under a specific dollar amount that requires the
executive branch to individually notify Congress, according to U.S.
officials and lawmakers who, like others, spoke on the condition of
anonymity to discuss a sensitive military matter.

[…] “That’s an extraordinary number of sales over the course of a
pretty short amount of time, which really strongly suggests that the
Israeli campaign would not be sustainable without this level of U.S.
support,” said Jeremy Konyndyk, a former senior Biden administration
official and current president of Refugees International.

So let’s recap. Biden is publicly lamenting the scale of death in
Gaza, going after Netanyahu, and pledging to build a maritime aid
corridor to get around Israel’s siege. But Netanyahu’s ability to
carry out that level of carnage, and impose such an inhumane siege, is
dependent on the continued flow of weapons to Israel from the
government headed by… Biden. Or, to put it more succinctly: The US
government is now making elaborate plans to ameliorate a humanitarian
catastrophe that would not exist without its own bombs.

When you add the fact that Biden’s government is not only sending
Israel weapons but is so eager to do so that it is purposefully
skirting congressional oversight and public accountability, it all
gets even more ludicrous. We’re no longer in a simple “this makes no
sense” situation. Instead, we’ve arrived at a Twilight Zone “if I try
to rationalize this, it will tear a hole in the fabric of space and
time” situation. It’s as if you kept secretly handing an arsonist
gasoline and matches, then showed up five minutes later with the
firefighters, read out a statement about how unconscionable arson is,
and announced that you were taking major steps to help the survivors.

Things get more maddening when you look at the nature of the American
aid effort. That pier Biden announced? The Pentagon says it could take
up to two months to build. There is a famine happening right now in
Gaza, not two months from now. And the US won’t even give assurances
that Israel will be prevented from firing on Palestinians trying to
retrieve American aid. There are other agencies on the ground, but the
US is in the way there too. It has cut off funding to UNWRA, the main
relief organization in Gaza, on dubious evidence that the UN now
claims was based in part on evidence obtained through torture.

These loopholes and contradictions have become so glaring that people
you might normally expect to overlook them are unable to. A recent
report in The New York Times, for instance, delicately noted that “the
United States finds itself on both sides of the war in a way, arming
the Israelis while trying to care for those hurt as a result.” And
Democratic Senator Chris Van Hollen told The New Yorker, “I really
haven’t heard a good response to the question of why we should not
apply existing U.S. law…to insure that U.S. military assistance is
used in accordance with our values.”

Nobody has heard a good response—and that’s because there isn’t one!
It’s shameless hypocrisy from Biden all the way down.

Yes, we must vote for Trump in November and send Biden a clear lesson. Thank you for posting this important article.

\its a mix over there. And a cursed one. God cursed Babel, long ago, permanently and that is why, hammas and others like them, worships the politician, mohammed.

for hundreds of years, they have been attacking everyone and are a small
army. History of it always shows they wind up doing the retreat.
yet we pay for the curse of it somehow. All of us. For we have to put
up with them. Destroying everything. To bad Israel, was not more a
perfect man to God trusting Him when the tower was built. He may of not
of cursed them so much. Fact is, they never continued building that
dammed by God thing.

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"Cryptoengineer" <petertrei@gmail.com> wrote in message news:uujsju$if7$1@dont-email.me...

On 4/3/2024 9:07 AM, Scott Dorsey wrote:

Scout <me4guns@verizon.removeme.this2.nospam.net> wrote:

Are you saying they can't act to defend themselves from terrorists, that >>> such criminals should remain at large to continue their rein of terror?

So tell me, how would you go about dealing with these terrorists?

Because allowing them to continue.. isn't a valid option.

And killing civilians doesn't help matters.

You've got crazy idealogues on both sides promoting the war. Neither
Netanyahu nor Haniyeh care anything about peace, they just want to win
(whatever that means to them). Then you have thousands of innocent
people
on both sides being caught in the crossfire. It's not the fault of any
of those people and they don't deserve what is happening to them.

I don't have a solution to this... but I also think that continuing to
toss bombs isn't going to fix anything. And I think that if people keep
doing the same thing they have been doing for the past sixty years that
they will get the same result that they have been getting for the past
sixty years.
--scott

I completely agree that Israel doesn't have to continue to tolerate
Hamas lobbing rockets into Israel. No nation could, and it has a right
to try to stop it. Certainly the invasion and massacre must be
responded to.

Actions speak louder than words.

When I look at the Netanyahu government's actions, as opposed to
its public statements, I get a strong impression that there is an
unspoken agenda to force the entire Arab population to leave Gaza
altogether, by making the place uninhabitable.

Well, they have to deal with the terrorists and that means taking steps to
do so. Yes, that means there is a fallout for the civilian population.

Generally speaking, these actions are those that harm and punish
the civilian population, rather than targeting Hamas specifically.

Typical in any warfare. To deny supplies to the combat forces usually
requires you to deny supplies to everyone.. otherwise the military forces
will simply get their supplies from the population.

They include:

* Cutting off food and water to the entire population. This
in particular supports my concern - it an extremely blunt weapon.
* Use of indiscriminate long distance weapons - missiles,
bombs, and artillery, which take down entire buildings.
* Deliberate demolition of cleared buildings.

Well, when the enemy is using them as bases, shelter and points for attack..
if they are empty, then removing them denies any use by the enemy. If you
don't think that isn't a regular part of warfare.. then you're sadly
ignorant.

Israel could have pursued far more targeted and less
destructive approach, albeit at the cost of more IDF deaths.

And why should the IDF allow more deaths than needed?

Netanyhu's actions suggest that he actually would prefer
to expel all Palestinians, not just from Gaza, but from
the West Bank as well.

Well since the Palestinians are the problem, as there is no Palestine to be
a member of, and historically Palestine was merely and area in which Jews
had settlements, then to remove all Palestinians would required the Jews
remove themselves from their homeland. A fact noted in the prophet
Mohammad's writings which noted that Palestine was the home of the Jews
since the start of time.

No, what they are trying to remove are terrorists that believe they have a right to the lands of the Jews and will stop at nothing including genocide
to obtain it.

So how do you bargain with such people? They have certainly tried time and
time again.. only to be regularly attacked without cause or warning.

As you said, actions speak louder than words and Hamas has repeatedly shown
by their actions that co-existence is not possible with them around.

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Scout <me4guns@verizon.removeme.this2.nospam.net> wrote:

Well, they have to deal with the terrorists and that means taking steps to
do so. Yes, that means there is a fallout for the civilian population.

And that fallout creates a new generation of terrorists and the problem is perpetuated.

No, what they are trying to remove are terrorists that believe they have a >right to the lands of the Jews and will stop at nothing including genocide
to obtain it.

As long as people on both sides care more about land than human lives, the
war will continue.
--scott
--
"C'est un Nagra. C'est suisse, et tres, tres precis."

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On Mon, 8 Apr 2024 07:45:28 -0400, "Scout" <me4guns@verizon.removeme.this2.nospam.net> wrote:

what they are trying to remove are terrorists[collonizers] that believe they have a
right to the lands of the Jews[Palistinians] and will stop at nothing including genocide
to obtain it.

--

Qualified immunity = virtual impunity.

Tim Merrigan

--
This email has been checked for viruses by AVG antivirus software.
www.avg.com

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On Tue, 9 Apr 2024 07:10:26 -0400, "Scout" <me4guns@verizon.removeme.this2.nospam.net> wrote:

"Tim Merrigan" <tppm@ca.rr.com> wrote in message >news:1aq81j9c7ke8pomev8nm489matvvb3o8in@4ax.com...

On Mon, 8 Apr 2024 07:45:28 -0400, "Scout"
<me4guns@verizon.removeme.this2.nospam.net> wrote:

what they are trying to remove are terrorists[collonizers] that believe >>>they have a
right to the lands of the Jews[Palistinians] and will stop at nothing >>>including genocide
to obtain it.

--

Qualified immunity = virtual impunity.

And yet, you want the terrorists to have qualified immunity for their >actions.

I want the terrorists to be arrested ant tried for their crimes, and
the civilians around them to be allowed to live their lives.
--

Qualified immunity = virtual impunity.

Tim Merrigan

--
This email has been checked for viruses by AVG antivirus software.
www.avg.com

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"Scott Dorsey" <kludge@panix.com> wrote in message news:uv1o9p$dus$1@panix2.panix.com...

Scout <me4guns@verizon.removeme.this2.nospam.net> wrote:

Well, they have to deal with the terrorists and that means taking steps to >>do so. Yes, that means there is a fallout for the civilian population.

And that fallout creates a new generation of terrorists and the problem is perpetuated.

Then they will kill that generation of terrorists.. until people realize
that to be a terrorist simply means your early death.

What I don't see, is how ignoring terrorists and terrorist actions does anything to eliminate terrorism.

No, what they are trying to remove are terrorists that believe they have a >>right to the lands of the Jews and will stop at nothing including genocide >>to obtain it.

As long as people on both sides care more about land than human lives, the war will continue.
--scott

And since the terrorists care more about the land than human lives.. where
does that leave us?

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"Tim Merrigan" <tppm@ca.rr.com> wrote in message news:1aq81j9c7ke8pomev8nm489matvvb3o8in@4ax.com...

On Mon, 8 Apr 2024 07:45:28 -0400, "Scout" <me4guns@verizon.removeme.this2.nospam.net> wrote:

what they are trying to remove are terrorists[collonizers] that believe >>they have a
right to the lands of the Jews[Palistinians] and will stop at nothing >>including genocide
to obtain it.

--

Qualified immunity = virtual impunity.

And yet, you want the terrorists to have qualified immunity for their
actions.

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On Tue, 9 Apr 2024 09:56:37 -0400, "Scout" <me4guns@verizon.removeme.this2.nospam.net> wrote:

"Tim Merrigan" <tppm@ca.rr.com> wrote in message >news:esba1jprel95temd606qsd3kf6mr52kqkm@4ax.com...

On Tue, 9 Apr 2024 07:10:26 -0400, "Scout"
<me4guns@verizon.removeme.this2.nospam.net> wrote:

"Tim Merrigan" <tppm@ca.rr.com> wrote in message >>>news:1aq81j9c7ke8pomev8nm489matvvb3o8in@4ax.com...

On Mon, 8 Apr 2024 07:45:28 -0400, "Scout"
<me4guns@verizon.removeme.this2.nospam.net> wrote:

what they are trying to remove are terrorists[collonizers] that believe >>>>>they have a
right to the lands of the Jews[Palistinians] and will stop at nothing >>>>>including genocide
to obtain it.

--

Qualified immunity = virtual impunity.

And yet, you want the terrorists to have qualified immunity for their >>>actions.

I want the terrorists to be arrested ant tried for their crimes, and
the civilians around them to be allowed to live their lives.

Great.. you go in there to arrest them.. Once you're dead.. we can go back
to doing what works.

It doesn't work. It inspires survivors to form new, and join
existing, terrorist organizations. Anything to get rid of the people
who destroyed their former lives.
--

Qualified immunity = virtual impunity.

Tim Merrigan

--
This email has been checked for viruses by AVG antivirus software.
www.avg.com

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"Tim Merrigan" <tppm@ca.rr.com> wrote in message news:esba1jprel95temd606qsd3kf6mr52kqkm@4ax.com...

On Tue, 9 Apr 2024 07:10:26 -0400, "Scout" <me4guns@verizon.removeme.this2.nospam.net> wrote:

"Tim Merrigan" <tppm@ca.rr.com> wrote in message >>news:1aq81j9c7ke8pomev8nm489matvvb3o8in@4ax.com...

On Mon, 8 Apr 2024 07:45:28 -0400, "Scout"
<me4guns@verizon.removeme.this2.nospam.net> wrote:

what they are trying to remove are terrorists[collonizers] that believe >>>>they have a
right to the lands of the Jews[Palistinians] and will stop at nothing >>>>including genocide
to obtain it.

--

Qualified immunity = virtual impunity.

And yet, you want the terrorists to have qualified immunity for their >>actions.

I want the terrorists to be arrested ant tried for their crimes, and
the civilians around them to be allowed to live their lives.

Great.. you go in there to arrest them.. Once you're dead.. we can go back
to doing what works.

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"Tim Merrigan" <tppm@ca.rr.com> wrote in message news:cfma1j9ccmaqednumtnpf3fnt0h51h3rjl@4ax.com...

On Tue, 9 Apr 2024 09:56:37 -0400, "Scout" <me4guns@verizon.removeme.this2.nospam.net> wrote:

"Tim Merrigan" <tppm@ca.rr.com> wrote in message >>news:esba1jprel95temd606qsd3kf6mr52kqkm@4ax.com...

On Tue, 9 Apr 2024 07:10:26 -0400, "Scout"
<me4guns@verizon.removeme.this2.nospam.net> wrote:

"Tim Merrigan" <tppm@ca.rr.com> wrote in message >>>>news:1aq81j9c7ke8pomev8nm489matvvb3o8in@4ax.com...

On Mon, 8 Apr 2024 07:45:28 -0400, "Scout"
<me4guns@verizon.removeme.this2.nospam.net> wrote:

what they are trying to remove are terrorists[collonizers] that >>>>>>believe
they have a
right to the lands of the Jews[Palistinians] and will stop at nothing >>>>>>including genocide
to obtain it.

--

Qualified immunity = virtual impunity.

And yet, you want the terrorists to have qualified immunity for their >>>>actions.

I want the terrorists to be arrested ant tried for their crimes, and
the civilians around them to be allowed to live their lives.

Great.. you go in there to arrest them.. Once you're dead.. we can go back >>to doing what works.

It doesn't work. It inspires survivors to form new, and join
existing, terrorist organizations. Anything to get rid of the people
who destroyed their former lives.

And yet.. you tell us that merely arresting them will work...

Then as survivors they will simply do it again.

Ok, you've convinced me that only the utter and total extermination of Hamas will work, and that anything necessary to that end should be done if we are
to have lasting peace in the Middle East... and you claimed the Jews were
too extreme.

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"Cryptoengineer" <petertrei@gmail.com> wrote in message news:uv4n3q$hn30$2@dont-email.me...

On 4/8/2024 7:45 AM, Scout wrote:

"Cryptoengineer" <petertrei@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:uujsju$if7$1@dont-email.me...

On 4/3/2024 9:07 AM, Scott Dorsey wrote:

Scout <me4guns@verizon.removeme.this2.nospam.net> wrote:

Are you saying they can't act to defend themselves from terrorists,
that
such criminals should remain at large to continue their rein of
terror?

So tell me, how would you go about dealing with these terrorists?

Because allowing them to continue.. isn't a valid option.

And killing civilians doesn't help matters.

You've got crazy idealogues on both sides promoting the war. Neither
Netanyahu nor Haniyeh care anything about peace, they just want to win >>>> (whatever that means to them). Then you have thousands of innocent
people
on both sides being caught in the crossfire. It's not the fault of any >>>> of those people and they don't deserve what is happening to them.

I don't have a solution to this... but I also think that continuing to >>>> toss bombs isn't going to fix anything. And I think that if people
keep
doing the same thing they have been doing for the past sixty years that >>>> they will get the same result that they have been getting for the past >>>> sixty years.
--scott

I completely agree that Israel doesn't have to continue to tolerate
Hamas lobbing rockets into Israel. No nation could, and it has a right
to try to stop it. Certainly the invasion and massacre must be
responded to.

Actions speak louder than words.

When I look at the Netanyahu government's actions, as opposed to
its public statements, I get a strong impression that there is an
unspoken agenda to force the entire Arab population to leave Gaza
altogether, by making the place uninhabitable.

Well, they have to deal with the terrorists and that means taking steps
to do so. Yes, that means there is a fallout for the civilian population.

Generally speaking, these actions are those that harm and punish
the civilian population, rather than targeting Hamas specifically.

Typical in any warfare. To deny supplies to the combat forces usually
requires you to deny supplies to everyone.. otherwise the military forces
will simply get their supplies from the population.

They include:

* Cutting off food and water to the entire population. This
in particular supports my concern - it an extremely blunt weapon.
* Use of indiscriminate long distance weapons - missiles,
bombs, and artillery, which take down entire buildings.
* Deliberate demolition of cleared buildings.

Well, when the enemy is using them as bases, shelter and points for
attack.. if they are empty, then removing them denies any use by the
enemy. If you don't think that isn't a regular part of warfare.. then
you're sadly ignorant.

War has Laws.

Yes, but terrorists do not. By their actions Hamas has violated every rule
of warfare.

The denial of food and water to non-combatants as a weapon of war is
a war crime.

Except this isn't a war. It's a police action against criminals..
specifically terrorists.

Note that this was written in 2001, and is not a reaction to the
situation in Gaza.

Doesn't matter... the matter in Gaza isn't a war and thus doesn't apply.

The Netanyahu government is engaged in war crimes.

How can they been committing war crimes where there is no war?

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"Cryptoengineer" <petertrei@gmail.com> wrote in message news:uv67m9$10ni2$1@dont-email.me...

On 4/10/2024 7:48 AM, Scout wrote:

"Cryptoengineer" <petertrei@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:uv4n3q$hn30$2@dont-email.me...

On 4/8/2024 7:45 AM, Scout wrote:

"Cryptoengineer" <petertrei@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:uujsju$if7$1@dont-email.me...

On 4/3/2024 9:07 AM, Scott Dorsey wrote:

Scout <me4guns@verizon.removeme.this2.nospam.net> wrote:

Are you saying they can't act to defend themselves from terrorists, >>>>>>> that
such criminals should remain at large to continue their rein of
terror?

So tell me, how would you go about dealing with these terrorists? >>>>>>>
Because allowing them to continue.. isn't a valid option.

And killing civilians doesn't help matters.

You've got crazy idealogues on both sides promoting the war. Neither >>>>>> Netanyahu nor Haniyeh care anything about peace, they just want to >>>>>> win
(whatever that means to them). Then you have thousands of innocent >>>>>> people
on both sides being caught in the crossfire. It's not the fault of >>>>>> any
of those people and they don't deserve what is happening to them.

I don't have a solution to this... but I also think that continuing >>>>>> to
toss bombs isn't going to fix anything. And I think that if people >>>>>> keep
doing the same thing they have been doing for the past sixty years >>>>>> that
they will get the same result that they have been getting for the
past
sixty years.
--scott

I completely agree that Israel doesn't have to continue to tolerate
Hamas lobbing rockets into Israel. No nation could, and it has a right >>>>> to try to stop it. Certainly the invasion and massacre must be
responded to.

Actions speak louder than words.

When I look at the Netanyahu government's actions, as opposed to
its public statements, I get a strong impression that there is an
unspoken agenda to force the entire Arab population to leave Gaza
altogether, by making the place uninhabitable.

Well, they have to deal with the terrorists and that means taking steps >>>> to do so. Yes, that means there is a fallout for the civilian
population.

Generally speaking, these actions are those that harm and punish
the civilian population, rather than targeting Hamas specifically.

Typical in any warfare. To deny supplies to the combat forces usually
requires you to deny supplies to everyone.. otherwise the military
forces will simply get their supplies from the population.

They include:

* Cutting off food and water to the entire population. This
in particular supports my concern - it an extremely blunt weapon.
* Use of indiscriminate long distance weapons - missiles,
bombs, and artillery, which take down entire buildings.
* Deliberate demolition of cleared buildings.

Well, when the enemy is using them as bases, shelter and points for
attack.. if they are empty, then removing them denies any use by the
enemy. If you don't think that isn't a regular part of warfare.. then
you're sadly ignorant.

War has Laws.

Yes, but terrorists do not. By their actions Hamas has violated every
rule of warfare.

The denial of food and water to non-combatants as a weapon of war is
a war crime.

Except this isn't a war. It's a police action against criminals..
specifically terrorists.

Note that this was written in 2001, and is not a reaction to the
situation in Gaza.

Doesn't matter... the matter in Gaza isn't a war and thus doesn't apply.

The Netanyahu government is engaged in war crimes.

How can they been committing war crimes where there is no war?

Not a war? Why isn't it a war?

Simple, to be a war then Hamas would have to comply with the rules of
warfare. They didn't, they aren't and they won't.

Hence.. they are criminals under those same rules and thus the rules don't apply.

First, you're demonstrating utter moral bankruptcy if you
think that simply saying its 'not a war' makes starving
non-combatants OK.

Ok.. who hides behind "human shields" otherwise known as the civilian population? Terrorists, aka criminals

Who locates command facilities in, under or near hospitals? Terrorists aka criminals

Who starts a conflict without warning? Terrorists aka criminals

What uniform does Hamas wear to identify they aren't civilians? None,
because they are terrorists.

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In article <uv69u5$11a2m$1@dont-email.me>,
Scout <me4guns@verizon.removeme.this2.nospam.net> wrote:

Simple, to be a war then Hamas would have to comply with the rules of >warfare. They didn't, they aren't and they won't.

[Hal Heydt]
The same argument could be applied to the Russians in Ukraine.

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"Cryptoengineer" <petertrei@gmail.com> wrote in message news:uv6afo$11eot$1@dont-email.me...

On 4/10/2024 11:06 AM, Scout wrote:

"Cryptoengineer" <petertrei@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:uv67m9$10ni2$1@dont-email.me...

On 4/10/2024 7:48 AM, Scout wrote:

"Cryptoengineer" <petertrei@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:uv4n3q$hn30$2@dont-email.me...

On 4/8/2024 7:45 AM, Scout wrote:

"Cryptoengineer" <petertrei@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:uujsju$if7$1@dont-email.me...

On 4/3/2024 9:07 AM, Scott Dorsey wrote:

Scout <me4guns@verizon.removeme.this2.nospam.net> wrote:

Are you saying they can't act to defend themselves from
terrorists, that
such criminals should remain at large to continue their rein of >>>>>>>>> terror?

So tell me, how would you go about dealing with these terrorists? >>>>>>>>>
Because allowing them to continue.. isn't a valid option.

And killing civilians doesn't help matters.

You've got crazy idealogues on both sides promoting the war.
Neither
Netanyahu nor Haniyeh care anything about peace, they just want to >>>>>>>> win
(whatever that means to them). Then you have thousands of innocent >>>>>>>> people
on both sides being caught in the crossfire. It's not the fault of >>>>>>>> any
of those people and they don't deserve what is happening to them. >>>>>>>>
I don't have a solution to this... but I also think that continuing >>>>>>>> to
toss bombs isn't going to fix anything. And I think that if people >>>>>>>> keep
doing the same thing they have been doing for the past sixty years >>>>>>>> that
they will get the same result that they have been getting for the >>>>>>>> past
sixty years.
--scott

I completely agree that Israel doesn't have to continue to tolerate >>>>>>> Hamas lobbing rockets into Israel. No nation could, and it has a >>>>>>> right
to try to stop it. Certainly the invasion and massacre must be
responded to.

Actions speak louder than words.

When I look at the Netanyahu government's actions, as opposed to >>>>>>> its public statements, I get a strong impression that there is an >>>>>>> unspoken agenda to force the entire Arab population to leave Gaza >>>>>>> altogether, by making the place uninhabitable.

Well, they have to deal with the terrorists and that means taking
steps to do so. Yes, that means there is a fallout for the civilian >>>>>> population.

Generally speaking, these actions are those that harm and punish >>>>>>> the civilian population, rather than targeting Hamas specifically. >>>>>>

Typical in any warfare. To deny supplies to the combat forces usually >>>>>> requires you to deny supplies to everyone.. otherwise the military >>>>>> forces will simply get their supplies from the population.

They include:

* Cutting off food and water to the entire population. This
in particular supports my concern - it an extremely blunt weapon. >>>>>>> * Use of indiscriminate long distance weapons - missiles,
bombs, and artillery, which take down entire buildings.
* Deliberate demolition of cleared buildings.

Well, when the enemy is using them as bases, shelter and points for >>>>>> attack.. if they are empty, then removing them denies any use by the >>>>>> enemy. If you don't think that isn't a regular part of warfare.. then >>>>>> you're sadly ignorant.

War has Laws.

Yes, but terrorists do not. By their actions Hamas has violated every
rule of warfare.

The denial of food and water to non-combatants as a weapon of war is >>>>> a war crime.

Except this isn't a war. It's a police action against criminals..
specifically terrorists.

Note that this was written in 2001, and is not a reaction to the
situation in Gaza.

Doesn't matter... the matter in Gaza isn't a war and thus doesn't
apply.

The Netanyahu government is engaged in war crimes.

How can they been committing war crimes where there is no war?

Not a war? Why isn't it a war?

Simple, to be a war then Hamas would have to comply with the rules of
warfare. They didn't, they aren't and they won't.

Hence.. they are criminals under those same rules and thus the rules
don't apply.

First, you're demonstrating utter moral bankruptcy if you
think that simply saying its 'not a war' makes starving
non-combatants OK.

Ok.. who hides behind "human shields" otherwise known as the civilian
population? Terrorists, aka criminals

Who locates command facilities in, under or near hospitals? Terrorists
aka criminals

Who starts a conflict without warning? Terrorists aka criminals

What uniform does Hamas wear to identify they aren't civilians? None,
because they are terrorists.

Who strips away the link that proves that the Netanyahu government
regards this as a war? As I said, you're morally bankrupt, 'Scout'.

<yawn> just because I don't accept your BS.. I'm morally bankrupt? LOL

War crimes by one side do not excuse war crimes by the other.

Again, you would first have to have a war. What we have is a terrorist
action.

The Israel are perfectly justified in the actions they are taking against Hamas..

However, let's say this is a war being conducted under the articles of war.

Then any armed individual not in uniform can be summarily executed on the
spot.
Any adult individual can be detained and imprisoned for the duration of the conflict without cause or trial.
Any identified members or suspected members of Hamas not in uniform can be summarily executed on the spot.
If Hamas sets up a command post, occupies or conducts military operations in
or near a hospital, church, or similar structure then Israel is legally justified to destroy such a structure and everyone in, on, or around it.
That if it can be shown that humanitarian aid is found being used by Hamas
that ALL such humanitarian aid can and would be denied in any area not fully occupied and controlled by Israel forces. Further that any groups attempting
to transport such aid into such areas could be stopped and denied entry
and/or have such supplies confiscated by whatever means are necessary. In extreme cases they could even be considered traitors or collaborators for aiding and abetting the enemy and again subject to punishment up to and including summary execution.
Finally anyone within the area can be stopped, searched and/or detained
without cause.


See, basically the rules of warfare say that if you don't obey the rules of warfare.. then the other guy can pretty much do whatever they want as well.

All said Israel is showing amazing restraint when they could be doing much
more if they wanted to.

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"Dorothy J Heydt" <djheydt@kithrup.com> wrote in message news:sBr2F6.rzz@kithrup.com...

In article <uv69u5$11a2m$1@dont-email.me>,
Scout <me4guns@verizon.removeme.this2.nospam.net> wrote:

Simple, to be a war then Hamas would have to comply with the rules of >>warfare. They didn't, they aren't and they won't.

[Hal Heydt]
The same argument could be applied to the Russians in Ukraine.

So far as I'm aware the Russian trumps in Ukraine are complying with the
rules of warfare.....

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In article <uv8k2p$1m6qu$3@dont-email.me>,
Scout <me4guns@verizon.removeme.this2.nospam.net> wrote:

"Dorothy J Heydt" <djheydt@kithrup.com> wrote in message >news:sBr2F6.rzz@kithrup.com...

In article <uv69u5$11a2m$1@dont-email.me>,
Scout <me4guns@verizon.removeme.this2.nospam.net> wrote:

Simple, to be a war then Hamas would have to comply with the rules of >>>warfare. They didn't, they aren't and they won't.

[Hal Heydt]
The same argument could be applied to the Russians in Ukraine.

So far as I'm aware the Russian trumps in Ukraine are complying with the >rules of warfare.....

[Hal Heydt]
Tens of thousands of Russian war crimes have been documented,
starting with Bucha. Russians are using chemical weapons.
Russians are using cluster muntion on civilian areas. Russians
are attacking purely civilian areas and infrastructure. That is
complying with the rules of war?

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On Thu, 11 Apr 2024 08:11:06 -0400, "Scout" <me4guns@verizon.removeme.this2.nospam.net> wrote:

"Dorothy J Heydt" <djheydt@kithrup.com> wrote in message >news:sBr2F6.rzz@kithrup.com...

In article <uv69u5$11a2m$1@dont-email.me>,
Scout <me4guns@verizon.removeme.this2.nospam.net> wrote:

Simple, to be a war then Hamas would have to comply with the rules of >>>warfare. They didn't, they aren't and they won't.

[Hal Heydt]
The same argument could be applied to the Russians in Ukraine.

So far as I'm aware the Russian trumps in Ukraine are complying with the >rules of warfare.....

Bombing schools, hospitals, and refugee columns, summarily executing
non combatants in occupied territories (unless you count a Russian
soldier saying "You're a Nazi" before shooting a trial and
sentencing), taking Ukrainian children far behind the Russian lines,
etc. are definitely violations of the rules of war. (Not to mention,
the unprovoked invasion the country and annexation of captured
territory, in the first place.)
--

Qualified immunity = virtual impunity.

Tim Merrigan

--
This email has been checked for viruses by AVG antivirus software.
www.avg.com

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On Thu, 11 Apr 2024 14:55:47 GMT
djheydt@kithrup.com (Dorothy J Heydt) wrote:

In article <uv8k2p$1m6qu$3@dont-email.me>,
Scout <me4guns@verizon.removeme.this2.nospam.net> wrote:

"Dorothy J Heydt" <djheydt@kithrup.com> wrote in message >news:sBr2F6.rzz@kithrup.com...

In article <uv69u5$11a2m$1@dont-email.me>,
Scout <me4guns@verizon.removeme.this2.nospam.net> wrote:

Simple, to be a war then Hamas would have to comply with the rules
of warfare. They didn't, they aren't and they won't.

[Hal Heydt]
The same argument could be applied to the Russians in Ukraine.

So far as I'm aware the Russian trumps in Ukraine are complying with
the rules of warfare.....

[Hal Heydt]
Tens of thousands of Russian war crimes have been documented,
starting with Bucha. Russians are using chemical weapons.
Russians are using cluster muntion on civilian areas. Russians
are attacking purely civilian areas and infrastructure. That is
complying with the rules of war?

https://crsreports.congress.gov/product/pdf/R/R47762

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On Thu, 11 Apr 2024 08:11:06 -0400
"Scout" <me4guns@verizon.removeme.this2.nospam.net> wrote:

"Dorothy J Heydt" <djheydt@kithrup.com> wrote in message news:sBr2F6.rzz@kithrup.com...

In article <uv69u5$11a2m$1@dont-email.me>,
Scout <me4guns@verizon.removeme.this2.nospam.net> wrote:

Simple, to be a war then Hamas would have to comply with the rules
of warfare. They didn't, they aren't and they won't.

[Hal Heydt]
The same argument could be applied to the Russians in Ukraine.

So far as I'm aware the Russian trumps in Ukraine are complying with
the rules of warfare.....

Alas, not so much:

https://www.amnesty.org/en/latest/news/2024/02/with-russias-full-scale-invasion-two-years-ago-an-act-of-aggression-that-is-a-crime-under-international-law-the-tragically-familiar-human-rights-catastrophe-extended-acros/

https://www.hrw.org/news/2022/04/03/ukraine-apparent-war-crimes-russia-controlled-areas

https://www.justice.gov/opa/pr/four-russia-affiliated-military-personnel-charged-war-crimes-connection-russias-invasion

https://crsreports.congress.gov/product/pdf/R/R47762

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On Thu, 11 Apr 2024 08:09:53 -0400, "Scout" <me4guns@verizon.removeme.this2.nospam.net> wrote:

"Cryptoengineer" <petertrei@gmail.com> wrote in message >news:uv6afo$11eot$1@dont-email.me...

On 4/10/2024 11:06 AM, Scout wrote:

"Cryptoengineer" <petertrei@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:uv67m9$10ni2$1@dont-email.me...

On 4/10/2024 7:48 AM, Scout wrote:

"Cryptoengineer" <petertrei@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:uv4n3q$hn30$2@dont-email.me...

On 4/8/2024 7:45 AM, Scout wrote:

"Cryptoengineer" <petertrei@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:uujsju$if7$1@dont-email.me...

On 4/3/2024 9:07 AM, Scott Dorsey wrote:

Scout <me4guns@verizon.removeme.this2.nospam.net> wrote:

Are you saying they can't act to defend themselves from
terrorists, that
such criminals should remain at large to continue their rein of >>>>>>>>>> terror?

So tell me, how would you go about dealing with these terrorists? >>>>>>>>>>
Because allowing them to continue.. isn't a valid option.

And killing civilians doesn't help matters.

You've got crazy idealogues on both sides promoting the war. >>>>>>>>> Neither
Netanyahu nor Haniyeh care anything about peace, they just want to >>>>>>>>> win
(whatever that means to them). Then you have thousands of innocent >>>>>>>>> people
on both sides being caught in the crossfire. It's not the fault of >>>>>>>>> any
of those people and they don't deserve what is happening to them. >>>>>>>>>
I don't have a solution to this... but I also think that continuing >>>>>>>>> to
toss bombs isn't going to fix anything. And I think that if people >>>>>>>>> keep
doing the same thing they have been doing for the past sixty years >>>>>>>>> that
they will get the same result that they have been getting for the >>>>>>>>> past
sixty years.
--scott

I completely agree that Israel doesn't have to continue to tolerate >>>>>>>> Hamas lobbing rockets into Israel. No nation could, and it has a >>>>>>>> right
to try to stop it. Certainly the invasion and massacre must be >>>>>>>> responded to.

Actions speak louder than words.

When I look at the Netanyahu government's actions, as opposed to >>>>>>>> its public statements, I get a strong impression that there is an >>>>>>>> unspoken agenda to force the entire Arab population to leave Gaza >>>>>>>> altogether, by making the place uninhabitable.

Well, they have to deal with the terrorists and that means taking >>>>>>> steps to do so. Yes, that means there is a fallout for the civilian >>>>>>> population.

Generally speaking, these actions are those that harm and punish >>>>>>>> the civilian population, rather than targeting Hamas specifically. >>>>>>>

Typical in any warfare. To deny supplies to the combat forces usually >>>>>>> requires you to deny supplies to everyone.. otherwise the military >>>>>>> forces will simply get their supplies from the population.

They include:

* Cutting off food and water to the entire population. This
in particular supports my concern - it an extremely blunt weapon. >>>>>>>> * Use of indiscriminate long distance weapons - missiles,
bombs, and artillery, which take down entire buildings.
* Deliberate demolition of cleared buildings.

Well, when the enemy is using them as bases, shelter and points for >>>>>>> attack.. if they are empty, then removing them denies any use by the >>>>>>> enemy. If you don't think that isn't a regular part of warfare.. then >>>>>>> you're sadly ignorant.

War has Laws.

Yes, but terrorists do not. By their actions Hamas has violated every >>>>> rule of warfare.

The denial of food and water to non-combatants as a weapon of war is >>>>>> a war crime.

Except this isn't a war. It's a police action against criminals..
specifically terrorists.

Note that this was written in 2001, and is not a reaction to the
situation in Gaza.

Doesn't matter... the matter in Gaza isn't a war and thus doesn't
apply.

The Netanyahu government is engaged in war crimes.

How can they been committing war crimes where there is no war?

Not a war? Why isn't it a war?

Simple, to be a war then Hamas would have to comply with the rules of
warfare. They didn't, they aren't and they won't.

Hence.. they are criminals under those same rules and thus the rules
don't apply.

First, you're demonstrating utter moral bankruptcy if you
think that simply saying its 'not a war' makes starving
non-combatants OK.

Ok.. who hides behind "human shields" otherwise known as the civilian
population? Terrorists, aka criminals

Who locates command facilities in, under or near hospitals? Terrorists
aka criminals

Who starts a conflict without warning? Terrorists aka criminals

What uniform does Hamas wear to identify they aren't civilians? None,
because they are terrorists.

Who strips away the link that proves that the Netanyahu government
regards this as a war? As I said, you're morally bankrupt, 'Scout'.

<yawn> just because I don't accept your BS.. I'm morally bankrupt? LOL

War crimes by one side do not excuse war crimes by the other.

Again, you would first have to have a war. What we have is a terrorist >action.

Okay, if you won't admit that there's a war (despite extensive
evidence to the contrary) how about crimes against humanity (which,
arguably, are worse)?

The Israel are perfectly justified in the actions they are taking against >Hamas..

However, let's say this is a war being conducted under the articles of war.

Then any armed individual not in uniform can be summarily executed on the >spot.
Any adult individual can be detained and imprisoned for the duration of the >conflict without cause or trial.
Any identified members or suspected members of Hamas not in uniform can be >summarily executed on the spot.
If Hamas sets up a command post, occupies or conducts military operations in >or near a hospital, church, or similar structure then Israel is legally >justified to destroy such a structure and everyone in, on, or around it.
That if it can be shown that humanitarian aid is found being used by Hamas >that ALL such humanitarian aid can and would be denied in any area not fully >occupied and controlled by Israel forces. Further that any groups attempting >to transport such aid into such areas could be stopped and denied entry >and/or have such supplies confiscated by whatever means are necessary. In >extreme cases they could even be considered traitors or collaborators for >aiding and abetting the enemy and again subject to punishment up to and >including summary execution.
Finally anyone within the area can be stopped, searched and/or detained >without cause.

See, basically the rules of warfare say that if you don't obey the rules of >warfare.. then the other guy can pretty much do whatever they want as well.

All said Israel is showing amazing restraint when they could be doing much >more if they wanted to.

--

Qualified immunity = virtual impunity.

Tim Merrigan

--
This email has been checked for viruses by AVG antivirus software.
www.avg.com

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On Wed, 10 Apr 2024 23:25:54 GMT
djheydt@kithrup.com (Dorothy J Heydt) wrote:

In article <uv69u5$11a2m$1@dont-email.me>,
Scout <me4guns@verizon.removeme.this2.nospam.net> wrote:

Simple, to be a war then Hamas would have to comply with the rules
of warfare. They didn't, they aren't and they won't.

[Hal Heydt]
The same argument could be applied to the Russians in Ukraine.

It's just a bankster/Soros shit show - the "war" is staged all the way.

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On Thu, 11 Apr 2024 12:47:36 -0400
Cryptoengineer <petertrei@gmail.com> wrote:

Anyone can go back in the thread and see 'Scout's ignorance,
inhumanity, and falsehoods.

You are subhuman lying filth, so FOAD.

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"Dorothy J Heydt" <djheydt@kithrup.com> wrote in message news:sBs9Gz.57H@kithrup.com...

In article <uv8k2p$1m6qu$3@dont-email.me>,
Scout <me4guns@verizon.removeme.this2.nospam.net> wrote:

"Dorothy J Heydt" <djheydt@kithrup.com> wrote in message >>news:sBr2F6.rzz@kithrup.com...

In article <uv69u5$11a2m$1@dont-email.me>,
Scout <me4guns@verizon.removeme.this2.nospam.net> wrote:

Simple, to be a war then Hamas would have to comply with the rules of >>>>warfare. They didn't, they aren't and they won't.

[Hal Heydt]
The same argument could be applied to the Russians in Ukraine.

So far as I'm aware the Russian trumps in Ukraine are complying with the >>rules of warfare.....

[Hal Heydt]
Tens of thousands of Russian war crimes have been documented,
starting with Bucha. Russians are using chemical weapons.
Russians are using cluster muntion on civilian areas. Russians
are attacking purely civilian areas and infrastructure. That is
complying with the rules of war?

Ok, looks like there would be problems there. In any case not relevant to
the events in Israel.

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"Tim Merrigan" <tppm@ca.rr.com> wrote in message news:jl7g1j966qpq1e395bm6k2kc119s9ik28g@4ax.com...

On Thu, 11 Apr 2024 08:09:53 -0400, "Scout" <me4guns@verizon.removeme.this2.nospam.net> wrote:

"Cryptoengineer" <petertrei@gmail.com> wrote in message >>news:uv6afo$11eot$1@dont-email.me...

On 4/10/2024 11:06 AM, Scout wrote:

"Cryptoengineer" <petertrei@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:uv67m9$10ni2$1@dont-email.me...

On 4/10/2024 7:48 AM, Scout wrote:

"Cryptoengineer" <petertrei@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:uv4n3q$hn30$2@dont-email.me...

On 4/8/2024 7:45 AM, Scout wrote:

"Cryptoengineer" <petertrei@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:uujsju$if7$1@dont-email.me...

On 4/3/2024 9:07 AM, Scott Dorsey wrote:

Scout <me4guns@verizon.removeme.this2.nospam.net> wrote:

Are you saying they can't act to defend themselves from
terrorists, that
such criminals should remain at large to continue their rein of >>>>>>>>>>> terror?

So tell me, how would you go about dealing with these
terrorists?

Because allowing them to continue.. isn't a valid option. >>>>>>>>>>

And killing civilians doesn't help matters.

You've got crazy idealogues on both sides promoting the war. >>>>>>>>>> Neither
Netanyahu nor Haniyeh care anything about peace, they just want >>>>>>>>>> to
win
(whatever that means to them). Then you have thousands of >>>>>>>>>> innocent
people
on both sides being caught in the crossfire. It's not the fault >>>>>>>>>> of
any
of those people and they don't deserve what is happening to them. >>>>>>>>>>
I don't have a solution to this... but I also think that
continuing
to
toss bombs isn't going to fix anything. And I think that if >>>>>>>>>> people
keep
doing the same thing they have been doing for the past sixty >>>>>>>>>> years
that
they will get the same result that they have been getting for the >>>>>>>>>> past
sixty years.
--scott

I completely agree that Israel doesn't have to continue to
tolerate
Hamas lobbing rockets into Israel. No nation could, and it has a >>>>>>>>> right
to try to stop it. Certainly the invasion and massacre must be >>>>>>>>> responded to.

Actions speak louder than words.

When I look at the Netanyahu government's actions, as opposed to >>>>>>>>> its public statements, I get a strong impression that there is an >>>>>>>>> unspoken agenda to force the entire Arab population to leave Gaza >>>>>>>>> altogether, by making the place uninhabitable.

Well, they have to deal with the terrorists and that means taking >>>>>>>> steps to do so. Yes, that means there is a fallout for the civilian >>>>>>>> population.

Generally speaking, these actions are those that harm and punish >>>>>>>>> the civilian population, rather than targeting Hamas specifically. >>>>>>>>

Typical in any warfare. To deny supplies to the combat forces
usually
requires you to deny supplies to everyone.. otherwise the military >>>>>>>> forces will simply get their supplies from the population.

They include:

* Cutting off food and water to the entire population. This
in particular supports my concern - it an extremely blunt weapon. >>>>>>>>> * Use of indiscriminate long distance weapons - missiles,
bombs, and artillery, which take down entire buildings.
* Deliberate demolition of cleared buildings.

Well, when the enemy is using them as bases, shelter and points for >>>>>>>> attack.. if they are empty, then removing them denies any use by >>>>>>>> the
enemy. If you don't think that isn't a regular part of warfare.. >>>>>>>> then
you're sadly ignorant.

War has Laws.

Yes, but terrorists do not. By their actions Hamas has violated every >>>>>> rule of warfare.

The denial of food and water to non-combatants as a weapon of war is >>>>>>> a war crime.

Except this isn't a war. It's a police action against criminals..
specifically terrorists.

Note that this was written in 2001, and is not a reaction to the >>>>>>> situation in Gaza.

Doesn't matter... the matter in Gaza isn't a war and thus doesn't
apply.

The Netanyahu government is engaged in war crimes.

How can they been committing war crimes where there is no war?

Not a war? Why isn't it a war?

Simple, to be a war then Hamas would have to comply with the rules of
warfare. They didn't, they aren't and they won't.

Hence.. they are criminals under those same rules and thus the rules
don't apply.

First, you're demonstrating utter moral bankruptcy if you
think that simply saying its 'not a war' makes starving
non-combatants OK.

Ok.. who hides behind "human shields" otherwise known as the civilian
population? Terrorists, aka criminals

Who locates command facilities in, under or near hospitals? Terrorists >>>> aka criminals

Who starts a conflict without warning? Terrorists aka criminals

What uniform does Hamas wear to identify they aren't civilians? None,
because they are terrorists.

Who strips away the link that proves that the Netanyahu government
regards this as a war? As I said, you're morally bankrupt, 'Scout'.

<yawn> just because I don't accept your BS.. I'm morally bankrupt? LOL

War crimes by one side do not excuse war crimes by the other.

Again, you would first have to have a war. What we have is a terrorist >>action.

Okay, if you won't admit that there's a war (despite extensive
evidence to the contrary) how about crimes against humanity (which,
arguably, are worse)?

So you want to charge Hamas with crimes against humanity?

Seems to bit extreme, but if that's where you want to go with this.

The Israel are perfectly justified in the actions they are taking against >>Hamas..

However, let's say this is a war being conducted under the articles of
war.

Then any armed individual not in uniform can be summarily executed on the >>spot.
Any adult individual can be detained and imprisoned for the duration of
the
conflict without cause or trial.
Any identified members or suspected members of Hamas not in uniform can be >>summarily executed on the spot.
If Hamas sets up a command post, occupies or conducts military operations >>in
or near a hospital, church, or similar structure then Israel is legally >>justified to destroy such a structure and everyone in, on, or around it. >>That if it can be shown that humanitarian aid is found being used by Hamas >>that ALL such humanitarian aid can and would be denied in any area not >>fully
occupied and controlled by Israel forces. Further that any groups >>attempting
to transport such aid into such areas could be stopped and denied entry >>and/or have such supplies confiscated by whatever means are necessary. In >>extreme cases they could even be considered traitors or collaborators for >>aiding and abetting the enemy and again subject to punishment up to and >>including summary execution.
Finally anyone within the area can be stopped, searched and/or detained >>without cause.


See, basically the rules of warfare say that if you don't obey the rules
of
warfare.. then the other guy can pretty much do whatever they want as
well.

All said Israel is showing amazing restraint when they could be doing much >>more if they wanted to.

--

<crickets>

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