• AKICIF: quit, close, exit

    From Joy Beeson@21:1/5 to All on Fri Oct 13 01:48:55 2023
    When I turn off a program, sometimes I "quit", sometimes I "close",
    and sometimes I "exit".

    Is this a matter of taste and programmer's whim, like choosing a
    typeface, or do the different words mean different things?


    --
    Joy Beeson
    joy beeson at centurylink dot net
    http://wlweather.net/PAGEJOY/

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
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  • From Gary McGath@21:1/5 to Joy Beeson on Fri Oct 13 05:27:58 2023
    On 10/13/23 1:48 AM, Joy Beeson wrote:

    When I turn off a program, sometimes I "quit", sometimes I "close",
    and sometimes I "exit".

    Is this a matter of taste and programmer's whim, like choosing a
    typeface, or do the different words mean different things?



    I think of closing as removing a specific activity. You close a
    connection, process, or window, which doesn't necessarily imply quitting
    or exiting from the whole program.

    --
    Gary McGath http://www.mcgath.com

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
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  • From Gary R. Schmidt@21:1/5 to Joy Beeson on Fri Oct 13 23:23:05 2023
    On 13/10/2023 16:48, Joy Beeson wrote:

    When I turn off a program, sometimes I "quit", sometimes I "close",
    and sometimes I "exit".

    Is this a matter of taste and programmer's whim, like choosing a
    typeface, or do the different words mean different things?


    I - as an ancient as grizzled UNIX guru - think like this:

    quit - don't save whatever I have been doing and stop the program.

    close - just stop doing whatever the program does, which may stop the
    program.

    exit - save what I have done and stop the program.

    Cheers,
    Gary B-)

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
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  • From Dorothy J Heydt@21:1/5 to jbeeson@invalid.net.invalid on Fri Oct 13 15:09:26 2023
    In article <ggmhiih2fe7b79snupu13p142juvdaoa06@4ax.com>,
    Joy Beeson <jbeeson@invalid.net.invalid> wrote:

    When I turn off a program, sometimes I "quit", sometimes I "close",
    and sometimes I "exit".

    Is this a matter of taste and programmer's whim, like choosing a
    typeface, or do the different words mean different things?

    [Hal Heydt]
    On the IBM 1620 in FORTAN IID, one ended a program with the
    statement "CALL EXIT". That would return control to the system
    monitor. If you end with "STOP", the whole system would halt.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Dorothy J Heydt@21:1/5 to garym@mcgath.com on Fri Oct 13 15:10:39 2023
    In article <ugb2iu$33gpm$1@dont-email.me>,
    Gary McGath <garym@mcgath.com> wrote:
    On 10/13/23 1:48 AM, Joy Beeson wrote:

    When I turn off a program, sometimes I "quit", sometimes I "close",
    and sometimes I "exit".

    Is this a matter of taste and programmer's whim, like choosing a
    typeface, or do the different words mean different things?



    I think of closing as removing a specific activity. You close a
    connection, process, or window, which doesn't necessarily imply quitting
    or exiting from the whole program.

    [Hal Heydt]
    Or you close a file.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From David Dyer-Bennet@21:1/5 to Dorothy J Heydt on Fri Oct 13 12:10:37 2023
    On 10/13/2023 10:09, Dorothy J Heydt wrote:
    In article <ggmhiih2fe7b79snupu13p142juvdaoa06@4ax.com>,
    Joy Beeson <jbeeson@invalid.net.invalid> wrote:

    When I turn off a program, sometimes I "quit", sometimes I "close",
    and sometimes I "exit".

    Is this a matter of taste and programmer's whim, like choosing a
    typeface, or do the different words mean different things?

    [Hal Heydt]
    On the IBM 1620 in FORTAN IID, one ended a program with the
    statement "CALL EXIT". That would return control to the system
    monitor. If you end with "STOP", the whole system would halt.

    Wait, since when did the 1620 have any sort of "system monitor"? Neither
    of the ones I used did.

    --
    David Dyer-Bennet, dd-b@dd-b.net; http://dd-b.net/
    Words Over Windows http://WordsOverWindows.dd-b.net/
    Snapshots: http://dd-b.net/dd-b/SnapshotAlbum/data/
    Photos: http://dd-b.net/photography/gallery/

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From David Dyer-Bennet@21:1/5 to Gary McGath on Fri Oct 13 12:09:12 2023
    On 10/13/2023 04:27, Gary McGath wrote:
    On 10/13/23 1:48 AM, Joy Beeson wrote:

    When I turn off a program, sometimes I "quit", sometimes I "close",
    and sometimes I "exit".

    Is this a matter of taste and programmer's whim, like choosing a
    typeface, or do the different words mean different things?



    I think of closing as removing a specific activity. You close a
    connection, process, or window, which doesn't necessarily imply quitting
    or exiting from the whole program.


    That's not wrong -- but one "closed" programs before they were routinely associated with windows, so it's not the full explanation.
    --
    David Dyer-Bennet, dd-b@dd-b.net; http://dd-b.net/
    Words Over Windows http://WordsOverWindows.dd-b.net/
    Snapshots: http://dd-b.net/dd-b/SnapshotAlbum/data/
    Photos: http://dd-b.net/photography/gallery/

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Dorothy J Heydt@21:1/5 to dd-b@dd-b.net on Sat Oct 14 02:33:56 2023
    In article <ugbtmc$39vku$2@dont-email.me>,
    David Dyer-Bennet <dd-b@dd-b.net> wrote:
    On 10/13/2023 10:09, Dorothy J Heydt wrote:
    In article <ggmhiih2fe7b79snupu13p142juvdaoa06@4ax.com>,
    Joy Beeson <jbeeson@invalid.net.invalid> wrote:

    When I turn off a program, sometimes I "quit", sometimes I "close",
    and sometimes I "exit".

    Is this a matter of taste and programmer's whim, like choosing a
    typeface, or do the different words mean different things?

    [Hal Heydt]
    On the IBM 1620 in FORTAN IID, one ended a program with the
    statement "CALL EXIT". That would return control to the system
    monitor. If you end with "STOP", the whole system would halt.

    Wait, since when did the 1620 have any sort of "system monitor"? Neither
    of the ones I used did.

    [Hal Heydt]
    MONITOR IID. The 1620 in question also had a removable pack HDD.
    2MB capacity. The actual code generated CALL EXIT was 4900796 (or
    BR 796), which was the return point in MONITOR IID.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Charles Packer@21:1/5 to David Dyer-Bennet on Sat Oct 14 07:06:21 2023
    On Fri, 13 Oct 2023 12:09:12 -0500, David Dyer-Bennet wrote:

    On 10/13/2023 04:27, Gary McGath wrote:
    On 10/13/23 1:48 AM, Joy Beeson wrote:

    When I turn off a program, sometimes I "quit", sometimes I "close",
    and sometimes I "exit".

    Is this a matter of taste and programmer's whim, like choosing a
    typeface, or do the different words mean different things?



    I think of closing as removing a specific activity. You close a
    connection, process, or window, which doesn't necessarily imply
    quitting or exiting from the whole program.


    That's not wrong -- but one "closed" programs before they were routinely associated with windows, so it's not the full explanation.

    At this point I would bet that any pre-windows-era program
    that used "close" to exit would have the closing of files
    as its last action. That is, the programmer, consciously or
    not, made the association.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Keith F. Lynch@21:1/5 to Gary McGath on Sat Oct 14 21:51:29 2023
    Gary McGath <garym@mcgath.com> wrote:
    Joy Beeson wrote:
    When I turn off a program, sometimes I "quit", sometimes I "close",
    and sometimes I "exit".

    Is this a matter of taste and programmer's whim, like choosing a
    typeface, or do the different words mean different things?

    Thanks for asking. I'm glad to see discussion here that has nothing
    to do with Doctor Who.

    I think of closing as removing a specific activity. You close a
    connection, process, or window, which doesn't necessarily imply
    quitting or exiting from the whole program.

    I've long considered "open" (and, by extension, "close") in a computer
    context to be a perfect example of what Ayn Rand calls an "anti-concept,"
    i.e. something that causes confusion by conflating unrelated concepts.

    How can one interact with a file? If it's a text file, you can
    display it as text on the screen so you can read it. If it's an audio
    file, you can play it through speakers or headphone so you can hear
    it. If it's a still photo or a video you can view it as an image on
    the screen. If it's an executable file, i.e. a compiled program, you
    can run it. These are very different actions. Placing them under a
    single word leads to confusion over things such as whether there's any
    risk from "opening" an email. I never want to "open" an email; I want
    to either view its text on my screen or copy it to another location.
    Very rarely, I might want to print its text to paper or to take some
    action with an attachment it contains.

    I never ever want the computer to figure out, based on what's in the
    email, what to do with it (other than discarding it as spam). For
    instance just because it has an executable attachment doesn't mean
    I want that program to run. That would be like my finding a random
    discarded hypodermic needle on the sidewalk and injecting myself with
    it because that's what one does with hypodermic needles.

    To "close" an email, or other file, is even more ambiguous. ("Quit,"
    to me, means to cause a program to stop running.)

    I strongly dislike pop-ups that give me unclear choices. Often, one
    of the choices, or even the only choice, is "OK." Is *what* okay?
    What exactly am I consenting to or agreeing with by clicking there?
    In some cases I've gone as far as rebooting the machine to avoid
    having to click on "OK."
    --
    Keith F. Lynch - http://keithlynch.net/
    Please see http://keithlynch.net/email.html before emailing me.

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