• Looking back at 2023, looking forward to 2024, a political perspective

    From Crash@21:1/5 to All on Mon Jan 1 21:03:05 2024
    Much has happened in 2023, including major surprises and predictable
    outcomes.

    The predictable outcome was that Labour/Greens government was defeated
    at the polls.

    The major surprise is that we have a 3-way coalition government that
    includes NZF. That is a first most notably because when NZF have held
    the balance of power in the past they had always leveraged that into
    being the sole minor party in a coalition. We are unlikely to know
    exactly how this (3-part coalition) was achieved. We will at some
    time in the future be able to assess its durability. I remain
    skeptical because Winston has not in the past worked as part of a
    3-way team where the other 2 are political adversaries.

    The coalition agreement clearly sets expectations. There are elements
    of controversy but all points of action were based on clearly
    enunciated policy from each of the 3 parties. So the controversy
    stems not from decisions taken but from the opposition parties as is
    to be expected.

    The real test for 2024 is whether the government sticks to the agenda
    defined in the coalition agreement and whether Winston continues to
    accept his (diminished) role as part of a 3-party Government. Part of
    this will rest with whatever leadership skills that PM Luxon can bring
    to bear to keep Winston under control as a bit-part player. David
    Seymour is more predicable to play a constructive role in similar
    circumstances to Winston.

    The key to this government though is to carry through with its 100-day
    agenda. Whether this takes longer than 100 days is not a concern to
    me - it just has to get all this stuff done in addition to making the
    normal decisions in Government.

    Labour has a period of political instability ahead - normal for a
    party that has faced election defeat and associated issues with
    leadership change and departure of senior MPs. That more have not
    resigned yet is not indicative of a commitment to see through a term
    in opposition but is indicative of a reluctance to resign until future alternative employment has been secured.

    Looking at the Greens, in recent years James Shaw has stood out not as
    a co-leader but as an outlier. He is male, hetro and has a
    respectable history in the corporate world. Do the Greens have
    another such MP? I don't think so and as such his tenure as a
    co-leader is surely limited. The Greens have always been the
    watermelon party but in recent years the green skin has been getting
    thinner and the flesh of the party a deeper shade of political red.
    Perhaps he is also in the job market.

    So 2024 will be interesting, but I will be a bit more relaxed when the
    Water Services Entities Act is repealed. A bonus would be the
    deferment of tax bracket indexation until a substantial reduction in
    Government debt has been made, but I acknowledge my wishful thinking
    on this.


    --
    Crash McBash

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  • From Gordon@21:1/5 to Crash on Mon Jan 1 21:37:07 2024
    On 2024-01-01, Crash <nogood@dontbother.invalid> wrote:
    Much has happened in 2023, including major surprises and predictable outcomes.

    The predictable outcome was that Labour/Greens government was defeated
    at the polls.

    The major surprise is that we have a 3-way coalition government that
    includes NZF. That is a first most notably because when NZF have held
    the balance of power in the past they had always leveraged that into
    being the sole minor party in a coalition. We are unlikely to know
    exactly how this (3-part coalition) was achieved. We will at some
    time in the future be able to assess its durability. I remain
    skeptical because Winston has not in the past worked as part of a
    3-way team where the other 2 are political adversaries.

    The coalition agreement clearly sets expectations. There are elements
    of controversy but all points of action were based on clearly
    enunciated policy from each of the 3 parties. So the controversy
    stems not from decisions taken but from the opposition parties as is
    to be expected.

    The real test for 2024 is whether the government sticks to the agenda
    defined in the coalition agreement and whether Winston continues to
    accept his (diminished) role as part of a 3-party Government.

    Winston has alot to lose. If he can appear to be a team member and not hog
    all the limelight NZF rating will rise. Any typical Winston activity will
    see the 5% way above his head in the next election.

    There is a base level of about 3-4% so some swing voters need to come to the party.



    Part of
    this will rest with whatever leadership skills that PM Luxon can bring
    to bear to keep Winston under control as a bit-part player. David
    Seymour is more predicable to play a constructive role in similar circumstances to Winston.

    The key to this government though is to carry through with its 100-day agenda. Whether this takes longer than 100 days is not a concern to
    me - it just has to get all this stuff done in addition to making the
    normal decisions in Government.

    Labour has a period of political instability ahead - normal for a
    party that has faced election defeat and associated issues with
    leadership change and departure of senior MPs. That more have not
    resigned yet is not indicative of a commitment to see through a term
    in opposition but is indicative of a reluctance to resign until future alternative employment has been secured.

    Looking at the Greens, in recent years James Shaw has stood out not as
    a co-leader but as an outlier. He is male, hetro and has a
    respectable history in the corporate world.

    Ah I did not know that. However it does explain the impression I have of
    him. Not the typical Green attitude. Still the whole party has morfed in the recent years as pointed out below.

    It is going to be interesting to see how the Labour and Greens change, if
    they do, and how they relate to each other. It seems to me at present both parties are going way into the authorian territory/road and are encouraging each other on.

    At some point the Green faithful are going to have to re-establish the Green idealogy, either by a revolt or spliting into a new party.



    Do the Greens have
    another such MP? I don't think so and as such his tenure as a
    co-leader is surely limited. The Greens have always been the
    watermelon party but in recent years the green skin has been getting
    thinner and the flesh of the party a deeper shade of political red.
    Perhaps he is also in the job market.

    So 2024 will be interesting, but I will be a bit more relaxed when the
    Water Services Entities Act is repealed. A bonus would be the
    deferment of tax bracket indexation until a substantial reduction in Government debt has been made, but I acknowledge my wishful thinking
    on this.



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  • From Lawrence D'Oliveiro@21:1/5 to Gordon on Mon Jan 1 21:49:42 2024
    On 1 Jan 2024 21:37:07 GMT, Gordon wrote:

    Winston has alot to lose.

    He also seems to be even more erratic than usual. That “bribery” bullshit being a case in point. He hates the media and seems to take pleasure in
    talking down to them and bossing them around, then he complains when they
    seem to ignore him (as on election night).

    What’s the bet this coalition won’t finish its term, and Winston will be the one to blame?

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  • From Rich80105@21:1/5 to All on Tue Jan 2 11:31:52 2024
    On Mon, 01 Jan 2024 21:03:05 +1300, Crash <nogood@dontbother.invalid>
    wrote:

    Much has happened in 2023, including major surprises and predictable >outcomes.

    The predictable outcome was that Labour/Greens government was defeated
    at the polls.

    The major surprise is that we have a 3-way coalition government that
    includes NZF. That is a first most notably because when NZF have held
    the balance of power in the past they had always leveraged that into
    being the sole minor party in a coalition. We are unlikely to know
    exactly how this (3-part coalition) was achieved. We will at some
    time in the future be able to assess its durability. I remain
    skeptical because Winston has not in the past worked as part of a
    3-way team where the other 2 are political adversaries.

    The coalition agreement clearly sets expectations. There are elements
    of controversy but all points of action were based on clearly
    enunciated policy from each of the 3 parties. So the controversy
    stems not from decisions taken but from the opposition parties as is
    to be expected.

    No, many of the policies were not well known, and even if they are now
    well known were not at the time voting was taking place. The three way coalition was not generally anticipated, and voted supporting both
    major parties may well have hoped NZ First would not get enough votes
    to be in government - many believe that they received enough votes
    purely to act as a brake on ACT in particular but also National


    The real test for 2024 is whether the government sticks to the agenda
    defined in the coalition agreement and whether Winston continues to
    accept his (diminished) role as part of a 3-party Government. Part of
    this will rest with whatever leadership skills that PM Luxon can bring
    to bear to keep Winston under control as a bit-part player. David
    Seymour is more predicable to play a constructive role in similar >circumstances to Winston.

    The coalition agreement was made essentially between three people - it
    should not be regarded as sanctioned by voters - on many policies in
    that agreement there may well be a majority of New Zealanders opposed
    - so much for democracy!


    The key to this government though is to carry through with its 100-day >agenda. Whether this takes longer than 100 days is not a concern to
    me - it just has to get all this stuff done in addition to making the
    normal decisions in Government.
    No, the key is having a government that properly considers legislation
    as the detail is developed, and assesses whether agreements made in
    haste should be pushed through, or changed in a minor or major way, or
    dropped. A Democracy expects intelligent decision making. It is clear
    that knowledge on financial issue was sadly lacking by key players in
    the new government, and it is clear there will be some changes to at
    least some of the expressed policies - we may be critical of the lack
    of understanding on which some policies were developed, but applaud
    sensible changes or delays that are now appropriate.

    Labour has a period of political instability ahead - normal for a
    party that has faced election defeat and associated issues with
    leadership change and departure of senior MPs. That more have not
    resigned yet is not indicative of a commitment to see through a term
    in opposition but is indicative of a reluctance to resign until future >alternative employment has been secured.

    That is part of the Democratic process - hopefully the departure of
    Ardern will not be as destructive for Labour as the departure of Key
    was to National, but that remains to be seen. This government does not
    have a particularly strong mandate for radical action; I suspect the
    prospect of a early election or at least a close election in three
    years will give an incentive for opposition parties (Labour / Green /
    Te Pati Maori) to work together in a positive way


    Looking at the Greens, in recent years James Shaw has stood out not as
    a co-leader but as an outlier. He is male, hetro and has a
    respectable history in the corporate world. Do the Greens have
    another such MP? I don't think so and as such his tenure as a
    co-leader is surely limited. The Greens have always been the
    watermelon party but in recent years the green skin has been getting
    thinner and the flesh of the party a deeper shade of political red.
    Perhaps he is also in the job market.
    He has also been a stabilising Leader of a party which has some
    members taking strong positions on particular issues rather than a
    coordinated broad policy front. He has been a Leader for a long time
    however, but at present there is not a clear leader in waiting to
    replace him.


    So 2024 will be interesting, but I will be a bit more relaxed when the
    Water Services Entities Act is repealed. A bonus would be the
    deferment of tax bracket indexation until a substantial reduction in >Government debt has been made, but I acknowledge my wishful thinking
    on this.
    We have not yet seen the water policies that National promised to put
    into place - it is possible that 30% increases in rates will be
    unpopular; especially as such increases will not be needed in all
    areas . . .

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