So NactFirst are going to scrap the Smokefree Policy - raising some
more money in the short term, but increasing costs for the health
system by millions, and killing many through the nasty side effects of
yet another drug addiction.
The nasty coalition starting off as predicted. putting money ahead of
lives.
There is also a suggestion that they will weaken standards for clean
water to save money and allow farmers to continue to send animal shit
and piss downstream for cities and towns to deal with.
Dirty killers for their own profit. Shame on New Zealand for not
recognising the billions they will cost us to enrich their supporters
. . .
So NactFirst are going to scrap the Smokefree Policy - raising someNo, it was a daft policy. There needs to be a different way to the Labour policy to stop pwople smoking. Their policy made no logical sense.
more money in the short term, but increasing costs for the health
system by millions, and killing many through the nasty side effects of
yet another drug addiction.
The nasty coalition starting off as predicted. putting money ahead ofYou can't help your abuse can you. They are not nasty, what was nasty was the last anti-democracy, anti New Zealanders government ousted a few weeks ago,
lives.
There is also a suggestion that they will weaken standards for cleanCite or admit you made it up.
water to save money and allow farmers to continue to send animal shit
and piss downstream for cities and towns to deal with.
Dirty killers for their own profit. Shame on New Zealand for notWhat awful lefty rhetoric - and your desparation and lies are showing.
recognising the billions they will cost us to enrich their supporters
. . .
On Sat, 25 Nov 2023 18:00:48 +1300, Rich80105 <Rich80105@hotmail.com>
wrote:
So NactFirst are going to scrap the Smokefree Policy - raising some
more money in the short term, but increasing costs for the health
system by millions, and killing many through the nasty side effects of
yet another drug addiction.
The nasty coalition starting off as predicted. putting money ahead of >>lives.
There is also a suggestion that they will weaken standards for clean
water to save money and allow farmers to continue to send animal shit
and piss downstream for cities and towns to deal with.
Dirty killers for their own profit. Shame on New Zealand for not >>recognising the billions they will cost us to enrich their supporters
. . .
Cite please. https://www.rnz.co.nz/news/political/503241/smokefree-law-changes-a-completely-backwards-step-health-experts
Rich80105 <Rich80105@hotmail.com> wrote:It was working, and may be picked up by other countries. Exposing a
So NactFirst are going to scrap the Smokefree Policy - raising someNo, it was a daft policy. There needs to be a different way to the Labour >policy to stop pwople smoking. Their policy made no logical sense.
more money in the short term, but increasing costs for the health
system by millions, and killing many through the nasty side effects of
yet another drug addiction.
Dying from the effects of smoking is nasty, and only a nastyYou can't help your abuse can you. They are not nasty,
The nasty coalition starting off as predicted. putting money ahead of >>lives.
what was nasty was theFrom the agreements:
last anti-democracy, anti New Zealanders government ousted a few weeks ago, Off topic.
There is also a suggestion that they will weaken standards for clean
water to save money and allow farmers to continue to send animal shit
and piss downstream for cities and towns to deal with.
Cite or admit you made it up.Your spelling gets worse when you are lying . . .
What awful lefty rhetoric - and your desparation and lies are showing.
Dirty killers for their own profit. Shame on New Zealand for not >>recognising the billions they will cost us to enrich their supporters
. . .
On Sat, 25 Nov 2023 05:53:36 -0000 (UTC), TonyNo it was not - it has note yet kicked in to any extent that is measurable.
<lizandtony@orcon.net.nz> wrote:
Rich80105 <Rich80105@hotmail.com> wrote:It was working, and may be picked up by other countries.
So NactFirst are going to scrap the Smokefree Policy - raising someNo, it was a daft policy. There needs to be a different way to the Labour >>policy to stop pwople smoking. Their policy made no logical sense.
more money in the short term, but increasing costs for the health
system by millions, and killing many through the nasty side effects of >>>yet another drug addiction.
Exposing aAgreed, but that is not what is happening.
new group of young people to an addictive product that we know kills
just to raise money for income tax cuts is despicable.
Agreed. But that is not what is happening.Dying from the effects of smoking is nasty, and only a nastyYou can't help your abuse can you. They are not nasty,
The nasty coalition starting off as predicted. putting money ahead of >>>lives.
government would condemn a new group of users to such a fate.
No, you introduced the word, not me.what was nasty was the
last anti-democracy, anti New Zealanders government ousted a few weeks ago, >Off topic.
Which does not support your statement in any way.From the agreements:
There is also a suggestion that they will weaken standards for clean >>>water to save money and allow farmers to continue to send animal shit
and piss downstream for cities and towns to deal with.
Replace the National Policy Statement for Freshwater Management 2020
to allow district councils more flexibility in how they meet
environmental limits and seek advice on how to exempt councils from >obligations under the National Policy Statement for Freshwater
Management 2020 as soon as practicable.
andAs above.
Replace the National Policy Statement for Freshwater 2020 to rebalance
Te Mana o te Wai to better effect the interests of all water users
The suggestion was made on radio today - I cannot locate a link.What a surprise.
Fast typists can make simple typing mistakes, that is not a spelling error. You use a spellchecker because otherwise you would be unable to type anything sensible - pity your education was so pitiful/.Cite or admit you made it up.Your spelling gets worse when you are lying . . .
What awful lefty rhetoric - and your desparation and lies are showing.
Dirty killers for their own profit. Shame on New Zealand for not >>>recognising the billions they will cost us to enrich their supporters
. . .
Rich80105 <Rich...@hotmail.com> wrote:
On Sat, 25 Nov 2023 05:53:36 -0000 (UTC), Tony
<lizan...@orcon.net.nz> wrote:
No it was not - it has note yet kicked in to any extent that is measurable.Rich80105 <Rich...@hotmail.com> wrote:It was working, and may be picked up by other countries.
So NactFirst are going to scrap the Smokefree Policy - raising some >>>more money in the short term, but increasing costs for the health >>>system by millions, and killing many through the nasty side effects of >>>yet another drug addiction.No, it was a daft policy. There needs to be a different way to the Labour >>policy to stop pwople smoking. Their policy made no logical sense.
Exposing aAgreed, but that is not what is happening.
new group of young people to an addictive product that we know kills
just to raise money for income tax cuts is despicable.
Agreed. But that is not what is happening.Dying from the effects of smoking is nasty, and only a nastyYou can't help your abuse can you. They are not nasty,
The nasty coalition starting off as predicted. putting money ahead of >>>lives.
government would condemn a new group of users to such a fate.
No, you introduced the word, not me.what was nasty was theOff topic.
last anti-democracy, anti New Zealanders government ousted a few weeks ago,
Which does not support your statement in any way.From the agreements:
There is also a suggestion that they will weaken standards for clean >>>water to save money and allow farmers to continue to send animal shit >>>and piss downstream for cities and towns to deal with.
Replace the National Policy Statement for Freshwater Management 2020
to allow district councils more flexibility in how they meet
environmental limits and seek advice on how to exempt councils from >obligations under the National Policy Statement for Freshwater
Management 2020 as soon as practicable.
andAs above.
Replace the National Policy Statement for Freshwater 2020 to rebalance
Te Mana o te Wai to better effect the interests of all water users
The suggestion was made on radio today - I cannot locate a link.What a surprise.
Fast typists can make simple typing mistakes, that is not a spelling error. YouCite or admit you made it up.Your spelling gets worse when you are lying . . .
Dirty killers for their own profit. Shame on New Zealand for not >>>recognising the billions they will cost us to enrich their supporters >>What awful lefty rhetoric - and your desparation and lies are showing. >>>. . .
use a spellchecker because otherwise you would be unable to type anything sensible - pity your education was so pitiful/.
I have not lied in this newsgroup - ever. And you cannot demonstrate otherwise.
On Sat, 25 Nov 2023 05:53:36 -0000 (UTC), Tony
<lizan...@orcon.net.nz> wrote:
Rich80105 <Rich...@hotmail.com> wrote:It was working, and may be picked up by other countries. Exposing a
So NactFirst are going to scrap the Smokefree Policy - raising someNo, it was a daft policy. There needs to be a different way to the Labour >policy to stop pwople smoking. Their policy made no logical sense.
more money in the short term, but increasing costs for the health
system by millions, and killing many through the nasty side effects of >>yet another drug addiction.
new group of young people to an addictive product that we know kills
just to raise money for income tax cuts is despicable.
Dying from the effects of smoking is nasty, and only a nastyYou can't help your abuse can you. They are not nasty,
The nasty coalition starting off as predicted. putting money ahead of >>lives.
government would condemn a new group of users to such a fate.
what was nasty was theFrom the agreements:
last anti-democracy, anti New Zealanders government ousted a few weeks ago, Off topic.
There is also a suggestion that they will weaken standards for clean >>water to save money and allow farmers to continue to send animal shit
and piss downstream for cities and towns to deal with.
Replace the National Policy Statement for Freshwater Management 2020
to allow district councils more flexibility in how they meet
environmental limits and seek advice on how to exempt councils from obligations under the National Policy Statement for Freshwater
Management 2020 as soon as practicable.
and
Replace the National Policy Statement for Freshwater 2020 to rebalance
Te Mana o te Wai to better effect the interests of all water users
The suggestion was made on radio today - I cannot locate a link.
Cite or admit you made it up.Your spelling gets worse when you are lying . . .
What awful lefty rhetoric - and your desparation and lies are showing.
Dirty killers for their own profit. Shame on New Zealand for not >>recognising the billions they will cost us to enrich their supporters
. . .
On Sat, 25 Nov 2023 05:53:36 -0000 (UTC), Tony
<lizandtony@orcon.net.nz> wrote:
Rich80105 <Rich80105@hotmail.com> wrote:It was working, and may be picked up by other countries. Exposing a
So NactFirst are going to scrap the Smokefree Policy - raising someNo, it was a daft policy. There needs to be a different way to the Labour >>policy to stop pwople smoking. Their policy made no logical sense.
more money in the short term, but increasing costs for the health
system by millions, and killing many through the nasty side effects of >>>yet another drug addiction.
new group of young people to an addictive product that we know kills
just to raise money for income tax cuts is despicable.
Dying from the effects of smoking is nasty, and only a nastyYou can't help your abuse can you. They are not nasty,
The nasty coalition starting off as predicted. putting money ahead of >>>lives.
government would condemn a new group of users to such a fate.
what was nasty was the
last anti-democracy, anti New Zealanders government ousted a few weeks ago, >Off topic.
From the agreements:
There is also a suggestion that they will weaken standards for clean >>>water to save money and allow farmers to continue to send animal shit
and piss downstream for cities and towns to deal with.
Replace the National Policy Statement for Freshwater Management 2020
to allow district councils more flexibility in how they meet
environmental limits and seek advice on how to exempt councils from >obligations under the National Policy Statement for Freshwater
Management 2020 as soon as practicable.
and
Replace the National Policy Statement for Freshwater 2020 to rebalance
Te Mana o te Wai to better effect the interests of all water users
The suggestion was made on radio today - I cannot locate a link.
Cite or admit you made it up.Your spelling gets worse when you are lying . . .
What awful lefty rhetoric - and your desparation and lies are showing.
Dirty killers for their own profit. Shame on New Zealand for not >>>recognising the billions they will cost us to enrich their supporters
. . .
So NactFirst are going to scrap the Smokefree Policy - raising some
more money in the short term, but increasing costs for the health
system by millions, and killing many through the nasty side effects of
yet another drug addiction.
The nasty coalition starting off as predicted. putting money ahead of
lives.
There is also a suggestion that they will weaken standards for clean
water to save money and allow farmers to continue to send animal shit
and piss downstream for cities and towns to deal with.
Dirty killers for their own profit.
Shame on New Zealand for not
recognising the billions they will cost us to enrich their supporters
. . .
So NactFirst are going to scrap the Smokefree Policy - raising some
more money in the short term, but increasing costs for the health
system by millions, and killing many through the nasty side effects of
yet another drug addiction.
The nasty coalition starting off as predicted. putting money ahead of
lives.
There is also a suggestion that they will weaken standards for clean
water to save money and allow farmers to continue to send animal shit
and piss downstream for cities and towns to deal with.
Dirty killers for their own profit. Shame on New Zealand for not
recognising the billions they will cost us to enrich their supporters
. . .
Rich80105 <Rich80105@hotmail.com> wrote:
So NactFirst are going to scrap the Smokefree Policy - raising some
more money in the short term, but increasing costs for the health
system by millions, and killing many through the nasty side effects of
yet another drug addiction.
The nasty coalition starting off as predicted. putting money ahead of >>lives.
There is also a suggestion that they will weaken standards for clean
water to save money and allow farmers to continue to send animal shit
and piss downstream for cities and towns to deal with.
Dirty killers for their own profit. Shame on New Zealand for not >>recognising the billions they will cost us to enrich their supporters
. . .
BS . Cry harder Rich. This is a good policy as there was no way that
NZ would be smokefree by Labor's smokefree date. No one's forcing
people to smoke it's their choice. Hopefully the next woke policy is
to ditch NZTA's Road to Zero. That means zero cars not zero road
deaths as that's impossible unless you ban all cars ..
On Mon, 27 Nov 2023 10:28:35 +1300, Mutley <mutley2000@hotmail.com>This is not a U turn, National did not vote in the ammendment, Labour did.
wrote:
Rich80105 <Rich80105@hotmail.com> wrote:
So NactFirst are going to scrap the Smokefree Policy - raising some
more money in the short term, but increasing costs for the health
system by millions, and killing many through the nasty side effects of >>>yet another drug addiction.
The nasty coalition starting off as predicted. putting money ahead of >>>lives.
There is also a suggestion that they will weaken standards for clean >>>water to save money and allow farmers to continue to send animal shit
and piss downstream for cities and towns to deal with.
Dirty killers for their own profit. Shame on New Zealand for not >>>recognising the billions they will cost us to enrich their supporters
. . .
BS . Cry harder Rich. This is a good policy as there was no way that
NZ would be smokefree by Labor's smokefree date. No one's forcing
people to smoke it's their choice. Hopefully the next woke policy is
to ditch NZTA's Road to Zero. That means zero cars not zero road
deaths as that's impossible unless you ban all cars ..
"The Smokefree Environments and Regulated Products (Smoked Tobacco)
Amendment Act 2022 was passed at the end of last year as a
world-leading set of interventions to achieve a target set by the-then >National-led Government of being smoke free by 2025. More than a third
of young Maori women still smoke and the shift to banning sales for
those born in 2009, slashing the number of sales outlets and cutting
nicotine levels was forecast to dramatically reduce smoking rates. The >details of the changes are detailed by the Ministry of Health here
Treasury estimated in its Regulatory Impact Assessment (RIA) to
then-Health Minister Ayesha Verrall that the proposed changes would:
save 580,000 Health Adjusted Life Years (HALYs) using a 3% discount
rate and 2.21 million years when not using a discount rate;
Cut public health costs by $5.25 billion when using a 3% discount rate
and $15.5 billion without a discount rate; and,
Add $5.88 billion in productivity benefits from 25-65 year olds over
time using a 3% discount rate and $16.2 billion without a discount
rate.
“While not all impacts can be costed at this time, those that can
suggest that the costs will be significantly outweighed by the
benefits. The resultant savings in health spending and income gain
from increased productivity are estimated to far outstrip the reduced
revenue from excise tax.” Treasury in July 2021"
_______________
For more information, see: >https://thekaka.substack.com/p/the-very-opposite-of-social-investment
For National it appears that a negative return on investment is OK
provided it benefits themselves and their financial backers. This
U-Turn from previous National Policy is costing us billions. Perhaps
National realise that they only have three years, so they will give >themselves as much as possible while they can make it last . . .
Worth watching the website for the Taxpayer Union to see what they
think of this profligate waste of taxpayer resources . . . - or do you
think they may find it hard to criticise waste from this new
government?
Rich80105 <Rich80105@hotmail.com> wrote:from the link above:
On Mon, 27 Nov 2023 10:28:35 +1300, Mutley <mutley2000@hotmail.com>This is not a U turn, National did not vote in the ammendment, Labour did.
wrote:
Rich80105 <Rich80105@hotmail.com> wrote:
So NactFirst are going to scrap the Smokefree Policy - raising some >>>>more money in the short term, but increasing costs for the health >>>>system by millions, and killing many through the nasty side effects of >>>>yet another drug addiction.
The nasty coalition starting off as predicted. putting money ahead of >>>>lives.
There is also a suggestion that they will weaken standards for clean >>>>water to save money and allow farmers to continue to send animal shit >>>>and piss downstream for cities and towns to deal with.
Dirty killers for their own profit. Shame on New Zealand for not >>>>recognising the billions they will cost us to enrich their supporters
. . .
BS . Cry harder Rich. This is a good policy as there was no way that
NZ would be smokefree by Labor's smokefree date. No one's forcing
people to smoke it's their choice. Hopefully the next woke policy is
to ditch NZTA's Road to Zero. That means zero cars not zero road
deaths as that's impossible unless you ban all cars ..
"The Smokefree Environments and Regulated Products (Smoked Tobacco) >>Amendment Act 2022 was passed at the end of last year as a
world-leading set of interventions to achieve a target set by the-then >>National-led Government of being smoke free by 2025. More than a third
of young Maori women still smoke and the shift to banning sales for
those born in 2009, slashing the number of sales outlets and cutting >>nicotine levels was forecast to dramatically reduce smoking rates. The >>details of the changes are detailed by the Ministry of Health here
Treasury estimated in its Regulatory Impact Assessment (RIA) to
then-Health Minister Ayesha Verrall that the proposed changes would:
save 580,000 Health Adjusted Life Years (HALYs) using a 3% discount
rate and 2.21 million years when not using a discount rate;
Cut public health costs by $5.25 billion when using a 3% discount rate
and $15.5 billion without a discount rate; and,
Add $5.88 billion in productivity benefits from 25-65 year olds over
time using a 3% discount rate and $16.2 billion without a discount
rate.
“While not all impacts can be costed at this time, those that can
suggest that the costs will be significantly outweighed by the
benefits. The resultant savings in health spending and income gain
from increased productivity are estimated to far outstrip the reduced >>revenue from excise tax.” Treasury in July 2021"
_______________
For more information, see: >>https://thekaka.substack.com/p/the-very-opposite-of-social-investment
For National it appears that a negative return on investment is OK
provided it benefits themselves and their financial backers. This
U-Turn from previous National Policy is costing us billions. Perhaps >>National realise that they only have three years, so they will give >>themselves as much as possible while they can make it last . . .
It will not cost billions, that is lludicrous.
Labour lasted exactly 3 years last time and suffered the worst defeat of any >single party governmen in our history - no accident that!
Worth watching the website for the Taxpayer Union to see what they
think of this profligate waste of taxpayer resources . . . - or do you >>think they may find it hard to criticise waste from this new
government?
On Tue, 28 Nov 2023 02:47:46 -0000 (UTC), TonyHow many "billions" is that?
<lizandtony@orcon.net.nz> wrote:
Rich80105 <Rich80105@hotmail.com> wrote:from the link above:
On Mon, 27 Nov 2023 10:28:35 +1300, Mutley <mutley2000@hotmail.com> >>>wrote:This is not a U turn, National did not vote in the ammendment, Labour did. >>It will not cost billions, that is lludicrous.
Rich80105 <Rich80105@hotmail.com> wrote:
So NactFirst are going to scrap the Smokefree Policy - raising some >>>>>more money in the short term, but increasing costs for the health >>>>>system by millions, and killing many through the nasty side effects of >>>>>yet another drug addiction.
The nasty coalition starting off as predicted. putting money ahead of >>>>>lives.
There is also a suggestion that they will weaken standards for clean >>>>>water to save money and allow farmers to continue to send animal shit >>>>>and piss downstream for cities and towns to deal with.
Dirty killers for their own profit. Shame on New Zealand for not >>>>>recognising the billions they will cost us to enrich their supporters >>>>>. . .
BS . Cry harder Rich. This is a good policy as there was no way that >>>>NZ would be smokefree by Labor's smokefree date. No one's forcing >>>>people to smoke it's their choice. Hopefully the next woke policy is >>>>to ditch NZTA's Road to Zero. That means zero cars not zero road >>>>deaths as that's impossible unless you ban all cars ..
"The Smokefree Environments and Regulated Products (Smoked Tobacco) >>>Amendment Act 2022 was passed at the end of last year as a
world-leading set of interventions to achieve a target set by the-then >>>National-led Government of being smoke free by 2025. More than a third
of young Maori women still smoke and the shift to banning sales for
those born in 2009, slashing the number of sales outlets and cutting >>>nicotine levels was forecast to dramatically reduce smoking rates. The >>>details of the changes are detailed by the Ministry of Health here
Treasury estimated in its Regulatory Impact Assessment (RIA) to >>>then-Health Minister Ayesha Verrall that the proposed changes would:
save 580,000 Health Adjusted Life Years (HALYs) using a 3% discount
rate and 2.21 million years when not using a discount rate;
Cut public health costs by $5.25 billion when using a 3% discount rate >>>and $15.5 billion without a discount rate; and,
Add $5.88 billion in productivity benefits from 25-65 year olds over
time using a 3% discount rate and $16.2 billion without a discount
rate.
“While not all impacts can be costed at this time, those that can
suggest that the costs will be significantly outweighed by the
benefits. The resultant savings in health spending and income gain
from increased productivity are estimated to far outstrip the reduced >>>revenue from excise tax.” Treasury in July 2021"
_______________
For more information, see: >>>https://thekaka.substack.com/p/the-very-opposite-of-social-investment
For National it appears that a negative return on investment is OK >>>provided it benefits themselves and their financial backers. This
U-Turn from previous National Policy is costing us billions. Perhaps >>>National realise that they only have three years, so they will give >>>themselves as much as possible while they can make it last . . .
For every dollar of tobacco taxes, Treasury has estimated health and
lost productivity costs of up to 20 dollars.
Labour lasted exactly 3 years last time and suffered the worst defeat of any >>single party governmen in our history - no accident that!
Worth watching the website for the Taxpayer Union to see what they
think of this profligate waste of taxpayer resources . . . - or do you >>>think they may find it hard to criticise waste from this new
government?
And on another subject, there is one group that is now not getting any >benefit from the tax changes - surprise it is not the wealthy! >https://archive.li/wbOCs
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