While we have some time to go before the nature of the new government
is finalised, will National have the courage to abandon their promise
to index tax rates if they cannot get contra-funding measures over the
line?
https://tinyurl.com/yuuups6d
On Tue, 17 Oct 2023 21:07:46 +1300, Crash <nogood@dontbother.invalid>What a bitter and childish diatribe by a poor loser - best ignored.
wrote:
While we have some time to go before the nature of the new government
is finalised, will National have the courage to abandon their promise
to index tax rates if they cannot get contra-funding measures over the >>line?
https://tinyurl.com/yuuups6d
Cameron Bagrie has shown that he is effectively a National supporter -
on a panel before voting closed he hedged around the hole in
National's plan for tax cuts, and here he goes implying that there are >surprises in the books. Problem with that is that National have seen
the books with the Reserve Bank update; all Bagrie is doing now is
setting the scene for National to claim that they have a problem
because of anything but it being their own fault.
We know that inflation declined slightly faster than had been
predicted (I am surprised that National are not claiming credit for
that!), and we are likely to get back to very low rates again sooner
than most of the rest of the world. In general, given the huge
problems including Covid, Floods, National stopping highway
maintenance for two years, earthquakes, and slips; NZ remains in a
very strong financial position.
But the reality is that a bigger problem for National (but which they
will welcome if they can get it) is Winston not agreeing to open
floodgates on allowing foreigners to buy houses to the extent National >anticipated (which is well short of covering their tax cuts for the
wealthy in any event. National will be very sad, but explain it is all >Winston's fault . . . and find sneakier ways to pay off donors . . .
Poor Nicola Willis has been pushed into the background the last week
or so - she has shown that she cannot handle difficult questions about >finance issues; I suspect she cannot be trusted to be convincing when
she spouts the words she is given . . .
While we have some time to go before the nature of the new government
is finalised, will National have the courage to abandon their promise
to index tax rates if they cannot get contra-funding measures over the
line?
https://tinyurl.com/yuuups6d
While we have some time to go before the nature of the new government
is finalised, will National have the courage to abandon their promise
to index tax rates if they cannot get contra-funding measures over the
line?
https://tinyurl.com/yuuups6d
On 2023-10-17, Crash <nogood@dontbother.invalid> wrote:Are you accusing Treasury and the Reserve Bank of breaking the law,
While we have some time to go before the nature of the new governmentIf we get back to bsics of MMP, each party puts to the election the ideas >that it thinks is good. People vote on this.
is finalised, will National have the courage to abandon their promise
to index tax rates if they cannot get contra-funding measures over the
line?
https://tinyurl.com/yuuups6d
Now comes the checks and balances of MMP as the coalition is formed, or not. >The concept that National, or any party apart from the exception of one
party holding more than 50% of the seats as per Labour had in the last >session is going to result in some give and take.
Add to this and we know that Labour spent billions and I an sure that the >books when opened will show a completely different view to that told by >Labour.
National needs enough reasons to sell the off the table tax cuts to be able >to do it. I am sure Labour has done this, after all they are good at secret >agenda and spending.What do you mean by "off the table tax cuts", and what is it that you
On 17 Oct 2023 21:30:33 GMT, Gordon <Gordon@leaf.net.nz> wrote:There is no suggestion by Gordon that a crime has been committed - you are deliberately twisting his words.
On 2023-10-17, Crash <nogood@dontbother.invalid> wrote:Are you accusing Treasury and the Reserve Bank of breaking the law,
While we have some time to go before the nature of the new governmentIf we get back to bsics of MMP, each party puts to the election the ideas >>that it thinks is good. People vote on this.
is finalised, will National have the courage to abandon their promise
to index tax rates if they cannot get contra-funding measures over the
line?
https://tinyurl.com/yuuups6d
Now comes the checks and balances of MMP as the coalition is formed, or not. >>The concept that National, or any party apart from the exception of one >>party holding more than 50% of the seats as per Labour had in the last >>session is going to result in some give and take.
Add to this and we know that Labour spent billions and I an sure that the >>books when opened will show a completely different view to that told by >>Labour.
Gordon? National have seen the Pre-election fiscal update, which will
have given them a good idea of the financial position for New Zealand,
and they will now be getting briefings from quite a few departments.
What is your evidence that a crime has been committed, Gordon?
National needs enough reasons to sell the off the table tax cuts to be able >>to do it. I am sure Labour has done this, after all they are good at secret >>agenda and spending.What do you mean by "off the table tax cuts", and what is it that you
are stating Labour has done?
Rich80105 <Rich80105@hotmail.com> wrote:Gordon said " . . .and we know that Labour spent billions and I an
On 17 Oct 2023 21:30:33 GMT, Gordon <Gordon@leaf.net.nz> wrote:There is no suggestion by Gordon that a crime has been committed - you are >deliberately twisting his words.
On 2023-10-17, Crash <nogood@dontbother.invalid> wrote:Are you accusing Treasury and the Reserve Bank of breaking the law,
While we have some time to go before the nature of the new governmentIf we get back to bsics of MMP, each party puts to the election the ideas >>>that it thinks is good. People vote on this.
is finalised, will National have the courage to abandon their promise
to index tax rates if they cannot get contra-funding measures over the >>>> line?
https://tinyurl.com/yuuups6d
Now comes the checks and balances of MMP as the coalition is formed, or not. >>>The concept that National, or any party apart from the exception of one >>>party holding more than 50% of the seats as per Labour had in the last >>>session is going to result in some give and take.
Add to this and we know that Labour spent billions and I an sure that the >>>books when opened will show a completely different view to that told by >>>Labour.
Gordon? National have seen the Pre-election fiscal update, which will
have given them a good idea of the financial position for New Zealand,
and they will now be getting briefings from quite a few departments.
What is your evidence that a crime has been committed, Gordon?
Shame on you - once more!
National needs enough reasons to sell the off the table tax cuts to be able >>>to do it. I am sure Labour has done this, after all they are good at secret >>>agenda and spending.What do you mean by "off the table tax cuts", and what is it that you
are stating Labour has done?
On Wed, 18 Oct 2023 05:21:04 -0000 (UTC), TonyPerfectly reasonable. All political parties and all governments tell half truths and sometimes downright lies, and Labour was no exception last time.
<lizandtony@orcon.net.nz> wrote:
Rich80105 <Rich80105@hotmail.com> wrote:Gordon said " . . .and we know that Labour spent billions and I an
On 17 Oct 2023 21:30:33 GMT, Gordon <Gordon@leaf.net.nz> wrote:There is no suggestion by Gordon that a crime has been committed - you are >>deliberately twisting his words.
On 2023-10-17, Crash <nogood@dontbother.invalid> wrote:Are you accusing Treasury and the Reserve Bank of breaking the law, >>>Gordon? National have seen the Pre-election fiscal update, which will >>>have given them a good idea of the financial position for New Zealand, >>>and they will now be getting briefings from quite a few departments.
While we have some time to go before the nature of the new government >>>>> is finalised, will National have the courage to abandon their promise >>>>> to index tax rates if they cannot get contra-funding measures over the >>>>> line?If we get back to bsics of MMP, each party puts to the election the ideas >>>>that it thinks is good. People vote on this.
https://tinyurl.com/yuuups6d
Now comes the checks and balances of MMP as the coalition is formed, or not.
The concept that National, or any party apart from the exception of one >>>>party holding more than 50% of the seats as per Labour had in the last >>>>session is going to result in some give and take.
Add to this and we know that Labour spent billions and I an sure that the >>>>books when opened will show a completely different view to that told by >>>>Labour.
What is your evidence that a crime has been committed, Gordon?
Shame on you - once more!
sure that the books when opened will show a completely different view
to that told by Labour. "
Now the books have been opened, and National saw them at the same time
as Labour did. Whatever Labour said about them is irrelevant to
National who were able to form their own view. If the books that were
opened show a completely different view from reality as known by
Treasury at that time, then a crime would have been committed.
I wasObviously he wasn't so don't ask idiotic and pointed questions. You love to hit the man don't you? Try the ball for a change.
asking if that was what Gordon was accusing as having happened.
I was not twisting Gordon words - I was asking him whether he had any >evidence of such a situation.Nonsense.
Unless you are the same person asTrying to shut me up are you? I thought you saw yourself as the champion of open discussion here - must have got that wrong then!
Gordon, why don't you shut up and see whether he actually responds?
National needs enough reasons to sell the off the table tax cuts to be able >>>>to do it. I am sure Labour has done this, after all they are good at secret >>>>agenda and spending.What do you mean by "off the table tax cuts", and what is it that you
are stating Labour has done?
On Tue, 17 Oct 2023 21:50:53 +1300, Rich80105 <Rich80105@hotmail.com>Cameron Bagrie's opinions formed a large part of the article at the
wrote:
On Tue, 17 Oct 2023 21:07:46 +1300, Crash <nogood@dontbother.invalid> >>wrote:Irrelevant. I did not mention Bagrie - I simply posted about National
While we have some time to go before the nature of the new government
is finalised, will National have the courage to abandon their promise
to index tax rates if they cannot get contra-funding measures over the >>>line?
https://tinyurl.com/yuuups6d
Cameron Bagrie has shown that he is effectively a National supporter -
on a panel before voting closed he hedged around the hole in
National's plan for tax cuts, and here he goes implying that there are >>surprises in the books. Problem with that is that National have seen
the books with the Reserve Bank update; all Bagrie is doing now is
setting the scene for National to claim that they have a problem
because of anything but it being their own fault.
and their planed tax changes.
Which was not the substance of the article you referenced.We know that inflation declined slightly faster than had beenIrrelevant again. I simply posted about National and their planed tax >changes.
predicted (I am surprised that National are not claiming credit for
that!), and we are likely to get back to very low rates again sooner
than most of the rest of the world. In general, given the huge
problems including Covid, Floods, National stopping highway
maintenance for two years, earthquakes, and slips; NZ remains in a
very strong financial position.
Which was what my comment related to.But the reality is that a bigger problem for National (but which theyIrrelevant again. I simply posted about National and their planed tax >changes.
will welcome if they can get it) is Winston not agreeing to open
floodgates on allowing foreigners to buy houses to the extent National >>anticipated (which is well short of covering their tax cuts for the
wealthy in any event. National will be very sad, but explain it is all >>Winston's fault . . . and find sneakier ways to pay off donors . . .
Willis is the putative Finance Minister for the new government when itPoor Nicola Willis has been pushed into the background the last week
or so - she has shown that she cannot handle difficult questions about >>finance issues; I suspect she cannot be trusted to be convincing when
she spouts the words she is given . .
Irrelevant again. I did not mention Willis. I simply posted about
National and their planed tax changes..
On Tue, 17 Oct 2023 21:07:46 +1300, Crash <nogood@dontbother.invalid>
wrote:
While we have some time to go before the nature of the new government
is finalised, will National have the courage to abandon their promise
to index tax rates if they cannot get contra-funding measures over the >>line?
https://tinyurl.com/yuuups6d
Cameron Bagrie has shown that he is effectively a National supporter -
on a panel before voting closed he hedged around the hole in
National's plan for tax cuts, and here he goes implying that there are >surprises in the books. Problem with that is that National have seen
the books with the Reserve Bank update; all Bagrie is doing now is
setting the scene for National to claim that they have a problem
because of anything but it being their own fault.
We know that inflation declined slightly faster than had been
predicted (I am surprised that National are not claiming credit for
that!), and we are likely to get back to very low rates again sooner
than most of the rest of the world. In general, given the huge
problems including Covid, Floods, National stopping highway
maintenance for two years, earthquakes, and slips; NZ remains in a
very strong financial position.
But the reality is that a bigger problem for National (but which they
will welcome if they can get it) is Winston not agreeing to open
floodgates on allowing foreigners to buy houses to the extent National >anticipated (which is well short of covering their tax cuts for the
wealthy in any event. National will be very sad, but explain it is all >Winston's fault . . . and find sneakier ways to pay off donors . . .
Poor Nicola Willis has been pushed into the background the last week
or so - she has shown that she cannot handle difficult questions about >finance issues; I suspect she cannot be trusted to be convincing when
she spouts the words she is given . .
On Wed, 18 Oct 2023 20:39:44 +1300, Crash <nogood@dontbother.invalid>
wrote:
On Tue, 17 Oct 2023 21:50:53 +1300, Rich80105 <Rich80105@hotmail.com> >>wrote:Cameron Bagrie's opinions formed a large part of the article at the
On Tue, 17 Oct 2023 21:07:46 +1300, Crash <nogood@dontbother.invalid> >>>wrote:Irrelevant. I did not mention Bagrie - I simply posted about National
While we have some time to go before the nature of the new government >>>>is finalised, will National have the courage to abandon their promise >>>>to index tax rates if they cannot get contra-funding measures over the >>>>line?
https://tinyurl.com/yuuups6d
Cameron Bagrie has shown that he is effectively a National supporter -
on a panel before voting closed he hedged around the hole in
National's plan for tax cuts, and here he goes implying that there are >>>surprises in the books. Problem with that is that National have seen
the books with the Reserve Bank update; all Bagrie is doing now is >>>setting the scene for National to claim that they have a problem
because of anything but it being their own fault.
and their planed tax changes.
url you posted - he headline for the article was "Election 2023:
Cameron Bagrie warns National could get 'reality check' when they open
Govt books, tax cuts no certainty to happen"
I was commenting on an important issue in relation to the article.
Which was not the substance of the article you referenced.
We know that inflation declined slightly faster than had beenIrrelevant again. I simply posted about National and their planed tax >>changes.
predicted (I am surprised that National are not claiming credit for >>>that!), and we are likely to get back to very low rates again sooner
than most of the rest of the world. In general, given the huge
problems including Covid, Floods, National stopping highway
maintenance for two years, earthquakes, and slips; NZ remains in a
very strong financial position.
Which was what my comment related to.
But the reality is that a bigger problem for National (but which they >>>will welcome if they can get it) is Winston not agreeing to open >>>floodgates on allowing foreigners to buy houses to the extent National >>>anticipated (which is well short of covering their tax cuts for the >>>wealthy in any event. National will be very sad, but explain it is all >>>Winston's fault . . . and find sneakier ways to pay off donors . . .Irrelevant again. I simply posted about National and their planed tax >>changes.
Willis is the putative Finance Minister for the new government when itPoor Nicola Willis has been pushed into the background the last week
or so - she has shown that she cannot handle difficult questions about >>>finance issues; I suspect she cannot be trusted to be convincing when
she spouts the words she is given . .
Irrelevant again. I did not mention Willis. I simply posted about >>National and their planed tax changes..
is formed - of course her credibility or lack of it is relevant to
such an important promise which so many saw as inadequately supported
by facts . . .
On Wed, 18 Oct 2023 21:07:34 +1300, Rich80105 <Rich80105@hotmail.com>Barrie's statements are the basis for the article.
wrote:
On Wed, 18 Oct 2023 20:39:44 +1300, Crash <nogood@dontbother.invalid> >>wrote:But your comments were not directed at the subject of this thread, but
On Tue, 17 Oct 2023 21:50:53 +1300, Rich80105 <Rich80105@hotmail.com> >>>wrote:Cameron Bagrie's opinions formed a large part of the article at the
On Tue, 17 Oct 2023 21:07:46 +1300, Crash <nogood@dontbother.invalid> >>>>wrote:Irrelevant. I did not mention Bagrie - I simply posted about National >>>and their planed tax changes.
While we have some time to go before the nature of the new government >>>>>is finalised, will National have the courage to abandon their promise >>>>>to index tax rates if they cannot get contra-funding measures over the >>>>>line?
https://tinyurl.com/yuuups6d
Cameron Bagrie has shown that he is effectively a National supporter - >>>>on a panel before voting closed he hedged around the hole in
National's plan for tax cuts, and here he goes implying that there are >>>>surprises in the books. Problem with that is that National have seen >>>>the books with the Reserve Bank update; all Bagrie is doing now is >>>>setting the scene for National to claim that they have a problem >>>>because of anything but it being their own fault.
url you posted - he headline for the article was "Election 2023:
Cameron Bagrie warns National could get 'reality check' when they open
Govt books, tax cuts no certainty to happen"
I was commenting on an important issue in relation to the article.
at unrelated speculation about the commentator.
Exactly - that is a concern to many New Zealanders - and apparentlyReally? Read the article headline again. It referenced uncertaintyWhich was not the substance of the article you referenced.We know that inflation declined slightly faster than had beenIrrelevant again. I simply posted about National and their planed tax >>>changes.
predicted (I am surprised that National are not claiming credit for >>>>that!), and we are likely to get back to very low rates again sooner >>>>than most of the rest of the world. In general, given the huge
problems including Covid, Floods, National stopping highway
maintenance for two years, earthquakes, and slips; NZ remains in a
very strong financial position.
about the affordability of tax cuts'.
Absolutely - I am glad you agree; Shane Reti appears to agree as wellWhich was what my comment related to.
But the reality is that a bigger problem for National (but which they >>>>will welcome if they can get it) is Winston not agreeing to open >>>>floodgates on allowing foreigners to buy houses to the extent National >>>>anticipated (which is well short of covering their tax cuts for the >>>>wealthy in any event. National will be very sad, but explain it is all >>>>Winston's fault . . . and find sneakier ways to pay off donors . . .Irrelevant again. I simply posted about National and their planed tax >>>changes.
So accusing Bagrie of being a National supporter was not a part ofYes it is - Bagrie hedged on the effect of tax cuts and was clearly uncomfortable with having to hedge on wholeheartedly supporting
commenting on affordability of tax cuts.
As was I - Willis was not being credible so took a back seat. She is
Poor Nicola Willis has been pushed into the background the last week
or so - she has shown that she cannot handle difficult questions about >>>>finance issues; I suspect she cannot be trusted to be convincing when >>>>she spouts the words she is given . .
Irrelevant again. I did not mention Willis. I simply posted about >>>National and their planed tax changes..
It is relevant that their finance spokesperson cannot honestly assertWillis is the putative Finance Minister for the new government when it
is formed - of course her credibility or lack of it is relevant to
such an important promise which so many saw as inadequately supported
by facts . . .
Willis was not mentioned by me or in the article. You are dragging >irrelevancies into the thread.
You have not actually addressed the core subject of this thread - seeIt's not a big promise - and if I recall there was no promise to
the wording of my original post.
On Wed, 18 Oct 2023 05:21:04 -0000 (UTC), Tony
<lizandtony@orcon.net.nz> wrote:
Rich80105 <Rich80105@hotmail.com> wrote:
On 17 Oct 2023 21:30:33 GMT, Gordon <Gordon@leaf.net.nz> wrote:
On 2023-10-17, Crash <nogood@dontbother.invalid> wrote:Are you accusing Treasury and the Reserve Bank of breaking the law, >>>Gordon? National have seen the Pre-election fiscal update, which will >>>have given them a good idea of the financial position for New Zealand, >>>and they will now be getting briefings from quite a few departments.
While we have some time to go before the nature of the new government >>>>> is finalised, will National have the courage to abandon their promise >>>>> to index tax rates if they cannot get contra-funding measures over the >>>>> line?If we get back to bsics of MMP, each party puts to the election the ideas >>>>that it thinks is good. People vote on this.
https://tinyurl.com/yuuups6d
Now comes the checks and balances of MMP as the coalition is formed, or not.
The concept that National, or any party apart from the exception of one >>>>party holding more than 50% of the seats as per Labour had in the last >>>>session is going to result in some give and take.
Add to this and we know that Labour spent billions and I an sure that the >>>>books when opened will show a completely different view to that told by >>>>Labour.
What is your evidence that a crime has been committed, Gordon?
There is no suggestion by Gordon that a crime has been committed - you are >>deliberately twisting his words.Gordon said " . . .and we know that Labour spent billions and I an
Shame on you - once more!
sure that the books when opened will show a completely different view
to that told by Labour. "
Now the books have been opened, and National saw them at the same time
as Labour did. Whatever Labour said about them is irrelevant to
National who were able to form their own view. If the books that were
opened show a completely different view from reality as known by
Treasury at that time, then a crime would have been committed. I was
asking if that was what Gordon was accusing as having happened.
I was not twisting Gordon words - I was asking him whether he had any evidence of such a situation. Unless you are the same person as
Gordon, why don't you shut up and see whether he actually responds?
National needs enough reasons to sell the off the table tax cuts to be able >>>>to do it. I am sure Labour has done this, after all they are good at secret >>>>agenda and spending.What do you mean by "off the table tax cuts", and what is it that you
are stating Labour has done?
On 2023-10-18, Rich80105 <Rich...@hotmail.com> wrote:
On Wed, 18 Oct 2023 05:21:04 -0000 (UTC), Tony
<lizan...@orcon.net.nz> wrote:
None at all.Rich80105 <Rich...@hotmail.com> wrote:
On 17 Oct 2023 21:30:33 GMT, Gordon <Gor...@leaf.net.nz> wrote:
On 2023-10-17, Crash <nog...@dontbother.invalid> wrote:Are you accusing Treasury and the Reserve Bank of breaking the law, >>>Gordon? National have seen the Pre-election fiscal update, which will >>>have given them a good idea of the financial position for New Zealand, >>>and they will now be getting briefings from quite a few departments. >>>What is your evidence that a crime has been committed, Gordon?
While we have some time to go before the nature of the new government >>>>> is finalised, will National have the courage to abandon their promise >>>>> to index tax rates if they cannot get contra-funding measures over the >>>>> line?If we get back to bsics of MMP, each party puts to the election the ideas >>>>that it thinks is good. People vote on this.
https://tinyurl.com/yuuups6d
Now comes the checks and balances of MMP as the coalition is formed, or not.
The concept that National, or any party apart from the exception of one >>>>party holding more than 50% of the seats as per Labour had in the last >>>>session is going to result in some give and take.
Add to this and we know that Labour spent billions and I an sure that the >>>>books when opened will show a completely different view to that told by >>>>Labour.
In the era of covid was not some $21 billion spend by the Labour Government?There is no suggestion by Gordon that a crime has been committed - you are >>deliberately twisting his words.Gordon said " . . .and we know that Labour spent billions and I an
Shame on you - once more!
sure that the books when opened will show a completely different view
to that told by Labour. "
Now the books have been opened, and National saw them at the same time
as Labour did. Whatever Labour said about them is irrelevant to
National who were able to form their own view. If the books that were opened show a completely different view from reality as known by
Treasury at that time, then a crime would have been committed. I was
asking if that was what Gordon was accusing as having happened.
I was not twisting Gordon words - I was asking him whether he had any evidence of such a situation. Unless you are the same person as
Gordon, why don't you shut up and see whether he actually responds?
Good-bye.National needs enough reasons to sell the off the table tax cuts to be ableWhat do you mean by "off the table tax cuts", and what is it that you >>>are stating Labour has done?
to do it. I am sure Labour has done this, after all they are good at secret
agenda and spending.
On 19 Oct 2023 06:30:52 GMT, Gordon <Gordon@leaf.net.nz> wrote:Speaking of unwarranted slurs - see that comment by Rich80105 - it seems that of the regular visitors here only one person does not make such slurs and that is ----- wait for it ---- rich80105 ----TaDa!
On 2023-10-18, Rich80105 <Rich80105@hotmail.com> wrote:two annual budgets with a lot of data published - the books have been
On Wed, 18 Oct 2023 05:21:04 -0000 (UTC), Tony
<lizandtony@orcon.net.nz> wrote:
Rich80105 <Rich80105@hotmail.com> wrote:
On 17 Oct 2023 21:30:33 GMT, Gordon <Gordon@leaf.net.nz> wrote:
On 2023-10-17, Crash <nogood@dontbother.invalid> wrote:Are you accusing Treasury and the Reserve Bank of breaking the law, >>>>>Gordon? National have seen the Pre-election fiscal update, which will >>>>>have given them a good idea of the financial position for New Zealand, >>>>>and they will now be getting briefings from quite a few departments. >>>>>What is your evidence that a crime has been committed, Gordon?
While we have some time to go before the nature of the new government >>>>>>> is finalised, will National have the courage to abandon their promise >>>>>>> to index tax rates if they cannot get contra-funding measures over the >>>>>>> line?If we get back to bsics of MMP, each party puts to the election the ideas >>>>>>that it thinks is good. People vote on this.
https://tinyurl.com/yuuups6d
Now comes the checks and balances of MMP as the coalition is formed, or >>>>>>not.
The concept that National, or any party apart from the exception of one >>>>>>party holding more than 50% of the seats as per Labour had in the last >>>>>>session is going to result in some give and take.
Add to this and we know that Labour spent billions and I an sure that the >>>>>>books when opened will show a completely different view to that told by >>>>>>Labour.
None at all.
There is no suggestion by Gordon that a crime has been committed - you are >>>>deliberately twisting his words.Gordon said " . . .and we know that Labour spent billions and I an
Shame on you - once more!
sure that the books when opened will show a completely different view
to that told by Labour. "
In the era of covid was not some $21 billion spend by the Labour Government? >Yes - a very long time ago now. Since then there have been at least
opened each year since that spending as budgets were announced and
enough data made public for many people to be able to see exactly what
is in the books"". More importantly, there is by law a "pre-election
fiscal update" which provides each political party with a similar
amount of data so that they can refine their policies.
National announced their policy just before that fiscal update, and
many economists were sceptical that they could raise the amount of
money they predicted from foreign purchasers of property. ACT held off
on all announcements of their policies until the "books had been
opened", and modified some as a result. The reality is that each time
the "books have been opened" over the last year (we do have quarterly >reporting which gives nearly as much information as a budget), the
financial position of New Zealand has been slightly better than
predicted, but even the right-leaning Cameron Bagrie could not do
better than to say that the policy outlined by Nicola Willis had
required heroic assumptions to be justified.
Nicola Willis suffered a severe setback to her personal credibility,
and Luxon's "Rock Solid" mantra became a joke - but now they have to
face the reality of their error. Already Shane Reti is saying that
Whangarei Hospital is not a priority for the first term . . .
Indeed - just like Tony and the Johns - make an unwarranted slur andNow the books have been opened, and National saw them at the same time
as Labour did. Whatever Labour said about them is irrelevant to
National who were able to form their own view. If the books that were
opened show a completely different view from reality as known by
Treasury at that time, then a crime would have been committed. I was
asking if that was what Gordon was accusing as having happened.
I was not twisting Gordon words - I was asking him whether he had any
evidence of such a situation. Unless you are the same person as
Gordon, why don't you shut up and see whether he actually responds?
National needs enough reasons to sell the off the table tax cuts to be >>>>>>ableWhat do you mean by "off the table tax cuts", and what is it that you >>>>>are stating Labour has done?
to do it. I am sure Labour has done this, after all they are good at >>>>>>secret
agenda and spending.
Good-bye.
then avoid justifying it.
So what was that secret agenda and secret
spending, Gordon?
National have probably been able to sell their tax cuts to many
people, even though the assumption about foreign buyers is widely
regarded as bullshit - but now reality will face them in actually
making it happen.
On 2023-10-18, Rich80105 <Rich80105@hotmail.com> wrote:two annual budgets with a lot of data published - the books have been
On Wed, 18 Oct 2023 05:21:04 -0000 (UTC), Tony
<lizandtony@orcon.net.nz> wrote:
Rich80105 <Rich80105@hotmail.com> wrote:
On 17 Oct 2023 21:30:33 GMT, Gordon <Gordon@leaf.net.nz> wrote:
On 2023-10-17, Crash <nogood@dontbother.invalid> wrote:Are you accusing Treasury and the Reserve Bank of breaking the law, >>>>Gordon? National have seen the Pre-election fiscal update, which will >>>>have given them a good idea of the financial position for New Zealand, >>>>and they will now be getting briefings from quite a few departments. >>>>What is your evidence that a crime has been committed, Gordon?
While we have some time to go before the nature of the new government >>>>>> is finalised, will National have the courage to abandon their promise >>>>>> to index tax rates if they cannot get contra-funding measures over the >>>>>> line?If we get back to bsics of MMP, each party puts to the election the ideas >>>>>that it thinks is good. People vote on this.
https://tinyurl.com/yuuups6d
Now comes the checks and balances of MMP as the coalition is formed, or not.
The concept that National, or any party apart from the exception of one >>>>>party holding more than 50% of the seats as per Labour had in the last >>>>>session is going to result in some give and take.
Add to this and we know that Labour spent billions and I an sure that the >>>>>books when opened will show a completely different view to that told by >>>>>Labour.
None at all.
There is no suggestion by Gordon that a crime has been committed - you are >>>deliberately twisting his words.Gordon said " . . .and we know that Labour spent billions and I an
Shame on you - once more!
sure that the books when opened will show a completely different view
to that told by Labour. "
In the era of covid was not some $21 billion spend by the Labour Government? Yes - a very long time ago now. Since then there have been at least
Indeed - just like Tony and the Johns - make an unwarranted slur andNow the books have been opened, and National saw them at the same time
as Labour did. Whatever Labour said about them is irrelevant to
National who were able to form their own view. If the books that were
opened show a completely different view from reality as known by
Treasury at that time, then a crime would have been committed. I was
asking if that was what Gordon was accusing as having happened.
I was not twisting Gordon words - I was asking him whether he had any
evidence of such a situation. Unless you are the same person as
Gordon, why don't you shut up and see whether he actually responds?
National needs enough reasons to sell the off the table tax cuts to be ableWhat do you mean by "off the table tax cuts", and what is it that you >>>>are stating Labour has done?
to do it. I am sure Labour has done this, after all they are good at secret
agenda and spending.
Good-bye.
On 19 Oct 2023 06:30:52 GMT, Gordon <Gor...@leaf.net.nz> wrote:All this bullshit doesn't change the fact Labour are considered the worst government in New Zealand. Only a Royal commission will excuse Labours excesses during covid and might explain why so much they finally got around to wasting was justified if at
On 2023-10-18, Rich80105 <Rich...@hotmail.com> wrote:
On Wed, 18 Oct 2023 05:21:04 -0000 (UTC), Tony
<lizan...@orcon.net.nz> wrote:
Rich80105 <Rich...@hotmail.com> wrote:
On 17 Oct 2023 21:30:33 GMT, Gordon <Gor...@leaf.net.nz> wrote:
On 2023-10-17, Crash <nog...@dontbother.invalid> wrote:Are you accusing Treasury and the Reserve Bank of breaking the law, >>>>Gordon? National have seen the Pre-election fiscal update, which will >>>>have given them a good idea of the financial position for New Zealand, >>>>and they will now be getting briefings from quite a few departments. >>>>What is your evidence that a crime has been committed, Gordon?
While we have some time to go before the nature of the new government >>>>>> is finalised, will National have the courage to abandon their promise >>>>>> to index tax rates if they cannot get contra-funding measures over theIf we get back to bsics of MMP, each party puts to the election the ideas
line?
https://tinyurl.com/yuuups6d
that it thinks is good. People vote on this.
Now comes the checks and balances of MMP as the coalition is formed, or not.
The concept that National, or any party apart from the exception of one >>>>>party holding more than 50% of the seats as per Labour had in the last >>>>>session is going to result in some give and take.
Add to this and we know that Labour spent billions and I an sure that the
books when opened will show a completely different view to that told by >>>>>Labour.
None at all.
There is no suggestion by Gordon that a crime has been committed - you areGordon said " . . .and we know that Labour spent billions and I an
deliberately twisting his words.
Shame on you - once more!
sure that the books when opened will show a completely different view
to that told by Labour. "
In the era of covid was not some $21 billion spend by the Labour Government? Yes - a very long time ago now. Since then there have been at leasttwo annual budgets with a lot of data published - the books have been
opened each year since that spending as budgets were announced and
enough data made public for many people to be able to see exactly what
is in the books"". More importantly, there is by law a "pre-election
fiscal update" which provides each political party with a similar
amount of data so that they can refine their policies.
National announced their policy just before that fiscal update, and
many economists were sceptical that they could raise the amount of
money they predicted from foreign purchasers of property. ACT held off
on all announcements of their policies until the "books had been
opened", and modified some as a result. The reality is that each time
the "books have been opened" over the last year (we do have quarterly reporting which gives nearly as much information as a budget), the
financial position of New Zealand has been slightly better than
predicted, but even the right-leaning Cameron Bagrie could not do
better than to say that the policy outlined by Nicola Willis had
required heroic assumptions to be justified.
Nicola Willis suffered a severe setback to her personal credibility,
and Luxon's "Rock Solid" mantra became a joke - but now they have to
face the reality of their error. Already Shane Reti is saying that
Whangarei Hospital is not a priority for the first term . . .
Now the books have been opened, and National saw them at the same time
as Labour did. Whatever Labour said about them is irrelevant to
National who were able to form their own view. If the books that were
opened show a completely different view from reality as known by
Treasury at that time, then a crime would have been committed. I was
asking if that was what Gordon was accusing as having happened.
I was not twisting Gordon words - I was asking him whether he had any
evidence of such a situation. Unless you are the same person as
Gordon, why don't you shut up and see whether he actually responds?
National needs enough reasons to sell the off the table tax cuts to be ableWhat do you mean by "off the table tax cuts", and what is it that you >>>>are stating Labour has done?
to do it. I am sure Labour has done this, after all they are good at secret
agenda and spending.
Good-bye.Indeed - just like Tony and the Johns - make an unwarranted slur and
then avoid justifying it. So what was that secret agenda and secret spending, Gordon?
National have probably been able to sell their tax cuts to many
people, even though the assumption about foreign buyers is widely
regarded as bullshit - but now reality will face them in actually
making it happen.
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