An interesting read for the rest of us. Mainly because unlike Rich we have open minds...
https://www.chrislynchmedia.com/news-items/thedisinformationproject#.ZDMjdFAu1jG.twitter
On Sun, 9 Apr 2023 15:06:13 -0700 (PDT), John BowesIt's sad to see that you still cannot address the content, you just have to attack people instead.
<bowesjohn02@gmail.com> wrote:
On Monday, April 10, 2023 at 9:38:56?AM UTC+12, John Bowes wrote:
An interesting read for the rest of us. Mainly because unlike Rich we have >>>open minds...
https://www.chrislynchmedia.com/news-items/thedisinformationproject#.ZDMjdFAu1jG.twitter
Yet more that doesn't fit Richie's mainstream disinformed mind...
https://nzdsos.com/2023/02/28/fifth-generation-warfare/
It is sad to see the rabbit holes some go down - see: >https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/health/coronavirus/300439357/covid19-nz-why-a-small-group-of-doctors-opposes-vaccination
On Monday, April 10, 2023 at 9:38:56?AM UTC+12, John Bowes wrote:
An interesting read for the rest of us. Mainly because unlike Rich we have open minds...
https://www.chrislynchmedia.com/news-items/thedisinformationproject#.ZDMjdFAu1jG.twitter
Yet more that doesn't fit Richie's mainstream disinformed mind...
https://nzdsos.com/2023/02/28/fifth-generation-warfare/
Rich80105 <Rich...@hotmail.com> wrote:Don't blame Rich. Blame the Labour mental health initiative that's failed Rich...
On Sun, 9 Apr 2023 15:06:13 -0700 (PDT), John Bowes
<bowes...@gmail.com> wrote:
On Monday, April 10, 2023 at 9:38:56?AM UTC+12, John Bowes wrote:
An interesting read for the rest of us. Mainly because unlike Rich we have
open minds...
https://www.chrislynchmedia.com/news-items/thedisinformationproject#.ZDMjdFAu1jG.twitter
Yet more that doesn't fit Richie's mainstream disinformed mind...
https://nzdsos.com/2023/02/28/fifth-generation-warfare/
It is sad to see the rabbit holes some go down - see: >https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/health/coronavirus/300439357/covid19-nz-why-a-small-group-of-doctors-opposes-vaccinationIt's sad to see that you still cannot address the content, you just have to attack people instead.
On Sun, 9 Apr 2023 15:06:13 -0700 (PDT), John Bowes
<bowes...@gmail.com> wrote:
On Monday, April 10, 2023 at 9:38:56?AM UTC+12, John Bowes wrote:
An interesting read for the rest of us. Mainly because unlike Rich we have open minds...
https://www.chrislynchmedia.com/news-items/thedisinformationproject#.ZDMjdFAu1jG.twitter
Yet more that doesn't fit Richie's mainstream disinformed mind...
https://nzdsos.com/2023/02/28/fifth-generation-warfare/It is sad to see the rabbit holes some go down - see: https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/health/coronavirus/300439357/covid19-nz-why-a-small-group-of-doctors-opposes-vaccination
On Sun, 9 Apr 2023 15:06:13 -0700 (PDT), John Bowes
<bowesjohn02@gmail.com> wrote:
On Monday, April 10, 2023 at 9:38:56?AM UTC+12, John Bowes wrote:
An interesting read for the rest of us. Mainly because unlike Rich we have open minds...
https://www.chrislynchmedia.com/news-items/thedisinformationproject#.ZDMjdFAu1jG.twitter
Yet more that doesn't fit Richie's mainstream disinformed mind...
https://nzdsos.com/2023/02/28/fifth-generation-warfare/
It is sad to see the rabbit holes some go down - see: https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/health/coronavirus/300439357/covid19-nz-why-a-small-group-of-doctors-opposes-vaccination
On 2023-04-09, Rich80105 <Rich...@hotmail.com> wrote:
On Sun, 9 Apr 2023 15:06:13 -0700 (PDT), John Bowes
<bowes...@gmail.com> wrote:
On Monday, April 10, 2023 at 9:38:56?AM UTC+12, John Bowes wrote:
An interesting read for the rest of us. Mainly because unlike Rich we have open minds...
https://www.chrislynchmedia.com/news-items/thedisinformationproject#.ZDMjdFAu1jG.twitter
Yet more that doesn't fit Richie's mainstream disinformed mind...
https://nzdsos.com/2023/02/28/fifth-generation-warfare/
It is sad to see the rabbit holes some go down - see: https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/health/coronavirus/300439357/covid19-nz-why-a-small-group-of-doctors-opposes-vaccinationThat article is 18 months ago. Things have changed in that time. It is before Omicron's arrival.
The fact that we have this almost total disregard of the option to changing the view point as the real world has changed says an awful lot.
On 2023-04-09, Rich80105 <Rich80105@hotmail.com> wrote:
On Sun, 9 Apr 2023 15:06:13 -0700 (PDT), John Bowes >><bowesjohn02@gmail.com> wrote:
On Monday, April 10, 2023 at 9:38:56?AM UTC+12, John Bowes wrote:
An interesting read for the rest of us. Mainly because unlike Rich we have open minds...
https://www.chrislynchmedia.com/news-items/thedisinformationproject#.ZDMjdFAu1jG.twitter
Yet more that doesn't fit Richie's mainstream disinformed mind...
https://nzdsos.com/2023/02/28/fifth-generation-warfare/
It is sad to see the rabbit holes some go down - see:
https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/health/coronavirus/300439357/covid19-nz-why-a-small-group-of-doctors-opposes-vaccination
That article is 18 months ago. Things have changed in that time. It is
before Omicron's arrival.
The fact that we have this almost total disregard of the option to changing >the view point as the real world has changed says an awful lot.
On 10 Apr 2023 00:38:09 GMT, Gordon <Gor...@leaf.net.nz> wrote:Prove it! Apparently you're such an arrogant Marxist muppet you believe you don't have to back up your disinformation with facts Rich. As usual you don't practice what you arrogantly demand from others. So how about playing by the rules you insist others
On 2023-04-09, Rich80105 <Rich...@hotmail.com> wrote:
On Sun, 9 Apr 2023 15:06:13 -0700 (PDT), John Bowes >><bowes...@gmail.com> wrote:
On Monday, April 10, 2023 at 9:38:56?AM UTC+12, John Bowes wrote:
An interesting read for the rest of us. Mainly because unlike Rich we have open minds...
https://www.chrislynchmedia.com/news-items/thedisinformationproject#.ZDMjdFAu1jG.twitter
Yet more that doesn't fit Richie's mainstream disinformed mind...
https://nzdsos.com/2023/02/28/fifth-generation-warfare/
It is sad to see the rabbit holes some go down - see:
https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/health/coronavirus/300439357/covid19-nz-why-a-small-group-of-doctors-opposes-vaccination
That article is 18 months ago. Things have changed in that time. It is >before Omicron's arrival.
The fact that we have this almost total disregard of the option to changing >the view point as the real world has changed says an awful lot.What has changed in that time, Gordon? Our Covid experience continues
to be better than many other countries with vaccination still being
popular and apparenty successful in keeping our death rates low.
On Monday, April 10, 2023 at 12:55:40?PM UTC+12, Rich80105 wrote:others follow. Or is it that you're just feral man-in-dresses like those peaceful people who attacked Possie Parker...
On 10 Apr 2023 00:38:09 GMT, Gordon <Gor...@leaf.net.nz> wrote:Prove it! Apparently you're such an arrogant Marxist muppet you believe you don't have to back up your disinformation with facts Rich. As usual you don't practice what you arrogantly demand from others. So how about playing by the rules you insist
On 2023-04-09, Rich80105 <Rich...@hotmail.com> wrote:What has changed in that time, Gordon? Our Covid experience continues
On Sun, 9 Apr 2023 15:06:13 -0700 (PDT), John Bowes
<bowes...@gmail.com> wrote:
On Monday, April 10, 2023 at 9:38:56?AM UTC+12, John Bowes wrote:
An interesting read for the rest of us. Mainly because unlike Rich we have open minds...
https://www.chrislynchmedia.com/news-items/thedisinformationproject#.ZDMjdFAu1jG.twitter
Yet more that doesn't fit Richie's mainstream disinformed mind...
https://nzdsos.com/2023/02/28/fifth-generation-warfare/
It is sad to see the rabbit holes some go down - see:
https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/health/coronavirus/300439357/covid19-nz-why-a-small-group-of-doctors-opposes-vaccination
That article is 18 months ago. Things have changed in that time. It is
before Omicron's arrival.
The fact that we have this almost total disregard of the option to changing >> >the view point as the real world has changed says an awful lot.
to be better than many other countries with vaccination still being
popular and apparenty successful in keeping our death rates low.
On Sun, 9 Apr 2023 18:27:55 -0700 (PDT), John Bowesothers follow. Or is it that you're just feral man-in-dresses like those peaceful people who attacked Possie Parker...
<bowes...@gmail.com> wrote:
On Monday, April 10, 2023 at 12:55:40?PM UTC+12, Rich80105 wrote:
On 10 Apr 2023 00:38:09 GMT, Gordon <Gor...@leaf.net.nz> wrote:Prove it! Apparently you're such an arrogant Marxist muppet you believe you don't have to back up your disinformation with facts Rich. As usual you don't practice what you arrogantly demand from others. So how about playing by the rules you insist
On 2023-04-09, Rich80105 <Rich...@hotmail.com> wrote:What has changed in that time, Gordon? Our Covid experience continues
On Sun, 9 Apr 2023 15:06:13 -0700 (PDT), John Bowes
<bowes...@gmail.com> wrote:
On Monday, April 10, 2023 at 9:38:56?AM UTC+12, John Bowes wrote:
An interesting read for the rest of us. Mainly because unlike Rich we have open minds...
https://www.chrislynchmedia.com/news-items/thedisinformationproject#.ZDMjdFAu1jG.twitter
Yet more that doesn't fit Richie's mainstream disinformed mind...
https://nzdsos.com/2023/02/28/fifth-generation-warfare/
It is sad to see the rabbit holes some go down - see:
https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/health/coronavirus/300439357/covid19-nz-why-a-small-group-of-doctors-opposes-vaccination
That article is 18 months ago. Things have changed in that time. It is >> >before Omicron's arrival.
The fact that we have this almost total disregard of the option to changing
the view point as the real world has changed says an awful lot.
to be better than many other countries with vaccination still being
popular and apparenty successful in keeping our death rates low.
Which part do you want proved, John Bowes?All of it you imbecilic moron :)
On Monday, April 10, 2023 at 1:33:28?PM UTC+12, Rich80105 wrote:others follow. Or is it that you're just feral man-in-dresses like those peaceful people who attacked Possie Parker...
On Sun, 9 Apr 2023 18:27:55 -0700 (PDT), John Bowes
<bowes...@gmail.com> wrote:
On Monday, April 10, 2023 at 12:55:40?PM UTC+12, Rich80105 wrote:
On 10 Apr 2023 00:38:09 GMT, Gordon <Gor...@leaf.net.nz> wrote:Prove it! Apparently you're such an arrogant Marxist muppet you believe you don't have to back up your disinformation with facts Rich. As usual you don't practice what you arrogantly demand from others. So how about playing by the rules you insist
On 2023-04-09, Rich80105 <Rich...@hotmail.com> wrote:What has changed in that time, Gordon? Our Covid experience continues
On Sun, 9 Apr 2023 15:06:13 -0700 (PDT), John Bowes
<bowes...@gmail.com> wrote:
On Monday, April 10, 2023 at 9:38:56?AM UTC+12, John Bowes wrote:
An interesting read for the rest of us. Mainly because unlike Rich we have open minds...
https://www.chrislynchmedia.com/news-items/thedisinformationproject#.ZDMjdFAu1jG.twitter
Yet more that doesn't fit Richie's mainstream disinformed mind...
https://nzdsos.com/2023/02/28/fifth-generation-warfare/
It is sad to see the rabbit holes some go down - see:
https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/health/coronavirus/300439357/covid19-nz-why-a-small-group-of-doctors-opposes-vaccination
That article is 18 months ago. Things have changed in that time. It is >> >> >before Omicron's arrival.
The fact that we have this almost total disregard of the option to changing
the view point as the real world has changed says an awful lot.
to be better than many other countries with vaccination still being
popular and apparently successful in keeping our death rates low.
Lets just stick to what I have posted; an important issue is whetherWhich part do you want proved, John Bowes?All of it you imbecilic moron :)
On Sun, 9 Apr 2023 18:37:02 -0700 (PDT), John Bowesothers follow. Or is it that you're just feral man-in-dresses like those peaceful people who attacked Possie Parker...
<bowes...@gmail.com> wrote:
On Monday, April 10, 2023 at 1:33:28?PM UTC+12, Rich80105 wrote:
On Sun, 9 Apr 2023 18:27:55 -0700 (PDT), John Bowes
<bowes...@gmail.com> wrote:
On Monday, April 10, 2023 at 12:55:40?PM UTC+12, Rich80105 wrote:
On 10 Apr 2023 00:38:09 GMT, Gordon <Gor...@leaf.net.nz> wrote:Prove it! Apparently you're such an arrogant Marxist muppet you believe you don't have to back up your disinformation with facts Rich. As usual you don't practice what you arrogantly demand from others. So how about playing by the rules you insist
On 2023-04-09, Rich80105 <Rich...@hotmail.com> wrote:What has changed in that time, Gordon? Our Covid experience continues >> >> to be better than many other countries with vaccination still being
On Sun, 9 Apr 2023 15:06:13 -0700 (PDT), John Bowes
<bowes...@gmail.com> wrote:
On Monday, April 10, 2023 at 9:38:56?AM UTC+12, John Bowes wrote: >> >> >>>> An interesting read for the rest of us. Mainly because unlike Rich we have open minds...
https://www.chrislynchmedia.com/news-items/thedisinformationproject#.ZDMjdFAu1jG.twitter
Yet more that doesn't fit Richie's mainstream disinformed mind... >> >> >>>
https://nzdsos.com/2023/02/28/fifth-generation-warfare/
It is sad to see the rabbit holes some go down - see:
https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/health/coronavirus/300439357/covid19-nz-why-a-small-group-of-doctors-opposes-vaccination
That article is 18 months ago. Things have changed in that time. It is
before Omicron's arrival.
The fact that we have this almost total disregard of the option to changing
the view point as the real world has changed says an awful lot.
popular and apparently successful in keeping our death rates low.
Lets just stick to what I have posted; an important issue is whetherWhich part do you want proved, John Bowes?All of it you imbecilic moron :)
we have had better Covid results than other countries - for that see: https://ourworldindata.org/grapher/cumulative-excess-deaths-covid?country=USA~AUS~NCL~SGP~FRA~SWE~GBR~NZL~JPN~ITA~DEU~ZAF~HKG~ARG~CAN~BEL
That measures actual deaths and compares with the expected deaths
based on pre-Covid mortality. Many countries are able to estimate
expected deaths by applying experience of actual deaths over recent
years to our population each ytear. For New Zealand, the total "Excess deaths" over that expected based on pre-covid death rates as at March
5, 2023 is -169 ; in other words we have had fewer deaths than
expected through the covid period. We do know that Covid precautions
did reduce many other deaths - deaths from other infectious diseases reduced, and road deaths reduced - and those positive effects
outweighed the deaths from Covid.
Compare that with say the UK - at that date, the equivalent number for
the UK is 198,995. Now that is still fairly low - they have a much
large population than we do - but the most recent figure from the USA
is 1.26 million.
In the chart above I have included a range of countries, you may like
to look and see how many countries have a better result than New
Zealand . . .
Happy now?
On Monday, April 10, 2023 at 2:24:47?PM UTC+12, Rich80105 wrote:others follow. Or is it that you're just feral man-in-dresses like those peaceful people who attacked Possie Parker...
On Sun, 9 Apr 2023 18:37:02 -0700 (PDT), John Bowes
<bowes...@gmail.com> wrote:
On Monday, April 10, 2023 at 1:33:28?PM UTC+12, Rich80105 wrote:
On Sun, 9 Apr 2023 18:27:55 -0700 (PDT), John Bowes
<bowes...@gmail.com> wrote:
On Monday, April 10, 2023 at 12:55:40?PM UTC+12, Rich80105 wrote:
On 10 Apr 2023 00:38:09 GMT, Gordon <Gor...@leaf.net.nz> wrote:Prove it! Apparently you're such an arrogant Marxist muppet you believe you don't have to back up your disinformation with facts Rich. As usual you don't practice what you arrogantly demand from others. So how about playing by the rules you insist
On 2023-04-09, Rich80105 <Rich...@hotmail.com> wrote:What has changed in that time, Gordon? Our Covid experience continues >> >> >> to be better than many other countries with vaccination still being
On Sun, 9 Apr 2023 15:06:13 -0700 (PDT), John Bowes
<bowes...@gmail.com> wrote:
On Monday, April 10, 2023 at 9:38:56?AM UTC+12, John Bowes wrote: >> >> >> >>>> An interesting read for the rest of us. Mainly because unlike Rich we have open minds...
https://www.chrislynchmedia.com/news-items/thedisinformationproject#.ZDMjdFAu1jG.twitter
Yet more that doesn't fit Richie's mainstream disinformed mind... >> >> >> >>>
https://nzdsos.com/2023/02/28/fifth-generation-warfare/
It is sad to see the rabbit holes some go down - see:
https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/health/coronavirus/300439357/covid19-nz-why-a-small-group-of-doctors-opposes-vaccination
That article is 18 months ago. Things have changed in that time. It is
before Omicron's arrival.
The fact that we have this almost total disregard of the option to changing
the view point as the real world has changed says an awful lot.
popular and apparently successful in keeping our death rates low.
No, its right up to date. Those calculations go up to data as at 12Lets just stick to what I have posted; an important issue is whetherWhich part do you want proved, John Bowes?All of it you imbecilic moron :)
we have had better Covid results than other countries - for that see:
https://ourworldindata.org/grapher/cumulative-excess-deaths-covid?country=USA~AUS~NCL~SGP~FRA~SWE~GBR~NZL~JPN~ITA~DEU~ZAF~HKG~ARG~CAN~BEL
That measures actual deaths and compares with the expected deaths
based on pre-Covid mortality. Many countries are able to estimate
expected deaths by applying experience of actual deaths over recent
years to our population each ytear. For New Zealand, the total "Excess
deaths" over that expected based on pre-covid death rates as at March
5, 2023 is -169 ; in other words we have had fewer deaths than
expected through the covid period. We do know that Covid precautions
did reduce many other deaths - deaths from other infectious diseases
reduced, and road deaths reduced - and those positive effects
outweighed the deaths from Covid.
Compare that with say the UK - at that date, the equivalent number for
the UK is 198,995. Now that is still fairly low - they have a much
large population than we do - but the most recent figure from the USA
is 1.26 million.
In the chart above I have included a range of countries, you may like
to look and see how many countries have a better result than New
Zealand . . .
It's past history and totally off topic Rich.
It may have been buried by your well known lack of comprehension. but new Zealand is surrounded by water and even though Ardern stuffed around for two weeks before she finally did the right thing. It was actually bloody easy to slow down the entry ofcovid to New Zealand. But it shouldn't have prevented New Zealanders from getting home while letting disc jockeys through whenever they wanted to come. Apart from breaching the NZ Bill of Rights the Labour response was over the top. Probably helped by
For privacy reasons you will never get that, John; but you are correct
Happy now?
Not till you provide a list of the names who were supposedly saved from dying from covid who were saved by out medical professionals. Zero were saved by your inglorious misleader Ardern!
On Sun, 9 Apr 2023 20:01:23 -0700 (PDT), John Bowesinsist others follow. Or is it that you're just feral man-in-dresses like those peaceful people who attacked Possie Parker...
<bowes...@gmail.com> wrote:
On Monday, April 10, 2023 at 2:24:47?PM UTC+12, Rich80105 wrote:
On Sun, 9 Apr 2023 18:37:02 -0700 (PDT), John Bowes
<bowes...@gmail.com> wrote:
On Monday, April 10, 2023 at 1:33:28?PM UTC+12, Rich80105 wrote:
On Sun, 9 Apr 2023 18:27:55 -0700 (PDT), John Bowes
<bowes...@gmail.com> wrote:
On Monday, April 10, 2023 at 12:55:40?PM UTC+12, Rich80105 wrote:
On 10 Apr 2023 00:38:09 GMT, Gordon <Gor...@leaf.net.nz> wrote:
On 2023-04-09, Rich80105 <Rich...@hotmail.com> wrote:What has changed in that time, Gordon? Our Covid experience continues
On Sun, 9 Apr 2023 15:06:13 -0700 (PDT), John Bowes
<bowes...@gmail.com> wrote:
On Monday, April 10, 2023 at 9:38:56?AM UTC+12, John Bowes wrote:
An interesting read for the rest of us. Mainly because unlike Rich we have open minds...
https://www.chrislynchmedia.com/news-items/thedisinformationproject#.ZDMjdFAu1jG.twitter
Yet more that doesn't fit Richie's mainstream disinformed mind...
https://nzdsos.com/2023/02/28/fifth-generation-warfare/
It is sad to see the rabbit holes some go down - see:
https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/health/coronavirus/300439357/covid19-nz-why-a-small-group-of-doctors-opposes-vaccination
That article is 18 months ago. Things have changed in that time. It is
before Omicron's arrival.
The fact that we have this almost total disregard of the option to changing
the view point as the real world has changed says an awful lot.
to be better than many other countries with vaccination still being >> >> >> popular and apparently successful in keeping our death rates low. >> >> >Prove it! Apparently you're such an arrogant Marxist muppet you believe you don't have to back up your disinformation with facts Rich. As usual you don't practice what you arrogantly demand from others. So how about playing by the rules you
covid to New Zealand. But it shouldn't have prevented New Zealanders from getting home while letting disc jockeys through whenever they wanted to come. Apart from breaching the NZ Bill of Rights the Labour response was over the top. Probably helped byLets just stick to what I have posted; an important issue is whetherWhich part do you want proved, John Bowes?All of it you imbecilic moron :)
we have had better Covid results than other countries - for that see:
https://ourworldindata.org/grapher/cumulative-excess-deaths-covid?country=USA~AUS~NCL~SGP~FRA~SWE~GBR~NZL~JPN~ITA~DEU~ZAF~HKG~ARG~CAN~BEL
That measures actual deaths and compares with the expected deaths
based on pre-Covid mortality. Many countries are able to estimate
expected deaths by applying experience of actual deaths over recent
years to our population each ytear. For New Zealand, the total "Excess
deaths" over that expected based on pre-covid death rates as at March
5, 2023 is -169 ; in other words we have had fewer deaths than
expected through the covid period. We do know that Covid precautions
did reduce many other deaths - deaths from other infectious diseases
reduced, and road deaths reduced - and those positive effects
outweighed the deaths from Covid.
Compare that with say the UK - at that date, the equivalent number for
the UK is 198,995. Now that is still fairly low - they have a much
large population than we do - but the most recent figure from the USA
is 1.26 million.
In the chart above I have included a range of countries, you may like
to look and see how many countries have a better result than New
Zealand . . .
It's past history and totally off topic Rich.No, its right up to date. Those calculations go up to data as at 12
March this year, and the chart will be available for some time. What
it does show if you did look to see how many have a better record than
New Zealand is find that, as you have tried to ignore for a long time,
the responses of our government over the whole period of the Covid
pandemic (and it is not yet over) have been consistently world
leading.
It may have been buried by your well known lack of comprehension. but new Zealand is surrounded by water and even though Ardern stuffed around for two weeks before she finally did the right thing. It was actually bloody easy to slow down the entry of
You are having a bob each way then - they should have stopped peopleRich I've had enough of your stupid and pointless games! You always go off topic and this thread isn't about bullshit figures from a scientist as stupid as you! Covid is here to stay and nothing your government did or does is going to do anything about
coming in but they should not have stopped people coming in . . . The
only question is how many more deaths would you have been prepared to
have? 50? 100? 100,000?
Only idiots from the far right fringe claim that any government would
be able to eliminate covid in New Zealand; while it is infecting
people anywhere around the world we are not safe from it, which is why
it is important that as many New Zealanders as possible in the
critical age groups contnue to get vaccines when that is recommended -
have you got an appointment yet, John, or are you trying to get off
the list of those that may have died had the government not acted as
well as they have done and are doing . . . ?
Happy now?
Not till you provide a list of the names who were supposedly saved from dying from covid who were saved by out medical professionals. Zero were saved by your inglorious misleader Ardern!For privacy reasons you will never get that, John; but you are correct
that our medical professionals did save quite a few that did get
infected; that list would not count however those who have been saved through following recommendations and avoiding infection through both
the vaccines and by taking sensible precautions. Do you have a
vaccination appointment for this latest round, John?
On Sun, 9 Apr 2023 18:37:02 -0700 (PDT), John BowesThat is a very narrow set of data./
<bowesjohn02@gmail.com> wrote:
On Monday, April 10, 2023 at 1:33:28?PM UTC+12, Rich80105 wrote:Lets just stick to what I have posted; an important issue is whether
On Sun, 9 Apr 2023 18:27:55 -0700 (PDT), John BowesAll of it you imbecilic moron :)
<bowes...@gmail.com> wrote:
On Monday, April 10, 2023 at 12:55:40?PM UTC+12, Rich80105 wrote:
On 10 Apr 2023 00:38:09 GMT, Gordon <Gor...@leaf.net.nz> wrote:Prove it! Apparently you're such an arrogant Marxist muppet you believe >>> >you don't have to back up your disinformation with facts Rich. As usual you
On 2023-04-09, Rich80105 <Rich...@hotmail.com> wrote:What has changed in that time, Gordon? Our Covid experience continues >>> >> to be better than many other countries with vaccination still being
On Sun, 9 Apr 2023 15:06:13 -0700 (PDT), John Bowes
<bowes...@gmail.com> wrote:
On Monday, April 10, 2023 at 9:38:56?AM UTC+12, John Bowes wrote:
An interesting read for the rest of us. Mainly because unlike Rich >>> >> >>>>we have open minds...
https://www.chrislynchmedia.com/news-items/thedisinformationproject#.ZDMjdFAu1jG.twitter
Yet more that doesn't fit Richie's mainstream disinformed mind...
https://nzdsos.com/2023/02/28/fifth-generation-warfare/
It is sad to see the rabbit holes some go down - see:
https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/health/coronavirus/300439357/covid19-nz-why-a-small-group-of-doctors-opposes-vaccination
That article is 18 months ago. Things have changed in that time. It is >>> >> >before Omicron's arrival.
The fact that we have this almost total disregard of the option to
changing
the view point as the real world has changed says an awful lot.
popular and apparently successful in keeping our death rates low.
don't practice what you arrogantly demand from others. So how about playing by
the rules you insist others follow. Or is it that you're just feral
man-in-dresses like those peaceful people who attacked Possie Parker... >>> Which part do you want proved, John Bowes?
we have had better Covid results than other countries - for that see: >https://ourworldindata.org/grapher/cumulative-excess-deaths-covid?country=USA~AUS~NCL~SGP~FRA~SWE~GBR~NZL~JPN~ITA~DEU~ZAF~HKG~ARG~CAN~BEL
That measures actual deaths and compares with the expected deaths
based on pre-Covid mortality. Many countries are able to estimate
expected deaths by applying experience of actual deaths over recent
years to our population each ytear. For New Zealand, the total "Excess >deaths" over that expected based on pre-covid death rates as at March
5, 2023 is -169 ; in other words we have had fewer deaths than
expected through the covid period. We do know that Covid precautions
did reduce many other deaths - deaths from other infectious diseases
reduced, and road deaths reduced - and those positive effects
outweighed the deaths from Covid.
Compare that with say the UK - at that date, the equivalent number for
the UK is 198,995. Now that is still fairly low - they have a much
large population than we do - but the most recent figure from the USA
is 1.26 million.
In the chart above I have included a range of countries, you may like
to look and see how many countries have a better result than New
Zealand . . .
Happy now?
On Sun, 9 Apr 2023 20:01:23 -0700 (PDT), John Bowesinsist others follow. Or is it that you're just feral man-in-dresses like those peaceful people who attacked Possie Parker...
<bowesjohn02@gmail.com> wrote:
On Monday, April 10, 2023 at 2:24:47?PM UTC+12, Rich80105 wrote:
On Sun, 9 Apr 2023 18:37:02 -0700 (PDT), John Bowes
<bowes...@gmail.com> wrote:
On Monday, April 10, 2023 at 1:33:28?PM UTC+12, Rich80105 wrote:
On Sun, 9 Apr 2023 18:27:55 -0700 (PDT), John Bowes
<bowes...@gmail.com> wrote:
On Monday, April 10, 2023 at 12:55:40?PM UTC+12, Rich80105 wrote:
On 10 Apr 2023 00:38:09 GMT, Gordon <Gor...@leaf.net.nz> wrote:Prove it! Apparently you're such an arrogant Marxist muppet you believe you don't have to back up your disinformation with facts Rich. As usual you don't practice what you arrogantly demand from others. So how about playing by the rules you
On 2023-04-09, Rich80105 <Rich...@hotmail.com> wrote:What has changed in that time, Gordon? Our Covid experience continues >>> >> >> to be better than many other countries with vaccination still being >>> >> >> popular and apparently successful in keeping our death rates low.
On Sun, 9 Apr 2023 15:06:13 -0700 (PDT), John Bowes
<bowes...@gmail.com> wrote:
On Monday, April 10, 2023 at 9:38:56?AM UTC+12, John Bowes wrote: >>> >> >> >>>> An interesting read for the rest of us. Mainly because unlike Rich we have open minds...
https://www.chrislynchmedia.com/news-items/thedisinformationproject#.ZDMjdFAu1jG.twitter
Yet more that doesn't fit Richie's mainstream disinformed mind... >>> >> >> >>>
https://nzdsos.com/2023/02/28/fifth-generation-warfare/
It is sad to see the rabbit holes some go down - see:
https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/health/coronavirus/300439357/covid19-nz-why-a-small-group-of-doctors-opposes-vaccination
That article is 18 months ago. Things have changed in that time. It is
before Omicron's arrival.
The fact that we have this almost total disregard of the option to changing
the view point as the real world has changed says an awful lot.
covid to New Zealand. But it shouldn't have prevented New Zealanders from getting home while letting disc jockeys through whenever they wanted to come. Apart from breaching the NZ Bill of Rights the Labour response was over the top. Probably helped byNo, its right up to date. Those calculations go up to data as at 12Lets just stick to what I have posted; an important issue is whetherWhich part do you want proved, John Bowes?All of it you imbecilic moron :)
we have had better Covid results than other countries - for that see:
https://ourworldindata.org/grapher/cumulative-excess-deaths-covid?country=USA~AUS~NCL~SGP~FRA~SWE~GBR~NZL~JPN~ITA~DEU~ZAF~HKG~ARG~CAN~BEL
That measures actual deaths and compares with the expected deaths
based on pre-Covid mortality. Many countries are able to estimate
expected deaths by applying experience of actual deaths over recent
years to our population each ytear. For New Zealand, the total "Excess
deaths" over that expected based on pre-covid death rates as at March
5, 2023 is -169 ; in other words we have had fewer deaths than
expected through the covid period. We do know that Covid precautions
did reduce many other deaths - deaths from other infectious diseases
reduced, and road deaths reduced - and those positive effects
outweighed the deaths from Covid.
Compare that with say the UK - at that date, the equivalent number for
the UK is 198,995. Now that is still fairly low - they have a much
large population than we do - but the most recent figure from the USA
is 1.26 million.
In the chart above I have included a range of countries, you may like
to look and see how many countries have a better result than New
Zealand . . .
It's past history and totally off topic Rich.
March this year, and the chart will be available for some time. What
it does show if you did look to see how many have a better record than
New Zealand is find that, as you have tried to ignore for a long time,
the responses of our government over the whole period of the Covid
pandemic (and it is not yet over) have been consistently world
leading.
It may have been buried by your well known lack of comprehension. but new Zealand is surrounded by water and even though Ardern stuffed around for two weeks before she finally did the right thing. It was actually bloody easy to slow down the entry of
You are having a bob each way then - they should have stopped people
coming in but they should not have stopped people coming in . . . The
only question is how many more deaths would you have been prepared to
have? 50? 100? 100,000?
Only idiots from the far right fringe claim that any government would
be able to eliminate covid in New Zealand; while it is infecting
people anywhere around the world we are not safe from it, which is why
it is important that as many New Zealanders as possible in the
critical age groups contnue to get vaccines when that is recommended -
have you got an appointment yet, John, or are you trying to get off
the list of those that may have died had the government not acted as
well as they have done and are doing . . . ?
For privacy reasons you will never get that, John; but you are correct
Happy now?
Not till you provide a list of the names who were supposedly saved from dying from covid who were saved by out medical professionals. Zero were saved by your inglorious misleader Ardern!
that our medical professionals did save quite a few that did get
infected; that list would not count however those who have been saved
through following recommendations and avoiding infection through both
the vaccines and by taking sensible precautions. Do you have a
vaccination appointment for this latest round, John?
On Mon, 10 Apr 2023 03:57:19 -0000 (UTC), TonySo provide some evidence that excess deaths in NZ is effectively zero.
<lizandtony@orcon.net.nz> wrote:
Rich80105 <Rich80105@hotmail.com> wrote:Indeed it is, but a very important one - and it is accompanied by a
On Sun, 9 Apr 2023 18:37:02 -0700 (PDT), John Bowes >>><bowesjohn02@gmail.com> wrote:That is a very narrow set of data./
On Monday, April 10, 2023 at 1:33:28?PM UTC+12, Rich80105 wrote:Lets just stick to what I have posted; an important issue is whether
On Sun, 9 Apr 2023 18:27:55 -0700 (PDT), John BowesAll of it you imbecilic moron :)
<bowes...@gmail.com> wrote:
On Monday, April 10, 2023 at 12:55:40?PM UTC+12, Rich80105 wrote:
On 10 Apr 2023 00:38:09 GMT, Gordon <Gor...@leaf.net.nz> wrote:don't practice what you arrogantly demand from others. So how about >>>>> >playing by
On 2023-04-09, Rich80105 <Rich...@hotmail.com> wrote:What has changed in that time, Gordon? Our Covid experience continues >>>>> >> to be better than many other countries with vaccination still being >>>>> >> popular and apparently successful in keeping our death rates low. >>>>> >Prove it! Apparently you're such an arrogant Marxist muppet you believe >>>>> >you don't have to back up your disinformation with facts Rich. As usual >>>>> >you
On Sun, 9 Apr 2023 15:06:13 -0700 (PDT), John Bowes
<bowes...@gmail.com> wrote:
On Monday, April 10, 2023 at 9:38:56?AM UTC+12, John Bowes wrote: >>>>> >> >>>> An interesting read for the rest of us. Mainly because unlike >>>>> >> >>>>Rich
we have open minds...
https://www.chrislynchmedia.com/news-items/thedisinformationproject#.ZDMjdFAu1jG.twitter
Yet more that doesn't fit Richie's mainstream disinformed mind... >>>>> >> >>>
https://nzdsos.com/2023/02/28/fifth-generation-warfare/
It is sad to see the rabbit holes some go down - see:
https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/health/coronavirus/300439357/covid19-nz-why-a-small-group-of-doctors-opposes-vaccination
That article is 18 months ago. Things have changed in that time. It >>>>> >> >is
before Omicron's arrival.
The fact that we have this almost total disregard of the option to >>>>> >> >changing
the view point as the real world has changed says an awful lot.
the rules you insist others follow. Or is it that you're just feral >>>>> >man-in-dresses like those peaceful people who attacked Possie Parker... >>>>> Which part do you want proved, John Bowes?
we have had better Covid results than other countries - for that see: >>>https://ourworldindata.org/grapher/cumulative-excess-deaths-covid?country=USA~AUS~NCL~SGP~FRA~SWE~GBR~NZL~JPN~ITA~DEU~ZAF~HKG~ARG~CAN~BEL
lot of other international comparisons that, individually and
collectively, confirm that New Zealand has suffered less in terms of
direct Covid effect on individuals, better than most and possibly all >comparable countries.
It is vital to aso look at what damage was done - a subject you refuse to >>address.The measurement of excess deaths is a measure of damage - slightly
negative, but effectively zero for New Zealand; yes some died, but an >equivalent number of others lived longer. Then there is economic
damage - we have a lower inflation rate than most countries, we have
low unemployment compared to most countries, but I do not pretend that
all New Zealanders have done better than all people from other
countries - what other danage are you thinking of, Tony?
That measures actual deaths and compares with the expected deaths
based on pre-Covid mortality. Many countries are able to estimate >>>expected deaths by applying experience of actual deaths over recent
years to our population each ytear. For New Zealand, the total "Excess >>>deaths" over that expected based on pre-covid death rates as at March
5, 2023 is -169 ; in other words we have had fewer deaths than
expected through the covid period. We do know that Covid precautions
did reduce many other deaths - deaths from other infectious diseases >>>reduced, and road deaths reduced - and those positive effects
outweighed the deaths from Covid.
Compare that with say the UK - at that date, the equivalent number for >>>the UK is 198,995. Now that is still fairly low - they have a much
large population than we do - but the most recent figure from the USA
is 1.26 million.
In the chart above I have included a range of countries, you may like
to look and see how many countries have a better result than New
Zealand . . .
Happy now?
On 2023-04-10, John Bowes <bowesjohn02@gmail.com> wrote:others follow. Or is it that you're just feral man-in-dresses like those peaceful people who attacked Possie Parker...
On Monday, April 10, 2023 at 12:55:40?PM UTC+12, Rich80105 wrote:
On 10 Apr 2023 00:38:09 GMT, Gordon <Gor...@leaf.net.nz> wrote:Prove it! Apparently you're such an arrogant Marxist muppet you believe you don't have to back up your disinformation with facts Rich. As usual you don't practice what you arrogantly demand from others. So how about playing by the rules you insist
On 2023-04-09, Rich80105 <Rich...@hotmail.com> wrote:What has changed in that time, Gordon? Our Covid experience continues
On Sun, 9 Apr 2023 15:06:13 -0700 (PDT), John Bowes
<bowes...@gmail.com> wrote:
On Monday, April 10, 2023 at 9:38:56?AM UTC+12, John Bowes wrote:
An interesting read for the rest of us. Mainly because unlike Rich we have open minds...
https://www.chrislynchmedia.com/news-items/thedisinformationproject#.ZDMjdFAu1jG.twitter
Yet more that doesn't fit Richie's mainstream disinformed mind...
https://nzdsos.com/2023/02/28/fifth-generation-warfare/
It is sad to see the rabbit holes some go down - see:
https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/health/coronavirus/300439357/covid19-nz-why-a-small-group-of-doctors-opposes-vaccination
That article is 18 months ago. Things have changed in that time. It is
before Omicron's arrival.
The fact that we have this almost total disregard of the option to changing
the view point as the real world has changed says an awful lot.
to be better than many other countries with vaccination still being
popular and apparenty successful in keeping our death rates low.
On RCR, http://realitycheck.radio. Some would say that I have spent the >better part of the morning down the rabbit hole of misinformation, however I >like checking out all view points, so that I am well informed and educated.Except that, with words, a single definition is often only ""correct""
Head to the replay section. Here you will find Rodney Hyde's rant on the >matter of "Define a woman? In it we have the answer, A woman is a adult >female human. Simple, correct and consice.
There is also Paul Brennan talking with Dr Guy Hatchard about the deathNow that is an example of the use of a statistic without adequately
rate, now increased to 17% above the average.
There is also the suggestion that the deaths caused by the vaccine are as >great as Covid deaths. (Sorry I forgotten where this is).
On Monday, April 10, 2023 at 12:55:40 PM UTC+12, Rich80105 wrote:others follow. Or is it that you're just feral man-in-dresses like those peaceful people who attacked Possie Parker...
On 10 Apr 2023 00:38:09 GMT, Gordon <Gor...@leaf.net.nz> wrote:Prove it! Apparently you're such an arrogant Marxist muppet you believe you don't have to back up your disinformation with facts Rich. As usual you don't practice what you arrogantly demand from others. So how about playing by the rules you insist
On 2023-04-09, Rich80105 <Rich...@hotmail.com> wrote:What has changed in that time, Gordon? Our Covid experience continues
On Sun, 9 Apr 2023 15:06:13 -0700 (PDT), John Bowes
<bowes...@gmail.com> wrote:
On Monday, April 10, 2023 at 9:38:56?AM UTC+12, John Bowes wrote:
An interesting read for the rest of us. Mainly because unlike Rich we have open minds...
https://www.chrislynchmedia.com/news-items/thedisinformationproject#.ZDMjdFAu1jG.twitter
Yet more that doesn't fit Richie's mainstream disinformed mind...
https://nzdsos.com/2023/02/28/fifth-generation-warfare/
It is sad to see the rabbit holes some go down - see:
https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/health/coronavirus/300439357/covid19-nz-why-a-small-group-of-doctors-opposes-vaccination
That article is 18 months ago. Things have changed in that time. It is
before Omicron's arrival.
The fact that we have this almost total disregard of the option to changing >> >the view point as the real world has changed says an awful lot.
to be better than many other countries with vaccination still being
popular and apparenty successful in keeping our death rates low.
Rich80105 <Rich80105@hotmail.com> wrote:Indeed it is, but a very important one - and it is accompanied by a
On Sun, 9 Apr 2023 18:37:02 -0700 (PDT), John BowesThat is a very narrow set of data./
<bowesjohn02@gmail.com> wrote:
On Monday, April 10, 2023 at 1:33:28?PM UTC+12, Rich80105 wrote:Lets just stick to what I have posted; an important issue is whether
On Sun, 9 Apr 2023 18:27:55 -0700 (PDT), John BowesAll of it you imbecilic moron :)
<bowes...@gmail.com> wrote:
On Monday, April 10, 2023 at 12:55:40?PM UTC+12, Rich80105 wrote:
On 10 Apr 2023 00:38:09 GMT, Gordon <Gor...@leaf.net.nz> wrote:Prove it! Apparently you're such an arrogant Marxist muppet you believe >>>> >you don't have to back up your disinformation with facts Rich. As usual you
On 2023-04-09, Rich80105 <Rich...@hotmail.com> wrote:What has changed in that time, Gordon? Our Covid experience continues >>>> >> to be better than many other countries with vaccination still being >>>> >> popular and apparently successful in keeping our death rates low.
On Sun, 9 Apr 2023 15:06:13 -0700 (PDT), John Bowes
<bowes...@gmail.com> wrote:
On Monday, April 10, 2023 at 9:38:56?AM UTC+12, John Bowes wrote: >>>> >> >>>> An interesting read for the rest of us. Mainly because unlike Rich >>>> >> >>>>we have open minds...
https://www.chrislynchmedia.com/news-items/thedisinformationproject#.ZDMjdFAu1jG.twitter
Yet more that doesn't fit Richie's mainstream disinformed mind... >>>> >> >>>
https://nzdsos.com/2023/02/28/fifth-generation-warfare/
It is sad to see the rabbit holes some go down - see:
https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/health/coronavirus/300439357/covid19-nz-why-a-small-group-of-doctors-opposes-vaccination
That article is 18 months ago. Things have changed in that time. It is >>>> >> >before Omicron's arrival.
The fact that we have this almost total disregard of the option to >>>> >> >changing
the view point as the real world has changed says an awful lot.
don't practice what you arrogantly demand from others. So how about playing by
the rules you insist others follow. Or is it that you're just feral
man-in-dresses like those peaceful people who attacked Possie Parker... >>>> Which part do you want proved, John Bowes?
we have had better Covid results than other countries - for that see: >>https://ourworldindata.org/grapher/cumulative-excess-deaths-covid?country=USA~AUS~NCL~SGP~FRA~SWE~GBR~NZL~JPN~ITA~DEU~ZAF~HKG~ARG~CAN~BEL
It is vital to aso look at what damage was done - a subject you refuse to >address.The measurement of excess deaths is a measure of damage - slightly
That measures actual deaths and compares with the expected deaths
based on pre-Covid mortality. Many countries are able to estimate
expected deaths by applying experience of actual deaths over recent
years to our population each ytear. For New Zealand, the total "Excess >>deaths" over that expected based on pre-covid death rates as at March
5, 2023 is -169 ; in other words we have had fewer deaths than
expected through the covid period. We do know that Covid precautions
did reduce many other deaths - deaths from other infectious diseases >>reduced, and road deaths reduced - and those positive effects
outweighed the deaths from Covid.
Compare that with say the UK - at that date, the equivalent number for
the UK is 198,995. Now that is still fairly low - they have a much
large population than we do - but the most recent figure from the USA
is 1.26 million.
In the chart above I have included a range of countries, you may like
to look and see how many countries have a better result than New
Zealand . . .
Happy now?
On 10 Apr 2023 04:23:45 GMT, Gordon <Gor...@leaf.net.nz> wrote:others follow. Or is it that you're just feral man-in-dresses like those peaceful people who attacked Possie Parker...
On 2023-04-10, John Bowes <bowes...@gmail.com> wrote:
On Monday, April 10, 2023 at 12:55:40?PM UTC+12, Rich80105 wrote:
On 10 Apr 2023 00:38:09 GMT, Gordon <Gor...@leaf.net.nz> wrote:Prove it! Apparently you're such an arrogant Marxist muppet you believe you don't have to back up your disinformation with facts Rich. As usual you don't practice what you arrogantly demand from others. So how about playing by the rules you insist
On 2023-04-09, Rich80105 <Rich...@hotmail.com> wrote:What has changed in that time, Gordon? Our Covid experience continues >>> to be better than many other countries with vaccination still being
On Sun, 9 Apr 2023 15:06:13 -0700 (PDT), John Bowes
<bowes...@gmail.com> wrote:
On Monday, April 10, 2023 at 9:38:56?AM UTC+12, John Bowes wrote:
An interesting read for the rest of us. Mainly because unlike Rich we have open minds...
https://www.chrislynchmedia.com/news-items/thedisinformationproject#.ZDMjdFAu1jG.twitter
Yet more that doesn't fit Richie's mainstream disinformed mind...
https://nzdsos.com/2023/02/28/fifth-generation-warfare/
It is sad to see the rabbit holes some go down - see:
https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/health/coronavirus/300439357/covid19-nz-why-a-small-group-of-doctors-opposes-vaccination
That article is 18 months ago. Things have changed in that time. It is >>> >before Omicron's arrival.
The fact that we have this almost total disregard of the option to changing
the view point as the real world has changed says an awful lot.
popular and apparenty successful in keeping our death rates low.
Get back on topic you moronic imbecile!On RCR, http://realitycheck.radio. Some would say that I have spent the >better part of the morning down the rabbit hole of misinformation, however I
like checking out all view points, so that I am well informed and educated.
Head to the replay section. Here you will find Rodney Hyde's rant on the >matter of "Define a woman? In it we have the answer, A woman is a adult >female human. Simple, correct and consice.Except that, with words, a single definition is often only ""correct""
for a small group who use it in that way - the definitions of both
''woman'' and ''man'' are no longer as clear cut in all situations
There is also Paul Brennan talking with Dr Guy Hatchard about the death >rate, now increased to 17% above the average.Now that is an example of the use of a statistic without adequately
defining it - what average? What deaths? what time period? what
population? Given the experience of the USA, it is possibly that we
have had world deaths from infection that are 17% higher than
previously, but that is not the case in New Zealand.
There is also the suggestion that the deaths caused by the vaccine are as >great as Covid deaths. (Sorry I forgotten where this is).Unless the vaccine induced positive tests for Covid without the
presence of the virus, that is clearly a wrong suggestion. Given that
Covid deaths required a positive test for the virus, an equivalent
number of vaccine induced deaths would have been very evident in
statistics - the comparison against actual vs expected deaths based on normal mortality would have shown a significant increase in actual
deaths. I suspect this is a conveniently anonymous wrong conjecture;
if you do recall where it was it you should be very wary of any
similar ''reckons'' from that source.
Rich80105 <Rich80105@hotmail.com> wrote:Look at the ''ourworldindata'' url I gave above, and look at the
On Mon, 10 Apr 2023 03:57:19 -0000 (UTC), TonySo provide some evidence that excess deaths in NZ is effectively zero.
<lizandtony@orcon.net.nz> wrote:
Rich80105 <Rich80105@hotmail.com> wrote:Indeed it is, but a very important one - and it is accompanied by a
On Sun, 9 Apr 2023 18:37:02 -0700 (PDT), John Bowes >>>><bowesjohn02@gmail.com> wrote:That is a very narrow set of data./
On Monday, April 10, 2023 at 1:33:28?PM UTC+12, Rich80105 wrote:Lets just stick to what I have posted; an important issue is whether
On Sun, 9 Apr 2023 18:27:55 -0700 (PDT), John BowesAll of it you imbecilic moron :)
<bowes...@gmail.com> wrote:
On Monday, April 10, 2023 at 12:55:40?PM UTC+12, Rich80105 wrote: >>>>>> >> On 10 Apr 2023 00:38:09 GMT, Gordon <Gor...@leaf.net.nz> wrote: >>>>>> >>
don't practice what you arrogantly demand from others. So how about >>>>>> >playing byOn 2023-04-09, Rich80105 <Rich...@hotmail.com> wrote:
On Sun, 9 Apr 2023 15:06:13 -0700 (PDT), John Bowes
<bowes...@gmail.com> wrote:
On Monday, April 10, 2023 at 9:38:56?AM UTC+12, John Bowes wrote: >>>>>> >> >>>> An interesting read for the rest of us. Mainly because unlike >>>>>> >> >>>>Rich
we have open minds...
https://www.chrislynchmedia.com/news-items/thedisinformationproject#.ZDMjdFAu1jG.twitter
Yet more that doesn't fit Richie's mainstream disinformed mind... >>>>>> >> >>>
https://nzdsos.com/2023/02/28/fifth-generation-warfare/
It is sad to see the rabbit holes some go down - see:
https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/health/coronavirus/300439357/covid19-nz-why-a-small-group-of-doctors-opposes-vaccination
That article is 18 months ago. Things have changed in that time. It >>>>>> >> >is
before Omicron's arrival.
The fact that we have this almost total disregard of the option to >>>>>> >> >changing
the view point as the real world has changed says an awful lot. >>>>>> >> What has changed in that time, Gordon? Our Covid experience continues >>>>>> >> to be better than many other countries with vaccination still being >>>>>> >> popular and apparently successful in keeping our death rates low. >>>>>> >Prove it! Apparently you're such an arrogant Marxist muppet you believe >>>>>> >you don't have to back up your disinformation with facts Rich. As usual >>>>>> >you
the rules you insist others follow. Or is it that you're just feral >>>>>> >man-in-dresses like those peaceful people who attacked Possie Parker... >>>>>> Which part do you want proved, John Bowes?
we have had better Covid results than other countries - for that see: >>>>https://ourworldindata.org/grapher/cumulative-excess-deaths-covid?country=USA~AUS~NCL~SGP~FRA~SWE~GBR~NZL~JPN~ITA~DEU~ZAF~HKG~ARG~CAN~BEL
lot of other international comparisons that, individually and
collectively, confirm that New Zealand has suffered less in terms of
direct Covid effect on individuals, better than most and possibly all >>comparable countries.
It is vital to aso look at what damage was done - a subject you refuse to >>>address.The measurement of excess deaths is a measure of damage - slightly >>negative, but effectively zero for New Zealand; yes some died, but an >>equivalent number of others lived longer. Then there is economic
damage - we have a lower inflation rate than most countries, we have
low unemployment compared to most countries, but I do not pretend that
all New Zealanders have done better than all people from other
countries - what other danage are you thinking of, Tony?
Do that and stop prevaricating.
There is increasing evidence that you are wrong.Mortality rates may reflct some elements of economic circumstances
Economic measurements are minor compared to health.
That measures actual deaths and compares with the expected deaths
based on pre-Covid mortality. Many countries are able to estimate >>>>expected deaths by applying experience of actual deaths over recent >>>>years to our population each year. For New Zealand, the total "Excess >>>>deaths" over that expected based on pre-covid death rates as at March >>>>5, 2023 is -169 ; in other words we have had fewer deaths than
expected through the covid period. We do know that Covid precautions >>>>did reduce many other deaths - deaths from other infectious diseases >>>>reduced, and road deaths reduced - and those positive effects >>>>outweighed the deaths from Covid.
Compare that with say the UK - at that date, the equivalent number for >>>>the UK is 198,995. Now that is still fairly low - they have a much >>>>large population than we do - but the most recent figure from the USA >>>>is 1.26 million.
In the chart above I have included a range of countries, you may like >>>>to look and see how many countries have a better result than New >>>>Zealand . . .
Happy now?
On Monday, April 10, 2023 at 5:05:21?PM UTC+12, Rich80105 wrote:others follow. Or is it that you're just feral man-in-dresses like those peaceful people who attacked Possie Parker...
On 10 Apr 2023 04:23:45 GMT, Gordon <Gor...@leaf.net.nz> wrote:
On 2023-04-10, John Bowes <bowes...@gmail.com> wrote:
On Monday, April 10, 2023 at 12:55:40?PM UTC+12, Rich80105 wrote:
On 10 Apr 2023 00:38:09 GMT, Gordon <Gor...@leaf.net.nz> wrote:Prove it! Apparently you're such an arrogant Marxist muppet you believe you don't have to back up your disinformation with facts Rich. As usual you don't practice what you arrogantly demand from others. So how about playing by the rules you insist
On 2023-04-09, Rich80105 <Rich...@hotmail.com> wrote:What has changed in that time, Gordon? Our Covid experience continues
On Sun, 9 Apr 2023 15:06:13 -0700 (PDT), John Bowes
<bowes...@gmail.com> wrote:
On Monday, April 10, 2023 at 9:38:56?AM UTC+12, John Bowes wrote:
An interesting read for the rest of us. Mainly because unlike Rich we have open minds...
https://www.chrislynchmedia.com/news-items/thedisinformationproject#.ZDMjdFAu1jG.twitter
Yet more that doesn't fit Richie's mainstream disinformed mind...
https://nzdsos.com/2023/02/28/fifth-generation-warfare/
It is sad to see the rabbit holes some go down - see:
https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/health/coronavirus/300439357/covid19-nz-why-a-small-group-of-doctors-opposes-vaccination
That article is 18 months ago. Things have changed in that time. It is >> >>> >before Omicron's arrival.
The fact that we have this almost total disregard of the option to changing
the view point as the real world has changed says an awful lot.
to be better than many other countries with vaccination still being
popular and apparenty successful in keeping our death rates low.
Get back on topic you moronic imbecile!Except that, with words, a single definition is often only ""correct""
On RCR, http://realitycheck.radio. Some would say that I have spent the
better part of the morning down the rabbit hole of misinformation, however I
like checking out all view points, so that I am well informed and educated. >> >
Head to the replay section. Here you will find Rodney Hyde's rant on the
matter of "Define a woman? In it we have the answer, A woman is a adult
female human. Simple, correct and consice.
for a small group who use it in that way - the definitions of both
''woman'' and ''man'' are no longer as clear cut in all situations
Now that is an example of the use of a statistic without adequately
There is also Paul Brennan talking with Dr Guy Hatchard about the death
rate, now increased to 17% above the average.
defining it - what average? What deaths? what time period? what
population? Given the experience of the USA, it is possibly that we
have had world deaths from infection that are 17% higher than
previously, but that is not the case in New Zealand.
There is also the suggestion that the deaths caused by the vaccine are as >> >great as Covid deaths. (Sorry I forgotten where this is).Unless the vaccine induced positive tests for Covid without the
presence of the virus, that is clearly a wrong suggestion. Given that
Covid deaths required a positive test for the virus, an equivalent
number of vaccine induced deaths would have been very evident in
statistics - the comparison against actual vs expected deaths based on
normal mortality would have shown a significant increase in actual
deaths. I suspect this is a conveniently anonymous wrong conjecture;
if you do recall where it was it you should be very wary of any
similar ''reckons'' from that source.
On 10 Apr 2023 04:23:45 GMT, Gordon <Gor...@leaf.net.nz> wrote:others follow. Or is it that you're just feral man-in-dresses like those peaceful people who attacked Possie Parker...
On 2023-04-10, John Bowes <bowes...@gmail.com> wrote:
On Monday, April 10, 2023 at 12:55:40?PM UTC+12, Rich80105 wrote:
On 10 Apr 2023 00:38:09 GMT, Gordon <Gor...@leaf.net.nz> wrote:Prove it! Apparently you're such an arrogant Marxist muppet you believe you don't have to back up your disinformation with facts Rich. As usual you don't practice what you arrogantly demand from others. So how about playing by the rules you insist
On 2023-04-09, Rich80105 <Rich...@hotmail.com> wrote:What has changed in that time, Gordon? Our Covid experience continues >>> to be better than many other countries with vaccination still being
On Sun, 9 Apr 2023 15:06:13 -0700 (PDT), John Bowes
<bowes...@gmail.com> wrote:
On Monday, April 10, 2023 at 9:38:56?AM UTC+12, John Bowes wrote:
An interesting read for the rest of us. Mainly because unlike Rich we have open minds...
https://www.chrislynchmedia.com/news-items/thedisinformationproject#.ZDMjdFAu1jG.twitter
Yet more that doesn't fit Richie's mainstream disinformed mind...
https://nzdsos.com/2023/02/28/fifth-generation-warfare/
It is sad to see the rabbit holes some go down - see:
https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/health/coronavirus/300439357/covid19-nz-why-a-small-group-of-doctors-opposes-vaccination
That article is 18 months ago. Things have changed in that time. It is >>> >before Omicron's arrival.
The fact that we have this almost total disregard of the option to changing
the view point as the real world has changed says an awful lot.
popular and apparenty successful in keeping our death rates low.
On RCR, http://realitycheck.radio. Some would say that I have spent the >better part of the morning down the rabbit hole of misinformation, however I
like checking out all view points, so that I am well informed and educated.
Head to the replay section. Here you will find Rodney Hyde's rant on the >matter of "Define a woman? In it we have the answer, A woman is a adult >female human. Simple, correct and consice.Except that, with words, a single definition is often only ""correct""
for a small group who use it in that way - the definitions of both
''woman'' and ''man'' are no longer as clear cut in all situations
There is also Paul Brennan talking with Dr Guy Hatchard about the death >rate, now increased to 17% above the average.Now that is an example of the use of a statistic without adequately
defining it - what average? What deaths? what time period? what
population? Given the experience of the USA, it is possibly that we
have had world deaths from infection that are 17% higher than
previously, but that is not the case in New Zealand.
There is also the suggestion that the deaths caused by the vaccine are as >great as Covid deaths. (Sorry I forgotten where this is).Unless the vaccine induced positive tests for Covid without the
presence of the virus, that is clearly a wrong suggestion. Given that
Covid deaths required a positive test for the virus, an equivalent
number of vaccine induced deaths would have been very evident in
statistics - the comparison against actual vs expected deaths based on normal mortality would have shown a significant increase in actual
deaths. I suspect this is a conveniently anonymous wrong conjecture;
if you do recall where it was it you should be very wary of any
similar ''reckons'' from that source.
On 2023-04-10, Rich80105 <Rich80105@hotmail.com> wrote:insist others follow. Or is it that you're just feral man-in-dresses like those peaceful people who attacked Possie Parker...
On Sun, 9 Apr 2023 20:01:23 -0700 (PDT), John Bowes >><bowesjohn02@gmail.com> wrote:
On Monday, April 10, 2023 at 2:24:47?PM UTC+12, Rich80105 wrote:
On Sun, 9 Apr 2023 18:37:02 -0700 (PDT), John Bowes
<bowes...@gmail.com> wrote:
On Monday, April 10, 2023 at 1:33:28?PM UTC+12, Rich80105 wrote:
On Sun, 9 Apr 2023 18:27:55 -0700 (PDT), John Bowes
<bowes...@gmail.com> wrote:
On Monday, April 10, 2023 at 12:55:40?PM UTC+12, Rich80105 wrote:
On 10 Apr 2023 00:38:09 GMT, Gordon <Gor...@leaf.net.nz> wrote:
On 2023-04-09, Rich80105 <Rich...@hotmail.com> wrote:to be better than many other countries with vaccination still being >>>> >> >> popular and apparently successful in keeping our death rates low. >>>> >> >Prove it! Apparently you're such an arrogant Marxist muppet you believe you don't have to back up your disinformation with facts Rich. As usual you don't practice what you arrogantly demand from others. So how about playing by the rules you
On Sun, 9 Apr 2023 15:06:13 -0700 (PDT), John Bowes
<bowes...@gmail.com> wrote:
On Monday, April 10, 2023 at 9:38:56?AM UTC+12, John Bowes wrote: >>>> >> >> >>>> An interesting read for the rest of us. Mainly because unlike Rich we have open minds...
https://www.chrislynchmedia.com/news-items/thedisinformationproject#.ZDMjdFAu1jG.twitter
Yet more that doesn't fit Richie's mainstream disinformed mind... >>>> >> >> >>>
https://nzdsos.com/2023/02/28/fifth-generation-warfare/
It is sad to see the rabbit holes some go down - see:
https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/health/coronavirus/300439357/covid19-nz-why-a-small-group-of-doctors-opposes-vaccination
That article is 18 months ago. Things have changed in that time. It is
before Omicron's arrival.
The fact that we have this almost total disregard of the option to changing
the view point as the real world has changed says an awful lot. >>>> >> >> What has changed in that time, Gordon? Our Covid experience continues
covid to New Zealand. But it shouldn't have prevented New Zealanders from getting home while letting disc jockeys through whenever they wanted to come. Apart from breaching the NZ Bill of Rights the Labour response was over the top. Probably helped byNo, its right up to date. Those calculations go up to data as at 12Lets just stick to what I have posted; an important issue is whetherWhich part do you want proved, John Bowes?All of it you imbecilic moron :)
we have had better Covid results than other countries - for that see:
https://ourworldindata.org/grapher/cumulative-excess-deaths-covid?country=USA~AUS~NCL~SGP~FRA~SWE~GBR~NZL~JPN~ITA~DEU~ZAF~HKG~ARG~CAN~BEL
That measures actual deaths and compares with the expected deaths
based on pre-Covid mortality. Many countries are able to estimate
expected deaths by applying experience of actual deaths over recent
years to our population each ytear. For New Zealand, the total "Excess >>>> deaths" over that expected based on pre-covid death rates as at March
5, 2023 is -169 ; in other words we have had fewer deaths than
expected through the covid period. We do know that Covid precautions
did reduce many other deaths - deaths from other infectious diseases
reduced, and road deaths reduced - and those positive effects
outweighed the deaths from Covid.
Compare that with say the UK - at that date, the equivalent number for >>>> the UK is 198,995. Now that is still fairly low - they have a much
large population than we do - but the most recent figure from the USA
is 1.26 million.
In the chart above I have included a range of countries, you may like
to look and see how many countries have a better result than New
Zealand . . .
It's past history and totally off topic Rich.
March this year, and the chart will be available for some time. What
it does show if you did look to see how many have a better record than
New Zealand is find that, as you have tried to ignore for a long time,
the responses of our government over the whole period of the Covid
pandemic (and it is not yet over) have been consistently world
leading.
It may have been buried by your well known lack of comprehension. but new Zealand is surrounded by water and even though Ardern stuffed around for two weeks before she finally did the right thing. It was actually bloody easy to slow down the entry of
You are having a bob each way then - they should have stopped people
coming in but they should not have stopped people coming in . . . The
only question is how many more deaths would you have been prepared to
have? 50? 100? 100,000?
Only idiots from the far right fringe claim that any government would
be able to eliminate covid in New Zealand; while it is infecting
people anywhere around the world we are not safe from it, which is why
it is important that as many New Zealanders as possible in the
critical age groups contnue to get vaccines when that is recommended -
have you got an appointment yet, John, or are you trying to get off
the list of those that may have died had the government not acted as
well as they have done and are doing . . . ?
For privacy reasons you will never get that, John; but you are correct
Happy now?
Not till you provide a list of the names who were supposedly saved from dying from covid who were saved by out medical professionals. Zero were saved by your inglorious misleader Ardern!
that our medical professionals did save quite a few that did get
infected; that list would not count however those who have been saved
through following recommendations and avoiding infection through both
the vaccines and by taking sensible precautions. Do you have a
vaccination appointment for this latest round, John?
Probably not as he, like many others have done the risk analaysis. Heard of >snake oil?
On 10 Apr 2023 04:23:45 GMT, Gordon <Gordon@leaf.net.nz> wrote:When prompted you used a single simple definition, and one that was woefully short of value.
On 2023-04-10, John Bowes <bowesjohn02@gmail.com> wrote:Except that, with words, a single definition is often only ""correct""
On Monday, April 10, 2023 at 12:55:40?PM UTC+12, Rich80105 wrote:
On 10 Apr 2023 00:38:09 GMT, Gordon <Gor...@leaf.net.nz> wrote:Prove it! Apparently you're such an arrogant Marxist muppet you believe you >>>don't have to back up your disinformation with facts Rich. As usual you don't
On 2023-04-09, Rich80105 <Rich...@hotmail.com> wrote:What has changed in that time, Gordon? Our Covid experience continues
On Sun, 9 Apr 2023 15:06:13 -0700 (PDT), John Bowes
<bowes...@gmail.com> wrote:
On Monday, April 10, 2023 at 9:38:56?AM UTC+12, John Bowes wrote:
An interesting read for the rest of us. Mainly because unlike Rich we >>>> >>>>have open minds...
https://www.chrislynchmedia.com/news-items/thedisinformationproject#.ZDMjdFAu1jG.twitter
Yet more that doesn't fit Richie's mainstream disinformed mind...
https://nzdsos.com/2023/02/28/fifth-generation-warfare/
It is sad to see the rabbit holes some go down - see:
https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/health/coronavirus/300439357/covid19-nz-why-a-small-group-of-doctors-opposes-vaccination
That article is 18 months ago. Things have changed in that time. It is >>>> >before Omicron's arrival.
The fact that we have this almost total disregard of the option to
changing
the view point as the real world has changed says an awful lot.
to be better than many other countries with vaccination still being
popular and apparenty successful in keeping our death rates low.
practice what you arrogantly demand from others. So how about playing by the >>>rules you insist others follow. Or is it that you're just feral man-in-dresses
like those peaceful people who attacked Possie Parker...
On RCR, http://realitycheck.radio. Some would say that I have spent the >>better part of the morning down the rabbit hole of misinformation, however I >>like checking out all view points, so that I am well informed and educated. >>
Head to the replay section. Here you will find Rodney Hyde's rant on the >>matter of "Define a woman? In it we have the answer, A woman is a adult >>female human. Simple, correct and consice.
for a small group who use it in that way - the definitions of both
''woman'' and ''man'' are no longer as clear cut in all situations
Now that is an example of the use of a statistic without adequately
There is also Paul Brennan talking with Dr Guy Hatchard about the death >>rate, now increased to 17% above the average.
defining it - what average? What deaths? what time period? what
population? Given the experience of the USA, it is possibly that we
have had world deaths from infection that are 17% higher than
previously, but that is not the case in New Zealand.
There is also the suggestion that the deaths caused by the vaccine are as >>great as Covid deaths. (Sorry I forgotten where this is).
Unless the vaccine induced positive tests for Covid without the
presence of the virus, that is clearly a wrong suggestion. Given that
Covid deaths required a positive test for the virus, an equivalent
number of vaccine induced deaths would have been very evident in
statistics - the comparison against actual vs expected deaths based on
normal mortality would have shown a significant increase in actual
deaths. I suspect this is a conveniently anonymous wrong conjecture;
if you do recall where it was it you should be very wary of any
similar ''reckons'' from that source.
On Sun, 9 Apr 2023 22:18:32 -0700 (PDT), John BowesSo you say - can you provide evidence of that?
<bowesjohn02@gmail.com> wrote:
On Monday, April 10, 2023 at 5:05:21?PM UTC+12, Rich80105 wrote:
On 10 Apr 2023 04:23:45 GMT, Gordon <Gor...@leaf.net.nz> wrote:Get back on topic you moronic imbecile!
On 2023-04-10, John Bowes <bowes...@gmail.com> wrote:Except that, with words, a single definition is often only ""correct""
On Monday, April 10, 2023 at 12:55:40?PM UTC+12, Rich80105 wrote:On RCR, http://realitycheck.radio. Some would say that I have spent the >>> >better part of the morning down the rabbit hole of misinformation, however >>> >I
On 10 Apr 2023 00:38:09 GMT, Gordon <Gor...@leaf.net.nz> wrote:Prove it! Apparently you're such an arrogant Marxist muppet you believe >>> >>you don't have to back up your disinformation with facts Rich. As usual you
On 2023-04-09, Rich80105 <Rich...@hotmail.com> wrote:What has changed in that time, Gordon? Our Covid experience continues >>> >>> to be better than many other countries with vaccination still being
On Sun, 9 Apr 2023 15:06:13 -0700 (PDT), John Bowes
<bowes...@gmail.com> wrote:
On Monday, April 10, 2023 at 9:38:56?AM UTC+12, John Bowes wrote: >>> >>> >>>> An interesting read for the rest of us. Mainly because unlike Rich >>> >>> >>>>we have open minds...
https://www.chrislynchmedia.com/news-items/thedisinformationproject#.ZDMjdFAu1jG.twitter
Yet more that doesn't fit Richie's mainstream disinformed mind... >>> >>> >>>
https://nzdsos.com/2023/02/28/fifth-generation-warfare/
It is sad to see the rabbit holes some go down - see:
https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/health/coronavirus/300439357/covid19-nz-why-a-small-group-of-doctors-opposes-vaccination
That article is 18 months ago. Things have changed in that time. It is >>> >>> >before Omicron's arrival.
The fact that we have this almost total disregard of the option to
changing
the view point as the real world has changed says an awful lot.
popular and apparenty successful in keeping our death rates low.
don't practice what you arrogantly demand from others. So how about playing by
the rules you insist others follow. Or is it that you're just feral
man-in-dresses like those peaceful people who attacked Possie Parker... >>> >
like checking out all view points, so that I am well informed and
educated.
Head to the replay section. Here you will find Rodney Hyde's rant on the >>> >matter of "Define a woman? In it we have the answer, A woman is a adult >>> >female human. Simple, correct and consice.
for a small group who use it in that way - the definitions of both
''woman'' and ''man'' are no longer as clear cut in all situations
Now that is an example of the use of a statistic without adequately
There is also Paul Brennan talking with Dr Guy Hatchard about the death >>> >rate, now increased to 17% above the average.
defining it - what average? What deaths? what time period? what
population? Given the experience of the USA, it is possibly that we
have had world deaths from infection that are 17% higher than
previously, but that is not the case in New Zealand.
There is also the suggestion that the deaths caused by the vaccine are as >>> >great as Covid deaths. (Sorry I forgotten where this is).Unless the vaccine induced positive tests for Covid without the
presence of the virus, that is clearly a wrong suggestion. Given that
Covid deaths required a positive test for the virus, an equivalent
number of vaccine induced deaths would have been very evident in
statistics - the comparison against actual vs expected deaths based on
normal mortality would have shown a significant increase in actual
deaths. I suspect this is a conveniently anonymous wrong conjecture;
if you do recall where it was it you should be very wary of any
similar ''reckons'' from that source.
I was responding to the bizarre clainm that "There is also Paul
Brennan talking with Dr Guy Hatchard about the death rate, now
increased to 17% above the average."
We have not experienced a death rate 17% above the average.
On Mon, 10 Apr 2023 04:55:32 -0000 (UTC), TonyAnswer the question or bugger off.
<lizandtony@orcon.net.nz> wrote:
Rich80105 <Rich80105@hotmail.com> wrote:Look at the ''ourworldindata'' url I gave above, and look at the
On Mon, 10 Apr 2023 03:57:19 -0000 (UTC), TonySo provide some evidence that excess deaths in NZ is effectively zero.
<lizandtony@orcon.net.nz> wrote:
Rich80105 <Rich80105@hotmail.com> wrote:Indeed it is, but a very important one - and it is accompanied by a
On Sun, 9 Apr 2023 18:37:02 -0700 (PDT), John Bowes >>>>><bowesjohn02@gmail.com> wrote:That is a very narrow set of data./
On Monday, April 10, 2023 at 1:33:28?PM UTC+12, Rich80105 wrote:Lets just stick to what I have posted; an important issue is whether >>>>>we have had better Covid results than other countries - for that see: >>>>>https://ourworldindata.org/grapher/cumulative-excess-deaths-covid?country=USA~AUS~NCL~SGP~FRA~SWE~GBR~NZL~JPN~ITA~DEU~ZAF~HKG~ARG~CAN~BEL
On Sun, 9 Apr 2023 18:27:55 -0700 (PDT), John BowesAll of it you imbecilic moron :)
<bowes...@gmail.com> wrote:
On Monday, April 10, 2023 at 12:55:40?PM UTC+12, Rich80105 wrote: >>>>>>> >> On 10 Apr 2023 00:38:09 GMT, Gordon <Gor...@leaf.net.nz> wrote: >>>>>>> >>Which part do you want proved, John Bowes?
you don't have to back up your disinformation with facts Rich. As >>>>>>> >usualOn 2023-04-09, Rich80105 <Rich...@hotmail.com> wrote:
On Sun, 9 Apr 2023 15:06:13 -0700 (PDT), John Bowes
<bowes...@gmail.com> wrote:
On Monday, April 10, 2023 at 9:38:56?AM UTC+12, John Bowes wrote: >>>>>>> >> >>>> An interesting read for the rest of us. Mainly because unlike >>>>>>> >> >>>>Rich
we have open minds...
https://www.chrislynchmedia.com/news-items/thedisinformationproject#.ZDMjdFAu1jG.twitter
Yet more that doesn't fit Richie's mainstream disinformed mind... >>>>>>> >> >>>
https://nzdsos.com/2023/02/28/fifth-generation-warfare/
It is sad to see the rabbit holes some go down - see:
continueshttps://www.stuff.co.nz/national/health/coronavirus/300439357/covid19-nz-why-a-small-group-of-doctors-opposes-vaccination
That article is 18 months ago. Things have changed in that time. It >>>>>>> >> >is
before Omicron's arrival.
The fact that we have this almost total disregard of the option to >>>>>>> >> >changing
the view point as the real world has changed says an awful lot. >>>>>>> >> What has changed in that time, Gordon? Our Covid experience
to be better than many other countries with vaccination still being >>>>>>> >> popular and apparently successful in keeping our death rates low. >>>>>>> >Prove it! Apparently you're such an arrogant Marxist muppet you >>>>>>> >believe
you
don't practice what you arrogantly demand from others. So how about >>>>>>> >playing by
the rules you insist others follow. Or is it that you're just feral >>>>>>> >man-in-dresses like those peaceful people who attacked Possie Parker...
lot of other international comparisons that, individually and >>>collectively, confirm that New Zealand has suffered less in terms of >>>direct Covid effect on individuals, better than most and possibly all >>>comparable countries.
It is vital to aso look at what damage was done - a subject you refuse to >>>>address.The measurement of excess deaths is a measure of damage - slightly >>>negative, but effectively zero for New Zealand; yes some died, but an >>>equivalent number of others lived longer. Then there is economic
damage - we have a lower inflation rate than most countries, we have
low unemployment compared to most countries, but I do not pretend that >>>all New Zealanders have done better than all people from other
countries - what other danage are you thinking of, Tony?
Do that and stop prevaricating.
latest figure for New Zealand. It should that, compared to the number
of deaths expected based on pre-covid death rates, we have experienced
169 fewer deaths - we are the only country of our size or large that
has such a result, but given the number of deaths we have each year, a >difference of 169 is not significantly different from zero.
Sure we have had covid deaths, but they have been balanced by later
deaths for many due we believe at least in part the effects of
lock-downs and other health measures that meant fewer people died from
other infections.
There is increasing evidence that you are wrong.Mortality rates may reflct some elements of economic circumstances
Economic measurements are minor compared to health.
(the poor do not live as long as those who are ''comfortable'', but in
broad terms is ins not normally considered and economic measurement.
Read also the next paragraph below:
That measures actual deaths and compares with the expected deaths >>>>>based on pre-Covid mortality. Many countries are able to estimate >>>>>expected deaths by applying experience of actual deaths over recent >>>>>years to our population each year. For New Zealand, the total "Excess >>>>>deaths" over that expected based on pre-covid death rates as at March >>>>>5, 2023 is -169 ; in other words we have had fewer deaths than >>>>>expected through the covid period. We do know that Covid precautions >>>>>did reduce many other deaths - deaths from other infectious diseases >>>>>reduced, and road deaths reduced - and those positive effects >>>>>outweighed the deaths from Covid.
Compare that with say the UK - at that date, the equivalent number for >>>>>the UK is 198,995. Now that is still fairly low - they have a much >>>>>large population than we do - but the most recent figure from the USA >>>>>is 1.26 million.
In the chart above I have included a range of countries, you may like >>>>>to look and see how many countries have a better result than New >>>>>Zealand . . .
Happy now?
Rich80105 <Rich...@hotmail.com> wrote:Rich is incapable of doing either. But what do you expect from a numbskull who believes women can have penises?
On Mon, 10 Apr 2023 04:55:32 -0000 (UTC), Tony
<lizan...@orcon.net.nz> wrote:
Rich80105 <Rich...@hotmail.com> wrote:Look at the ''ourworldindata'' url I gave above, and look at the
On Mon, 10 Apr 2023 03:57:19 -0000 (UTC), TonySo provide some evidence that excess deaths in NZ is effectively zero. >>Do that and stop prevaricating.
<lizan...@orcon.net.nz> wrote:
Rich80105 <Rich...@hotmail.com> wrote:Indeed it is, but a very important one - and it is accompanied by a >>>lot of other international comparisons that, individually and >>>collectively, confirm that New Zealand has suffered less in terms of >>>direct Covid effect on individuals, better than most and possibly all >>>comparable countries.
On Sun, 9 Apr 2023 18:37:02 -0700 (PDT), John Bowes >>>>><bowes...@gmail.com> wrote:That is a very narrow set of data./
On Monday, April 10, 2023 at 1:33:28?PM UTC+12, Rich80105 wrote: >>>>>>> On Sun, 9 Apr 2023 18:27:55 -0700 (PDT), John BowesLets just stick to what I have posted; an important issue is whether >>>>>we have had better Covid results than other countries - for that see: >>>>>https://ourworldindata.org/grapher/cumulative-excess-deaths-covid?country=USA~AUS~NCL~SGP~FRA~SWE~GBR~NZL~JPN~ITA~DEU~ZAF~HKG~ARG~CAN~BEL
<bowes...@gmail.com> wrote:All of it you imbecilic moron :)
On Monday, April 10, 2023 at 12:55:40?PM UTC+12, Rich80105 wrote: >>>>>>> >> On 10 Apr 2023 00:38:09 GMT, Gordon <Gor...@leaf.net.nz> wrote: >>>>>>> >>Which part do you want proved, John Bowes?
you don't have to back up your disinformation with facts Rich. As >>>>>>> >usualOn 2023-04-09, Rich80105 <Rich...@hotmail.com> wrote:
On Sun, 9 Apr 2023 15:06:13 -0700 (PDT), John Bowes
<bowes...@gmail.com> wrote:
On Monday, April 10, 2023 at 9:38:56?AM UTC+12, John Bowes wrote:
An interesting read for the rest of us. Mainly because unlike
Rich
we have open minds...
It is sad to see the rabbit holes some go down - see:https://www.chrislynchmedia.com/news-items/thedisinformationproject#.ZDMjdFAu1jG.twitter
Yet more that doesn't fit Richie's mainstream disinformed mind...
https://nzdsos.com/2023/02/28/fifth-generation-warfare/ >>>>>>> >> >>
to be better than many other countries with vaccination still beinghttps://www.stuff.co.nz/national/health/coronavirus/300439357/covid19-nz-why-a-small-group-of-doctors-opposes-vaccination
That article is 18 months ago. Things have changed in that time. It
is
before Omicron's arrival.
The fact that we have this almost total disregard of the option to
changing
the view point as the real world has changed says an awful lot. >>>>>>> >> What has changed in that time, Gordon? Our Covid experience >>>>>>> >>continues
popular and apparently successful in keeping our death rates low. >>>>>>> >Prove it! Apparently you're such an arrogant Marxist muppet you >>>>>>> >believe
you
don't practice what you arrogantly demand from others. So how about >>>>>>> >playing by
the rules you insist others follow. Or is it that you're just feral >>>>>>> >man-in-dresses like those peaceful people who attacked Possie Parker...
It is vital to aso look at what damage was done - a subject you refuse toThe measurement of excess deaths is a measure of damage - slightly >>>negative, but effectively zero for New Zealand; yes some died, but an >>>equivalent number of others lived longer. Then there is economic >>>damage - we have a lower inflation rate than most countries, we have >>>low unemployment compared to most countries, but I do not pretend that >>>all New Zealanders have done better than all people from other >>>countries - what other danage are you thinking of, Tony?
address.
latest figure for New Zealand. It should that, compared to the number
of deaths expected based on pre-covid death rates, we have experienced
169 fewer deaths - we are the only country of our size or large that
has such a result, but given the number of deaths we have each year, a >difference of 169 is not significantly different from zero.
Sure we have had covid deaths, but they have been balanced by later
deaths for many due we believe at least in part the effects of
lock-downs and other health measures that meant fewer people died from >other infections.
There is increasing evidence that you are wrong.Mortality rates may reflct some elements of economic circumstances
Economic measurements are minor compared to health.
(the poor do not live as long as those who are ''comfortable'', but in >broad terms is ins not normally considered and economic measurement.
Read also the next paragraph below:Answer the question or bugger off.
That measures actual deaths and compares with the expected deaths >>>>>based on pre-Covid mortality. Many countries are able to estimate >>>>>expected deaths by applying experience of actual deaths over recent >>>>>years to our population each year. For New Zealand, the total "Excess >>>>>deaths" over that expected based on pre-covid death rates as at March >>>>>5, 2023 is -169 ; in other words we have had fewer deaths than >>>>>expected through the covid period. We do know that Covid precautions >>>>>did reduce many other deaths - deaths from other infectious diseases >>>>>reduced, and road deaths reduced - and those positive effects >>>>>outweighed the deaths from Covid.
Compare that with say the UK - at that date, the equivalent number for >>>>>the UK is 198,995. Now that is still fairly low - they have a much >>>>>large population than we do - but the most recent figure from the USA >>>>>is 1.26 million.
In the chart above I have included a range of countries, you may like >>>>>to look and see how many countries have a better result than New >>>>>Zealand . . .
Happy now?
On Sun, 9 Apr 2023 22:18:32 -0700 (PDT), John Bowesinsist others follow. Or is it that you're just feral man-in-dresses like those peaceful people who attacked Possie Parker...
<bowes...@gmail.com> wrote:
On Monday, April 10, 2023 at 5:05:21?PM UTC+12, Rich80105 wrote:
On 10 Apr 2023 04:23:45 GMT, Gordon <Gor...@leaf.net.nz> wrote:
On 2023-04-10, John Bowes <bowes...@gmail.com> wrote:
On Monday, April 10, 2023 at 12:55:40?PM UTC+12, Rich80105 wrote:
On 10 Apr 2023 00:38:09 GMT, Gordon <Gor...@leaf.net.nz> wrote:Prove it! Apparently you're such an arrogant Marxist muppet you believe you don't have to back up your disinformation with facts Rich. As usual you don't practice what you arrogantly demand from others. So how about playing by the rules you
On 2023-04-09, Rich80105 <Rich...@hotmail.com> wrote:What has changed in that time, Gordon? Our Covid experience continues >> >>> to be better than many other countries with vaccination still being >> >>> popular and apparenty successful in keeping our death rates low.
On Sun, 9 Apr 2023 15:06:13 -0700 (PDT), John Bowes
<bowes...@gmail.com> wrote:
On Monday, April 10, 2023 at 9:38:56?AM UTC+12, John Bowes wrote: >> >>> >>>> An interesting read for the rest of us. Mainly because unlike Rich we have open minds...
https://www.chrislynchmedia.com/news-items/thedisinformationproject#.ZDMjdFAu1jG.twitter
Yet more that doesn't fit Richie's mainstream disinformed mind... >> >>> >>>
https://nzdsos.com/2023/02/28/fifth-generation-warfare/
It is sad to see the rabbit holes some go down - see:
https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/health/coronavirus/300439357/covid19-nz-why-a-small-group-of-doctors-opposes-vaccination
That article is 18 months ago. Things have changed in that time. It is
before Omicron's arrival.
The fact that we have this almost total disregard of the option to changing
the view point as the real world has changed says an awful lot.
So typical of you Rich. You can't help telling us stuff we already know. Is it just your stupid arrogance or your insane arrogance that does that.I was responding to the bizarre clainm that "There is also PaulGet back on topic you moronic imbecile!Except that, with words, a single definition is often only ""correct""
On RCR, http://realitycheck.radio. Some would say that I have spent the >> >better part of the morning down the rabbit hole of misinformation, however I
like checking out all view points, so that I am well informed and educated.
Head to the replay section. Here you will find Rodney Hyde's rant on the >> >matter of "Define a woman? In it we have the answer, A woman is a adult >> >female human. Simple, correct and consice.
for a small group who use it in that way - the definitions of both
''woman'' and ''man'' are no longer as clear cut in all situations
Now that is an example of the use of a statistic without adequately
There is also Paul Brennan talking with Dr Guy Hatchard about the death >> >rate, now increased to 17% above the average.
defining it - what average? What deaths? what time period? what
population? Given the experience of the USA, it is possibly that we
have had world deaths from infection that are 17% higher than
previously, but that is not the case in New Zealand.
There is also the suggestion that the deaths caused by the vaccine are asUnless the vaccine induced positive tests for Covid without the
great as Covid deaths. (Sorry I forgotten where this is).
presence of the virus, that is clearly a wrong suggestion. Given that
Covid deaths required a positive test for the virus, an equivalent
number of vaccine induced deaths would have been very evident in
statistics - the comparison against actual vs expected deaths based on
normal mortality would have shown a significant increase in actual
deaths. I suspect this is a conveniently anonymous wrong conjecture;
if you do recall where it was it you should be very wary of any
similar ''reckons'' from that source.
Brennan talking with Dr Guy Hatchard about the death rate, now
increased to 17% above the average."
We have not experienced a death rate 17% above the average.
Rich80105 <Rich...@hotmail.com> wrote:Simple pretty well describes Rich. I'd bet his science degree is just in his mind. After all he claim's you can change what sex you are just by thinking it. Guess in his case it probably applies to science degrees...
On 10 Apr 2023 04:23:45 GMT, Gordon <Gor...@leaf.net.nz> wrote:
When prompted you used a single simple definition, and one that was woefully short of value.On 2023-04-10, John Bowes <bowes...@gmail.com> wrote:Except that, with words, a single definition is often only ""correct""
On Monday, April 10, 2023 at 12:55:40?PM UTC+12, Rich80105 wrote:
On 10 Apr 2023 00:38:09 GMT, Gordon <Gor...@leaf.net.nz> wrote:Prove it! Apparently you're such an arrogant Marxist muppet you believe you
On 2023-04-09, Rich80105 <Rich...@hotmail.com> wrote:What has changed in that time, Gordon? Our Covid experience continues >>>> to be better than many other countries with vaccination still being >>>> popular and apparenty successful in keeping our death rates low.
On Sun, 9 Apr 2023 15:06:13 -0700 (PDT), John Bowes
<bowes...@gmail.com> wrote:
On Monday, April 10, 2023 at 9:38:56?AM UTC+12, John Bowes wrote: >>>> >>>> An interesting read for the rest of us. Mainly because unlike Rich we
have open minds...
https://www.chrislynchmedia.com/news-items/thedisinformationproject#.ZDMjdFAu1jG.twitter
Yet more that doesn't fit Richie's mainstream disinformed mind... >>>> >>>
https://nzdsos.com/2023/02/28/fifth-generation-warfare/
It is sad to see the rabbit holes some go down - see:
https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/health/coronavirus/300439357/covid19-nz-why-a-small-group-of-doctors-opposes-vaccination
That article is 18 months ago. Things have changed in that time. It is >>>> >before Omicron's arrival.
The fact that we have this almost total disregard of the option to >>>> >changing
the view point as the real world has changed says an awful lot.
don't have to back up your disinformation with facts Rich. As usual you don't
practice what you arrogantly demand from others. So how about playing by the
rules you insist others follow. Or is it that you're just feral man-in-dresses
like those peaceful people who attacked Possie Parker...
On RCR, http://realitycheck.radio. Some would say that I have spent the >>better part of the morning down the rabbit hole of misinformation, however I
like checking out all view points, so that I am well informed and educated.
Head to the replay section. Here you will find Rodney Hyde's rant on the >>matter of "Define a woman? In it we have the answer, A woman is a adult >>female human. Simple, correct and consice.
for a small group who use it in that way - the definitions of both >''woman'' and ''man'' are no longer as clear cut in all situations
Now that is an example of the use of a statistic without adequately >defining it - what average? What deaths? what time period? what >population? Given the experience of the USA, it is possibly that we
There is also Paul Brennan talking with Dr Guy Hatchard about the death >>rate, now increased to 17% above the average.
have had world deaths from infection that are 17% higher than
previously, but that is not the case in New Zealand.
There is also the suggestion that the deaths caused by the vaccine are as >>great as Covid deaths. (Sorry I forgotten where this is).
Unless the vaccine induced positive tests for Covid without the
presence of the virus, that is clearly a wrong suggestion. Given that >Covid deaths required a positive test for the virus, an equivalent
number of vaccine induced deaths would have been very evident in >statistics - the comparison against actual vs expected deaths based on >normal mortality would have shown a significant increase in actual
deaths. I suspect this is a conveniently anonymous wrong conjecture;
if you do recall where it was it you should be very wary of any
similar ''reckons'' from that source.
Rich80105 <Rich80105@hotmail.com> wrote:Yes: https://ourworldindata.org/grapher/cumulative-excess-deaths-covid?country=USA~AUS~NCL~SGP~FRA~SWE~GBR~NZL~JPN~ITA~DEU~ZAF~HKG~ARG~CAN~BEL
On Sun, 9 Apr 2023 22:18:32 -0700 (PDT), John BowesSo you say - can you provide evidence of that?
<bowesjohn02@gmail.com> wrote:
On Monday, April 10, 2023 at 5:05:21?PM UTC+12, Rich80105 wrote:
On 10 Apr 2023 04:23:45 GMT, Gordon <Gor...@leaf.net.nz> wrote:Get back on topic you moronic imbecile!
On 2023-04-10, John Bowes <bowes...@gmail.com> wrote:Except that, with words, a single definition is often only ""correct"" >>>> for a small group who use it in that way - the definitions of both
On Monday, April 10, 2023 at 12:55:40?PM UTC+12, Rich80105 wrote:On RCR, http://realitycheck.radio. Some would say that I have spent the >>>> >better part of the morning down the rabbit hole of misinformation, however
On 10 Apr 2023 00:38:09 GMT, Gordon <Gor...@leaf.net.nz> wrote:Prove it! Apparently you're such an arrogant Marxist muppet you believe >>>> >>you don't have to back up your disinformation with facts Rich. As usual you
On 2023-04-09, Rich80105 <Rich...@hotmail.com> wrote:What has changed in that time, Gordon? Our Covid experience continues >>>> >>> to be better than many other countries with vaccination still being >>>> >>> popular and apparenty successful in keeping our death rates low.
On Sun, 9 Apr 2023 15:06:13 -0700 (PDT), John Bowes
<bowes...@gmail.com> wrote:
On Monday, April 10, 2023 at 9:38:56?AM UTC+12, John Bowes wrote: >>>> >>> >>>> An interesting read for the rest of us. Mainly because unlike Rich
we have open minds...
https://www.chrislynchmedia.com/news-items/thedisinformationproject#.ZDMjdFAu1jG.twitter
Yet more that doesn't fit Richie's mainstream disinformed mind... >>>> >>> >>>
https://nzdsos.com/2023/02/28/fifth-generation-warfare/
It is sad to see the rabbit holes some go down - see:
https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/health/coronavirus/300439357/covid19-nz-why-a-small-group-of-doctors-opposes-vaccination
That article is 18 months ago. Things have changed in that time. It is
before Omicron's arrival.
The fact that we have this almost total disregard of the option to >>>> >>> >changing
the view point as the real world has changed says an awful lot.
don't practice what you arrogantly demand from others. So how about playing by
the rules you insist others follow. Or is it that you're just feral
man-in-dresses like those peaceful people who attacked Possie Parker... >>>> >
I
like checking out all view points, so that I am well informed and
educated.
Head to the replay section. Here you will find Rodney Hyde's rant on the >>>> >matter of "Define a woman? In it we have the answer, A woman is a adult >>>> >female human. Simple, correct and consice.
''woman'' and ''man'' are no longer as clear cut in all situations
Now that is an example of the use of a statistic without adequately
There is also Paul Brennan talking with Dr Guy Hatchard about the death >>>> >rate, now increased to 17% above the average.
defining it - what average? What deaths? what time period? what
population? Given the experience of the USA, it is possibly that we
have had world deaths from infection that are 17% higher than
previously, but that is not the case in New Zealand.
There is also the suggestion that the deaths caused by the vaccine are as >>>> >great as Covid deaths. (Sorry I forgotten where this is).Unless the vaccine induced positive tests for Covid without the
presence of the virus, that is clearly a wrong suggestion. Given that
Covid deaths required a positive test for the virus, an equivalent
number of vaccine induced deaths would have been very evident in
statistics - the comparison against actual vs expected deaths based on >>>> normal mortality would have shown a significant increase in actual
deaths. I suspect this is a conveniently anonymous wrong conjecture;
if you do recall where it was it you should be very wary of any
similar ''reckons'' from that source.
I was responding to the bizarre clainm that "There is also Paul
Brennan talking with Dr Guy Hatchard about the death rate, now
increased to 17% above the average."
We have not experienced a death rate 17% above the average.
Rich80105 <Rich80105@hotmail.com> wrote:I gave this one:
On 10 Apr 2023 04:23:45 GMT, Gordon <Gordon@leaf.net.nz> wrote:When prompted you used a single simple definition, and one that was woefully >short of value.
On 2023-04-10, John Bowes <bowesjohn02@gmail.com> wrote:Except that, with words, a single definition is often only ""correct""
On Monday, April 10, 2023 at 12:55:40?PM UTC+12, Rich80105 wrote:
On 10 Apr 2023 00:38:09 GMT, Gordon <Gor...@leaf.net.nz> wrote:Prove it! Apparently you're such an arrogant Marxist muppet you believe you
On 2023-04-09, Rich80105 <Rich...@hotmail.com> wrote:What has changed in that time, Gordon? Our Covid experience continues >>>>> to be better than many other countries with vaccination still being
On Sun, 9 Apr 2023 15:06:13 -0700 (PDT), John Bowes
<bowes...@gmail.com> wrote:
On Monday, April 10, 2023 at 9:38:56?AM UTC+12, John Bowes wrote: >>>>> >>>> An interesting read for the rest of us. Mainly because unlike Rich we
have open minds...
https://www.chrislynchmedia.com/news-items/thedisinformationproject#.ZDMjdFAu1jG.twitter
Yet more that doesn't fit Richie's mainstream disinformed mind... >>>>> >>>
https://nzdsos.com/2023/02/28/fifth-generation-warfare/
It is sad to see the rabbit holes some go down - see:
https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/health/coronavirus/300439357/covid19-nz-why-a-small-group-of-doctors-opposes-vaccination
That article is 18 months ago. Things have changed in that time. It is >>>>> >before Omicron's arrival.
The fact that we have this almost total disregard of the option to
changing
the view point as the real world has changed says an awful lot.
popular and apparenty successful in keeping our death rates low.
don't have to back up your disinformation with facts Rich. As usual you don't
practice what you arrogantly demand from others. So how about playing by the
rules you insist others follow. Or is it that you're just feral man-in-dresses
like those peaceful people who attacked Possie Parker...
On RCR, http://realitycheck.radio. Some would say that I have spent the >>>better part of the morning down the rabbit hole of misinformation, however I >>>like checking out all view points, so that I am well informed and educated. >>>
Head to the replay section. Here you will find Rodney Hyde's rant on the >>>matter of "Define a woman? In it we have the answer, A woman is a adult >>>female human. Simple, correct and consice.
for a small group who use it in that way - the definitions of both >>''woman'' and ''man'' are no longer as clear cut in all situations
Now that is an example of the use of a statistic without adequately >>defining it - what average? What deaths? what time period? what
There is also Paul Brennan talking with Dr Guy Hatchard about the death >>>rate, now increased to 17% above the average.
population? Given the experience of the USA, it is possibly that we
have had world deaths from infection that are 17% higher than
previously, but that is not the case in New Zealand.
There is also the suggestion that the deaths caused by the vaccine are as >>>great as Covid deaths. (Sorry I forgotten where this is).
Unless the vaccine induced positive tests for Covid without the
presence of the virus, that is clearly a wrong suggestion. Given that
Covid deaths required a positive test for the virus, an equivalent
number of vaccine induced deaths would have been very evident in
statistics - the comparison against actual vs expected deaths based on >>normal mortality would have shown a significant increase in actual
deaths. I suspect this is a conveniently anonymous wrong conjecture;
if you do recall where it was it you should be very wary of any
similar ''reckons'' from that source.
Rich80105 <Rich80105@hotmail.com> wrote:I was providing a direct answer to the implied quetion:
On Mon, 10 Apr 2023 04:55:32 -0000 (UTC), TonyAnswer the question or bugger off.
<lizandtony@orcon.net.nz> wrote:
Rich80105 <Rich80105@hotmail.com> wrote:Look at the ''ourworldindata'' url I gave above, and look at the
On Mon, 10 Apr 2023 03:57:19 -0000 (UTC), Tony >>>><lizandtony@orcon.net.nz> wrote:So provide some evidence that excess deaths in NZ is effectively zero.
Rich80105 <Rich80105@hotmail.com> wrote:Indeed it is, but a very important one - and it is accompanied by a
On Sun, 9 Apr 2023 18:37:02 -0700 (PDT), John Bowes >>>>>><bowesjohn02@gmail.com> wrote:That is a very narrow set of data./
On Monday, April 10, 2023 at 1:33:28?PM UTC+12, Rich80105 wrote: >>>>>>>> On Sun, 9 Apr 2023 18:27:55 -0700 (PDT), John BowesLets just stick to what I have posted; an important issue is whether >>>>>>we have had better Covid results than other countries - for that see: >>>>>>https://ourworldindata.org/grapher/cumulative-excess-deaths-covid?country=USA~AUS~NCL~SGP~FRA~SWE~GBR~NZL~JPN~ITA~DEU~ZAF~HKG~ARG~CAN~BEL
<bowes...@gmail.com> wrote:All of it you imbecilic moron :)
On Monday, April 10, 2023 at 12:55:40?PM UTC+12, Rich80105 wrote: >>>>>>>> >> On 10 Apr 2023 00:38:09 GMT, Gordon <Gor...@leaf.net.nz> wrote: >>>>>>>> >>Which part do you want proved, John Bowes?
you don't have to back up your disinformation with facts Rich. As >>>>>>>> >usualOn 2023-04-09, Rich80105 <Rich...@hotmail.com> wrote:
On Sun, 9 Apr 2023 15:06:13 -0700 (PDT), John Bowes
<bowes...@gmail.com> wrote:
On Monday, April 10, 2023 at 9:38:56?AM UTC+12, John Bowes wrote:
An interesting read for the rest of us. Mainly because unlike >>>>>>>> >> >>>>Rich
we have open minds...
https://www.chrislynchmedia.com/news-items/thedisinformationproject#.ZDMjdFAu1jG.twitter
Yet more that doesn't fit Richie's mainstream disinformed mind...
https://nzdsos.com/2023/02/28/fifth-generation-warfare/
It is sad to see the rabbit holes some go down - see:
to be better than many other countries with vaccination still being >>>>>>>> >> popular and apparently successful in keeping our death rates low. >>>>>>>> >Prove it! Apparently you're such an arrogant Marxist muppet you >>>>>>>> >believehttps://www.stuff.co.nz/national/health/coronavirus/300439357/covid19-nz-why-a-small-group-of-doctors-opposes-vaccination
That article is 18 months ago. Things have changed in that time. It
is
before Omicron's arrival.
The fact that we have this almost total disregard of the option to >>>>>>>> >> >changing
the view point as the real world has changed says an awful lot. >>>>>>>> >> What has changed in that time, Gordon? Our Covid experience >>>>>>>> >>continues
you
don't practice what you arrogantly demand from others. So how about >>>>>>>> >playing by
the rules you insist others follow. Or is it that you're just feral >>>>>>>> >man-in-dresses like those peaceful people who attacked Possie Parker...
lot of other international comparisons that, individually and >>>>collectively, confirm that New Zealand has suffered less in terms of >>>>direct Covid effect on individuals, better than most and possibly all >>>>comparable countries.
It is vital to aso look at what damage was done - a subject you refuse to >>>>>address.The measurement of excess deaths is a measure of damage - slightly >>>>negative, but effectively zero for New Zealand; yes some died, but an >>>>equivalent number of others lived longer. Then there is economic
damage - we have a lower inflation rate than most countries, we have >>>>low unemployment compared to most countries, but I do not pretend that >>>>all New Zealanders have done better than all people from other >>>>countries - what other danage are you thinking of, Tony?
Do that and stop prevaricating.
latest figure for New Zealand. It should that, compared to the number
of deaths expected based on pre-covid death rates, we have experienced
169 fewer deaths - we are the only country of our size or large that
has such a result, but given the number of deaths we have each year, a >>difference of 169 is not significantly different from zero.
Sure we have had covid deaths, but they have been balanced by later
deaths for many due we believe at least in part the effects of
lock-downs and other health measures that meant fewer people died from >>other infections.
There is increasing evidence that you are wrong.Mortality rates may reflct some elements of economic circumstances
Economic measurements are minor compared to health.
(the poor do not live as long as those who are ''comfortable'', but in >>broad terms is ins not normally considered and economic measurement.
Read also the next paragraph below:
That measures actual deaths and compares with the expected deaths >>>>>>based on pre-Covid mortality. Many countries are able to estimate >>>>>>expected deaths by applying experience of actual deaths over recent >>>>>>years to our population each year. For New Zealand, the total "Excess >>>>>>deaths" over that expected based on pre-covid death rates as at March >>>>>>5, 2023 is -169 ; in other words we have had fewer deaths than >>>>>>expected through the covid period. We do know that Covid precautions >>>>>>did reduce many other deaths - deaths from other infectious diseases >>>>>>reduced, and road deaths reduced - and those positive effects >>>>>>outweighed the deaths from Covid.
Compare that with say the UK - at that date, the equivalent number for >>>>>>the UK is 198,995. Now that is still fairly low - they have a much >>>>>>large population than we do - but the most recent figure from the USA >>>>>>is 1.26 million.
In the chart above I have included a range of countries, you may like >>>>>>to look and see how many countries have a better result than New >>>>>>Zealand . . .
Happy now?
On Monday, April 10, 2023 at 5:39:35?PM UTC+12, Rich80105 wrote:insist others follow. Or is it that you're just feral man-in-dresses like those peaceful people who attacked Possie Parker...
On Sun, 9 Apr 2023 22:18:32 -0700 (PDT), John Bowes
<bowes...@gmail.com> wrote:
On Monday, April 10, 2023 at 5:05:21?PM UTC+12, Rich80105 wrote:
On 10 Apr 2023 04:23:45 GMT, Gordon <Gor...@leaf.net.nz> wrote:
On 2023-04-10, John Bowes <bowes...@gmail.com> wrote:
On Monday, April 10, 2023 at 12:55:40?PM UTC+12, Rich80105 wrote:
On 10 Apr 2023 00:38:09 GMT, Gordon <Gor...@leaf.net.nz> wrote:Prove it! Apparently you're such an arrogant Marxist muppet you believe you don't have to back up your disinformation with facts Rich. As usual you don't practice what you arrogantly demand from others. So how about playing by the rules you
On 2023-04-09, Rich80105 <Rich...@hotmail.com> wrote:What has changed in that time, Gordon? Our Covid experience continues >> >> >>> to be better than many other countries with vaccination still being >> >> >>> popular and apparenty successful in keeping our death rates low.
On Sun, 9 Apr 2023 15:06:13 -0700 (PDT), John Bowes
<bowes...@gmail.com> wrote:
On Monday, April 10, 2023 at 9:38:56?AM UTC+12, John Bowes wrote: >> >> >>> >>>> An interesting read for the rest of us. Mainly because unlike Rich we have open minds...
https://www.chrislynchmedia.com/news-items/thedisinformationproject#.ZDMjdFAu1jG.twitter
Yet more that doesn't fit Richie's mainstream disinformed mind... >> >> >>> >>>
https://nzdsos.com/2023/02/28/fifth-generation-warfare/
It is sad to see the rabbit holes some go down - see:
https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/health/coronavirus/300439357/covid19-nz-why-a-small-group-of-doctors-opposes-vaccination
That article is 18 months ago. Things have changed in that time. It is
before Omicron's arrival.
The fact that we have this almost total disregard of the option to changing
the view point as the real world has changed says an awful lot.
So typical of you Rich. You can't help telling us stuff we already know.I was responding to the bizarre claim that "There is also PaulGet back on topic you moronic imbecile!Except that, with words, a single definition is often only ""correct""
On RCR, http://realitycheck.radio. Some would say that I have spent the >> >> >better part of the morning down the rabbit hole of misinformation, however I
like checking out all view points, so that I am well informed and educated.
Head to the replay section. Here you will find Rodney Hyde's rant on the >> >> >matter of "Define a woman? In it we have the answer, A woman is a adult >> >> >female human. Simple, correct and consice.
for a small group who use it in that way - the definitions of both
''woman'' and ''man'' are no longer as clear cut in all situations
Now that is an example of the use of a statistic without adequately
There is also Paul Brennan talking with Dr Guy Hatchard about the death >> >> >rate, now increased to 17% above the average.
defining it - what average? What deaths? what time period? what
population? Given the experience of the USA, it is possibly that we
have had world deaths from infection that are 17% higher than
previously, but that is not the case in New Zealand.
There is also the suggestion that the deaths caused by the vaccine are asUnless the vaccine induced positive tests for Covid without the
great as Covid deaths. (Sorry I forgotten where this is).
presence of the virus, that is clearly a wrong suggestion. Given that
Covid deaths required a positive test for the virus, an equivalent
number of vaccine induced deaths would have been very evident in
statistics - the comparison against actual vs expected deaths based on
normal mortality would have shown a significant increase in actual
deaths. I suspect this is a conveniently anonymous wrong conjecture;
if you do recall where it was it you should be very wary of any
similar ''reckons'' from that source.
Brennan talking with Dr Guy Hatchard about the death rate, now
increased to 17% above the average."
We have not experienced a death rate 17% above the average.
Is it just your stupid arrogance or your insane arrogance that does that. >You're STILL off topic Rich. Your refusal to address the two cite this thread is about only highlights the fact you can't refute anything in either of them. Though I'm pretty sure due to your clam like so called mind you haven't bothered to read thembecause they haven't come from your usual biased sources of information!
On Monday, April 10, 2023 at 6:21:06?PM UTC+12, Tony wrote:I certainly have made such a bizarre claim - what on earth made you
Rich80105 <Rich...@hotmail.com> wrote:Simple pretty well describes Rich. I'd bet his science degree is just in his mind. After all he claim's you can change what sex you are just by thinking it.
On 10 Apr 2023 04:23:45 GMT, Gordon <Gor...@leaf.net.nz> wrote:When prompted you used a single simple definition, and one that was woefully >> short of value.
On 2023-04-10, John Bowes <bowes...@gmail.com> wrote:Except that, with words, a single definition is often only ""correct""
On Monday, April 10, 2023 at 12:55:40?PM UTC+12, Rich80105 wrote:
On 10 Apr 2023 00:38:09 GMT, Gordon <Gor...@leaf.net.nz> wrote:Prove it! Apparently you're such an arrogant Marxist muppet you believe you
On 2023-04-09, Rich80105 <Rich...@hotmail.com> wrote:What has changed in that time, Gordon? Our Covid experience continues >> >>>> to be better than many other countries with vaccination still being
On Sun, 9 Apr 2023 15:06:13 -0700 (PDT), John Bowes
<bowes...@gmail.com> wrote:
On Monday, April 10, 2023 at 9:38:56?AM UTC+12, John Bowes wrote:
An interesting read for the rest of us. Mainly because unlike Rich we
have open minds...
https://www.chrislynchmedia.com/news-items/thedisinformationproject#.ZDMjdFAu1jG.twitter
Yet more that doesn't fit Richie's mainstream disinformed mind...
https://nzdsos.com/2023/02/28/fifth-generation-warfare/
It is sad to see the rabbit holes some go down - see:
https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/health/coronavirus/300439357/covid19-nz-why-a-small-group-of-doctors-opposes-vaccination
That article is 18 months ago. Things have changed in that time. It is >> >>>> >before Omicron's arrival.
The fact that we have this almost total disregard of the option to
changing
the view point as the real world has changed says an awful lot.
popular and apparenty successful in keeping our death rates low.
don't have to back up your disinformation with facts Rich. As usual you don't
practice what you arrogantly demand from others. So how about playing by the
rules you insist others follow. Or is it that you're just feral man-in-dresses
like those peaceful people who attacked Possie Parker...
On RCR, http://realitycheck.radio. Some would say that I have spent the
better part of the morning down the rabbit hole of misinformation, however I
like checking out all view points, so that I am well informed and educated.
Head to the replay section. Here you will find Rodney Hyde's rant on the >> >>matter of "Define a woman? In it we have the answer, A woman is a adult
female human. Simple, correct and consice.
for a small group who use it in that way - the definitions of both
''woman'' and ''man'' are no longer as clear cut in all situations
Now that is an example of the use of a statistic without adequately
There is also Paul Brennan talking with Dr Guy Hatchard about the death
rate, now increased to 17% above the average.
defining it - what average? What deaths? what time period? what
population? Given the experience of the USA, it is possibly that we
have had world deaths from infection that are 17% higher than
previously, but that is not the case in New Zealand.
There is also the suggestion that the deaths caused by the vaccine are as >> >>great as Covid deaths. (Sorry I forgotten where this is).
Unless the vaccine induced positive tests for Covid without the
presence of the virus, that is clearly a wrong suggestion. Given that
Covid deaths required a positive test for the virus, an equivalent
number of vaccine induced deaths would have been very evident in
statistics - the comparison against actual vs expected deaths based on
normal mortality would have shown a significant increase in actual
deaths. I suspect this is a conveniently anonymous wrong conjecture;
if you do recall where it was it you should be very wary of any
similar ''reckons'' from that source.
Guess in his case it probably applies to science degrees...
On Mon, 10 Apr 2023 06:21:04 -0000 (UTC), Tony
<lizan...@orcon.net.nz> wrote:
Rich80105 <Rich...@hotmail.com> wrote:I gave this one:
On 10 Apr 2023 04:23:45 GMT, Gordon <Gor...@leaf.net.nz> wrote:When prompted you used a single simple definition, and one that was woefully
On 2023-04-10, John Bowes <bowes...@gmail.com> wrote:Except that, with words, a single definition is often only ""correct"" >>for a small group who use it in that way - the definitions of both >>''woman'' and ''man'' are no longer as clear cut in all situations
On Monday, April 10, 2023 at 12:55:40?PM UTC+12, Rich80105 wrote:
On 10 Apr 2023 00:38:09 GMT, Gordon <Gor...@leaf.net.nz> wrote:Prove it! Apparently you're such an arrogant Marxist muppet you believe you
On 2023-04-09, Rich80105 <Rich...@hotmail.com> wrote:What has changed in that time, Gordon? Our Covid experience continues >>>>> to be better than many other countries with vaccination still being >>>>> popular and apparenty successful in keeping our death rates low.
On Sun, 9 Apr 2023 15:06:13 -0700 (PDT), John Bowes
<bowes...@gmail.com> wrote:
On Monday, April 10, 2023 at 9:38:56?AM UTC+12, John Bowes wrote: >>>>> >>>> An interesting read for the rest of us. Mainly because unlike Rich we
have open minds...
https://www.chrislynchmedia.com/news-items/thedisinformationproject#.ZDMjdFAu1jG.twitter
Yet more that doesn't fit Richie's mainstream disinformed mind... >>>>> >>>
https://nzdsos.com/2023/02/28/fifth-generation-warfare/
It is sad to see the rabbit holes some go down - see:
https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/health/coronavirus/300439357/covid19-nz-why-a-small-group-of-doctors-opposes-vaccination
That article is 18 months ago. Things have changed in that time. It is
before Omicron's arrival.
The fact that we have this almost total disregard of the option to >>>>> >changing
the view point as the real world has changed says an awful lot.
don't have to back up your disinformation with facts Rich. As usual you don't
practice what you arrogantly demand from others. So how about playing by the
rules you insist others follow. Or is it that you're just feral man-in-dresses
like those peaceful people who attacked Possie Parker...
On RCR, http://realitycheck.radio. Some would say that I have spent the >>>better part of the morning down the rabbit hole of misinformation, however I
like checking out all view points, so that I am well informed and educated.
Head to the replay section. Here you will find Rodney Hyde's rant on the >>>matter of "Define a woman? In it we have the answer, A woman is a adult >>>female human. Simple, correct and consice.
short of value.
https://dictionary.cambridge.org/dictionary/english/woman
As I recall you have not given a definition that you are prepared to
accept; the definition that I gave is not as simple as that given in
the quotation from Rodney Hide above. In most situations, the simpler definition is quite adequate, but as I pointed out, language is not
static; for New Zealanders the election of Georgina Beyer, our first
trans woman MP, gave acceptance to that subtle definition change for
many New Zealanders.
So are you going to sit on the fence, Tony, or tell us what you really think?
Now that is an example of the use of a statistic without adequately >>defining it - what average? What deaths? what time period? what >>population? Given the experience of the USA, it is possibly that we
There is also Paul Brennan talking with Dr Guy Hatchard about the death >>>rate, now increased to 17% above the average.
have had world deaths from infection that are 17% higher than >>previously, but that is not the case in New Zealand.
There is also the suggestion that the deaths caused by the vaccine are as >>>great as Covid deaths. (Sorry I forgotten where this is).
Unless the vaccine induced positive tests for Covid without the
presence of the virus, that is clearly a wrong suggestion. Given that >>Covid deaths required a positive test for the virus, an equivalent >>number of vaccine induced deaths would have been very evident in >>statistics - the comparison against actual vs expected deaths based on >>normal mortality would have shown a significant increase in actual >>deaths. I suspect this is a conveniently anonymous wrong conjecture;
if you do recall where it was it you should be very wary of any
similar ''reckons'' from that source.
On Monday, April 10, 2023 at 6:24:46?PM UTC+12, Tony wrote:I have neither said or implied any such thing - you must be getting
Rich80105 <Rich...@hotmail.com> wrote:Rich is incapable of doing either. But what do you expect from a numbskull who believes women can have penises?
On Mon, 10 Apr 2023 04:55:32 -0000 (UTC), TonyAnswer the question or bugger off.
<lizan...@orcon.net.nz> wrote:
Rich80105 <Rich...@hotmail.com> wrote:Look at the ''ourworldindata'' url I gave above, and look at the
On Mon, 10 Apr 2023 03:57:19 -0000 (UTC), TonySo provide some evidence that excess deaths in NZ is effectively zero.
<lizan...@orcon.net.nz> wrote:
Rich80105 <Rich...@hotmail.com> wrote:Indeed it is, but a very important one - and it is accompanied by a
On Sun, 9 Apr 2023 18:37:02 -0700 (PDT), John BowesThat is a very narrow set of data./
<bowes...@gmail.com> wrote:
On Monday, April 10, 2023 at 1:33:28?PM UTC+12, Rich80105 wrote:Lets just stick to what I have posted; an important issue is whether
On Sun, 9 Apr 2023 18:27:55 -0700 (PDT), John BowesAll of it you imbecilic moron :)
<bowes...@gmail.com> wrote:
On Monday, April 10, 2023 at 12:55:40?PM UTC+12, Rich80105 wrote: >> >>>>>>> >> On 10 Apr 2023 00:38:09 GMT, Gordon <Gor...@leaf.net.nz> wrote: >> >>>>>>> >>Which part do you want proved, John Bowes?
believeOn 2023-04-09, Rich80105 <Rich...@hotmail.com> wrote:
On Sun, 9 Apr 2023 15:06:13 -0700 (PDT), John Bowes
<bowes...@gmail.com> wrote:
On Monday, April 10, 2023 at 9:38:56?AM UTC+12, John Bowes wrote:
An interesting read for the rest of us. Mainly because unlike
Rich
we have open minds...
https://www.chrislynchmedia.com/news-items/thedisinformationproject#.ZDMjdFAu1jG.twitter
Yet more that doesn't fit Richie's mainstream disinformed mind...
https://nzdsos.com/2023/02/28/fifth-generation-warfare/
It is sad to see the rabbit holes some go down - see:
continueshttps://www.stuff.co.nz/national/health/coronavirus/300439357/covid19-nz-why-a-small-group-of-doctors-opposes-vaccination
That article is 18 months ago. Things have changed in that time. It
is
before Omicron's arrival.
The fact that we have this almost total disregard of the option to
changing
the view point as the real world has changed says an awful lot. >> >>>>>>> >> What has changed in that time, Gordon? Our Covid experience
to be better than many other countries with vaccination still being
popular and apparently successful in keeping our death rates low. >> >>>>>>> >Prove it! Apparently you're such an arrogant Marxist muppet you
you don't have to back up your disinformation with facts Rich. As >> >>>>>>> >usual
you
don't practice what you arrogantly demand from others. So how about >> >>>>>>> >playing by
the rules you insist others follow. Or is it that you're just feral >> >>>>>>> >man-in-dresses like those peaceful people who attacked Possie Parker...
we have had better Covid results than other countries - for that see: >> >>>>>https://ourworldindata.org/grapher/cumulative-excess-deaths-covid?country=USA~AUS~NCL~SGP~FRA~SWE~GBR~NZL~JPN~ITA~DEU~ZAF~HKG~ARG~CAN~BEL
lot of other international comparisons that, individually and
collectively, confirm that New Zealand has suffered less in terms of
direct Covid effect on individuals, better than most and possibly all
comparable countries.
It is vital to aso look at what damage was done - a subject you refuse toThe measurement of excess deaths is a measure of damage - slightly
address.
negative, but effectively zero for New Zealand; yes some died, but an
equivalent number of others lived longer. Then there is economic
damage - we have a lower inflation rate than most countries, we have
low unemployment compared to most countries, but I do not pretend that
all New Zealanders have done better than all people from other
countries - what other danage are you thinking of, Tony?
Do that and stop prevaricating.
latest figure for New Zealand. It should that, compared to the number
of deaths expected based on pre-covid death rates, we have experienced
169 fewer deaths - we are the only country of our size or large that
has such a result, but given the number of deaths we have each year, a
difference of 169 is not significantly different from zero.
Sure we have had covid deaths, but they have been balanced by later
deaths for many due we believe at least in part the effects of
lock-downs and other health measures that meant fewer people died from
other infections.
There is increasing evidence that you are wrong.Mortality rates may reflct some elements of economic circumstances
Economic measurements are minor compared to health.
(the poor do not live as long as those who are ''comfortable'', but in
broad terms is ins not normally considered and economic measurement.
Read also the next paragraph below:
That measures actual deaths and compares with the expected deaths
based on pre-Covid mortality. Many countries are able to estimate
expected deaths by applying experience of actual deaths over recent
years to our population each year. For New Zealand, the total "Excess >> >>>>>deaths" over that expected based on pre-covid death rates as at March >> >>>>>5, 2023 is -169 ; in other words we have had fewer deaths than
expected through the covid period. We do know that Covid precautions
did reduce many other deaths - deaths from other infectious diseases
reduced, and road deaths reduced - and those positive effects
outweighed the deaths from Covid.
Compare that with say the UK - at that date, the equivalent number for >> >>>>>the UK is 198,995. Now that is still fairly low - they have a much
large population than we do - but the most recent figure from the USA >> >>>>>is 1.26 million.
In the chart above I have included a range of countries, you may like >> >>>>>to look and see how many countries have a better result than New
Zealand . . .
Happy now?
On Mon, 10 Apr 2023 00:42:14 -0700 (PDT), John Bowes
<bowes...@gmail.com> wrote:
On Monday, April 10, 2023 at 6:21:06?PM UTC+12, Tony wrote:I certainly have made such a bizarre claim - what on earth made you
Rich80105 <Rich...@hotmail.com> wrote:Simple pretty well describes Rich. I'd bet his science degree is just in his mind. After all he claim's you can change what sex you are just by thinking it.
On 10 Apr 2023 04:23:45 GMT, Gordon <Gor...@leaf.net.nz> wrote:When prompted you used a single simple definition, and one that was woefully
On 2023-04-10, John Bowes <bowes...@gmail.com> wrote:Except that, with words, a single definition is often only ""correct"" >> >for a small group who use it in that way - the definitions of both
On Monday, April 10, 2023 at 12:55:40?PM UTC+12, Rich80105 wrote:
On 10 Apr 2023 00:38:09 GMT, Gordon <Gor...@leaf.net.nz> wrote:Prove it! Apparently you're such an arrogant Marxist muppet you believe you
On 2023-04-09, Rich80105 <Rich...@hotmail.com> wrote:What has changed in that time, Gordon? Our Covid experience continues
On Sun, 9 Apr 2023 15:06:13 -0700 (PDT), John Bowes
<bowes...@gmail.com> wrote:
On Monday, April 10, 2023 at 9:38:56?AM UTC+12, John Bowes wrote: >> >>>> >>>> An interesting read for the rest of us. Mainly because unlike Rich we
have open minds...
https://www.chrislynchmedia.com/news-items/thedisinformationproject#.ZDMjdFAu1jG.twitter
Yet more that doesn't fit Richie's mainstream disinformed mind... >> >>>> >>>
https://nzdsos.com/2023/02/28/fifth-generation-warfare/
It is sad to see the rabbit holes some go down - see:
https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/health/coronavirus/300439357/covid19-nz-why-a-small-group-of-doctors-opposes-vaccination
That article is 18 months ago. Things have changed in that time. It is
before Omicron's arrival.
The fact that we have this almost total disregard of the option to >> >>>> >changing
the view point as the real world has changed says an awful lot.
to be better than many other countries with vaccination still being >> >>>> popular and apparenty successful in keeping our death rates low.
don't have to back up your disinformation with facts Rich. As usual you don't
practice what you arrogantly demand from others. So how about playing by the
rules you insist others follow. Or is it that you're just feral man-in-dresses
like those peaceful people who attacked Possie Parker...
On RCR, http://realitycheck.radio. Some would say that I have spent the >> >>better part of the morning down the rabbit hole of misinformation, however I
like checking out all view points, so that I am well informed and educated.
Head to the replay section. Here you will find Rodney Hyde's rant on the
matter of "Define a woman? In it we have the answer, A woman is a adult >> >>female human. Simple, correct and consice.
''woman'' and ''man'' are no longer as clear cut in all situations
short of value.
Now that is an example of the use of a statistic without adequately
There is also Paul Brennan talking with Dr Guy Hatchard about the death >> >>rate, now increased to 17% above the average.
defining it - what average? What deaths? what time period? what
population? Given the experience of the USA, it is possibly that we
have had world deaths from infection that are 17% higher than
previously, but that is not the case in New Zealand.
There is also the suggestion that the deaths caused by the vaccine are as
great as Covid deaths. (Sorry I forgotten where this is).
Unless the vaccine induced positive tests for Covid without the
presence of the virus, that is clearly a wrong suggestion. Given that
Covid deaths required a positive test for the virus, an equivalent
number of vaccine induced deaths would have been very evident in
statistics - the comparison against actual vs expected deaths based on >> >normal mortality would have shown a significant increase in actual
deaths. I suspect this is a conveniently anonymous wrong conjecture;
if you do recall where it was it you should be very wary of any
similar ''reckons'' from that source.
think such a thing?
Guess in his case it probably applies to science degrees...
On Tuesday, April 11, 2023 at 9:03:46?AM UTC+12, Rich80105 wrote:I did not claim that Georgina Beyer used that term - but it was used
On Mon, 10 Apr 2023 06:21:04 -0000 (UTC), Tony
<lizan...@orcon.net.nz> wrote:
Rich80105 <Rich...@hotmail.com> wrote:I gave this one:
On 10 Apr 2023 04:23:45 GMT, Gordon <Gor...@leaf.net.nz> wrote:When prompted you used a single simple definition, and one that was woefully
On 2023-04-10, John Bowes <bowes...@gmail.com> wrote:Except that, with words, a single definition is often only ""correct""
On Monday, April 10, 2023 at 12:55:40?PM UTC+12, Rich80105 wrote:
On 10 Apr 2023 00:38:09 GMT, Gordon <Gor...@leaf.net.nz> wrote:Prove it! Apparently you're such an arrogant Marxist muppet you believe you
On 2023-04-09, Rich80105 <Rich...@hotmail.com> wrote:What has changed in that time, Gordon? Our Covid experience continues >> >>>>> to be better than many other countries with vaccination still being
On Sun, 9 Apr 2023 15:06:13 -0700 (PDT), John Bowes
<bowes...@gmail.com> wrote:
On Monday, April 10, 2023 at 9:38:56?AM UTC+12, John Bowes wrote: >> >>>>> >>>> An interesting read for the rest of us. Mainly because unlike Rich we
have open minds...
https://www.chrislynchmedia.com/news-items/thedisinformationproject#.ZDMjdFAu1jG.twitter
Yet more that doesn't fit Richie's mainstream disinformed mind... >> >>>>> >>>
https://nzdsos.com/2023/02/28/fifth-generation-warfare/
It is sad to see the rabbit holes some go down - see:
https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/health/coronavirus/300439357/covid19-nz-why-a-small-group-of-doctors-opposes-vaccination
That article is 18 months ago. Things have changed in that time. It is
before Omicron's arrival.
The fact that we have this almost total disregard of the option to
changing
the view point as the real world has changed says an awful lot.
popular and apparenty successful in keeping our death rates low.
don't have to back up your disinformation with facts Rich. As usual you don't
practice what you arrogantly demand from others. So how about playing by the
rules you insist others follow. Or is it that you're just feral man-in-dresses
like those peaceful people who attacked Possie Parker...
On RCR, http://realitycheck.radio. Some would say that I have spent the >> >>>better part of the morning down the rabbit hole of misinformation, however I
like checking out all view points, so that I am well informed and educated.
Head to the replay section. Here you will find Rodney Hyde's rant on the >> >>>matter of "Define a woman? In it we have the answer, A woman is a adult >> >>>female human. Simple, correct and consice.
for a small group who use it in that way - the definitions of both
''woman'' and ''man'' are no longer as clear cut in all situations
short of value.
https://dictionary.cambridge.org/dictionary/english/woman
As I recall you have not given a definition that you are prepared to
accept; the definition that I gave is not as simple as that given in
the quotation from Rodney Hide above. In most situations, the simpler
definition is quite adequate, but as I pointed out, language is not
static; for New Zealanders the election of Georgina Beyer, our first
trans woman MP, gave acceptance to that subtle definition change for
many New Zealanders.
Where and when did she claim men could be women? Beyer used the term transexual. A word feral trans like you refuse to accept!
So are you going to sit on the fence, Tony, or tell us what you really
think?
Stop lying. Tony has made it clear to anyone with comprehension skills Rich! >> >>
Now that is an example of the use of a statistic without adequately
There is also Paul Brennan talking with Dr Guy Hatchard about the death >> >>>rate, now increased to 17% above the average.
defining it - what average? What deaths? what time period? what
population? Given the experience of the USA, it is possibly that we
have had world deaths from infection that are 17% higher than
previously, but that is not the case in New Zealand.
There is also the suggestion that the deaths caused by the vaccine are as >> >>>great as Covid deaths. (Sorry I forgotten where this is).
Unless the vaccine induced positive tests for Covid without the
presence of the virus, that is clearly a wrong suggestion. Given that
Covid deaths required a positive test for the virus, an equivalent
number of vaccine induced deaths would have been very evident in
statistics - the comparison against actual vs expected deaths based on
normal mortality would have shown a significant increase in actual
deaths. I suspect this is a conveniently anonymous wrong conjecture;
if you do recall where it was it you should be very wary of any
similar ''reckons'' from that source.
On Mon, 10 Apr 2023 00:43:19 -0700 (PDT), John BowesNo but you have argued that that is in fact true in what passes as your depraved and warped mind Rich by your refusal to acknowledge that men-in-dresses have no place in women's sport or safe places!
<bowes...@gmail.com> wrote:
On Monday, April 10, 2023 at 6:24:46?PM UTC+12, Tony wrote:I have neither said or implied any such thing - you must be getting desperate to resort to misquoting me, John Bowes. A hint for you -
Rich80105 <Rich...@hotmail.com> wrote:Rich is incapable of doing either. But what do you expect from a numbskull who believes women can have penises?
On Mon, 10 Apr 2023 04:55:32 -0000 (UTC), TonyAnswer the question or bugger off.
<lizan...@orcon.net.nz> wrote:
Rich80105 <Rich...@hotmail.com> wrote:Look at the ''ourworldindata'' url I gave above, and look at the
On Mon, 10 Apr 2023 03:57:19 -0000 (UTC), TonySo provide some evidence that excess deaths in NZ is effectively zero. >> >>Do that and stop prevaricating.
<lizan...@orcon.net.nz> wrote:
Rich80105 <Rich...@hotmail.com> wrote:Indeed it is, but a very important one - and it is accompanied by a
On Sun, 9 Apr 2023 18:37:02 -0700 (PDT), John BowesThat is a very narrow set of data./
<bowes...@gmail.com> wrote:
On Monday, April 10, 2023 at 1:33:28?PM UTC+12, Rich80105 wrote:Lets just stick to what I have posted; an important issue is whether >> >>>>>we have had better Covid results than other countries - for that see:
On Sun, 9 Apr 2023 18:27:55 -0700 (PDT), John BowesAll of it you imbecilic moron :)
<bowes...@gmail.com> wrote:
On Monday, April 10, 2023 at 12:55:40?PM UTC+12, Rich80105 wrote:Which part do you want proved, John Bowes?
On 10 Apr 2023 00:38:09 GMT, Gordon <Gor...@leaf.net.nz> wrote:Prove it! Apparently you're such an arrogant Marxist muppet you >> >>>>>>> >believe
On 2023-04-09, Rich80105 <Rich...@hotmail.com> wrote:
On Sun, 9 Apr 2023 15:06:13 -0700 (PDT), John Bowes
<bowes...@gmail.com> wrote:
On Monday, April 10, 2023 at 9:38:56?AM UTC+12, John Bowes wrote:
An interesting read for the rest of us. Mainly because unlike
Rich
we have open minds...
https://www.chrislynchmedia.com/news-items/thedisinformationproject#.ZDMjdFAu1jG.twitter
Yet more that doesn't fit Richie's mainstream disinformed mind...
https://nzdsos.com/2023/02/28/fifth-generation-warfare/
It is sad to see the rabbit holes some go down - see:
What has changed in that time, Gordon? Our Covid experiencehttps://www.stuff.co.nz/national/health/coronavirus/300439357/covid19-nz-why-a-small-group-of-doctors-opposes-vaccination
That article is 18 months ago. Things have changed in that time. It
is
before Omicron's arrival.
The fact that we have this almost total disregard of the option to
changing
the view point as the real world has changed says an awful lot.
continues
to be better than many other countries with vaccination still being
popular and apparently successful in keeping our death rates low.
you don't have to back up your disinformation with facts Rich. As
usual
you
don't practice what you arrogantly demand from others. So how about
playing by
the rules you insist others follow. Or is it that you're just feral
man-in-dresses like those peaceful people who attacked Possie Parker...
https://ourworldindata.org/grapher/cumulative-excess-deaths-covid?country=USA~AUS~NCL~SGP~FRA~SWE~GBR~NZL~JPN~ITA~DEU~ZAF~HKG~ARG~CAN~BEL
lot of other international comparisons that, individually and
collectively, confirm that New Zealand has suffered less in terms of >> >>>direct Covid effect on individuals, better than most and possibly all >> >>>comparable countries.
It is vital to aso look at what damage was done - a subject you refuse toThe measurement of excess deaths is a measure of damage - slightly
address.
negative, but effectively zero for New Zealand; yes some died, but an >> >>>equivalent number of others lived longer. Then there is economic
damage - we have a lower inflation rate than most countries, we have >> >>>low unemployment compared to most countries, but I do not pretend that >> >>>all New Zealanders have done better than all people from other
countries - what other danage are you thinking of, Tony?
latest figure for New Zealand. It should that, compared to the number
of deaths expected based on pre-covid death rates, we have experienced >> >169 fewer deaths - we are the only country of our size or large that
has such a result, but given the number of deaths we have each year, a >> >difference of 169 is not significantly different from zero.
Sure we have had covid deaths, but they have been balanced by later
deaths for many due we believe at least in part the effects of
lock-downs and other health measures that meant fewer people died from >> >other infections.
There is increasing evidence that you are wrong.Mortality rates may reflct some elements of economic circumstances
Economic measurements are minor compared to health.
(the poor do not live as long as those who are ''comfortable'', but in >> >broad terms is ins not normally considered and economic measurement.
Read also the next paragraph below:
That measures actual deaths and compares with the expected deaths
based on pre-Covid mortality. Many countries are able to estimate
expected deaths by applying experience of actual deaths over recent >> >>>>>years to our population each year. For New Zealand, the total "Excess
deaths" over that expected based on pre-covid death rates as at March
5, 2023 is -169 ; in other words we have had fewer deaths than
expected through the covid period. We do know that Covid precautions >> >>>>>did reduce many other deaths - deaths from other infectious diseases >> >>>>>reduced, and road deaths reduced - and those positive effects
outweighed the deaths from Covid.
Compare that with say the UK - at that date, the equivalent number for
the UK is 198,995. Now that is still fairly low - they have a much >> >>>>>large population than we do - but the most recent figure from the USA
is 1.26 million.
In the chart above I have included a range of countries, you may like
to look and see how many countries have a better result than New
Zealand . . .
Happy now?
lying does not make a robust argument.
On Mon, 10 Apr 2023 14:30:21 -0700 (PDT), John BowesLIAR! You posted a long winded and bullshit article comparing horses being bred with letting transexuals compete against women!
<bowes...@gmail.com> wrote:
On Tuesday, April 11, 2023 at 9:26:32?AM UTC+12, Rich80105 wrote:I have not commented on that issue at all. I was asked to give a
On Mon, 10 Apr 2023 00:43:19 -0700 (PDT), John BowesNo but you have argued that that is in fact true in what passes as your depraved and warped mind Rich by your refusal to acknowledge that men-in-dresses have no place in women's sport or safe places!
<bowes...@gmail.com> wrote:
On Monday, April 10, 2023 at 6:24:46?PM UTC+12, Tony wrote:I have neither said or implied any such thing - you must be getting
Rich80105 <Rich...@hotmail.com> wrote:Rich is incapable of doing either. But what do you expect from a numbskull who believes women can have penises?
On Mon, 10 Apr 2023 04:55:32 -0000 (UTC), TonyAnswer the question or bugger off.
<lizan...@orcon.net.nz> wrote:
Rich80105 <Rich...@hotmail.com> wrote:Look at the ''ourworldindata'' url I gave above, and look at the
On Mon, 10 Apr 2023 03:57:19 -0000 (UTC), TonySo provide some evidence that excess deaths in NZ is effectively zero.
<lizan...@orcon.net.nz> wrote:
Rich80105 <Rich...@hotmail.com> wrote:Indeed it is, but a very important one - and it is accompanied by a >> >> >>>lot of other international comparisons that, individually and
On Sun, 9 Apr 2023 18:37:02 -0700 (PDT), John BowesThat is a very narrow set of data./
<bowes...@gmail.com> wrote:
On Monday, April 10, 2023 at 1:33:28?PM UTC+12, Rich80105 wrote: >> >> >>>>>>> On Sun, 9 Apr 2023 18:27:55 -0700 (PDT), John BowesLets just stick to what I have posted; an important issue is whether
<bowes...@gmail.com> wrote:All of it you imbecilic moron :)
On Monday, April 10, 2023 at 12:55:40?PM UTC+12, Rich80105 wrote:Which part do you want proved, John Bowes?
On 10 Apr 2023 00:38:09 GMT, Gordon <Gor...@leaf.net.nz> wrote:Prove it! Apparently you're such an arrogant Marxist muppet you
On 2023-04-09, Rich80105 <Rich...@hotmail.com> wrote:
On Sun, 9 Apr 2023 15:06:13 -0700 (PDT), John Bowes
<bowes...@gmail.com> wrote:
On Monday, April 10, 2023 at 9:38:56?AM UTC+12, John Bowes wrote:
An interesting read for the rest of us. Mainly because unlike
Rich
we have open minds...
It is sad to see the rabbit holes some go down - see:https://www.chrislynchmedia.com/news-items/thedisinformationproject#.ZDMjdFAu1jG.twitter
Yet more that doesn't fit Richie's mainstream disinformed mind...
https://nzdsos.com/2023/02/28/fifth-generation-warfare/ >> >> >>>>>>> >> >>
What has changed in that time, Gordon? Our Covid experience >> >> >>>>>>> >>continueshttps://www.stuff.co.nz/national/health/coronavirus/300439357/covid19-nz-why-a-small-group-of-doctors-opposes-vaccination
That article is 18 months ago. Things have changed in that time. It
is
before Omicron's arrival.
The fact that we have this almost total disregard of the option to
changing
the view point as the real world has changed says an awful lot.
to be better than many other countries with vaccination still being
popular and apparently successful in keeping our death rates low.
believe
you don't have to back up your disinformation with facts Rich. As
usual
you
don't practice what you arrogantly demand from others. So how about
playing by
the rules you insist others follow. Or is it that you're just feral
man-in-dresses like those peaceful people who attacked Possie Parker...
we have had better Covid results than other countries - for that see:
https://ourworldindata.org/grapher/cumulative-excess-deaths-covid?country=USA~AUS~NCL~SGP~FRA~SWE~GBR~NZL~JPN~ITA~DEU~ZAF~HKG~ARG~CAN~BEL
collectively, confirm that New Zealand has suffered less in terms of
direct Covid effect on individuals, better than most and possibly all
comparable countries.
It is vital to aso look at what damage was done - a subject you refuse toThe measurement of excess deaths is a measure of damage - slightly >> >> >>>negative, but effectively zero for New Zealand; yes some died, but an
address.
equivalent number of others lived longer. Then there is economic
damage - we have a lower inflation rate than most countries, we have
low unemployment compared to most countries, but I do not pretend that
all New Zealanders have done better than all people from other
countries - what other danage are you thinking of, Tony?
Do that and stop prevaricating.
latest figure for New Zealand. It should that, compared to the number >> >> >of deaths expected based on pre-covid death rates, we have experienced
169 fewer deaths - we are the only country of our size or large that >> >> >has such a result, but given the number of deaths we have each year, a
difference of 169 is not significantly different from zero.
Sure we have had covid deaths, but they have been balanced by later >> >> >deaths for many due we believe at least in part the effects of
lock-downs and other health measures that meant fewer people died from
other infections.
There is increasing evidence that you are wrong.Mortality rates may reflct some elements of economic circumstances
Economic measurements are minor compared to health.
(the poor do not live as long as those who are ''comfortable'', but in
broad terms is ins not normally considered and economic measurement. >> >> >
Read also the next paragraph below:
That measures actual deaths and compares with the expected deaths >> >> >>>>>based on pre-Covid mortality. Many countries are able to estimate >> >> >>>>>expected deaths by applying experience of actual deaths over recent
years to our population each year. For New Zealand, the total "Excess
deaths" over that expected based on pre-covid death rates as at March
5, 2023 is -169 ; in other words we have had fewer deaths than
expected through the covid period. We do know that Covid precautions
did reduce many other deaths - deaths from other infectious diseases
reduced, and road deaths reduced - and those positive effects
outweighed the deaths from Covid.
Compare that with say the UK - at that date, the equivalent number for
the UK is 198,995. Now that is still fairly low - they have a much
large population than we do - but the most recent figure from the USA
is 1.26 million.
In the chart above I have included a range of countries, you may like
to look and see how many countries have a better result than New >> >> >>>>>Zealand . . .
Happy now?
desperate to resort to misquoting me, John Bowes. A hint for you -
lying does not make a robust argument.
definition of a woman so I gave one from a prominent dictionary. I
have not commented at as to your cross-dressing fetish, but I have
said that who is eligible to compete in sport is up to each sport - it
is not an issue for some; others are working through the issues.
Whatever physical or mental issues an individual has they should be
treated with compassion and dignity - it is clear you have some sort
of fetish about sexual identity issues and have no compassion at all,
but it does take all kinds to make a world - it is possible that you
are confused by your own sexuality (or lack of sexuality) and so are
lashing out at others, but I do hope that is not the case.
On Tuesday, April 11, 2023 at 9:26:32?AM UTC+12, Rich80105 wrote:I have not commented on that issue at all. I was asked to give a
On Mon, 10 Apr 2023 00:43:19 -0700 (PDT), John BowesNo but you have argued that that is in fact true in what passes as your depraved and warped mind Rich by your refusal to acknowledge that men-in-dresses have no place in women's sport or safe places!
<bowes...@gmail.com> wrote:
On Monday, April 10, 2023 at 6:24:46?PM UTC+12, Tony wrote:I have neither said or implied any such thing - you must be getting
Rich80105 <Rich...@hotmail.com> wrote:Rich is incapable of doing either. But what do you expect from a numbskull who believes women can have penises?
On Mon, 10 Apr 2023 04:55:32 -0000 (UTC), TonyAnswer the question or bugger off.
<lizan...@orcon.net.nz> wrote:
Rich80105 <Rich...@hotmail.com> wrote:Look at the ''ourworldindata'' url I gave above, and look at the
On Mon, 10 Apr 2023 03:57:19 -0000 (UTC), TonySo provide some evidence that excess deaths in NZ is effectively zero. >> >> >>Do that and stop prevaricating.
<lizan...@orcon.net.nz> wrote:
Rich80105 <Rich...@hotmail.com> wrote:Indeed it is, but a very important one - and it is accompanied by a
On Sun, 9 Apr 2023 18:37:02 -0700 (PDT), John BowesThat is a very narrow set of data./
<bowes...@gmail.com> wrote:
On Monday, April 10, 2023 at 1:33:28?PM UTC+12, Rich80105 wrote:Lets just stick to what I have posted; an important issue is whether >> >> >>>>>we have had better Covid results than other countries - for that see:
On Sun, 9 Apr 2023 18:27:55 -0700 (PDT), John BowesAll of it you imbecilic moron :)
<bowes...@gmail.com> wrote:
On Monday, April 10, 2023 at 12:55:40?PM UTC+12, Rich80105 wrote:Which part do you want proved, John Bowes?
On 10 Apr 2023 00:38:09 GMT, Gordon <Gor...@leaf.net.nz> wrote:Prove it! Apparently you're such an arrogant Marxist muppet you >> >> >>>>>>> >believe
On 2023-04-09, Rich80105 <Rich...@hotmail.com> wrote:
On Sun, 9 Apr 2023 15:06:13 -0700 (PDT), John Bowes
<bowes...@gmail.com> wrote:
On Monday, April 10, 2023 at 9:38:56?AM UTC+12, John Bowes wrote:
An interesting read for the rest of us. Mainly because unlike
Rich
we have open minds...
https://www.chrislynchmedia.com/news-items/thedisinformationproject#.ZDMjdFAu1jG.twitter
Yet more that doesn't fit Richie's mainstream disinformed mind...
https://nzdsos.com/2023/02/28/fifth-generation-warfare/
It is sad to see the rabbit holes some go down - see:
What has changed in that time, Gordon? Our Covid experiencehttps://www.stuff.co.nz/national/health/coronavirus/300439357/covid19-nz-why-a-small-group-of-doctors-opposes-vaccination
That article is 18 months ago. Things have changed in that time. It
is
before Omicron's arrival.
The fact that we have this almost total disregard of the option to
changing
the view point as the real world has changed says an awful lot.
continues
to be better than many other countries with vaccination still being
popular and apparently successful in keeping our death rates low.
you don't have to back up your disinformation with facts Rich. As
usual
you
don't practice what you arrogantly demand from others. So how about
playing by
the rules you insist others follow. Or is it that you're just feral
man-in-dresses like those peaceful people who attacked Possie Parker...
https://ourworldindata.org/grapher/cumulative-excess-deaths-covid?country=USA~AUS~NCL~SGP~FRA~SWE~GBR~NZL~JPN~ITA~DEU~ZAF~HKG~ARG~CAN~BEL
lot of other international comparisons that, individually and
collectively, confirm that New Zealand has suffered less in terms of >> >> >>>direct Covid effect on individuals, better than most and possibly all >> >> >>>comparable countries.
It is vital to aso look at what damage was done - a subject you refuse toThe measurement of excess deaths is a measure of damage - slightly
address.
negative, but effectively zero for New Zealand; yes some died, but an >> >> >>>equivalent number of others lived longer. Then there is economic
damage - we have a lower inflation rate than most countries, we have >> >> >>>low unemployment compared to most countries, but I do not pretend that >> >> >>>all New Zealanders have done better than all people from other
countries - what other danage are you thinking of, Tony?
latest figure for New Zealand. It should that, compared to the number
of deaths expected based on pre-covid death rates, we have experienced >> >> >169 fewer deaths - we are the only country of our size or large that
has such a result, but given the number of deaths we have each year, a >> >> >difference of 169 is not significantly different from zero.
Sure we have had covid deaths, but they have been balanced by later
deaths for many due we believe at least in part the effects of
lock-downs and other health measures that meant fewer people died from >> >> >other infections.
There is increasing evidence that you are wrong.Mortality rates may reflct some elements of economic circumstances
Economic measurements are minor compared to health.
(the poor do not live as long as those who are ''comfortable'', but in >> >> >broad terms is ins not normally considered and economic measurement.
Read also the next paragraph below:
That measures actual deaths and compares with the expected deaths
based on pre-Covid mortality. Many countries are able to estimate
expected deaths by applying experience of actual deaths over recent >> >> >>>>>years to our population each year. For New Zealand, the total "Excess
deaths" over that expected based on pre-covid death rates as at March
5, 2023 is -169 ; in other words we have had fewer deaths than
expected through the covid period. We do know that Covid precautions >> >> >>>>>did reduce many other deaths - deaths from other infectious diseases >> >> >>>>>reduced, and road deaths reduced - and those positive effects
outweighed the deaths from Covid.
Compare that with say the UK - at that date, the equivalent number for
the UK is 198,995. Now that is still fairly low - they have a much >> >> >>>>>large population than we do - but the most recent figure from the USA
is 1.26 million.
In the chart above I have included a range of countries, you may like
to look and see how many countries have a better result than New
Zealand . . .
Happy now?
desperate to resort to misquoting me, John Bowes. A hint for you -
lying does not make a robust argument.
On Tuesday, April 11, 2023 at 10:32:10?AM UTC+12, Rich80105 wrote:are a lying, deliberate warping of what you and others have said to support your belief and support of Totalitarian and lying political party's!
On Mon, 10 Apr 2023 14:30:21 -0700 (PDT), John BowesLIAR! You posted a long winded and bullshit article comparing horses being bred with letting transexuals compete against women!
<bowes...@gmail.com> wrote:
On Tuesday, April 11, 2023 at 9:26:32?AM UTC+12, Rich80105 wrote:I have not commented on that issue at all. I was asked to give a
On Mon, 10 Apr 2023 00:43:19 -0700 (PDT), John BowesNo but you have argued that that is in fact true in what passes as your depraved and warped mind Rich by your refusal to acknowledge that men-in-dresses have no place in women's sport or safe places!
<bowes...@gmail.com> wrote:
On Monday, April 10, 2023 at 6:24:46?PM UTC+12, Tony wrote:I have neither said or implied any such thing - you must be getting
Rich80105 <Rich...@hotmail.com> wrote:Rich is incapable of doing either. But what do you expect from a numbskull who believes women can have penises?
On Mon, 10 Apr 2023 04:55:32 -0000 (UTC), TonyAnswer the question or bugger off.
<lizan...@orcon.net.nz> wrote:
Rich80105 <Rich...@hotmail.com> wrote:Look at the ''ourworldindata'' url I gave above, and look at the
On Mon, 10 Apr 2023 03:57:19 -0000 (UTC), TonySo provide some evidence that excess deaths in NZ is effectively zero.
<lizan...@orcon.net.nz> wrote:
Rich80105 <Rich...@hotmail.com> wrote:Indeed it is, but a very important one - and it is accompanied by a >> >> >> >>>lot of other international comparisons that, individually and
On Sun, 9 Apr 2023 18:37:02 -0700 (PDT), John BowesThat is a very narrow set of data./
<bowes...@gmail.com> wrote:
On Monday, April 10, 2023 at 1:33:28?PM UTC+12, Rich80105 wrote: >> >> >> >>>>>>> On Sun, 9 Apr 2023 18:27:55 -0700 (PDT), John BowesLets just stick to what I have posted; an important issue is whether
<bowes...@gmail.com> wrote:All of it you imbecilic moron :)
On Monday, April 10, 2023 at 12:55:40?PM UTC+12, Rich80105 wrote:Which part do you want proved, John Bowes?
On 10 Apr 2023 00:38:09 GMT, Gordon <Gor...@leaf.net.nz> wrote:Prove it! Apparently you're such an arrogant Marxist muppet you
On 2023-04-09, Rich80105 <Rich...@hotmail.com> wrote:
On Sun, 9 Apr 2023 15:06:13 -0700 (PDT), John Bowes
<bowes...@gmail.com> wrote:
On Monday, April 10, 2023 at 9:38:56?AM UTC+12, John Bowes wrote:
An interesting read for the rest of us. Mainly because unlike
Rich
we have open minds...
It is sad to see the rabbit holes some go down - see:https://www.chrislynchmedia.com/news-items/thedisinformationproject#.ZDMjdFAu1jG.twitter
Yet more that doesn't fit Richie's mainstream disinformed mind...
https://nzdsos.com/2023/02/28/fifth-generation-warfare/ >> >> >> >>>>>>> >> >>
What has changed in that time, Gordon? Our Covid experience >> >> >> >>>>>>> >>continueshttps://www.stuff.co.nz/national/health/coronavirus/300439357/covid19-nz-why-a-small-group-of-doctors-opposes-vaccination
That article is 18 months ago. Things have changed in that time. It
is
before Omicron's arrival.
The fact that we have this almost total disregard of the option to
changing
the view point as the real world has changed says an awful lot.
to be better than many other countries with vaccination still being
popular and apparently successful in keeping our death rates low.
believe
you don't have to back up your disinformation with facts Rich. As
usual
you
don't practice what you arrogantly demand from others. So how about
playing by
the rules you insist others follow. Or is it that you're just feral
man-in-dresses like those peaceful people who attacked Possie Parker...
we have had better Covid results than other countries - for that see:
https://ourworldindata.org/grapher/cumulative-excess-deaths-covid?country=USA~AUS~NCL~SGP~FRA~SWE~GBR~NZL~JPN~ITA~DEU~ZAF~HKG~ARG~CAN~BEL
collectively, confirm that New Zealand has suffered less in terms of
direct Covid effect on individuals, better than most and possibly all
comparable countries.
It is vital to aso look at what damage was done - a subject you refuse toThe measurement of excess deaths is a measure of damage - slightly >> >> >> >>>negative, but effectively zero for New Zealand; yes some died, but an
address.
equivalent number of others lived longer. Then there is economic
damage - we have a lower inflation rate than most countries, we have
low unemployment compared to most countries, but I do not pretend that
all New Zealanders have done better than all people from other
countries - what other danage are you thinking of, Tony?
Do that and stop prevaricating.
latest figure for New Zealand. It should that, compared to the number >> >> >> >of deaths expected based on pre-covid death rates, we have experienced
169 fewer deaths - we are the only country of our size or large that >> >> >> >has such a result, but given the number of deaths we have each year, a
difference of 169 is not significantly different from zero.
Sure we have had covid deaths, but they have been balanced by later >> >> >> >deaths for many due we believe at least in part the effects of
lock-downs and other health measures that meant fewer people died from
other infections.
There is increasing evidence that you are wrong.Mortality rates may reflct some elements of economic circumstances
Economic measurements are minor compared to health.
(the poor do not live as long as those who are ''comfortable'', but in
broad terms is ins not normally considered and economic measurement. >> >> >> >
Read also the next paragraph below:
That measures actual deaths and compares with the expected deaths >> >> >> >>>>>based on pre-Covid mortality. Many countries are able to estimate >> >> >> >>>>>expected deaths by applying experience of actual deaths over recent
years to our population each year. For New Zealand, the total "Excess
deaths" over that expected based on pre-covid death rates as at March
5, 2023 is -169 ; in other words we have had fewer deaths than
expected through the covid period. We do know that Covid precautions
did reduce many other deaths - deaths from other infectious diseases
reduced, and road deaths reduced - and those positive effects
outweighed the deaths from Covid.
Compare that with say the UK - at that date, the equivalent number for
the UK is 198,995. Now that is still fairly low - they have a much
large population than we do - but the most recent figure from the USA
is 1.26 million.
In the chart above I have included a range of countries, you may like
to look and see how many countries have a better result than New >> >> >> >>>>>Zealand . . .
Happy now?
desperate to resort to misquoting me, John Bowes. A hint for you -
lying does not make a robust argument.
definition of a woman so I gave one from a prominent dictionary. I
have not commented at as to your cross-dressing fetish, but I have
said that who is eligible to compete in sport is up to each sport - it
is not an issue for some; others are working through the issues.
Whatever physical or mental issues an individual has they should be
treated with compassion and dignity - it is clear you have some sort
of fetish about sexual identity issues and have no compassion at all,
but it does take all kinds to make a world - it is possible that you
are confused by your own sexuality (or lack of sexuality) and so are
lashing out at others, but I do hope that is not the case.
btw it is you who support men with a cross dressing fetish! So continue to lie and try and insult me it doesn't worry me. I'm quite happy being a man from birth and knowing I am. Do you have a problem with what you are? Because I can help you. You Rich
On Mon, 10 Apr 2023 16:13:58 -0700 (PDT), John BowesRich are a lying, deliberate warping of what you and others have said to support your belief and support of Totalitarian and lying political party's!
<bowes...@gmail.com> wrote:
On Tuesday, April 11, 2023 at 10:32:10?AM UTC+12, Rich80105 wrote:
On Mon, 10 Apr 2023 14:30:21 -0700 (PDT), John BowesLIAR! You posted a long winded and bullshit article comparing horses being bred with letting transexuals compete against women!
<bowes...@gmail.com> wrote:
On Tuesday, April 11, 2023 at 9:26:32?AM UTC+12, Rich80105 wrote:I have not commented on that issue at all. I was asked to give a
On Mon, 10 Apr 2023 00:43:19 -0700 (PDT), John BowesNo but you have argued that that is in fact true in what passes as your depraved and warped mind Rich by your refusal to acknowledge that men-in-dresses have no place in women's sport or safe places!
<bowes...@gmail.com> wrote:
On Monday, April 10, 2023 at 6:24:46?PM UTC+12, Tony wrote:I have neither said or implied any such thing - you must be getting
Rich80105 <Rich...@hotmail.com> wrote:Rich is incapable of doing either. But what do you expect from a numbskull who believes women can have penises?
On Mon, 10 Apr 2023 04:55:32 -0000 (UTC), TonyAnswer the question or bugger off.
<lizan...@orcon.net.nz> wrote:
Rich80105 <Rich...@hotmail.com> wrote:Look at the ''ourworldindata'' url I gave above, and look at the >> >> >> >latest figure for New Zealand. It should that, compared to the number
On Mon, 10 Apr 2023 03:57:19 -0000 (UTC), TonySo provide some evidence that excess deaths in NZ is effectively zero.
<lizan...@orcon.net.nz> wrote:
Rich80105 <Rich...@hotmail.com> wrote:Indeed it is, but a very important one - and it is accompanied by a
On Sun, 9 Apr 2023 18:37:02 -0700 (PDT), John BowesThat is a very narrow set of data./
<bowes...@gmail.com> wrote:
On Monday, April 10, 2023 at 1:33:28?PM UTC+12, Rich80105 wrote:Lets just stick to what I have posted; an important issue is whether
On Sun, 9 Apr 2023 18:27:55 -0700 (PDT), John BowesAll of it you imbecilic moron :)
<bowes...@gmail.com> wrote:
On Monday, April 10, 2023 at 12:55:40?PM UTC+12, Rich80105 wrote:Which part do you want proved, John Bowes?
On 10 Apr 2023 00:38:09 GMT, Gordon <Gor...@leaf.net.nz> wrote:Prove it! Apparently you're such an arrogant Marxist muppet you
On 2023-04-09, Rich80105 <Rich...@hotmail.com> wrote: >> >> >> >>>>>>> >> >> On Sun, 9 Apr 2023 15:06:13 -0700 (PDT), John Bowes >> >> >> >>>>>>> >> >><bowes...@gmail.com> wrote:
On Monday, April 10, 2023 at 9:38:56?AM UTC+12, John Bowes wrote:
An interesting read for the rest of us. Mainly because unlike
Rich
we have open minds...
https://www.chrislynchmedia.com/news-items/thedisinformationproject#.ZDMjdFAu1jG.twitter
Yet more that doesn't fit Richie's mainstream disinformed mind...
https://nzdsos.com/2023/02/28/fifth-generation-warfare/
It is sad to see the rabbit holes some go down - see: >> >> >> >>>>>>> >> >>
What has changed in that time, Gordon? Our Covid experiencehttps://www.stuff.co.nz/national/health/coronavirus/300439357/covid19-nz-why-a-small-group-of-doctors-opposes-vaccination
That article is 18 months ago. Things have changed in that time. It
is
before Omicron's arrival.
The fact that we have this almost total disregard of the option to
changing
the view point as the real world has changed says an awful lot.
continues
to be better than many other countries with vaccination still being
popular and apparently successful in keeping our death rates low.
believe
you don't have to back up your disinformation with facts Rich. As
usual
you
don't practice what you arrogantly demand from others. So how about
playing by
the rules you insist others follow. Or is it that you're just feral
man-in-dresses like those peaceful people who attacked Possie Parker...
we have had better Covid results than other countries - for that see:
https://ourworldindata.org/grapher/cumulative-excess-deaths-covid?country=USA~AUS~NCL~SGP~FRA~SWE~GBR~NZL~JPN~ITA~DEU~ZAF~HKG~ARG~CAN~BEL
lot of other international comparisons that, individually and
collectively, confirm that New Zealand has suffered less in terms of
direct Covid effect on individuals, better than most and possibly all
comparable countries.
It is vital to aso look at what damage was done - a subject you refuse toThe measurement of excess deaths is a measure of damage - slightly
address.
negative, but effectively zero for New Zealand; yes some died, but an
equivalent number of others lived longer. Then there is economic >> >> >> >>>damage - we have a lower inflation rate than most countries, we have
low unemployment compared to most countries, but I do not pretend that
all New Zealanders have done better than all people from other >> >> >> >>>countries - what other danage are you thinking of, Tony?
Do that and stop prevaricating.
of deaths expected based on pre-covid death rates, we have experienced
169 fewer deaths - we are the only country of our size or large that
has such a result, but given the number of deaths we have each year, a
difference of 169 is not significantly different from zero.
Sure we have had covid deaths, but they have been balanced by later
deaths for many due we believe at least in part the effects of
lock-downs and other health measures that meant fewer people died from
other infections.
There is increasing evidence that you are wrong.Mortality rates may reflct some elements of economic circumstances >> >> >> >(the poor do not live as long as those who are ''comfortable'', but in
Economic measurements are minor compared to health.
broad terms is ins not normally considered and economic measurement.
Read also the next paragraph below:
That measures actual deaths and compares with the expected deaths
based on pre-Covid mortality. Many countries are able to estimate
expected deaths by applying experience of actual deaths over recent
years to our population each year. For New Zealand, the total "Excess
deaths" over that expected based on pre-covid death rates as at March
5, 2023 is -169 ; in other words we have had fewer deaths than >> >> >> >>>>>expected through the covid period. We do know that Covid precautions
did reduce many other deaths - deaths from other infectious diseases
reduced, and road deaths reduced - and those positive effects >> >> >> >>>>>outweighed the deaths from Covid.
Compare that with say the UK - at that date, the equivalent number for
the UK is 198,995. Now that is still fairly low - they have a much
large population than we do - but the most recent figure from the USA
is 1.26 million.
In the chart above I have included a range of countries, you may like
to look and see how many countries have a better result than New
Zealand . . .
Happy now?
desperate to resort to misquoting me, John Bowes. A hint for you -
lying does not make a robust argument.
definition of a woman so I gave one from a prominent dictionary. I
have not commented at as to your cross-dressing fetish, but I have
said that who is eligible to compete in sport is up to each sport - it
is not an issue for some; others are working through the issues.
Whatever physical or mental issues an individual has they should be
treated with compassion and dignity - it is clear you have some sort
of fetish about sexual identity issues and have no compassion at all,
but it does take all kinds to make a world - it is possible that you
are confused by your own sexuality (or lack of sexuality) and so are
lashing out at others, but I do hope that is not the case.
btw it is you who support men with a cross dressing fetish! So continue to lie and try and insult me it doesn't worry me. I'm quite happy being a man from birth and knowing I am. Do you have a problem with what you are? Because I can help you. You
I acknowledge your belief that you have expertise with cross dressing,
but no I do not need your help.
But to go back to the subject of deaths earlier above, you may likeBullshit! compare Sweden with it's neighbours Rich.
the following : https://www.newshub.co.nz/home/new-zealand/2021/04/coronavirus-every-claim-about-covid-19-made-by-anti-lockdown-group-voices-for-freedom-debunked-by-scientists.html
The lying and warping is all with you and your anti-science "Freedumb"
idiot fringe.
On Mon, 10 Apr 2023 14:25:09 -0700 (PDT), John BowesWhich makes it clearly meaningless to mention her.
<bowesjohn02@gmail.com> wrote:
On Tuesday, April 11, 2023 at 9:03:46?AM UTC+12, Rich80105 wrote:I did not claim that Georgina Beyer used that term - but it was used
On Mon, 10 Apr 2023 06:21:04 -0000 (UTC), Tony
<lizan...@orcon.net.nz> wrote:
Rich80105 <Rich...@hotmail.com> wrote:I gave this one:
On 10 Apr 2023 04:23:45 GMT, Gordon <Gor...@leaf.net.nz> wrote:When prompted you used a single simple definition, and one that was
On 2023-04-10, John Bowes <bowes...@gmail.com> wrote:Except that, with words, a single definition is often only ""correct"" >>> >>for a small group who use it in that way - the definitions of both
On Monday, April 10, 2023 at 12:55:40?PM UTC+12, Rich80105 wrote:
On 10 Apr 2023 00:38:09 GMT, Gordon <Gor...@leaf.net.nz> wrote:Prove it! Apparently you're such an arrogant Marxist muppet you
On 2023-04-09, Rich80105 <Rich...@hotmail.com> wrote:What has changed in that time, Gordon? Our Covid experience continues >>> >>>>> to be better than many other countries with vaccination still being >>> >>>>> popular and apparenty successful in keeping our death rates low.
On Sun, 9 Apr 2023 15:06:13 -0700 (PDT), John Bowes
<bowes...@gmail.com> wrote:
On Monday, April 10, 2023 at 9:38:56?AM UTC+12, John Bowes wrote: >>> >>>>> >>>> An interesting read for the rest of us. Mainly because unlike >>> >>>>> >>>>Rich we
have open minds...
https://www.chrislynchmedia.com/news-items/thedisinformationproject#.ZDMjdFAu1jG.twitter
Yet more that doesn't fit Richie's mainstream disinformed mind... >>> >>>>> >>>
https://nzdsos.com/2023/02/28/fifth-generation-warfare/
It is sad to see the rabbit holes some go down - see:
https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/health/coronavirus/300439357/covid19-nz-why-a-small-group-of-doctors-opposes-vaccination
That article is 18 months ago. Things have changed in that time. It >>> >>>>> >is
before Omicron's arrival.
The fact that we have this almost total disregard of the option to >>> >>>>> >changing
the view point as the real world has changed says an awful lot.
believe you
don't have to back up your disinformation with facts Rich. As usual you >>> >>>>don't
practice what you arrogantly demand from others. So how about playing >>> >>>>by the
rules you insist others follow. Or is it that you're just feral
man-in-dresses
like those peaceful people who attacked Possie Parker...
On RCR, http://realitycheck.radio. Some would say that I have spent the >>> >>>better part of the morning down the rabbit hole of misinformation,
however I
like checking out all view points, so that I am well informed and
educated.
Head to the replay section. Here you will find Rodney Hyde's rant on the >>> >>>matter of "Define a woman? In it we have the answer, A woman is a adult >>> >>>female human. Simple, correct and consice.
''woman'' and ''man'' are no longer as clear cut in all situations
woefully
short of value.
https://dictionary.cambridge.org/dictionary/english/woman
As I recall you have not given a definition that you are prepared to
accept; the definition that I gave is not as simple as that given in
the quotation from Rodney Hide above. In most situations, the simpler
definition is quite adequate, but as I pointed out, language is not
static; for New Zealanders the election of Georgina Beyer, our first
trans woman MP, gave acceptance to that subtle definition change for
many New Zealanders.
Where and when did she claim men could be women? Beyer used the term >>transexual. A word feral trans like you refuse to accept!
about her.
So are you going to sit on the fence, Tony, or tell us what you really
think?
Stop lying. Tony has made it clear to anyone with comprehension skills Rich! >>> >>
Now that is an example of the use of a statistic without adequately
There is also Paul Brennan talking with Dr Guy Hatchard about the death >>> >>>rate, now increased to 17% above the average.
defining it - what average? What deaths? what time period? what
population? Given the experience of the USA, it is possibly that we
have had world deaths from infection that are 17% higher than
previously, but that is not the case in New Zealand.
There is also the suggestion that the deaths caused by the vaccine are >>> >>>as
great as Covid deaths. (Sorry I forgotten where this is).
Unless the vaccine induced positive tests for Covid without the
presence of the virus, that is clearly a wrong suggestion. Given that
Covid deaths required a positive test for the virus, an equivalent
number of vaccine induced deaths would have been very evident in
statistics - the comparison against actual vs expected deaths based on >>> >>normal mortality would have shown a significant increase in actual
deaths. I suspect this is a conveniently anonymous wrong conjecture;
if you do recall where it was it you should be very wary of any
similar ''reckons'' from that source.
On Mon, 10 Apr 2023 06:21:04 -0000 (UTC), TonyI am not on the fence. I have already stated that you gave a definition of the meaning of a word. You did not define a woman, not even close. Your English language is appalling.
<lizandtony@orcon.net.nz> wrote:
Rich80105 <Rich80105@hotmail.com> wrote:I gave this one:
On 10 Apr 2023 04:23:45 GMT, Gordon <Gordon@leaf.net.nz> wrote:When prompted you used a single simple definition, and one that was woefully >>short of value.
On 2023-04-10, John Bowes <bowesjohn02@gmail.com> wrote:Except that, with words, a single definition is often only ""correct"" >>>for a small group who use it in that way - the definitions of both >>>''woman'' and ''man'' are no longer as clear cut in all situations
On Monday, April 10, 2023 at 12:55:40?PM UTC+12, Rich80105 wrote:
On 10 Apr 2023 00:38:09 GMT, Gordon <Gor...@leaf.net.nz> wrote:Prove it! Apparently you're such an arrogant Marxist muppet you believe >>>>>you
On 2023-04-09, Rich80105 <Rich...@hotmail.com> wrote:What has changed in that time, Gordon? Our Covid experience continues >>>>>> to be better than many other countries with vaccination still being >>>>>> popular and apparenty successful in keeping our death rates low.
On Sun, 9 Apr 2023 15:06:13 -0700 (PDT), John Bowes
<bowes...@gmail.com> wrote:
On Monday, April 10, 2023 at 9:38:56?AM UTC+12, John Bowes wrote: >>>>>> >>>> An interesting read for the rest of us. Mainly because unlike Rich >>>>>> >>>>we
have open minds...
https://www.chrislynchmedia.com/news-items/thedisinformationproject#.ZDMjdFAu1jG.twitter
Yet more that doesn't fit Richie's mainstream disinformed mind... >>>>>> >>>
https://nzdsos.com/2023/02/28/fifth-generation-warfare/
It is sad to see the rabbit holes some go down - see:
https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/health/coronavirus/300439357/covid19-nz-why-a-small-group-of-doctors-opposes-vaccination
That article is 18 months ago. Things have changed in that time. It is >>>>>> >before Omicron's arrival.
The fact that we have this almost total disregard of the option to >>>>>> >changing
the view point as the real world has changed says an awful lot.
don't have to back up your disinformation with facts Rich. As usual you >>>>>don't
practice what you arrogantly demand from others. So how about playing by >>>>>the
rules you insist others follow. Or is it that you're just feral >>>>>man-in-dresses
like those peaceful people who attacked Possie Parker...
On RCR, http://realitycheck.radio. Some would say that I have spent the >>>>better part of the morning down the rabbit hole of misinformation, however I
like checking out all view points, so that I am well informed and educated. >>>>
Head to the replay section. Here you will find Rodney Hyde's rant on the >>>>matter of "Define a woman? In it we have the answer, A woman is a adult >>>>female human. Simple, correct and consice.
https://dictionary.cambridge.org/dictionary/english/woman
As I recall you have not given a definition that you are prepared to
accept; the definition that I gave is not as simple as that given in
the quotation from Rodney Hide above. In most situations, the simpler >definition is quite adequate, but as I pointed out, language is not
static; for New Zealanders the election of Georgina Beyer, our first
trans woman MP, gave acceptance to that subtle definition change for
many New Zealanders.
So are you going to sit on the fence, Tony, or tell us what you really
think?
Now that is an example of the use of a statistic without adequately >>>defining it - what average? What deaths? what time period? what >>>population? Given the experience of the USA, it is possibly that we >>>have had world deaths from infection that are 17% higher than
There is also Paul Brennan talking with Dr Guy Hatchard about the death >>>>rate, now increased to 17% above the average.
previously, but that is not the case in New Zealand.
There is also the suggestion that the deaths caused by the vaccine are as >>>>great as Covid deaths. (Sorry I forgotten where this is).
Unless the vaccine induced positive tests for Covid without the
presence of the virus, that is clearly a wrong suggestion. Given that >>>Covid deaths required a positive test for the virus, an equivalent
number of vaccine induced deaths would have been very evident in >>>statistics - the comparison against actual vs expected deaths based on >>>normal mortality would have shown a significant increase in actual >>>deaths. I suspect this is a conveniently anonymous wrong conjecture;
if you do recall where it was it you should be very wary of any
similar ''reckons'' from that source.
On Mon, 10 Apr 2023 06:24:44 -0000 (UTC), TonyYour answer was waffle.
<lizandtony@orcon.net.nz> wrote:
Rich80105 <Rich80105@hotmail.com> wrote:I was providing a direct answer to the implied quetion:
On Mon, 10 Apr 2023 04:55:32 -0000 (UTC), TonyAnswer the question or bugger off.
<lizandtony@orcon.net.nz> wrote:
Rich80105 <Rich80105@hotmail.com> wrote:Look at the ''ourworldindata'' url I gave above, and look at the
On Mon, 10 Apr 2023 03:57:19 -0000 (UTC), Tony >>>>><lizandtony@orcon.net.nz> wrote:So provide some evidence that excess deaths in NZ is effectively zero. >>>>Do that and stop prevaricating.
Rich80105 <Rich80105@hotmail.com> wrote:Indeed it is, but a very important one - and it is accompanied by a >>>>>lot of other international comparisons that, individually and >>>>>collectively, confirm that New Zealand has suffered less in terms of >>>>>direct Covid effect on individuals, better than most and possibly all >>>>>comparable countries.
On Sun, 9 Apr 2023 18:37:02 -0700 (PDT), John Bowes >>>>>>><bowesjohn02@gmail.com> wrote:That is a very narrow set of data./
On Monday, April 10, 2023 at 1:33:28?PM UTC+12, Rich80105 wrote: >>>>>>>>> On Sun, 9 Apr 2023 18:27:55 -0700 (PDT), John BowesLets just stick to what I have posted; an important issue is whether >>>>>>>we have had better Covid results than other countries - for that see: >>>>>>>https://ourworldindata.org/grapher/cumulative-excess-deaths-covid?country=USA~AUS~NCL~SGP~FRA~SWE~GBR~NZL~JPN~ITA~DEU~ZAF~HKG~ARG~CAN~BEL
<bowes...@gmail.com> wrote:All of it you imbecilic moron :)
On Monday, April 10, 2023 at 12:55:40?PM UTC+12, Rich80105 wrote: >>>>>>>>> >> On 10 Apr 2023 00:38:09 GMT, Gordon <Gor...@leaf.net.nz> wrote: >>>>>>>>> >>Which part do you want proved, John Bowes?
you don't have to back up your disinformation with facts Rich. As >>>>>>>>> >usualOn 2023-04-09, Rich80105 <Rich...@hotmail.com> wrote:
On Sun, 9 Apr 2023 15:06:13 -0700 (PDT), John Bowes
<bowes...@gmail.com> wrote:
On Monday, April 10, 2023 at 9:38:56?AM UTC+12, John Bowes >>>>>>>>> >> >>>wrote:
An interesting read for the rest of us. Mainly because unlike >>>>>>>>> >> >>>>Rich
we have open minds...
It is sad to see the rabbit holes some go down - see:https://www.chrislynchmedia.com/news-items/thedisinformationproject#.ZDMjdFAu1jG.twitter
Yet more that doesn't fit Richie's mainstream disinformed >>>>>>>>> >> >>>mind...
https://nzdsos.com/2023/02/28/fifth-generation-warfare/ >>>>>>>>> >> >>
to be better than many other countries with vaccination still >>>>>>>>> >>beinghttps://www.stuff.co.nz/national/health/coronavirus/300439357/covid19-nz-why-a-small-group-of-doctors-opposes-vaccination
That article is 18 months ago. Things have changed in that time. >>>>>>>>> >> >It
is
before Omicron's arrival.
The fact that we have this almost total disregard of the option >>>>>>>>> >> >to
changing
the view point as the real world has changed says an awful lot. >>>>>>>>> >> What has changed in that time, Gordon? Our Covid experience >>>>>>>>> >>continues
popular and apparently successful in keeping our death rates low. >>>>>>>>> >Prove it! Apparently you're such an arrogant Marxist muppet you >>>>>>>>> >believe
you
don't practice what you arrogantly demand from others. So how about >>>>>>>>> >playing by
the rules you insist others follow. Or is it that you're just feral >>>>>>>>> >man-in-dresses like those peaceful people who attacked Possie >>>>>>>>> >Parker...
It is vital to aso look at what damage was done - a subject you refuse to >>>>>>address.The measurement of excess deaths is a measure of damage - slightly >>>>>negative, but effectively zero for New Zealand; yes some died, but an >>>>>equivalent number of others lived longer. Then there is economic >>>>>damage - we have a lower inflation rate than most countries, we have >>>>>low unemployment compared to most countries, but I do not pretend that >>>>>all New Zealanders have done better than all people from other >>>>>countries - what other danage are you thinking of, Tony?
latest figure for New Zealand. It should that, compared to the number
of deaths expected based on pre-covid death rates, we have experienced >>>169 fewer deaths - we are the only country of our size or large that
has such a result, but given the number of deaths we have each year, a >>>difference of 169 is not significantly different from zero.
Sure we have had covid deaths, but they have been balanced by later >>>deaths for many due we believe at least in part the effects of
lock-downs and other health measures that meant fewer people died from >>>other infections.
There is increasing evidence that you are wrong.Mortality rates may reflct some elements of economic circumstances
Economic measurements are minor compared to health.
(the poor do not live as long as those who are ''comfortable'', but in >>>broad terms is ins not normally considered and economic measurement.
Read also the next paragraph below:
So provide some evidence that excess deaths in NZ is effectively zero.No I cannot because there is no such proof.
Are you having difficulty following the thread, Tony?No but you are, obviously.
That measures actual deaths and compares with the expected deaths >>>>>>>based on pre-Covid mortality. Many countries are able to estimate >>>>>>>expected deaths by applying experience of actual deaths over recent >>>>>>>years to our population each year. For New Zealand, the total "Excess >>>>>>>deaths" over that expected based on pre-covid death rates as at March >>>>>>>5, 2023 is -169 ; in other words we have had fewer deaths than >>>>>>>expected through the covid period. We do know that Covid precautions >>>>>>>did reduce many other deaths - deaths from other infectious diseases >>>>>>>reduced, and road deaths reduced - and those positive effects >>>>>>>outweighed the deaths from Covid.
Compare that with say the UK - at that date, the equivalent number for >>>>>>>the UK is 198,995. Now that is still fairly low - they have a much >>>>>>>large population than we do - but the most recent figure from the USA >>>>>>>is 1.26 million.
In the chart above I have included a range of countries, you may like >>>>>>>to look and see how many countries have a better result than New >>>>>>>Zealand . . .
Happy now?
Rich80105 <Rich80105@hotmail.com> wrote:
On Mon, 10 Apr 2023 06:21:04 -0000 (UTC), TonyI am not on the fence. I have already stated that you gave a definition of the >meaning of a word. You did not define a woman, not even close. Your English >language is appalling.
<lizandtony@orcon.net.nz> wrote:
Rich80105 <Rich80105@hotmail.com> wrote:I gave this one:
On 10 Apr 2023 04:23:45 GMT, Gordon <Gordon@leaf.net.nz> wrote:When prompted you used a single simple definition, and one that was woefully >>>short of value.
On 2023-04-10, John Bowes <bowesjohn02@gmail.com> wrote:Except that, with words, a single definition is often only ""correct"" >>>>for a small group who use it in that way - the definitions of both >>>>''woman'' and ''man'' are no longer as clear cut in all situations
On Monday, April 10, 2023 at 12:55:40?PM UTC+12, Rich80105 wrote: >>>>>>> On 10 Apr 2023 00:38:09 GMT, Gordon <Gor...@leaf.net.nz> wrote:
Prove it! Apparently you're such an arrogant Marxist muppet you believe >>>>>>you
On 2023-04-09, Rich80105 <Rich...@hotmail.com> wrote:
On Sun, 9 Apr 2023 15:06:13 -0700 (PDT), John Bowes
<bowes...@gmail.com> wrote:
On Monday, April 10, 2023 at 9:38:56?AM UTC+12, John Bowes wrote: >>>>>>> >>>> An interesting read for the rest of us. Mainly because unlike Rich >>>>>>> >>>>we
have open minds...
https://www.chrislynchmedia.com/news-items/thedisinformationproject#.ZDMjdFAu1jG.twitter
Yet more that doesn't fit Richie's mainstream disinformed mind... >>>>>>> >>>
https://nzdsos.com/2023/02/28/fifth-generation-warfare/
It is sad to see the rabbit holes some go down - see:
https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/health/coronavirus/300439357/covid19-nz-why-a-small-group-of-doctors-opposes-vaccination
That article is 18 months ago. Things have changed in that time. It is >>>>>>> >before Omicron's arrival.
The fact that we have this almost total disregard of the option to >>>>>>> >changing
the view point as the real world has changed says an awful lot. >>>>>>> What has changed in that time, Gordon? Our Covid experience continues >>>>>>> to be better than many other countries with vaccination still being >>>>>>> popular and apparenty successful in keeping our death rates low.
don't have to back up your disinformation with facts Rich. As usual you >>>>>>don't
practice what you arrogantly demand from others. So how about playing by >>>>>>the
rules you insist others follow. Or is it that you're just feral >>>>>>man-in-dresses
like those peaceful people who attacked Possie Parker...
On RCR, http://realitycheck.radio. Some would say that I have spent the >>>>>better part of the morning down the rabbit hole of misinformation, however I
like checking out all view points, so that I am well informed and educated.
Head to the replay section. Here you will find Rodney Hyde's rant on the >>>>>matter of "Define a woman? In it we have the answer, A woman is a adult >>>>>female human. Simple, correct and consice.
https://dictionary.cambridge.org/dictionary/english/woman
As I recall you have not given a definition that you are prepared to >>accept; the definition that I gave is not as simple as that given in
the quotation from Rodney Hide above. In most situations, the simpler >>definition is quite adequate, but as I pointed out, language is not
static; for New Zealanders the election of Georgina Beyer, our first
trans woman MP, gave acceptance to that subtle definition change for
many New Zealanders.
So are you going to sit on the fence, Tony, or tell us what you really >>think?
Philosophers have strauggled for millenia to define any human being, none have >provided a definitive definition.
You have not defined a woman and neither did your source attempt to.
Now that is an example of the use of a statistic without adequately >>>>defining it - what average? What deaths? what time period? what >>>>population? Given the experience of the USA, it is possibly that we >>>>have had world deaths from infection that are 17% higher than >>>>previously, but that is not the case in New Zealand.
There is also Paul Brennan talking with Dr Guy Hatchard about the death >>>>>rate, now increased to 17% above the average.
There is also the suggestion that the deaths caused by the vaccine are as >>>>>great as Covid deaths. (Sorry I forgotten where this is).
Unless the vaccine induced positive tests for Covid without the >>>>presence of the virus, that is clearly a wrong suggestion. Given that >>>>Covid deaths required a positive test for the virus, an equivalent >>>>number of vaccine induced deaths would have been very evident in >>>>statistics - the comparison against actual vs expected deaths based on >>>>normal mortality would have shown a significant increase in actual >>>>deaths. I suspect this is a conveniently anonymous wrong conjecture;
if you do recall where it was it you should be very wary of any
similar ''reckons'' from that source.
On Tue, 11 Apr 2023 02:28:40 -0000 (UTC), TonyWhere still waiting for an honest and accurate definition of a woman from you and the PM Rich!
<lizan...@orcon.net.nz> wrote:
Rich80105 <Rich...@hotmail.com> wrote:So are you prepared to define a woman, Tony?
On Mon, 10 Apr 2023 06:21:04 -0000 (UTC), TonyI am not on the fence. I have already stated that you gave a definition of the
<lizan...@orcon.net.nz> wrote:
Rich80105 <Rich...@hotmail.com> wrote:I gave this one: >>https://dictionary.cambridge.org/dictionary/english/woman
On 10 Apr 2023 04:23:45 GMT, Gordon <Gor...@leaf.net.nz> wrote:short of value.
On 2023-04-10, John Bowes <bowes...@gmail.com> wrote:Except that, with words, a single definition is often only ""correct"" >>>>for a small group who use it in that way - the definitions of both >>>>''woman'' and ''man'' are no longer as clear cut in all situations >>>When prompted you used a single simple definition, and one that was woefully
On Monday, April 10, 2023 at 12:55:40?PM UTC+12, Rich80105 wrote: >>>>>>> On 10 Apr 2023 00:38:09 GMT, Gordon <Gor...@leaf.net.nz> wrote: >>>>>>>
youOn 2023-04-09, Rich80105 <Rich...@hotmail.com> wrote:to be better than many other countries with vaccination still being >>>>>>> popular and apparenty successful in keeping our death rates low. >>>>>> Prove it! Apparently you're such an arrogant Marxist muppet you believe
On Sun, 9 Apr 2023 15:06:13 -0700 (PDT), John Bowes
<bowes...@gmail.com> wrote:
On Monday, April 10, 2023 at 9:38:56?AM UTC+12, John Bowes wrote: >>>>>>> >>>> An interesting read for the rest of us. Mainly because unlike Rich
we
have open minds...
https://www.chrislynchmedia.com/news-items/thedisinformationproject#.ZDMjdFAu1jG.twitter
Yet more that doesn't fit Richie's mainstream disinformed mind... >>>>>>> >>>
https://nzdsos.com/2023/02/28/fifth-generation-warfare/
It is sad to see the rabbit holes some go down - see:
https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/health/coronavirus/300439357/covid19-nz-why-a-small-group-of-doctors-opposes-vaccination
That article is 18 months ago. Things have changed in that time. It is
before Omicron's arrival.
The fact that we have this almost total disregard of the option to >>>>>>> >changing
the view point as the real world has changed says an awful lot. >>>>>>> What has changed in that time, Gordon? Our Covid experience continues
don't have to back up your disinformation with facts Rich. As usual you
don't
practice what you arrogantly demand from others. So how about playing by
the
rules you insist others follow. Or is it that you're just feral >>>>>>man-in-dresses
like those peaceful people who attacked Possie Parker...
On RCR, http://realitycheck.radio. Some would say that I have spent the >>>>>better part of the morning down the rabbit hole of misinformation, however I
like checking out all view points, so that I am well informed and educated.
Head to the replay section. Here you will find Rodney Hyde's rant on the
matter of "Define a woman? In it we have the answer, A woman is a adult >>>>>female human. Simple, correct and consice.
As I recall you have not given a definition that you are prepared to >>accept; the definition that I gave is not as simple as that given in
the quotation from Rodney Hide above. In most situations, the simpler >>definition is quite adequate, but as I pointed out, language is not >>static; for New Zealanders the election of Georgina Beyer, our first >>trans woman MP, gave acceptance to that subtle definition change for >>many New Zealanders.
So are you going to sit on the fence, Tony, or tell us what you really >>think?
meaning of a word. You did not define a woman, not even close. Your English >language is appalling.
Philosophers have strauggled for millenia to define any human being, none have
provided a definitive definition.
You have not defined a woman and neither did your source attempt to.
Now that is an example of the use of a statistic without adequately >>>>defining it - what average? What deaths? what time period? what >>>>population? Given the experience of the USA, it is possibly that we >>>>have had world deaths from infection that are 17% higher than >>>>previously, but that is not the case in New Zealand.
There is also Paul Brennan talking with Dr Guy Hatchard about the death >>>>>rate, now increased to 17% above the average.
There is also the suggestion that the deaths caused by the vaccine are as
great as Covid deaths. (Sorry I forgotten where this is).
Unless the vaccine induced positive tests for Covid without the >>>>presence of the virus, that is clearly a wrong suggestion. Given that >>>>Covid deaths required a positive test for the virus, an equivalent >>>>number of vaccine induced deaths would have been very evident in >>>>statistics - the comparison against actual vs expected deaths based on >>>>normal mortality would have shown a significant increase in actual >>>>deaths. I suspect this is a conveniently anonymous wrong conjecture; >>>>if you do recall where it was it you should be very wary of any >>>>similar ''reckons'' from that source.
Rich80105 <Rich80105@hotmail.com> wrote:Except it has been given above : https://ourworldindata.org/grapher/cumulative-excess-deaths-covid?country=USA~AUS~NCL~SGP~FRA~SWE~GBR~NZL~JPN~ITA~DEU~ZAF~HKG~ARG~CAN~BEL
On Mon, 10 Apr 2023 06:24:44 -0000 (UTC), TonyYour answer was waffle.
<lizandtony@orcon.net.nz> wrote:
Rich80105 <Rich80105@hotmail.com> wrote:I was providing a direct answer to the implied quetion:
On Mon, 10 Apr 2023 04:55:32 -0000 (UTC), Tony >>>><lizandtony@orcon.net.nz> wrote:Answer the question or bugger off.
Rich80105 <Rich80105@hotmail.com> wrote:Look at the ''ourworldindata'' url I gave above, and look at the
On Mon, 10 Apr 2023 03:57:19 -0000 (UTC), Tony >>>>>><lizandtony@orcon.net.nz> wrote:So provide some evidence that excess deaths in NZ is effectively zero. >>>>>Do that and stop prevaricating.
Rich80105 <Rich80105@hotmail.com> wrote:Indeed it is, but a very important one - and it is accompanied by a >>>>>>lot of other international comparisons that, individually and >>>>>>collectively, confirm that New Zealand has suffered less in terms of >>>>>>direct Covid effect on individuals, better than most and possibly all >>>>>>comparable countries.
On Sun, 9 Apr 2023 18:37:02 -0700 (PDT), John Bowes >>>>>>>><bowesjohn02@gmail.com> wrote:That is a very narrow set of data./
On Monday, April 10, 2023 at 1:33:28?PM UTC+12, Rich80105 wrote: >>>>>>>>>> On Sun, 9 Apr 2023 18:27:55 -0700 (PDT), John BowesLets just stick to what I have posted; an important issue is whether >>>>>>>>we have had better Covid results than other countries - for that see: >>>>>>>>https://ourworldindata.org/grapher/cumulative-excess-deaths-covid?country=USA~AUS~NCL~SGP~FRA~SWE~GBR~NZL~JPN~ITA~DEU~ZAF~HKG~ARG~CAN~BEL
<bowes...@gmail.com> wrote:All of it you imbecilic moron :)
On Monday, April 10, 2023 at 12:55:40?PM UTC+12, Rich80105 wrote: >>>>>>>>>> >> On 10 Apr 2023 00:38:09 GMT, Gordon <Gor...@leaf.net.nz> wrote: >>>>>>>>>> >>Which part do you want proved, John Bowes?
you don't have to back up your disinformation with facts Rich. As >>>>>>>>>> >usualOn 2023-04-09, Rich80105 <Rich...@hotmail.com> wrote:
On Sun, 9 Apr 2023 15:06:13 -0700 (PDT), John Bowes
<bowes...@gmail.com> wrote:
On Monday, April 10, 2023 at 9:38:56?AM UTC+12, John Bowes >>>>>>>>>> >> >>>wrote:
An interesting read for the rest of us. Mainly because unlike
Rich
we have open minds...
It is sad to see the rabbit holes some go down - see: >>>>>>>>>> >> >>https://www.chrislynchmedia.com/news-items/thedisinformationproject#.ZDMjdFAu1jG.twitter
Yet more that doesn't fit Richie's mainstream disinformed >>>>>>>>>> >> >>>mind...
https://nzdsos.com/2023/02/28/fifth-generation-warfare/ >>>>>>>>>> >> >>
to be better than many other countries with vaccination still >>>>>>>>>> >>beinghttps://www.stuff.co.nz/national/health/coronavirus/300439357/covid19-nz-why-a-small-group-of-doctors-opposes-vaccination
That article is 18 months ago. Things have changed in that time. >>>>>>>>>> >> >It
is
before Omicron's arrival.
The fact that we have this almost total disregard of the option >>>>>>>>>> >> >to
changing
the view point as the real world has changed says an awful lot. >>>>>>>>>> >> What has changed in that time, Gordon? Our Covid experience >>>>>>>>>> >>continues
popular and apparently successful in keeping our death rates low. >>>>>>>>>> >Prove it! Apparently you're such an arrogant Marxist muppet you >>>>>>>>>> >believe
you
don't practice what you arrogantly demand from others. So how about >>>>>>>>>> >playing by
the rules you insist others follow. Or is it that you're just feral >>>>>>>>>> >man-in-dresses like those peaceful people who attacked Possie >>>>>>>>>> >Parker...
It is vital to aso look at what damage was done - a subject you refuse toThe measurement of excess deaths is a measure of damage - slightly >>>>>>negative, but effectively zero for New Zealand; yes some died, but an >>>>>>equivalent number of others lived longer. Then there is economic >>>>>>damage - we have a lower inflation rate than most countries, we have >>>>>>low unemployment compared to most countries, but I do not pretend that >>>>>>all New Zealanders have done better than all people from other >>>>>>countries - what other danage are you thinking of, Tony?
address.
latest figure for New Zealand. It should that, compared to the number >>>>of deaths expected based on pre-covid death rates, we have experienced >>>>169 fewer deaths - we are the only country of our size or large that >>>>has such a result, but given the number of deaths we have each year, a >>>>difference of 169 is not significantly different from zero.
Sure we have had covid deaths, but they have been balanced by later >>>>deaths for many due we believe at least in part the effects of >>>>lock-downs and other health measures that meant fewer people died from >>>>other infections.
There is increasing evidence that you are wrong.Mortality rates may reflct some elements of economic circumstances
Economic measurements are minor compared to health.
(the poor do not live as long as those who are ''comfortable'', but in >>>>broad terms is ins not normally considered and economic measurement.
Read also the next paragraph below:
So provide some evidence that excess deaths in NZ is effectively zero.No I cannot because there is no such proof.
No but you are, obviously.
Are you having difficulty following the thread, Tony?
That measures actual deaths and compares with the expected deaths >>>>>>>>based on pre-Covid mortality. Many countries are able to estimate >>>>>>>>expected deaths by applying experience of actual deaths over recent >>>>>>>>years to our population each year. For New Zealand, the total "Excess >>>>>>>>deaths" over that expected based on pre-covid death rates as at March >>>>>>>>5, 2023 is -169 ; in other words we have had fewer deaths than >>>>>>>>expected through the covid period. We do know that Covid precautions >>>>>>>>did reduce many other deaths - deaths from other infectious diseases >>>>>>>>reduced, and road deaths reduced - and those positive effects >>>>>>>>outweighed the deaths from Covid.
Compare that with say the UK - at that date, the equivalent number for >>>>>>>>the UK is 198,995. Now that is still fairly low - they have a much >>>>>>>>large population than we do - but the most recent figure from the USA >>>>>>>>is 1.26 million.
In the chart above I have included a range of countries, you may like >>>>>>>>to look and see how many countries have a better result than New >>>>>>>>Zealand . . .
Happy now?
Rich80105 <Rich80105@hotmail.com> wrote:
On Mon, 10 Apr 2023 14:25:09 -0700 (PDT), John Bowes >><bowesjohn02@gmail.com> wrote:Which makes it clearly meaningless to mention her.
On Tuesday, April 11, 2023 at 9:03:46?AM UTC+12, Rich80105 wrote:I did not claim that Georgina Beyer used that term - but it was used
On Mon, 10 Apr 2023 06:21:04 -0000 (UTC), Tony
<lizan...@orcon.net.nz> wrote:
Rich80105 <Rich...@hotmail.com> wrote:I gave this one:
On 10 Apr 2023 04:23:45 GMT, Gordon <Gor...@leaf.net.nz> wrote:When prompted you used a single simple definition, and one that was
On 2023-04-10, John Bowes <bowes...@gmail.com> wrote:Except that, with words, a single definition is often only ""correct"" >>>> >>for a small group who use it in that way - the definitions of both
On Monday, April 10, 2023 at 12:55:40?PM UTC+12, Rich80105 wrote: >>>> >>>>> On 10 Apr 2023 00:38:09 GMT, Gordon <Gor...@leaf.net.nz> wrote:
believe you
On 2023-04-09, Rich80105 <Rich...@hotmail.com> wrote:to be better than many other countries with vaccination still being >>>> >>>>> popular and apparenty successful in keeping our death rates low. >>>> >>>> Prove it! Apparently you're such an arrogant Marxist muppet you
On Sun, 9 Apr 2023 15:06:13 -0700 (PDT), John Bowes
<bowes...@gmail.com> wrote:
On Monday, April 10, 2023 at 9:38:56?AM UTC+12, John Bowes wrote: >>>> >>>>> >>>> An interesting read for the rest of us. Mainly because unlike >>>> >>>>> >>>>Rich we
have open minds...
https://www.chrislynchmedia.com/news-items/thedisinformationproject#.ZDMjdFAu1jG.twitter
Yet more that doesn't fit Richie's mainstream disinformed mind... >>>> >>>>> >>>
https://nzdsos.com/2023/02/28/fifth-generation-warfare/
It is sad to see the rabbit holes some go down - see:
https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/health/coronavirus/300439357/covid19-nz-why-a-small-group-of-doctors-opposes-vaccination
That article is 18 months ago. Things have changed in that time. It >>>> >>>>> >is
before Omicron's arrival.
The fact that we have this almost total disregard of the option to >>>> >>>>> >changing
the view point as the real world has changed says an awful lot. >>>> >>>>> What has changed in that time, Gordon? Our Covid experience continues
don't have to back up your disinformation with facts Rich. As usual you
don't
practice what you arrogantly demand from others. So how about playing >>>> >>>>by the
rules you insist others follow. Or is it that you're just feral
man-in-dresses
like those peaceful people who attacked Possie Parker...
On RCR, http://realitycheck.radio. Some would say that I have spent the >>>> >>>better part of the morning down the rabbit hole of misinformation,
however I
like checking out all view points, so that I am well informed and
educated.
Head to the replay section. Here you will find Rodney Hyde's rant on the
matter of "Define a woman? In it we have the answer, A woman is a adult >>>> >>>female human. Simple, correct and consice.
''woman'' and ''man'' are no longer as clear cut in all situations
woefully
short of value.
https://dictionary.cambridge.org/dictionary/english/woman
As I recall you have not given a definition that you are prepared to
accept; the definition that I gave is not as simple as that given in
the quotation from Rodney Hide above. In most situations, the simpler
definition is quite adequate, but as I pointed out, language is not
static; for New Zealanders the election of Georgina Beyer, our first
trans woman MP, gave acceptance to that subtle definition change for
many New Zealanders.
Where and when did she claim men could be women? Beyer used the term >>>transexual. A word feral trans like you refuse to accept!
about her.
So are you going to sit on the fence, Tony, or tell us what you really >>>> think?
Stop lying. Tony has made it clear to anyone with comprehension skills Rich! >>>> >>
Now that is an example of the use of a statistic without adequately
There is also Paul Brennan talking with Dr Guy Hatchard about the death >>>> >>>rate, now increased to 17% above the average.
defining it - what average? What deaths? what time period? what
population? Given the experience of the USA, it is possibly that we
have had world deaths from infection that are 17% higher than
previously, but that is not the case in New Zealand.
There is also the suggestion that the deaths caused by the vaccine are >>>> >>>as
great as Covid deaths. (Sorry I forgotten where this is).
Unless the vaccine induced positive tests for Covid without the
presence of the virus, that is clearly a wrong suggestion. Given that >>>> >>Covid deaths required a positive test for the virus, an equivalent
number of vaccine induced deaths would have been very evident in
statistics - the comparison against actual vs expected deaths based on >>>> >>normal mortality would have shown a significant increase in actual
deaths. I suspect this is a conveniently anonymous wrong conjecture; >>>> >>if you do recall where it was it you should be very wary of any
similar ''reckons'' from that source.
On Mon, 10 Apr 2023 20:54:17 -0700 (PDT), John BowesStop distracting - you have never defined a woman, not in this thread, not in your entire life.
<bowesjohn02@gmail.com> wrote:
On Tuesday, April 11, 2023 at 3:38:42?PM UTC+12, Rich80105 wrote:
On Tue, 11 Apr 2023 02:28:40 -0000 (UTC), TonyWhere still waiting for an honest and accurate definition of a woman from you >>and the PM Rich!
<lizan...@orcon.net.nz> wrote:
Rich80105 <Rich...@hotmail.com> wrote:So are you prepared to define a woman, Tony?
On Mon, 10 Apr 2023 06:21:04 -0000 (UTC), TonyI am not on the fence. I have already stated that you gave a definition of >>> >the
<lizan...@orcon.net.nz> wrote:
Rich80105 <Rich...@hotmail.com> wrote:I gave this one:
On 10 Apr 2023 04:23:45 GMT, Gordon <Gor...@leaf.net.nz> wrote:When prompted you used a single simple definition, and one that was
On 2023-04-10, John Bowes <bowes...@gmail.com> wrote:Except that, with words, a single definition is often only ""correct"" >>> >>>>for a small group who use it in that way - the definitions of both
On Monday, April 10, 2023 at 12:55:40?PM UTC+12, Rich80105 wrote: >>> >>>>>>> On 10 Apr 2023 00:38:09 GMT, Gordon <Gor...@leaf.net.nz> wrote:
believe
On 2023-04-09, Rich80105 <Rich...@hotmail.com> wrote:
On Sun, 9 Apr 2023 15:06:13 -0700 (PDT), John Bowes
<bowes...@gmail.com> wrote:
On Monday, April 10, 2023 at 9:38:56?AM UTC+12, John Bowes
wrote:
An interesting read for the rest of us. Mainly because unlike >>> >>>>>>> >>>>Rich
we
have open minds...
https://www.chrislynchmedia.com/news-items/thedisinformationproject#.ZDMjdFAu1jG.twitter
Yet more that doesn't fit Richie's mainstream disinformed
mind...
https://nzdsos.com/2023/02/28/fifth-generation-warfare/
It is sad to see the rabbit holes some go down - see:
continueshttps://www.stuff.co.nz/national/health/coronavirus/300439357/covid19-nz-why-a-small-group-of-doctors-opposes-vaccination
That article is 18 months ago. Things have changed in that time. >>> >>>>>>> >It is
before Omicron's arrival.
The fact that we have this almost total disregard of the option to >>> >>>>>>> >changing
the view point as the real world has changed says an awful lot. >>> >>>>>>> What has changed in that time, Gordon? Our Covid experience
to be better than many other countries with vaccination still being >>> >>>>>>> popular and apparenty successful in keeping our death rates low. >>> >>>>>> Prove it! Apparently you're such an arrogant Marxist muppet you
you
don't have to back up your disinformation with facts Rich. As usual >>> >>>>>>you
don't
practice what you arrogantly demand from others. So how about playing >>> >>>>>>by
the
rules you insist others follow. Or is it that you're just feral
man-in-dresses
like those peaceful people who attacked Possie Parker...
On RCR, http://realitycheck.radio. Some would say that I have spent >>> >>>>>the
better part of the morning down the rabbit hole of misinformation,
however I
like checking out all view points, so that I am well informed and
educated.
Head to the replay section. Here you will find Rodney Hyde's rant on >>> >>>>>the
matter of "Define a woman? In it we have the answer, A woman is a
adult
female human. Simple, correct and consice.
''woman'' and ''man'' are no longer as clear cut in all situations
woefully
short of value.
https://dictionary.cambridge.org/dictionary/english/woman
As I recall you have not given a definition that you are prepared to
accept; the definition that I gave is not as simple as that given in
the quotation from Rodney Hide above. In most situations, the simpler
definition is quite adequate, but as I pointed out, language is not
static; for New Zealanders the election of Georgina Beyer, our first
trans woman MP, gave acceptance to that subtle definition change for
many New Zealanders.
So are you going to sit on the fence, Tony, or tell us what you really >>> >>think?
meaning of a word. You did not define a woman, not even close. Your
English
language is appalling.
Philosophers have strauggled for millenia to define any human being, none >>> >have
provided a definitive definition.
You have not defined a woman and neither did your source attempt to.
Now that is an example of the use of a statistic without adequately
There is also Paul Brennan talking with Dr Guy Hatchard about the
death
rate, now increased to 17% above the average.
defining it - what average? What deaths? what time period? what
population? Given the experience of the USA, it is possibly that we
have had world deaths from infection that are 17% higher than
previously, but that is not the case in New Zealand.
There is also the suggestion that the deaths caused by the vaccine are >>> >>>>>as
great as Covid deaths. (Sorry I forgotten where this is).
Unless the vaccine induced positive tests for Covid without the
presence of the virus, that is clearly a wrong suggestion. Given that >>> >>>>Covid deaths required a positive test for the virus, an equivalent
number of vaccine induced deaths would have been very evident in
statistics - the comparison against actual vs expected deaths based on >>> >>>>normal mortality would have shown a significant increase in actual
deaths. I suspect this is a conveniently anonymous wrong conjecture; >>> >>>>if you do recall where it was it you should be very wary of any
similar ''reckons'' from that source.
You go first for once!
Have you forgotten already? Sorry to tell you John but you have
serious memory issues . . .
Look back through the thread - if that is not too much of a challenge
for you . . .
But more to the point, give us the benefit of your view . . . waiting
. . .
On Tue, 11 Apr 2023 02:28:40 -0000 (UTC), TonyNo. But I never said that I could.
<lizandtony@orcon.net.nz> wrote:
Rich80105 <Rich80105@hotmail.com> wrote:
On Mon, 10 Apr 2023 06:21:04 -0000 (UTC), TonyI am not on the fence. I have already stated that you gave a definition of >>the
<lizandtony@orcon.net.nz> wrote:
Rich80105 <Rich80105@hotmail.com> wrote:I gave this one: >>>https://dictionary.cambridge.org/dictionary/english/woman
On 10 Apr 2023 04:23:45 GMT, Gordon <Gordon@leaf.net.nz> wrote:short of value.
On 2023-04-10, John Bowes <bowesjohn02@gmail.com> wrote:Except that, with words, a single definition is often only ""correct"" >>>>>for a small group who use it in that way - the definitions of both >>>>>''woman'' and ''man'' are no longer as clear cut in all situations >>>>When prompted you used a single simple definition, and one that was >>>>woefully
On Monday, April 10, 2023 at 12:55:40?PM UTC+12, Rich80105 wrote: >>>>>>>> On 10 Apr 2023 00:38:09 GMT, Gordon <Gor...@leaf.net.nz> wrote: >>>>>>>>
don't have to back up your disinformation with facts Rich. As usual you >>>>>>>don'tOn 2023-04-09, Rich80105 <Rich...@hotmail.com> wrote:
On Sun, 9 Apr 2023 15:06:13 -0700 (PDT), John Bowes
<bowes...@gmail.com> wrote:
On Monday, April 10, 2023 at 9:38:56?AM UTC+12, John Bowes wrote: >>>>>>>> >>>> An interesting read for the rest of us. Mainly because unlike >>>>>>>> >>>>Rich
we
have open minds...
https://www.chrislynchmedia.com/news-items/thedisinformationproject#.ZDMjdFAu1jG.twitter
Yet more that doesn't fit Richie's mainstream disinformed mind... >>>>>>>> >>>
https://nzdsos.com/2023/02/28/fifth-generation-warfare/
It is sad to see the rabbit holes some go down - see:
https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/health/coronavirus/300439357/covid19-nz-why-a-small-group-of-doctors-opposes-vaccination
That article is 18 months ago. Things have changed in that time. It >>>>>>>> >is
before Omicron's arrival.
The fact that we have this almost total disregard of the option to >>>>>>>> >changing
the view point as the real world has changed says an awful lot. >>>>>>>> What has changed in that time, Gordon? Our Covid experience continues >>>>>>>> to be better than many other countries with vaccination still being >>>>>>>> popular and apparenty successful in keeping our death rates low. >>>>>>> Prove it! Apparently you're such an arrogant Marxist muppet you believe >>>>>>>you
practice what you arrogantly demand from others. So how about playing by >>>>>>>the
rules you insist others follow. Or is it that you're just feral >>>>>>>man-in-dresses
like those peaceful people who attacked Possie Parker...
On RCR, http://realitycheck.radio. Some would say that I have spent the >>>>>>better part of the morning down the rabbit hole of misinformation, >>>>>>however I
like checking out all view points, so that I am well informed and >>>>>>educated.
Head to the replay section. Here you will find Rodney Hyde's rant on the >>>>>>matter of "Define a woman? In it we have the answer, A woman is a adult >>>>>>female human. Simple, correct and consice.
As I recall you have not given a definition that you are prepared to >>>accept; the definition that I gave is not as simple as that given in
the quotation from Rodney Hide above. In most situations, the simpler >>>definition is quite adequate, but as I pointed out, language is not >>>static; for New Zealanders the election of Georgina Beyer, our first >>>trans woman MP, gave acceptance to that subtle definition change for
many New Zealanders.
So are you going to sit on the fence, Tony, or tell us what you really >>>think?
meaning of a word. You did not define a woman, not even close. Your English >>language is appalling.
Philosophers have strauggled for millenia to define any human being, none >>have
provided a definitive definition.
You have not defined a woman and neither did your source attempt to.
So are you prepared to define a woman, Tony?
Now that is an example of the use of a statistic without adequately >>>>>defining it - what average? What deaths? what time period? what >>>>>population? Given the experience of the USA, it is possibly that we >>>>>have had world deaths from infection that are 17% higher than >>>>>previously, but that is not the case in New Zealand.
There is also Paul Brennan talking with Dr Guy Hatchard about the death >>>>>>rate, now increased to 17% above the average.
There is also the suggestion that the deaths caused by the vaccine are as >>>>>>great as Covid deaths. (Sorry I forgotten where this is).
Unless the vaccine induced positive tests for Covid without the >>>>>presence of the virus, that is clearly a wrong suggestion. Given that >>>>>Covid deaths required a positive test for the virus, an equivalent >>>>>number of vaccine induced deaths would have been very evident in >>>>>statistics - the comparison against actual vs expected deaths based on >>>>>normal mortality would have shown a significant increase in actual >>>>>deaths. I suspect this is a conveniently anonymous wrong conjecture; >>>>>if you do recall where it was it you should be very wary of any >>>>>similar ''reckons'' from that source.
On Tuesday, April 11, 2023 at 3:38:42?PM UTC+12, Rich80105 wrote:
On Tue, 11 Apr 2023 02:28:40 -0000 (UTC), TonyWhere still waiting for an honest and accurate definition of a woman from you and the PM Rich!
<lizan...@orcon.net.nz> wrote:
Rich80105 <Rich...@hotmail.com> wrote:So are you prepared to define a woman, Tony?
On Mon, 10 Apr 2023 06:21:04 -0000 (UTC), TonyI am not on the fence. I have already stated that you gave a definition of the
<lizan...@orcon.net.nz> wrote:
Rich80105 <Rich...@hotmail.com> wrote:I gave this one:
On 10 Apr 2023 04:23:45 GMT, Gordon <Gor...@leaf.net.nz> wrote:When prompted you used a single simple definition, and one that was woefully
On 2023-04-10, John Bowes <bowes...@gmail.com> wrote:Except that, with words, a single definition is often only ""correct"" >> >>>>for a small group who use it in that way - the definitions of both
On Monday, April 10, 2023 at 12:55:40?PM UTC+12, Rich80105 wrote:
On 10 Apr 2023 00:38:09 GMT, Gordon <Gor...@leaf.net.nz> wrote:Prove it! Apparently you're such an arrogant Marxist muppet you believe
On 2023-04-09, Rich80105 <Rich...@hotmail.com> wrote:What has changed in that time, Gordon? Our Covid experience continues
On Sun, 9 Apr 2023 15:06:13 -0700 (PDT), John Bowes
<bowes...@gmail.com> wrote:
On Monday, April 10, 2023 at 9:38:56?AM UTC+12, John Bowes wrote: >> >>>>>>> >>>> An interesting read for the rest of us. Mainly because unlike Rich
we
have open minds...
https://www.chrislynchmedia.com/news-items/thedisinformationproject#.ZDMjdFAu1jG.twitter
Yet more that doesn't fit Richie's mainstream disinformed mind... >> >>>>>>> >>>
https://nzdsos.com/2023/02/28/fifth-generation-warfare/
It is sad to see the rabbit holes some go down - see:
https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/health/coronavirus/300439357/covid19-nz-why-a-small-group-of-doctors-opposes-vaccination
That article is 18 months ago. Things have changed in that time. It is
before Omicron's arrival.
The fact that we have this almost total disregard of the option to >> >>>>>>> >changing
the view point as the real world has changed says an awful lot.
to be better than many other countries with vaccination still being >> >>>>>>> popular and apparenty successful in keeping our death rates low.
you
don't have to back up your disinformation with facts Rich. As usual you
don't
practice what you arrogantly demand from others. So how about playing by
the
rules you insist others follow. Or is it that you're just feral
man-in-dresses
like those peaceful people who attacked Possie Parker...
On RCR, http://realitycheck.radio. Some would say that I have spent the >> >>>>>better part of the morning down the rabbit hole of misinformation, however I
like checking out all view points, so that I am well informed and educated.
Head to the replay section. Here you will find Rodney Hyde's rant on the
matter of "Define a woman? In it we have the answer, A woman is a adult >> >>>>>female human. Simple, correct and consice.
''woman'' and ''man'' are no longer as clear cut in all situations
short of value.
https://dictionary.cambridge.org/dictionary/english/woman
As I recall you have not given a definition that you are prepared to
accept; the definition that I gave is not as simple as that given in
the quotation from Rodney Hide above. In most situations, the simpler
definition is quite adequate, but as I pointed out, language is not
static; for New Zealanders the election of Georgina Beyer, our first
trans woman MP, gave acceptance to that subtle definition change for
many New Zealanders.
So are you going to sit on the fence, Tony, or tell us what you really
think?
meaning of a word. You did not define a woman, not even close. Your English >> >language is appalling.
Philosophers have strauggled for millenia to define any human being, none have
provided a definitive definition.
You have not defined a woman and neither did your source attempt to.
Now that is an example of the use of a statistic without adequately
There is also Paul Brennan talking with Dr Guy Hatchard about the death >> >>>>>rate, now increased to 17% above the average.
defining it - what average? What deaths? what time period? what
population? Given the experience of the USA, it is possibly that we
have had world deaths from infection that are 17% higher than
previously, but that is not the case in New Zealand.
There is also the suggestion that the deaths caused by the vaccine are as
great as Covid deaths. (Sorry I forgotten where this is).
Unless the vaccine induced positive tests for Covid without the
presence of the virus, that is clearly a wrong suggestion. Given that
Covid deaths required a positive test for the virus, an equivalent
number of vaccine induced deaths would have been very evident in
statistics - the comparison against actual vs expected deaths based on >> >>>>normal mortality would have shown a significant increase in actual
deaths. I suspect this is a conveniently anonymous wrong conjecture;
if you do recall where it was it you should be very wary of any
similar ''reckons'' from that source.
You go first for once!
On Tue, 11 Apr 2023 02:29:52 -0000 (UTC), Tony
<lizandtony@orcon.net.nz> wrote:
Rich80105 <Rich80105@hotmail.com> wrote:
On Mon, 10 Apr 2023 14:25:09 -0700 (PDT), John Bowes >>><bowesjohn02@gmail.com> wrote:Which makes it clearly meaningless to mention her.
On Tuesday, April 11, 2023 at 9:03:46?AM UTC+12, Rich80105 wrote:I did not claim that Georgina Beyer used that term - but it was used >>>about her.
On Mon, 10 Apr 2023 06:21:04 -0000 (UTC), Tony
<lizan...@orcon.net.nz> wrote:
Rich80105 <Rich...@hotmail.com> wrote:I gave this one:
On 10 Apr 2023 04:23:45 GMT, Gordon <Gor...@leaf.net.nz> wrote:short of value.
On 2023-04-10, John Bowes <bowes...@gmail.com> wrote:Except that, with words, a single definition is often only ""correct"" >>>>> >>for a small group who use it in that way - the definitions of both >>>>> >>''woman'' and ''man'' are no longer as clear cut in all situations >>>>> >When prompted you used a single simple definition, and one that was >>>>> >woefully
On Monday, April 10, 2023 at 12:55:40?PM UTC+12, Rich80105 wrote: >>>>> >>>>> On 10 Apr 2023 00:38:09 GMT, Gordon <Gor...@leaf.net.nz> wrote: >>>>> >>>>>
don't have to back up your disinformation with facts Rich. As usual >>>>> >>>>youOn 2023-04-09, Rich80105 <Rich...@hotmail.com> wrote:
On Sun, 9 Apr 2023 15:06:13 -0700 (PDT), John Bowes
<bowes...@gmail.com> wrote:
On Monday, April 10, 2023 at 9:38:56?AM UTC+12, John Bowes
wrote:
An interesting read for the rest of us. Mainly because unlike >>>>> >>>>> >>>>Rich we
have open minds...
https://www.chrislynchmedia.com/news-items/thedisinformationproject#.ZDMjdFAu1jG.twitter
Yet more that doesn't fit Richie's mainstream disinformed
mind...
https://nzdsos.com/2023/02/28/fifth-generation-warfare/
It is sad to see the rabbit holes some go down - see:
continueshttps://www.stuff.co.nz/national/health/coronavirus/300439357/covid19-nz-why-a-small-group-of-doctors-opposes-vaccination
That article is 18 months ago. Things have changed in that time. >>>>> >>>>> >It
is
before Omicron's arrival.
The fact that we have this almost total disregard of the option to >>>>> >>>>> >changing
the view point as the real world has changed says an awful lot. >>>>> >>>>> What has changed in that time, Gordon? Our Covid experience
to be better than many other countries with vaccination still being >>>>> >>>>> popular and apparenty successful in keeping our death rates low. >>>>> >>>> Prove it! Apparently you're such an arrogant Marxist muppet you >>>>> >>>>believe you
don't
practice what you arrogantly demand from others. So how about playing >>>>> >>>>by the
rules you insist others follow. Or is it that you're just feral
man-in-dresses
like those peaceful people who attacked Possie Parker...
On RCR, http://realitycheck.radio. Some would say that I have spent >>>>> >>>the
better part of the morning down the rabbit hole of misinformation, >>>>> >>>however I
like checking out all view points, so that I am well informed and >>>>> >>>educated.
Head to the replay section. Here you will find Rodney Hyde's rant on >>>>> >>>the
matter of "Define a woman? In it we have the answer, A woman is a >>>>> >>>adult
female human. Simple, correct and consice.
https://dictionary.cambridge.org/dictionary/english/woman
As I recall you have not given a definition that you are prepared to >>>>> accept; the definition that I gave is not as simple as that given in >>>>> the quotation from Rodney Hide above. In most situations, the simpler >>>>> definition is quite adequate, but as I pointed out, language is not
static; for New Zealanders the election of Georgina Beyer, our first >>>>> trans woman MP, gave acceptance to that subtle definition change for >>>>> many New Zealanders.
Where and when did she claim men could be women? Beyer used the term >>>>transexual. A word feral trans like you refuse to accept!
Not at all: From: >https://www.teaomaori.news/brave-fabulous-trailblazer-politicians-and-close-friends-remember-georgina-beyer
In 1999, Beyer made history as Cartertons first Maori, transgender
and woman mayor with a sharp tongue and great sense of humour.
McAnulty recalled a candidate debate where Beyers legendary wit
brought the house down.
Someone yells out, 'Where's your penis?' She says, It's on a jar on
the mantlepiece. Where's yours? And the place just cracked up, they
just absolutely lost it. And this guy was humiliated and no one ever
said a thing again.
So referring to a trangender person as a woman mayor has happened - IAnd is there something wrong with that? Do tell.
do not know if the person that yelled a quetion was John Bowes, but
referring to her as a woman, using the words She and her when talking
about here was quite normal and not a matter for comment - Ron Marks
referred to her and described what she was like.
Still, you can use whatever you want; you have never backed away from >minority positions on a lot of issues.
So are you going to sit on the fence, Tony, or tell us what you really >>>>> think?
Stop lying. Tony has made it clear to anyone with comprehension skills Rich!
Now that is an example of the use of a statistic without adequately >>>>> >>defining it - what average? What deaths? what time period? what
There is also Paul Brennan talking with Dr Guy Hatchard about the >>>>> >>>death
rate, now increased to 17% above the average.
population? Given the experience of the USA, it is possibly that we >>>>> >>have had world deaths from infection that are 17% higher than
previously, but that is not the case in New Zealand.
There is also the suggestion that the deaths caused by the vaccine are >>>>> >>>as
great as Covid deaths. (Sorry I forgotten where this is).
Unless the vaccine induced positive tests for Covid without the
presence of the virus, that is clearly a wrong suggestion. Given that >>>>> >>Covid deaths required a positive test for the virus, an equivalent >>>>> >>number of vaccine induced deaths would have been very evident in
statistics - the comparison against actual vs expected deaths based on >>>>> >>normal mortality would have shown a significant increase in actual >>>>> >>deaths. I suspect this is a conveniently anonymous wrong conjecture; >>>>> >>if you do recall where it was it you should be very wary of any
similar ''reckons'' from that source.
On Tue, 11 Apr 2023 02:43:01 -0000 (UTC), TonyThat is not proof. It is just one set of questionable data - no peer reviews and no supporting evidence.
<lizandtony@orcon.net.nz> wrote:
Rich80105 <Rich80105@hotmail.com> wrote:Except it has been given above : >https://ourworldindata.org/grapher/cumulative-excess-deaths-covid?country=USA~AUS~NCL~SGP~FRA~SWE~GBR~NZL~JPN~ITA~DEU~ZAF~HKG~ARG~CAN~BEL
On Mon, 10 Apr 2023 06:24:44 -0000 (UTC), TonyYour answer was waffle.
<lizandtony@orcon.net.nz> wrote:
Rich80105 <Rich80105@hotmail.com> wrote:I was providing a direct answer to the implied quetion:
On Mon, 10 Apr 2023 04:55:32 -0000 (UTC), Tony >>>>><lizandtony@orcon.net.nz> wrote:Answer the question or bugger off.
Rich80105 <Rich80105@hotmail.com> wrote:Look at the ''ourworldindata'' url I gave above, and look at the >>>>>latest figure for New Zealand. It should that, compared to the number >>>>>of deaths expected based on pre-covid death rates, we have experienced >>>>>169 fewer deaths - we are the only country of our size or large that >>>>>has such a result, but given the number of deaths we have each year, a >>>>>difference of 169 is not significantly different from zero.
On Mon, 10 Apr 2023 03:57:19 -0000 (UTC), Tony >>>>>>><lizandtony@orcon.net.nz> wrote:So provide some evidence that excess deaths in NZ is effectively zero. >>>>>>Do that and stop prevaricating.
Rich80105 <Rich80105@hotmail.com> wrote:Indeed it is, but a very important one - and it is accompanied by a >>>>>>>lot of other international comparisons that, individually and >>>>>>>collectively, confirm that New Zealand has suffered less in terms of >>>>>>>direct Covid effect on individuals, better than most and possibly all >>>>>>>comparable countries.
On Sun, 9 Apr 2023 18:37:02 -0700 (PDT), John Bowes >>>>>>>>><bowesjohn02@gmail.com> wrote:That is a very narrow set of data./
On Monday, April 10, 2023 at 1:33:28?PM UTC+12, Rich80105 wrote: >>>>>>>>>>> On Sun, 9 Apr 2023 18:27:55 -0700 (PDT), John BowesLets just stick to what I have posted; an important issue is whether >>>>>>>>>we have had better Covid results than other countries - for that see: >>>>>>>>>https://ourworldindata.org/grapher/cumulative-excess-deaths-covid?country=USA~AUS~NCL~SGP~FRA~SWE~GBR~NZL~JPN~ITA~DEU~ZAF~HKG~ARG~CAN~BEL
<bowes...@gmail.com> wrote:All of it you imbecilic moron :)
On Monday, April 10, 2023 at 12:55:40?PM UTC+12, Rich80105 wrote: >>>>>>>>>>> >> On 10 Apr 2023 00:38:09 GMT, Gordon <Gor...@leaf.net.nz> wrote: >>>>>>>>>>> >>Which part do you want proved, John Bowes?
Prove it! Apparently you're such an arrogant Marxist muppet you >>>>>>>>>>> >believeOn 2023-04-09, Rich80105 <Rich...@hotmail.com> wrote: >>>>>>>>>>> >> >> On Sun, 9 Apr 2023 15:06:13 -0700 (PDT), John Bowes >>>>>>>>>>> >> >><bowes...@gmail.com> wrote:
On Monday, April 10, 2023 at 9:38:56?AM UTC+12, John Bowes >>>>>>>>>>> >> >>>wrote:
An interesting read for the rest of us. Mainly because >>>>>>>>>>> >> >>>>unlike
Rich
we have open minds...
It is sad to see the rabbit holes some go down - see: >>>>>>>>>>> >> >>https://www.chrislynchmedia.com/news-items/thedisinformationproject#.ZDMjdFAu1jG.twitter
Yet more that doesn't fit Richie's mainstream disinformed >>>>>>>>>>> >> >>>mind...
https://nzdsos.com/2023/02/28/fifth-generation-warfare/ >>>>>>>>>>> >> >>
to be better than many other countries with vaccination still >>>>>>>>>>> >>beinghttps://www.stuff.co.nz/national/health/coronavirus/300439357/covid19-nz-why-a-small-group-of-doctors-opposes-vaccination
That article is 18 months ago. Things have changed in that >>>>>>>>>>> >> >time.
It
is
before Omicron's arrival.
The fact that we have this almost total disregard of the option >>>>>>>>>>> >> >to
changing
the view point as the real world has changed says an awful lot. >>>>>>>>>>> >> What has changed in that time, Gordon? Our Covid experience >>>>>>>>>>> >>continues
popular and apparently successful in keeping our death rates >>>>>>>>>>> >>low.
you don't have to back up your disinformation with facts Rich. As >>>>>>>>>>> >usual
you
don't practice what you arrogantly demand from others. So how >>>>>>>>>>> >about
playing by
the rules you insist others follow. Or is it that you're just >>>>>>>>>>> >feral
man-in-dresses like those peaceful people who attacked Possie >>>>>>>>>>> >Parker...
It is vital to aso look at what damage was done - a subject you refuse >>>>>>>>toThe measurement of excess deaths is a measure of damage - slightly >>>>>>>negative, but effectively zero for New Zealand; yes some died, but an >>>>>>>equivalent number of others lived longer. Then there is economic >>>>>>>damage - we have a lower inflation rate than most countries, we have >>>>>>>low unemployment compared to most countries, but I do not pretend that >>>>>>>all New Zealanders have done better than all people from other >>>>>>>countries - what other danage are you thinking of, Tony?
address.
Sure we have had covid deaths, but they have been balanced by later >>>>>deaths for many due we believe at least in part the effects of >>>>>lock-downs and other health measures that meant fewer people died from >>>>>other infections.
There is increasing evidence that you are wrong.Mortality rates may reflct some elements of economic circumstances >>>>>(the poor do not live as long as those who are ''comfortable'', but in >>>>>broad terms is ins not normally considered and economic measurement.
Economic measurements are minor compared to health.
Read also the next paragraph below:
So provide some evidence that excess deaths in NZ is effectively zero.No I cannot because there is no such proof.
No but you are, obviously.
Are you having difficulty following the thread, Tony?
That measures actual deaths and compares with the expected deaths >>>>>>>>>based on pre-Covid mortality. Many countries are able to estimate >>>>>>>>>expected deaths by applying experience of actual deaths over recent >>>>>>>>>years to our population each year. For New Zealand, the total "Excess >>>>>>>>>deaths" over that expected based on pre-covid death rates as at March >>>>>>>>>5, 2023 is -169 ; in other words we have had fewer deaths than >>>>>>>>>expected through the covid period. We do know that Covid precautions >>>>>>>>>did reduce many other deaths - deaths from other infectious diseases >>>>>>>>>reduced, and road deaths reduced - and those positive effects >>>>>>>>>outweighed the deaths from Covid.
Compare that with say the UK - at that date, the equivalent number for >>>>>>>>>the UK is 198,995. Now that is still fairly low - they have a much >>>>>>>>>large population than we do - but the most recent figure from the USA >>>>>>>>>is 1.26 million.
In the chart above I have included a range of countries, you may like >>>>>>>>>to look and see how many countries have a better result than New >>>>>>>>>Zealand . . .
Happy now?
On Tue, 11 Apr 2023 02:29:52 -0000 (UTC), Tony
<lizan...@orcon.net.nz> wrote:
Rich80105 <Rich...@hotmail.com> wrote:Not at all: From: https://www.teaomaori.news/brave-fabulous-trailblazer-politicians-and-close-friends-remember-georgina-beyer
On Mon, 10 Apr 2023 14:25:09 -0700 (PDT), John Bowes >><bowes...@gmail.com> wrote:Which makes it clearly meaningless to mention her.
On Tuesday, April 11, 2023 at 9:03:46?AM UTC+12, Rich80105 wrote:I did not claim that Georgina Beyer used that term - but it was used >>about her.
On Mon, 10 Apr 2023 06:21:04 -0000 (UTC), Tony
<lizan...@orcon.net.nz> wrote:
Rich80105 <Rich...@hotmail.com> wrote:I gave this one:
On 10 Apr 2023 04:23:45 GMT, Gordon <Gor...@leaf.net.nz> wrote:short of value.
On 2023-04-10, John Bowes <bowes...@gmail.com> wrote:Except that, with words, a single definition is often only ""correct""
On Monday, April 10, 2023 at 12:55:40?PM UTC+12, Rich80105 wrote: >>>> >>>>> On 10 Apr 2023 00:38:09 GMT, Gordon <Gor...@leaf.net.nz> wrote: >>>> >>>>>
don't have to back up your disinformation with facts Rich. As usual youOn 2023-04-09, Rich80105 <Rich...@hotmail.com> wrote:to be better than many other countries with vaccination still being
On Sun, 9 Apr 2023 15:06:13 -0700 (PDT), John Bowes
<bowes...@gmail.com> wrote:
On Monday, April 10, 2023 at 9:38:56?AM UTC+12, John Bowes wrote:
An interesting read for the rest of us. Mainly because unlike
Rich we
have open minds...
https://www.chrislynchmedia.com/news-items/thedisinformationproject#.ZDMjdFAu1jG.twitter
Yet more that doesn't fit Richie's mainstream disinformed mind...
https://nzdsos.com/2023/02/28/fifth-generation-warfare/
It is sad to see the rabbit holes some go down - see:
https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/health/coronavirus/300439357/covid19-nz-why-a-small-group-of-doctors-opposes-vaccination
That article is 18 months ago. Things have changed in that time. It
is
before Omicron's arrival.
The fact that we have this almost total disregard of the option to
changing
the view point as the real world has changed says an awful lot. >>>> >>>>> What has changed in that time, Gordon? Our Covid experience continues
popular and apparenty successful in keeping our death rates low. >>>> >>>> Prove it! Apparently you're such an arrogant Marxist muppet you >>>> >>>>believe you
don't
practice what you arrogantly demand from others. So how about playing
by the
rules you insist others follow. Or is it that you're just feral >>>> >>>>man-in-dresses
like those peaceful people who attacked Possie Parker...
On RCR, http://realitycheck.radio. Some would say that I have spent the
better part of the morning down the rabbit hole of misinformation, >>>> >>>however I
like checking out all view points, so that I am well informed and >>>> >>>educated.
Head to the replay section. Here you will find Rodney Hyde's rant on the
matter of "Define a woman? In it we have the answer, A woman is a adult
female human. Simple, correct and consice.
for a small group who use it in that way - the definitions of both >>>> >>''woman'' and ''man'' are no longer as clear cut in all situations >>>> >When prompted you used a single simple definition, and one that was >>>> >woefully
https://dictionary.cambridge.org/dictionary/english/woman
As I recall you have not given a definition that you are prepared to >>>> accept; the definition that I gave is not as simple as that given in >>>> the quotation from Rodney Hide above. In most situations, the simpler >>>> definition is quite adequate, but as I pointed out, language is not >>>> static; for New Zealanders the election of Georgina Beyer, our first >>>> trans woman MP, gave acceptance to that subtle definition change for >>>> many New Zealanders.
Where and when did she claim men could be women? Beyer used the term >>>transexual. A word feral trans like you refuse to accept!
In 1999, Beyer made history as Carterton’s first Maori, transgender
and woman mayor – with a sharp tongue and great sense of humour.
McAnulty recalled a candidate debate where Beyer’s legendary wit
brought the house down.
“Someone yells out, 'Where's your penis?' She says, ‘It's on a jar on the mantlepiece. Where's yours?’ And the place just cracked up, they
just absolutely lost it. And this guy was humiliated and no one ever
said a thing again.”
So referring to a trangender person as a woman mayor has happened - I
do not know if the person that yelled a quetion was John Bowes, but referring to her as a woman, using the words She and her when talking
about here was quite normal and not a matter for comment - Ron Marks referred to her and described what she was like.
Still, you can use whatever you want; you have never backed away from minority positions on a lot of issues.
This current load of garbage doesn't tell us what YOU believe a women to be Rich. Now how about once in your life stop the fucking lies and besmirching the memory of a decent transexual and answer the fucking question!
So are you going to sit on the fence, Tony, or tell us what you really >>>> think?
Stop lying. Tony has made it clear to anyone with comprehension skills Rich!
Now that is an example of the use of a statistic without adequately >>>> >>defining it - what average? What deaths? what time period? what
There is also Paul Brennan talking with Dr Guy Hatchard about the death
rate, now increased to 17% above the average.
population? Given the experience of the USA, it is possibly that we >>>> >>have had world deaths from infection that are 17% higher than
previously, but that is not the case in New Zealand.
There is also the suggestion that the deaths caused by the vaccine are
as
great as Covid deaths. (Sorry I forgotten where this is).
Unless the vaccine induced positive tests for Covid without the
presence of the virus, that is clearly a wrong suggestion. Given that >>>> >>Covid deaths required a positive test for the virus, an equivalent >>>> >>number of vaccine induced deaths would have been very evident in
statistics - the comparison against actual vs expected deaths based on
normal mortality would have shown a significant increase in actual >>>> >>deaths. I suspect this is a conveniently anonymous wrong conjecture; >>>> >>if you do recall where it was it you should be very wary of any
similar ''reckons'' from that source.
On Sun, 9 Apr 2023 15:06:13 -0700 (PDT), John Bowes
<bowesjohn02@gmail.com> wrote:
On Monday, April 10, 2023 at 9:38:56?AM UTC+12, John Bowes wrote:
An interesting read for the rest of us. Mainly because unlike Rich we have open minds...
https://www.chrislynchmedia.com/news-items/thedisinformationproject#.ZDMjdFAu1jG.twitter
Yet more that doesn't fit Richie's mainstream disinformed mind...
https://nzdsos.com/2023/02/28/fifth-generation-warfare/
It is sad to see the rabbit holes some go down - see: >https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/health/coronavirus/300439357/covid19-nz-why-a-small-group-of-doctors-opposes-vaccination
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