XPost: news.misc

Am 08.07.2023 um 09:42:23 Uhr schrieb Julien ÉLIE:

And it's not easy to improve the "poor support for multimedia" and
"hard for new users to find it" problems.

Getting new users means it must be findable via normal web searches.

Something like narkive.com, but with posting possible.

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XPost: news.misc

Am 09.07.2023 um 15:37:50 Uhr schrieb Adam H. Kerman:

We already know what hasn't been attracting new users to Usenet.

I was one of them.
Without finding articles via narkive.com, I would never post here.

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XPost: news.misc

Doc O'Leary , <droleary.usenet@2023.impossiblystupid.com> writes:

For your reference, records indicate that
=?UTF-8?Q?Julien_=c3=89LIE?= <iulius@nom-de-mon-site.com.invalid> wrote:

Indeed, fighting spam and abuse is a daily challenge.

Only inasmuch as people don’t *actually* want to take the steps needed to solve the problem. The UDP was a rare thing, but cutting off hostile networks should be one of the first steps in eliminating abuse.

If anything deserves a UDP it's Google Groups.


john

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XPost: news.misc

Marco Moock <mo01@posteo.de> wrote:

Am 09.07.2023 um 15:37:50 Uhr schrieb Adam H. Kerman:

We already know what hasn't been attracting new users to Usenet.

I was one of them.
Without finding articles via narkive.com, I would never post here.

I'll note you didn't state that you had used a non-site-limited Google search.

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XPost: news.misc

Am 20.07.2023 um 13:24:19 Uhr schrieb Jesse Rehmer:

I can tell you one VERY interesting FACT about all commercial Usenet providers in the United States - their servers and infrastructure
handling Usenet feeds are located in Ashburn Virginia, in facilities
near the NSA.

Is there a specific (legal) reason for that?

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Richard Kettlewell wrote:

John Levine <johnl@taugh.com> writes:

Meanwhile AFAIK binary groups still exist today, there’s just a >>>> relatively limited set of providers who carry them. I don’t know how
they escape being sued into obvlivion by copyright holders.

There's no secret. They act on the DMCA notices they receive and
delete the offending articles. I've been a technical expert in some
court cases on this very topic.

I’m not very familiar with US law. The reason I’m puzzled is that the point of carrying binary groups is, rather obviously, to facilitate large-scale copyright violation, not some more innocuous pursuit that
happens to be troubled by the occasional pirated movie.

Can you really get away with that (at least in the USA) as long as you respond to notices from the rights holders who actually bother to check?
If so then how is it that Napster was destroyed?

(Has it not occurred to anyone to automate ‘NNTP to DMCA notice’?)

Most binaries are now hidden behind file names and subjects that give
no indication of what is there. You need to be part of one of the roving
groups sharing the hidden_name -> real_name conversion to know what to download.

So, browsing the groups does not give the info needed to submit a DCMA
notice.

--
Retro Guy

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According to Retro Guy <retro.guy@rocksolidbbs.com>:

There's no secret. They act on the DMCA notices they receive and
delete the offending articles. I've been a technical expert in some
court cases on this very topic.

I’m not very familiar with US law. The reason I’m puzzled is that the
point of carrying binary groups is, rather obviously, to facilitate
large-scale copyright violation, not some more innocuous pursuit that
happens to be troubled by the occasional pirated movie.

Can you really get away with that (at least in the USA) as long as you
respond to notices from the rights holders who actually bother to check?

Yes. See https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Online_Copyright_Infringement_Liability_Limitation_Act

If so then how is it that Napster was destroyed?

A combination of not taking the DMCA seriously, bad lawyering, and bad luck.

Most binaries are now hidden behind file names and subjects that give
no indication of what is there. You need to be part of one of the roving >groups sharing the hidden_name -> real_name conversion to know what to >download.

So, browsing the groups does not give the info needed to submit a DCMA >notice.

Media companies have spiders scouring the web looking for infringing
stuff. I'm sure they could do the same with a usenet feed, but I have
no idea how much they do, since usenet is so relatively tiny these days.

For an example of how not to do this, see the current case in which the
entire music industry is suing Twitter.

https://www.theverge.com/2023/6/14/23761680/twitter-music-lawsuit-nmpa-copyright-infringement
--
Regards,
John Levine, johnl@taugh.com, Primary Perpetrator of "The Internet for Dummies",
Please consider the environment before reading this e-mail. https://jl.ly

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In article <u9m77h$2lkb9$4@news.xmission.com>, Richard <> wrote:

... the whole moderation infrastructure on usenet appears to have
fallen into disarray from lack of use.

I'm one of the people who maintains the Usenet moderation system,
and I assure you that it does work as before. Prospective moderators
seem to have difficulty using the old (mostly shell-based) tools,
so it can be an issue to find someone, but it's not an infrastructure
problem.

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