• Finding a tentative bullseye release date

    From Paul Gevers@21:1/5 to All on Fri Apr 9 20:50:01 2021
    XPost: linux.debian.maint.boot, linux.debian.devel.release
    To: press@debian.org
    To: debian-cd@lists.debian.org
    To: debian-boot@lists.debian.org
    To: debian-release@lists.debian.org (debian-release)

    This is an OpenPGP/MIME signed message (RFC 4880 and 3156) --SwT1YULE6QN5a5rLlS5rp3iRMyIOfwveO
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    Dear release team, ftpmasters, press team, cd team, d-i team,

    The Release Team believes that the state of bullseye is pretty good.
    Yes, there are some blocking bugs [1] and d-i and shim still need some
    love, but the state is much better than we remembered from the same time
    in buster.

    Last time in the buster release cycle, it took quite a while to pick a
    release date once it was clear that buster could get released. As we
    believe that shorter freeze period are better for the spirit of
    contributors to Debian, we'd like to avoid such an unnecessary delay
    again, and we'd want to pick a tentative release date. We call it
    tentative, because it would be the date where we do the bullseye release assuming that the identified issues are resolved by then and that we
    don't find new blocking issues between now and two weeks before that
    proposed date. So, the date would not be the set-in-stone release date,
    but obviously it would become more solid as we get near it.

    We propose to aim for a release date in May. Would either of the
    following work for you and do you have any preference?
    - May 1
    - May 8
    - May 15
    - May 22
    - May 29

    Paul

    [1] https://udd.debian.org/dev/bugs.cgi?merged=ign&rc=1&format=html&release=bullseye_and_sid&done=ign&deferred=ign&rtbullseye-is-blocker=only&cpopcon=1&chints=1&ckeypackage=1&ctags=1&cdeferred=1&caffected=1&cmissingbuilds=1&clastupload=1&crttags=1&
    cautormtime=1&cwhykey=1&cbritney=1&sortby=last_modified&sorto=asc&#results








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  • From Steve McIntyre@21:1/5 to Paul Gevers on Fri Apr 9 22:10:02 2021
    XPost: linux.debian.maint.boot, linux.debian.devel.release

    Hey Paul and others!

    On Fri, Apr 09, 2021 at 08:47:21PM +0200, Paul Gevers wrote:
    Dear release team, ftpmasters, press team, cd team, d-i team,

    The Release Team believes that the state of bullseye is pretty good.
    Yes, there are some blocking bugs [1] and d-i and shim still need some
    love, but the state is much better than we remembered from the same time
    in buster.

    Last time in the buster release cycle, it took quite a while to pick a >release date once it was clear that buster could get released. As we
    believe that shorter freeze period are better for the spirit of
    contributors to Debian, we'd like to avoid such an unnecessary delay
    again, and we'd want to pick a tentative release date. We call it
    tentative, because it would be the date where we do the bullseye release >assuming that the identified issues are resolved by then and that we
    don't find new blocking issues between now and two weeks before that
    proposed date. So, the date would not be the set-in-stone release date,
    but obviously it would become more solid as we get near it.

    We propose to aim for a release date in May. Would either of the
    following work for you and do you have any preference?
    - May 1
    - May 8
    - May 15
    - May 22
    - May 29

    So far I'm available for all of those weekends, but for selfish
    reasons I'd prefer not to be busy on the weekend of the 29th.

    --
    Steve McIntyre, Cambridge, UK. steve@einval.com
    Armed with "Valor": "Centurion" represents quality of Discipline,
    Honor, Integrity and Loyalty. Now you don't have to be a Caesar to
    concord the digital world while feeling safe and proud.

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  • From Donald Norwood@21:1/5 to Paul Gevers on Fri Apr 9 22:50:01 2021
    XPost: linux.debian.maint.boot, linux.debian.devel.release
    To: ftpmaster@ftp-master.debian.org
    To: press@debian.org
    To: debian-cd@lists.debian.org
    To: debian-boot@lists.debian.org
    To: debian-release@lists.debian.org (debian-release)

    This is an OpenPGP/MIME signed message (RFC 4880 and 3156) --XhhyvhxCpP6EUfBF22TwSWPekQ9pX9nXD
    Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8
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    Hello, everyone


    On 4/9/21 2:47 PM, Paul Gevers wrote:
    Dear release team, ftpmasters, press team, cd team, d-i team,

    The Release Team believes that the state of bullseye is pretty good.
    Yes, there are some blocking bugs [1] and d-i and shim still need some
    love, but the state is much better than we remembered from the same time
    in buster.


    Great job all around, very exciting.

    Last time in the buster release cycle, it took quite a while to pick a release date once it was clear that buster could get released. As we
    believe that shorter freeze period are better for the spirit of
    contributors to Debian, we'd like to avoid such an unnecessary delay
    again, and we'd want to pick a tentative release date. We call it
    tentative, because it would be the date where we do the bullseye release assuming that the identified issues are resolved by then and that we
    don't find new blocking issues between now and two weeks before that
    proposed date. So, the date would not be the set-in-stone release date,
    but obviously it would become more solid as we get near it.

    We propose to aim for a release date in May. Would either of the
    following work for you and do you have any preference?
    - May 1
    - May 8
    - May 15
    - May 22
    - May 29

    Press can do May 1, 8, or 22.

    Looking forward already!

    -Donald

    --
    --
    -
    ⢀⣴⠾⠻⢶⣦⠀
    ⣾⠁⢠⠒⠀⣿⡁ Donald Norwood
    ⢿⡄⠘⠷⠚⠋⠀ B7A1 5F45 5B28 7F38 4174
    ⠈⠳⣄⠀⠀⠀⠀ D5E9 E5EC 4AC9 BD62 7B05


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  • From Cyril Brulebois@21:1/5 to All on Sat Apr 10 12:00:01 2021
    XPost: linux.debian.maint.boot, linux.debian.devel.release

    Hi,

    Paul Gevers <elbrus@debian.org> (2021-04-09):
    The Release Team believes that the state of bullseye is pretty good.
    Yes, there are some blocking bugs [1] and d-i and shim still need some
    love, but the state is much better than we remembered from the same
    time in buster.

    As already explained, trying to release in April/May wasn't quite
    anticipated, and there's still ground to cover on the d-i side.

    Last time in the buster release cycle, it took quite a while to pick a release date once it was clear that buster could get released. As we
    believe that shorter freeze period are better for the spirit of
    contributors to Debian, we'd like to avoid such an unnecessary delay
    again, and we'd want to pick a tentative release date. We call it
    tentative, because it would be the date where we do the bullseye
    release assuming that the identified issues are resolved by then and
    that we don't find new blocking issues between now and two weeks
    before that proposed date. So, the date would not be the set-in-stone
    release date, but obviously it would become more solid as we get near
    it.

    We propose to aim for a release date in May. Would either of the
    following work for you and do you have any preference?
    - May 1
    - May 8
    - May 15
    - May 22
    - May 29

    As it stands, the later the better.


    Cheers,
    --
    Cyril Brulebois (kibi@debian.org) <https://debamax.com/>
    D-I release manager -- Release team member -- Freelance Consultant

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  • From Holger Wansing@21:1/5 to Cyril Brulebois on Sat Apr 10 13:20:02 2021
    XPost: linux.debian.maint.boot, linux.debian.devel.release

    Hi,

    Cyril Brulebois <kibi@debian.org> wrote (Sat, 10 Apr 2021 11:54:59 +0200):
    Hi,

    Paul Gevers <elbrus@debian.org> (2021-04-09):
    The Release Team believes that the state of bullseye is pretty good.
    Yes, there are some blocking bugs [1] and d-i and shim still need some love, but the state is much better than we remembered from the same
    time in buster.

    As already explained, trying to release in April/May wasn't quite anticipated, and there's still ground to cover on the d-i side.

    Trying to minimize the work load for kibi:
    @kibi: (given there are no objections against this from you?):

    Maybe the release-team could look into the pending unblock issues for d-i
    in the meantime?
    Most of them should be quite unproblematic, since they only contain translation updates.

    A bit more of an issue would be tasksel.
    1. Currently there is 3.65 in sid, which needs to migrate to bullseye.
    2. A problem came up during freeze regarding input methods for several
    languages:
    Starting with bullseye, GNOME depends on ibus, which is not fully
    compatible with the view of some language teams, who would like to
    prefer fcitx.
    The best way to get this situation fixed would require some new
    binary packages to be added to Bullseye (would only be tasks packages,
    so no new code/functions to be added!).
    A thread regarding this started at
    https://lists.debian.org/debian-boot/2021/03/msg00058.html
    and the release-team was also added to the loop at some point.
    Maybe release-team could look into this too, and try to make a
    decision?


    Holger





    --
    Holger Wansing <hwansing@mailbox.org>
    PGP-Fingerprint: 496A C6E8 1442 4B34 8508 3529 59F1 87CA 156E B076

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  • From Jacek Krysztofik@21:1/5 to All on Sat Apr 10 17:50:01 2021
    XPost: linux.debian.maint.boot, linux.debian.devel.release

    Hi,

    sob., 10 kwi 2021 o 13:18 Holger Wansing <hwansing@mailbox.org> napisał(a):

    Hi,

    Cyril Brulebois <kibi@debian.org> wrote (Sat, 10 Apr 2021 11:54:59 +0200):
    Hi,

    Paul Gevers <elbrus@debian.org> (2021-04-09):
    The Release Team believes that the state of bullseye is pretty good.
    Yes, there are some blocking bugs [1] and d-i and shim still need some love, but the state is much better than we remembered from the same
    time in buster.

    As already explained, trying to release in April/May wasn't quite anticipated, and there's still ground to cover on the d-i side.

    Trying to minimize the work load for kibi:
    @kibi: (given there are no objections against this from you?):

    Maybe the release-team could look into the pending unblock issues for d-i
    in the meantime?
    Most of them should be quite unproblematic, since they only contain translation
    updates.

    A bit more of an issue would be tasksel.
    1. Currently there is 3.65 in sid, which needs to migrate to bullseye.
    2. A problem came up during freeze regarding input methods for several
    languages:
    Starting with bullseye, GNOME depends on ibus, which is not fully
    compatible with the view of some language teams, who would like to
    prefer fcitx.
    The best way to get this situation fixed would require some new
    binary packages to be added to Bullseye (would only be tasks packages,
    so no new code/functions to be added!).
    A thread regarding this started at
    https://lists.debian.org/debian-boot/2021/03/msg00058.html
    and the release-team was also added to the loop at some point.
    Maybe release-team could look into this too, and try to make a
    decision?


    Holger

    "When does the new Debian release come out?"
    "When it's ready."

    <div dir="ltr"><div>Hi,</div><br><div class="gmail_quote"><div dir="ltr" class="gmail_attr">sob., 10 kwi 2021 o 13:18 Holger Wansing &lt;<a href="mailto:hwansing@mailbox.org">hwansing@mailbox.org</a>&gt; napisał(a):<br></div><blockquote class="gmail_
    quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex">Hi,<br>

    Cyril Brulebois &lt;<a href="mailto:kibi@debian.org" target="_blank">kibi@debian.org</a>&gt; wrote (Sat, 10 Apr 2021 11:54:59 +0200):<br>
    &gt; Hi,<br>
    &gt; <br>
    &gt; Paul Gevers &lt;<a href="mailto:elbrus@debian.org" target="_blank">elbrus@debian.org</a>&gt; (2021-04-09):<br>
    &gt; &gt; The Release Team believes that the state of bullseye is pretty good.<br>
    &gt; &gt; Yes, there are some blocking bugs [1] and d-i and shim still need some<br>
    &gt; &gt; love, but the state is much better than we remembered from the same<br>
    &gt; &gt; time in buster.<br>
    &gt; <br>
    &gt; As already explained, trying to release in April/May wasn&#39;t quite<br> &gt; anticipated, and there&#39;s still ground to cover on the d-i side.<br>

    Trying to minimize the work load for kibi:<br>
    @kibi: (given there are no objections against this from you?):<br>

    Maybe the release-team could look into the pending unblock issues for d-i<br> in the meantime?<br>
    Most of them should be quite unproblematic, since they only contain translation<br>
    updates.<br>

    A bit more of an issue would be tasksel.<br>
    1. Currently there is 3.65 in sid, which needs to migrate to bullseye.<br>
    2. A problem came up during freeze regarding input methods for several <br>
       languages:<br>
       Starting with bullseye, GNOME depends on ibus, which is not fully<br>
       compatible with the view of some language teams, who would like to<br>
       prefer fcitx. <br>
       The best way to get this situation fixed would require some new<br>
       binary packages to be added to Bullseye (would only be tasks packages,<br>    so no new code/functions to be added!).<br>
       A thread regarding this started at<br>
            <a href="https://lists.debian.org/debian-boot/2021/03/msg00058.html" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">https://lists.debian.org/debian-boot/2021/03/msg00058.html</a><br>
       and the release-team was also added to the loop at some point.<br>
       Maybe release-team could look into this too, and try to make a <br>
       decision?<br>


    Holger<br><br></blockquote><div>&quot;When does the new Debian release come out?&quot; </div><div>&quot;When it&#39;s ready.&quot; </div></div></div>

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  • From Paul Gevers@21:1/5 to Paul Gevers on Wed Apr 21 21:20:02 2021
    XPost: linux.debian.devel.release, linux.debian.maint.boot
    To: debian-release@lists.debian.org (debian-release)
    Copy: press@debian.org
    Copy: debian-cd@lists.debian.org
    Copy: debian-boot@lists.debian.org

    This is an OpenPGP/MIME signed message (RFC 4880 and 3156) --VhcYv50ESipIfhrHTY1K9mWZAjcrTb2QC
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    Hi ftpmasters, Adam,

    On 09-04-2021 20:47, Paul Gevers wrote:
    Dear release team, ftpmasters, press team, cd team, d-i team,

    [...]

    We propose to aim for a release date in May. Would either of the
    following work for you and do you have any preference?
    - May 1
    - May 8
    - May 15
    - May 22
    - May 29

    I've seen replies from Steve for CD, from Donald for Press and Cyril for
    d-i. Can you please let us know if/when you're available?
    May 1 CD, Press
    May 8 CD, Press
    May 15 CD
    May 22 CD, Press
    May 29 (CD)

    [d-i: the later the better]

    Seems like our current best option is May 22 if you can make it.

    Paul






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  • From Ansgar@21:1/5 to Paul Gevers on Wed Apr 21 22:10:02 2021
    XPost: linux.debian.devel.release, linux.debian.maint.boot

    にゃあ!

    On Wed, 2021-04-21 at 21:19 +0200, Paul Gevers wrote:
    Can you please let us know if/when you're available?
    May  1 CD, Press
    May  8 CD, Press
    May 15 CD
    May 22 CD, Press
    May 29 (CD)

    All should be fine for me. It's not like one can do much other
    interesting things currently.

    Ansgar

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  • From Adam D. Barratt@21:1/5 to Paul Gevers on Thu Apr 22 18:30:02 2021
    XPost: linux.debian.devel.release, linux.debian.maint.boot

    [I'm quite behind on list mail in general, and tend to use the BTS for
    tracking / processing SRM work. Direct mail often works better than
    waiting for me to notice list mail]

    On Wed, 2021-04-21 at 21:19 +0200, Paul Gevers wrote:
    I've seen replies from Steve for CD, from Donald for Press and Cyril
    for d-i. Can you please let us know if/when you're available?
    May 1 CD, Press
    May 8 CD, Press
    May 15 CD
    May 22 CD, Press
    May 29 (CD)

    [d-i: the later the better]

    Seems like our current best option is May 22 if you can make it.

    I'm likely to be away for the long weekend at the end of the May (29-
    31) and can't guarantee my availability or access to useful
    connectivity then. The other dates should currently work for me.

    Regards,

    Adam

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  • From Mark Hymers@21:1/5 to All on Fri Apr 23 11:30:02 2021
    XPost: linux.debian.devel.release, linux.debian.maint.boot

    On Wed, 21, Apr, 2021 at 09:19:17PM +0200, Paul Gevers spoke thus..
    I've seen replies from Steve for CD, from Donald for Press and Cyril for
    d-i. Can you please let us know if/when you're available?
    May 1 CD, Press
    May 8 CD, Press
    May 15 CD
    May 22 CD, Press
    May 29 (CD)

    [d-i: the later the better]

    Seems like our current best option is May 22 if you can make it.

    I can help out with ftp-master foo on any of those.

    Mark


    --
    Mark Hymers <mhy at debian dot org>

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  • From Cyril Brulebois@21:1/5 to All on Fri Apr 23 15:20:02 2021
    XPost: linux.debian.devel.release, linux.debian.maint.boot

    Hi,

    Paul Gevers <elbrus@debian.org> (2021-04-21):
    We propose to aim for a release date in May. Would either of the
    following work for you and do you have any preference?
    - May 1
    - May 8
    - May 15
    - May 22
    - May 29

    I've seen replies from Steve for CD, from Donald for Press and Cyril
    for d-i. Can you please let us know if/when you're available?
    May 1 CD, Press
    May 8 CD, Press
    May 15 CD
    May 22 CD, Press
    May 29 (CD)

    [d-i: the later the better]

    My answer wasn't quite meant to state “May is fine”…

    Seems like our current best option is May 22 if you can make it.

    That's definitely not what I would call “best option” from an
    installer point of view.

    D-I Bullseye RC 1 was published a few hours ago. And at the risk of
    sounding like a broken record: I have *absolutely no guarantee* to
    have a fix or workaround for the amdgpu issue in less than a month,
    that would be tested somewhat.

    Can we please *not* release with black screens for AMD users?


    Cheers,
    --
    Cyril Brulebois (kibi@debian.org) <https://debamax.com/>
    D-I release manager -- Release team member -- Freelance Consultant

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  • From Paul Gevers@21:1/5 to Cyril Brulebois on Fri Apr 23 21:30:01 2021
    XPost: linux.debian.devel.release, linux.debian.maint.boot
    Copy: ftpmaster@ftp-master.debian.org
    Copy: debian-release@lists.debian.org (debian-release)
    Copy: press@debian.org
    Copy: debian-cd@lists.debian.org
    Copy: debian-boot@lists.debian.org

    This is an OpenPGP/MIME signed message (RFC 4880 and 3156) --VfySN0ObGLxnfttZQunyIwDstuUt0fkPn
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    Content-Language: en-US
    Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

    Hi Cyril,

    On 23-04-2021 15:13, Cyril Brulebois wrote:
    Seems like our current best option is May 22 if you can make it.

    That's definitely not what I would call “best option” from an
    installer point of view.

    I hear you. So, I fear that we're getting into a situation where
    everything except the installer is more or less ready for the bullseye
    release. (Well assuming the shim is signed any time soon).

    D-I Bullseye RC 1 was published a few hours ago. And at the risk of
    sounding like a broken record: I have *absolutely no guarantee* to
    have a fix or workaround for the amdgpu issue in less than a month,
    that would be tested somewhat.

    Can we please *not* release with black screens for AMD users?

    Indeed, let's not. But can't we get the full Debian community on board
    to search for good solution? I have the feeling there's much interest to release sooner rather than late, so maybe there's brains we can use to
    help the installer forward? I'm going to draft a bits shortly, is there
    a bug number or mail thread we can point at?

    Also, I recognize that the debian-installer is largely handled by you
    alone. I estimate that it's not going to help you on the short term if
    people volunteer to help with the coding as you would be spending time
    on on-boarding them. So, how can we, the Debian Community, help you
    getting the installer in releasable shape? I can think of testing RC1,
    but what else? Do you have the right hardware available for the amdgpu
    issue? Can people try out solutions for you? Tell us, or tell us how to
    find out.

    That said, I still think it's good to keep May 22 in the agenda as an
    option to do the release, with the remark that we'll not release when
    we're not ready (as Debian always does).

    Paul


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  • From Cyril Brulebois@21:1/5 to All on Fri Apr 23 22:40:03 2021
    XPost: linux.debian.devel.release, linux.debian.maint.boot

    Hi Paul,

    Paul Gevers <elbrus@debian.org> (2021-04-23):
    I hear you. So, I fear that we're getting into a situation where
    everything except the installer is more or less ready for the bullseye release. (Well assuming the shim is signed any time soon).

    D-I Bullseye RC 1 was published a few hours ago. And at the risk of sounding like a broken record: I have *absolutely no guarantee* to
    have a fix or workaround for the amdgpu issue in less than a month,
    that would be tested somewhat.

    Can we please *not* release with black screens for AMD users?

    Indeed, let's not. But can't we get the full Debian community on board
    to search for good solution? I have the feeling there's much interest
    to release sooner rather than late, so maybe there's brains we can use
    to help the installer forward? I'm going to draft a bits shortly, is
    there a bug number or mail thread we can point at?

    I've just put out a new release, and I've tried to assemble stuff into
    errata, can I *please* just have some time to look at our bugs, triage
    them, and see what needs be fixed before the bullseye is out?!

    amdgpu is the biggest issue I could think of, for this thread, and for
    errata, but we have other showstoppers apparently. We need *time* to
    stabilize the installer. What really worked last times was iterating
    over as many releases as needed.

    I tried to convey this earlier, but seemed to have failed, so I'll just
    repeat myself: Over the last few release cycles, we've had a *predictable* timing, with no sense of urgency and due date, and I've felt trusted to
    do the right thing all the way.

    It's been a few weeks since I've started to feel like this is getting
    taken away from me. That's not a particular joyful experience, and
    that's also a pretty huge motivation killer.

    Also, I recognize that the debian-installer is largely handled by you
    alone. I estimate that it's not going to help you on the short term if
    people volunteer to help with the coding as you would be spending time
    on on-boarding them. So, how can we, the Debian Community, help you
    getting the installer in releasable shape?

    I'd advise releasing the time pressure, but it seems my pleading for
    exactly that over the last few weeks/months hasn't achieved anything.

    I can think of testing RC1, but what else? Do you have the right
    hardware available for the amdgpu issue? Can people try out solutions
    for you? Tell us, or tell us how to find out.

    No, I don't have any amdgpu hardware at the moment; but yes, I have
    leader@'s checklist handy for when I can allocate some time to plan for
    this.

    That said, I still think it's good to keep May 22 in the agenda as an
    option to do the release, with the remark that we'll not release when
    we're not ready (as Debian always does).

    Getting mixed signals after the initial “I hear you”…


    Cheers,
    --
    Cyril Brulebois (kibi@debian.org) <https://debamax.com/>
    D-I release manager -- Release team member -- Freelance Consultant

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  • From Jonathan Carter@21:1/5 to Cyril Brulebois on Fri Apr 23 23:10:02 2021
    XPost: linux.debian.devel.release, linux.debian.maint.boot

    Hi Cyril

    On 2021/04/23 22:30, Cyril Brulebois wrote:
    No, I don't have any amdgpu hardware at the moment; but yes, I have
    leader@'s checklist handy for when I can allocate some time to plan for
    this.

    I suggest getting a standalone card and laptop (there are some really
    cheap ones with amd GPUs available) as soon as you have a chance and get reimbursement for it.

    I'm trusting the release team to block until d-i is ready, from what I understand the date that they're trying to find in May is just a
    tentative date. Would it also make sense to keep another tentative date
    for June as a back-up? (I'm thinking that it might make it easier to
    plan now than to scramble again in May, but if you feel different then
    that's fine too).

    -Jonathan

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  • From Donald Norwood@21:1/5 to Jonathan Carter on Sat Apr 24 01:00:02 2021
    XPost: linux.debian.devel.release, linux.debian.maint.boot

    On 4/23/21 5:00 PM, Jonathan Carter wrote:


    I'm trusting the release team to block until d-i is ready, from what I understand the date that they're trying to find in May is just a
    tentative date. Would it also make sense to keep another tentative date
    for June as a back-up? (I'm thinking that it might make it easier to
    plan now than to scramble again in May, but if you feel different then
    that's fine too).

    Indeed, from this and the last few posts in the discussion it reads that perhaps June is the better option for the 'timed' ready when ready
    release date.

    I think it would allow for extra care to be given in the areas needed
    and would as Paul suggested allow the larger community to pull together
    to help resolve some of the issues.

    I'd suggest to strike the May 1, 8, and 15th dates and move to:

    May 22
    May 29
    Jun 05
    Jun 12
    Jun 19

    Separately, if there is an area where a non-programmer-coder (NPC, haha)
    can assist perhaps with a set of steps that I can reproduce on my
    equipment here, please point me to it and I'll chip in.


    Be well,

    -Donald



    --
    --
    -
    ⢀⣴⠾⠻⢶⣦⠀
    ⣾⠁⢠⠒⠀⣿⡁ Donald Norwood
    ⢿⡄⠘⠷⠚⠋⠀ B7A1 5F45 5B28 7F38 4174
    ⠈⠳⣄⠀⠀⠀⠀ D5E9 E5EC 4AC9 BD62 7B05

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  • From Holger Wansing@21:1/5 to Cyril Brulebois on Sat Apr 24 09:50:02 2021
    XPost: linux.debian.devel.release, linux.debian.maint.boot

    Hi,

    Cyril Brulebois <kibi@debian.org> wrote (Fri, 23 Apr 2021 15:13:15 +0200):
    D-I Bullseye RC 1 was published a few hours ago. And at the risk of
    sounding like a broken record: I have *absolutely no guarantee* to
    have a fix or workaround for the amdgpu issue in less than a month,
    that would be tested somewhat.

    Can we please *not* release with black screens for AMD users?

    Moreover, it's not just an AMD issue.
    We got a confirmation just now on debian-boot, that also NVIDIA users can
    get affected by this: https://lists.debian.org/debian-boot/2021/04/msg00225.html
    Some months ago, I have confirmed with that user, that missing firmware
    is indeed the issue there!


    Holger

    --
    Holger Wansing <hwansing@mailbox.org>
    PGP-Fingerprint: 496A C6E8 1442 4B34 8508 3529 59F1 87CA 156E B076

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  • From Paul Gevers@21:1/5 to Donald Norwood on Fri May 28 22:20:01 2021
    XPost: linux.debian.maint.boot, linux.debian.devel.release
    To: debian-cd@lists.debian.org
    To: press@debian.org
    To: ftpmaster@ftp-master.debian.org
    To: debian-release@lists.debian.org (debian-release)

    This is an OpenPGP/MIME signed message (RFC 4880 and 3156) --b8rJVxA4rS8uLvqgfzdYEkkaK2Mpi1CWH
    Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8
    Content-Language: en-US
    Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

    Hi all,

    On 24-04-2021 00:41, Donald Norwood wrote:
    Indeed, from this and the last few posts in the discussion it reads that perhaps June is the better option for the 'timed' ready when ready
    release date.

    The progress of fixing the blocking issues in the debian-installer is
    good enough to start thinking again about a tentative bullseye release
    date (see for more details in the quote below). Assuming all goes well
    with RC2 and RC3, we'd be looking at the following candidate release dates:

    26 June
    3 July
    10 July
    17 July
    24 July

    Can you let us know which date work for you and which don't?

    I think it would allow for extra care to be given in the areas needed
    and would as Paul suggested allow the larger community to pull
    together to help resolve some of the issues.

    The installer team needs everybody's help to test the d-i release
    candidates, to see if the issues that are being solved now are handled correctly across as many different machines as possible. If anybody has
    better ideas than the wiki page that kibi suggested in his e-mail below,
    then let us know. Otherwise I'll probably see if I can set up something
    like that shortly.

    Paul

    -------- Forwarded Message --------
    Date: Fri, 28 May 2021 02:10:14 +0200
    From: Cyril Brulebois <kibi@debian.org>

    [...]

    Right, I think I have a better grasp on where we stand. I haven't dug
    into each and every mail from debian-boot@, but it feels like people are generally happy with the installer in RC1 *provided* they don't run into
    the graphical installer hangs or issues at reboot time (due to firmware
    stuff).

    I have a few other topics that we may want to fix (serial console on
    s390x, problems on PowerPC, support for HTTPS, etc.) but that could be
    fixed in 11.1 or 11.n…

    Hangs in the graphical installer should be under control, even if it
    took quite some time and iterations and testing to figure that out for
    real. Firmware stuff is the next big item on my list.

    I've floated the idea of an RC2 in the next few days so that people
    could test the installer without fearing the hangs (and hopefully
    without finding new ones) but was waiting on linux to migrate, but some security issues came up and Salvatore would like to get 5.10.40 into
    testing instead, so it might be ready by next week-end (June 5-6)?

    I should be able to work on firmware stuff while waiting on the kernel
    to be ready. I'm mainly worried about the many hardware setups out there
    and having something that works for some machines locally might not be representative of what users are going to face.

    Provided I get a PoC ready in the right timing, and debian-cd people
    are available, we might be able to have something like the following:
    - RC2: June 5-6 (fixing hangs in graphical installer in particular)
    - RC3: June 12-13 (firmware PoC)

    The RC2 announcement (and maybe some help from publicity team) could be
    the right place to let people know we expect problems with firmware, and
    ask them to keep an eye on the RC3 that should feature an attempt at
    fixing it. Maybe setting up some wikipage where people could register
    their hardware and what they experience with the “stock” RC2, and where they could follow up with their experience with the “patched” RC3. There might be better tools for that, but I'm more used to pinging a submitter
    (or two or three) on a bug report than to collecting info from lots of people…

    If feedback from RC3 is good enough, we might call that RC sufficient to
    be the installer for 11.0, and think about a release by the end of June.
    We could refine it further still, e.g. by merging translation updates as
    what I have in mind would involve presenting users some information,
    which would require translation, but that's just a matter of uploading
    the right package with new/updated po files (the hard part is getting
    the actual translations, but we could think of merging those again in
    11.1, 11.2, etc.).

    All that is rather optimistic (which I can try to be sometimes…),
    and I
    fear we might need to iterate a little, and I'm not sure how quickly
    we would get actionable feedback from users… If we were to hit real difficulties, maybe shift that “end of June” a few weeks,
    and call that
    “mid-July”?

    [...]




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  • From Andrew M.A. Cater@21:1/5 to Paul Gevers on Sat May 29 11:50:02 2021
    On Fri, May 28, 2021 at 10:17:55PM +0200, Paul Gevers wrote:
    Hi all,

    On 24-04-2021 00:41, Donald Norwood wrote:
    Indeed, from this and the last few posts in the discussion it reads that perhaps June is the better option for the 'timed' ready when ready
    release date.

    The progress of fixing the blocking issues in the debian-installer is
    good enough to start thinking again about a tentative bullseye release
    date (see for more details in the quote below). Assuming all goes well
    with RC2 and RC3, we'd be looking at the following candidate release dates:

    26 June
    3 July
    10 July
    17 July
    24 July

    Any of the above, I think - I only help with the image testing anyway - I
    hang around with the smart people like a rock drummer hangs around with musicians.

    Andy C.

    Can you let us know which date work for you and which don't?

    I think it would allow for extra care to be given in the areas needed
    and would as Paul suggested allow the larger community to pull
    together to help resolve some of the issues.

    The installer team needs everybody's help to test the d-i release
    candidates, to see if the issues that are being solved now are handled correctly across as many different machines as possible. If anybody has better ideas than the wiki page that kibi suggested in his e-mail below,
    then let us know. Otherwise I'll probably see if I can set up something
    like that shortly.


    ACK This is really important and we can always do with testers and good installation reports.

    Paul


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  • From Steve McIntyre@21:1/5 to Paul Gevers on Sat May 29 15:20:01 2021
    XPost: linux.debian.maint.boot, linux.debian.devel.release

    Hey Paul!

    On Fri, May 28, 2021 at 10:17:55PM +0200, Paul Gevers wrote:

    On 24-04-2021 00:41, Donald Norwood wrote:
    Indeed, from this and the last few posts in the discussion it reads that
    perhaps June is the better option for the 'timed' ready when ready
    release date.

    The progress of fixing the blocking issues in the debian-installer is
    good enough to start thinking again about a tentative bullseye release
    date (see for more details in the quote below). Assuming all goes well
    with RC2 and RC3, we'd be looking at the following candidate release dates:

    26 June
    3 July
    10 July
    17 July
    24 July

    Can you let us know which date work for you and which don't?

    Apologies - I'm unavailable for the first three of those. I can do the
    17th and 24th of July just fine.

    I think it would allow for extra care to be given in the areas needed
    and would as Paul suggested allow the larger community to pull
    together to help resolve some of the issues.

    The installer team needs everybody's help to test the d-i release
    candidates, to see if the issues that are being solved now are handled >correctly across as many different machines as possible. If anybody has >better ideas than the wiki page that kibi suggested in his e-mail below,
    then let us know. Otherwise I'll probably see if I can set up something
    like that shortly.

    Paul

    --
    Steve McIntyre, Cambridge, UK. steve@einval.com You raise the blade, you make the change... You re-arrange me 'til I'm sane...

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Paul Gevers@21:1/5 to Donald Norwood on Sun May 30 09:10:01 2021
    XPost: linux.debian.maint.boot, linux.debian.devel.release
    To: debian-cd@lists.debian.org
    To: press@debian.org
    To: ftpmaster@ftp-master.debian.org
    To: debian-release@lists.debian.org (debian-release)

    This is an OpenPGP/MIME signed message (RFC 4880 and 3156) --d8QWVYDteszAdfP9THf7e0oG5AFt54CkS
    Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8
    Content-Language: en-US
    Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

    Hi,

    On 30-05-2021 06:35, Donald Norwood wrote:
    On 5/29/21 9:12 AM, Steve McIntyre wrote:
    On Fri, May 28, 2021 at 10:17:55PM +0200, Paul Gevers wrote:
    Assuming all goes well
    with RC2 and RC3, we'd be looking at the following candidate release dates: >>>
    26 June
    3 July
    10 July
    17 July
    24 July

    Can you let us know which date work for you and which don't?

    [Steve]
    I can do the
    17th and 24th of July just fine.

    Asking a question I think most people know the answer to, but CD without
    Steve is no option? Don't get me wrong, I don't want to push otherwise,
    but I just want to understand the options. So much in Debian is based on "rituals", it's not always clear what's needed and what is just (nearly)
    always done in a certain way.

    [Press]
    Press can do both the 17th and the 24th. Perhaps we add an additional 3 dates?

    Yes, let's do that, so the list becomes:

    26 June
    3 July
    10 July
    17 July [Steve (CD), press]
    24 July [Steve (CD), press]
    31 July
    7 August
    14 August

    Paul


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  • From Andrew M.A. Cater@21:1/5 to Paul Gevers on Sun May 30 17:50:01 2021
    On Sun, May 30, 2021 at 09:09:28AM +0200, Paul Gevers wrote:
    Hi,

    On 30-05-2021 06:35, Donald Norwood wrote:
    On 5/29/21 9:12 AM, Steve McIntyre wrote:
    On Fri, May 28, 2021 at 10:17:55PM +0200, Paul Gevers wrote:
    Assuming all goes well
    with RC2 and RC3, we'd be looking at the following candidate release dates:

    26 June
    3 July
    10 July
    17 July
    24 July

    Can you let us know which date work for you and which don't?

    [Steve]
    I can do the
    17th and 24th of July just fine.

    Asking a question I think most people know the answer to, but CD without Steve is no option? Don't get me wrong, I don't want to push otherwise,
    but I just want to understand the options. So much in Debian is based on "rituals", it's not always clear what's needed and what is just (nearly) always done in a certain way.

    [Press]
    Press can do both the 17th and the 24th. Perhaps we add an additional 3 dates?

    Yes, let's do that, so the list becomes:

    26 June
    3 July
    10 July
    17 July [Steve (CD), press]
    24 July [Steve (CD), press]
    31 July
    7 August
    14 August

    Paul

    Images without Steve is _just_ about do-able. [RattusRattus is understudy and has been doing much of hte work as Steve's deputy for the last couple of
    Buster point releases - but yes, Steve is incredibly useful as the person
    who knows / has seen problems before / can hack up fixes mid-point-release].

    Not by any chance something we'd want to do at any point, but if the next meteor were to hit OMGWTFBBQ centrally we might just about be able to cope.

    Andy C.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Steve McIntyre@21:1/5 to Paul Gevers on Sun May 30 18:50:02 2021
    XPost: linux.debian.maint.boot, linux.debian.devel.release

    On Sun, May 30, 2021 at 09:09:28AM +0200, Paul Gevers wrote:
    On 30-05-2021 06:35, Donald Norwood wrote:
    On 5/29/21 9:12 AM, Steve McIntyre wrote:
    On Fri, May 28, 2021 at 10:17:55PM +0200, Paul Gevers wrote:
    Assuming all goes well
    with RC2 and RC3, we'd be looking at the following candidate release dates:

    26 June
    3 July
    10 July
    17 July
    24 July

    Can you let us know which date work for you and which don't?

    [Steve]
    I can do the
    17th and 24th of July just fine.

    Asking a question I think most people know the answer to, but CD without >Steve is no option? Don't get me wrong, I don't want to push otherwise,
    but I just want to understand the options. So much in Debian is based on >"rituals", it's not always clear what's needed and what is just (nearly) >always done in a certain way.

    We've been slowly working up to getting other people able to do image
    releases, but I don't think we're *quite* there yet. Maybe on the next
    point release Andy could do it all without me watching and helping,
    but we want to work that out and I'm not sure a new major release is
    the right time to try this!

    Thinking about things some more, the 10th July is more of a "maybe"
    than a "no" - I'll be driving home from a vacation that day and
    available later in the day. We could possibly fit things in around
    that.

    [Press]
    Press can do both the 17th and the 24th. Perhaps we add an additional 3
    dates?

    Yes, let's do that, so the list becomes:

    26 June
    3 July
    10 July
    17 July [Steve (CD), press]
    24 July [Steve (CD), press]
    31 July [Steve (CD)]
    7 August [Steve (CD)]
    14 August [Steve (CD)]

    I'm available for the later 3, no problems.

    --
    Steve McIntyre, Cambridge, UK. steve@einval.com < liw> everything I know about UK hotels I learned from "Fawlty Towers"

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Ansgar@21:1/5 to Paul Gevers on Tue Jun 1 15:10:01 2021
    XPost: linux.debian.maint.boot, linux.debian.devel.release

    On Sun, 2021-05-30 at 09:09 +0200, Paul Gevers wrote:
    26 June
    3 July
    10 July
    17 July [Steve (CD), press]
    24 July [Steve (CD), press]
    31 July
    7 August
    14 August

    Currently all of these are fine for me.

    Ansgar

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Sebastian Ramacher@21:1/5 to Paul Gevers on Wed Jun 2 23:30:02 2021
    XPost: linux.debian.maint.boot, linux.debian.devel.release

    On 2021-05-30 09:09:28 +0200, Paul Gevers wrote:
    [Press]
    Press can do both the 17th and the 24th. Perhaps we add an additional 3 dates?

    Yes, let's do that, so the list becomes:

    26 June
    3 July
    10 July
    17 July [Steve (CD), press]
    24 July [Steve (CD), press]
    31 July
    7 August
    14 August

    I can be around on

    3 July
    24 July
    31 July
    7 August
    14 august

    Cheers
    --
    Sebastian Ramacher

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  • From Paul Gevers@21:1/5 to Paul Gevers on Fri Jun 4 06:50:02 2021
    XPost: linux.debian.maint.boot, linux.debian.devel.release
    To: debian-cd@lists.debian.org
    To: press@debian.org
    To: ftpmaster@ftp-master.debian.org
    To: debian-release@lists.debian.org (debian-release)

    This is an OpenPGP/MIME signed message (RFC 4880 and 3156) --u6qTEHyoWYSdrFESmCtqM7Oq9vltDG5Qg
    Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8
    Content-Language: en-US
    Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

    Hi all,

    On 30-05-2021 09:09, Paul Gevers wrote:
    26 June
    3 July
    10 July
    17 July [Steve (CD), press]
    24 July [Steve (CD), press]
    31 July
    7 August
    14 August

    This can now be updated to:

    26 June [Ansgar (ftp)]
    3 July [Ansgar (ftp), Sebastian (release), Paul (release)]
    10 July [Steve (CD) MAYBE , Ansgar (ftp), Paul (release)]
    17 July [Steve (CD), press, Ansgar (ftp), Paul (release)]
    24 July [Steve (CD), press, Ansgar (ftp), Sebastian (release)]
    31 July [Steve (CD), press, Ansgar (ftp), Sebastian (release)]
    7 August [Steve (CD), press, Ansgar (ftp), Sebastian (release)]
    14 August [Steve (CD), press, Ansgar (ftp), Sebastian (release)]

    For those following along on IRC, we still have to figure out who from
    the release team that has access to the keys can join (if only for the signing). I hope we can update you on that shortly.

    On 30-05-2021 18:48, Steve McIntyre wrote:
    We've been slowly working up to getting other people able to do image releases, but I don't think we're *quite* there yet. Maybe on the next
    point release Andy could do it all without me watching and helping,
    but we want to work that out and I'm not sure a new major release is
    the right time to try this!

    Again, without wanting to push, as we now have a point release before
    any of the mentioned dates, would any of the earlier dates be still a possibility from CD point of view? Andy, are you available? Donald, did
    you look at the earlier days and is press not available, or didn't you
    bother because of Steve's availability?

    Paul

    PS: I'm starting to realize I may feel uncomfortably direct for some people/cultures. The Dutch are known for it (some call it rude).
    Probably because I was raised like that, I don't want to read peoples
    mind, I rather hear what they mean.


    --u6qTEHyoWYSdrFESmCtqM7Oq9vltDG5Qg--

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  • From Adam D. Barratt@21:1/5 to Paul Gevers on Fri Jun 4 16:50:02 2021
    XPost: linux.debian.maint.boot, linux.debian.devel.release

    On Sun, 2021-05-30 at 09:09 +0200, Paul Gevers wrote:
    26 June
    3 July
    10 July
    17 July [Steve (CD), press]
    24 July [Steve (CD), press]
    31 July
    7 August
    14 August

    July 17th doesn't work well for me unfortunately*.

    The others currently all look OK, although I'd prefer not to do two
    releases in a row, so with 10.10 being on the 19th the 26th isn't
    great.

    Regards,

    Adam


    * it _could_, but I have a prior appointment around lunchtime on the
    Saturday and don't know whether I'd be able to continue after that
    (including on Sunday), so it wouldn't be fair to any of us to risk it

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Paul Gevers@21:1/5 to Paul Gevers on Sun Jun 6 20:10:02 2021
    XPost: linux.debian.maint.boot, linux.debian.devel.release
    To: debian-cd@lists.debian.org
    To: press@debian.org
    To: ftpmaster@ftp-master.debian.org
    To: debian-release@lists.debian.org (debian-release)

    This is an OpenPGP/MIME signed message (RFC 4880 and 3156) --JkIGi1sVJigQO49cgbfGBlZSK6g5yFrp3
    Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8
    Content-Language: en-US
    Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

    Hi all,

    On 04-06-2021 06:49, Paul Gevers wrote:
    26 June [Ansgar (ftp)]
    3 July [Ansgar (ftp), Sebastian (release), Paul (release)]
    10 July [Steve (CD) MAYBE , Ansgar (ftp), Paul (release)]
    17 July [Steve (CD), press, Ansgar (ftp), Paul (release)]
    24 July [Steve (CD), press, Ansgar (ftp), Sebastian (release)]
    31 July [Steve (CD), press, Ansgar (ftp), Sebastian (release)]
    7 August [Steve (CD), press, Ansgar (ftp), Sebastian (release)]
    14 August [Steve (CD), press, Ansgar (ftp), Sebastian (release)]

    With the availability of Adam now known (and some off-list info), we have:

    26 June
    [Ansgar (ftp), Sebastian (release), Adam (release)]
    3 July
    [Ansgar (ftp), Paul (release), Adam (release)]
    10 July
    [Steve (CD) MAYBE , Ansgar (ftp), Paul (release), Adam (release),
    Graham (release)]
    17 July
    [Steve (CD), press, Ansgar (ftp), Paul (release)]
    24 July
    [Steve (CD), press, Ansgar (ftp), Sebastian (release), Adam (release),
    Graham (release)]
    31 July
    [Steve (CD), press, Ansgar (ftp), Sebastian (release), Adam (release)]
    7 August
    [Steve (CD), press, Ansgar (ftp), Sebastian (release), Adam (release)]
    14 August
    [Steve (CD), press, Ansgar (ftp), Sebastian (release), Adam (release)]

    So, what to pick? We still believe that shorter freezes are better for
    the Debian community as a whole, so Steve can you look at turning your
    maybe on 10 July into a "lets go for this"? If the answer is no, than
    lets pick 24 July as the *tentative* release date.

    Regardless of which of the two we pick, I propose we decide two weeks
    before if it's going to be final.

    And, relevant for every maintainer of non-key packages without passing autopkgtests, the full freeze will start two weeks before the
    *tentative* release. The means that, with traditionally the last week
    being totally frozen, the last week that packages can migrate *all*
    packages need manual unblocks by the release team.

    Paul



    --JkIGi1sVJigQO49cgbfGBlZSK6g5yFrp3--

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  • From Paul Gevers@21:1/5 to Paul Gevers on Mon Jun 7 20:40:02 2021
    XPost: linux.debian.maint.boot, linux.debian.devel.release
    To: debian-cd@lists.debian.org
    To: press@debian.org
    To: ftpmaster@ftp-master.debian.org
    To: debian-release@lists.debian.org (debian-release)

    This is an OpenPGP/MIME signed message (RFC 4880 and 3156) --MpQ4FDgtSPBukLh356miOjCwUE2Xa5W8f
    Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8
    Content-Language: en-US
    Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

    Hi all,

    On 06-06-2021 20:03, Paul Gevers wrote:
    With the availability of Adam now known (and some off-list info), we have:

    26 June
    [Ansgar (ftp), Sebastian (release), Adam (release)]
    3 July
    [Ansgar (ftp), Paul (release), Adam (release)]
    10 July
    [Steve (CD) MAYBE , Ansgar (ftp), Paul (release), Adam (release),
    Graham (release)]
    17 July
    [Steve (CD), press, Ansgar (ftp), Paul (release)]
    24 July
    [Steve (CD), press, Ansgar (ftp), Sebastian (release), Adam (release),
    Graham (release)]
    31 July
    [Steve (CD), press, Ansgar (ftp), Sebastian (release), Adam (release)]
    7 August
    [Steve (CD), press, Ansgar (ftp), Sebastian (release), Adam (release)]
    14 August
    [Steve (CD), press, Ansgar (ftp), Sebastian (release), Adam (release)]

    So, what to pick? We still believe that shorter freezes are better for
    the Debian community as a whole, so Steve can you look at turning your
    maybe on 10 July into a "lets go for this"? If the answer is no, than
    lets pick 24 July as the *tentative* release date.

    Nevermind 10 July. Steve, you can stop contemplating about it. We'll go
    for 24 July as the *tentative* release date.

    Regardless of which of the two we pick, I propose we decide two weeks
    before if it's going to be final.

    So, we'll decide around 10 July.

    And, relevant for every maintainer of non-key packages without passing autopkgtests, the full freeze will start two weeks before the
    *tentative* release. The means that, with traditionally the last week
    being totally frozen, the last week that packages can migrate *all*
    packages need manual unblocks by the release team.

    And the Full Freeze will start on 10 July too.

    Paul


    --MpQ4FDgtSPBukLh356miOjCwUE2Xa5W8f--

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  • From Adam D. Barratt@21:1/5 to Paul Gevers on Mon Jun 7 23:10:02 2021
    XPost: linux.debian.maint.boot, linux.debian.devel.release

    On Mon, 2021-06-07 at 20:38 +0200, Paul Gevers wrote:
    Hi all,

    On 06-06-2021 20:03, Paul Gevers wrote:
    With the availability of Adam now known (and some off-list info),
    we have:

    [...]
    So, what to pick? We still believe that shorter freezes are better
    for
    the Debian community as a whole, so Steve can you look at turning
    your
    maybe on 10 July into a "lets go for this"? If the answer is no,
    than
    lets pick 24 July as the *tentative* release date.

    Nevermind 10 July. Steve, you can stop contemplating about it. We'll
    go for 24 July as the *tentative* release date.

    Unfortunately I've just discovered that I was given the wrong date for
    a family event, so I'm actually going to be AFK for most of the 24th.
    :-(

    Apologies for sticking a slight spanner in the works at this stage.

    Adam

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
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  • From Andy Simpkins@21:1/5 to Paul Gevers on Mon Jun 7 23:10:02 2021
    This is an OpenPGP/MIME signed message (RFC 4880 and 3156) --hjgiepR1gUn28JHnZ8nujp2rMvau3VLwM
    Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8
    Content-Language: en-GB
    Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

    On 07/06/21 19:38, Paul Gevers wrote:
    Hi all,

    On 06-06-2021 20:03, Paul Gevers wrote:
    With the availability of Adam now known (and some off-list info), we have: >>
    26 June
    [Ansgar (ftp), Sebastian (release), Adam (release)]
    3 July
    [Ansgar (ftp), Paul (release), Adam (release)]
    10 July
    [Steve (CD) MAYBE , Ansgar (ftp), Paul (release), Adam (release),
    Graham (release)]
    17 July
    [Steve (CD), press, Ansgar (ftp), Paul (release)]
    24 July
    [Steve (CD), press, Ansgar (ftp), Sebastian (release), Adam (release),
    Graham (release)]
    31 July
    [Steve (CD), press, Ansgar (ftp), Sebastian (release), Adam (release)]
    7 August
    [Steve (CD), press, Ansgar (ftp), Sebastian (release), Adam (release)]
    14 August
    [Steve (CD), press, Ansgar (ftp), Sebastian (release), Adam (release)]

    So, what to pick? We still believe that shorter freezes are better for
    the Debian community as a whole, so Steve can you look at turning your
    maybe on 10 July into a "lets go for this"? If the answer is no, than
    lets pick 24 July as the *tentative* release date.

    Nevermind 10 July. Steve, you can stop contemplating about it. We'll go
    for 24 July as the *tentative* release date.

    Regardless of which of the two we pick, I propose we decide two weeks
    before if it's going to be final.

    So, we'll decide around 10 July.

    And, relevant for every maintainer of non-key packages without passing
    autopkgtests, the full freeze will start two weeks before the
    *tentative* release. The means that, with traditionally the last week
    being totally frozen, the last week that packages can migrate *all*
    packages need manual unblocks by the release team.

    And the Full Freeze will start on 10 July too.

    Paul


    26 June sorry No.
    I can do any of the other dates.
    I am not able to complete the images (I don't have, nor feel ready for
    access to, the signing key just yet) but can start the process and keep
    things going with smoke testing if Steve would be available in the
    evening...

    /Andy


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  • From Andy Simpkins@21:1/5 to Adam D. Barratt on Tue Jun 8 18:20:03 2021
    On 07/06/2021 22:08, Adam D. Barratt wrote:
    On Mon, 2021-06-07 at 20:38 +0200, Paul Gevers wrote:
    Hi all,

    On 06-06-2021 20:03, Paul Gevers wrote:
    With the availability of Adam now known (and some off-list info),
    we have:

    [...]
    So, what to pick? We still believe that shorter freezes are better
    for
    the Debian community as a whole, so Steve can you look at turning
    your
    maybe on 10 July into a "lets go for this"? If the answer is no,
    than
    lets pick 24 July as the *tentative* release date.
    Nevermind 10 July. Steve, you can stop contemplating about it. We'll
    go for 24 July as the *tentative* release date.
    Unfortunately I've just discovered that I was given the wrong date for
    a family event, so I'm actually going to be AFK for most of the 24th.
    :-(

    Apologies for sticking a slight spanner in the works at this stage.

    Adam



    Hi Guys

    Just spotted this.

    If we need to change away from the 24th July I am sorry but I shall no
    longer be available on the 10th (Isy has admissions planning visit for
    6th form collage)


    Sorry if this breaks things (again)

    /Andy

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Paul Gevers@21:1/5 to Adam D. Barratt on Tue Jun 8 21:00:01 2021
    XPost: linux.debian.maint.boot, linux.debian.devel.release
    To: debian-cd@lists.debian.org
    To: press@debian.org
    To: ftpmaster@ftp-master.debian.org
    To: debian-release@lists.debian.org (debian-release)

    This is an OpenPGP/MIME signed message (RFC 4880 and 3156) --HNxXIre4Fl42sgHK59yjRNpO42N626Xt5
    Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8
    Content-Language: en-US
    Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

    Hi all again,

    On 07-06-2021 23:08, Adam D. Barratt wrote:
    On Mon, 2021-06-07 at 20:38 +0200, Paul Gevers wrote:
    Nevermind 10 July. Steve, you can stop contemplating about it. We'll
    go for 24 July as the *tentative* release date.

    Unfortunately I've just discovered that I was given the wrong date for
    a family event, so I'm actually going to be AFK for most of the 24th.
    :-(

    Apologies for sticking a slight spanner in the works at this stage.

    Those things happen. It's the price we pay for our bus factors (which we
    should fix/are fixing).

    So, if I did all the booking right (including updates from IRC) we now have:

    26 June
    [Ansgar (ftp), Sebastian (release), Adam (release)]
    3 July
    [Ansgar (ftp), Paul (release), Adam (release)]
    10 July
    [Steve + Andy (CD), Paul (release), Adam (release), Graham (release)]
    17 July
    [Steve (CD), press, Ansgar (ftp), Paul (release)]
    24 July
    [Steve (CD), press, Ansgar (ftp), Sebastian (release),
    Graham (release)]
    31 July
    [Steve (CD), press, Ansgar (ftp), Sebastian (release), Adam (release)]
    7 August
    [Steve (CD), press, Ansgar (ftp), Sebastian (release), Adam (release)]
    14 August
    [Steve (CD), press, Ansgar (ftp), Sebastian (release), Adam (release)]

    The first available date is 31 July, so let's shift all my dates another
    week.
    17 July: Hard Freeze & confirmation of the release date
    31 July: ** tentative ** release date

    Paul


    --HNxXIre4Fl42sgHK59yjRNpO42N626Xt5--

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  • From Steve McIntyre@21:1/5 to Paul Gevers on Tue Jun 8 21:50:02 2021
    XPost: linux.debian.maint.boot, linux.debian.devel.release

    On Tue, Jun 08, 2021 at 08:50:55PM +0200, Paul Gevers wrote:

    So, if I did all the booking right (including updates from IRC) we now have:

    26 June
    [Ansgar (ftp), Sebastian (release), Adam (release)]
    3 July
    [Ansgar (ftp), Paul (release), Adam (release)]
    10 July
    [Steve + Andy (CD), Paul (release), Adam (release), Graham (release)]
    17 July
    [Steve (CD), press, Ansgar (ftp), Paul (release)]
    24 July
    [Steve (CD), press, Ansgar (ftp), Sebastian (release),
    Graham (release)]
    31 July
    [Steve (CD), press, Ansgar (ftp), Sebastian (release), Adam (release)]
    7 August
    [Steve (CD), press, Ansgar (ftp), Sebastian (release), Adam (release)]
    14 August
    [Steve (CD), press, Ansgar (ftp), Sebastian (release), Adam (release)]

    The first available date is 31 July, so let's shift all my dates another >week.
    17 July: Hard Freeze & confirmation of the release date
    31 July: ** tentative ** release date

    Cool, works for me. Pencilled into my calendar now. :-)

    --
    Steve McIntyre, Cambridge, UK. steve@einval.com < sladen> I actually stayed in a hotel and arrived to find a post-it
    note stuck to the mini-bar saying "Paul: This fridge and
    fittings are the correct way around and do not need altering"

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Andy Simpkins@21:1/5 to Paul Gevers on Tue Jun 8 22:30:03 2021
    On 08/06/2021 19:50, Paul Gevers wrote:
    Hi all again,

    On 07-06-2021 23:08, Adam D. Barratt wrote:
    On Mon, 2021-06-07 at 20:38 +0200, Paul Gevers wrote:
    Nevermind 10 July. Steve, you can stop contemplating about it. We'll
    go for 24 July as the *tentative* release date.
    Unfortunately I've just discovered that I was given the wrong date for
    a family event, so I'm actually going to be AFK for most of the 24th.
    :-(

    Apologies for sticking a slight spanner in the works at this stage.
    Those things happen. It's the price we pay for our bus factors (which we should fix/are fixing).

    So, if I did all the booking right (including updates from IRC) we now have:

    26 June
    [Ansgar (ftp), Sebastian (release), Adam (release)]
    3 July
    [Ansgar (ftp), Paul (release), Adam (release)]
    10 July
    [Steve + Andy (CD), Paul (release), Adam (release), Graham (release)]
    17 July
    [Steve (CD), press, Ansgar (ftp), Paul (release)]
    24 July
    [Steve (CD), press, Ansgar (ftp), Sebastian (release),
    Graham (release)]
    31 July
    [Steve (CD), press, Ansgar (ftp), Sebastian (release), Adam (release)]
    7 August
    [Steve (CD), press, Ansgar (ftp), Sebastian (release), Adam (release)]
    14 August
    [Steve (CD), press, Ansgar (ftp), Sebastian (release), Adam (release)]

    The first available date is 31 July, so let's shift all my dates another week.
    17 July: Hard Freeze & confirmation of the release date
    31 July: ** tentative ** release date

    Paul


    Ack.  31st July in calendar

    /Andy

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Paul Gevers@21:1/5 to Steve McIntyre on Sun Jul 11 21:20:01 2021
    XPost: linux.debian.maint.boot, linux.debian.devel.release
    To: debian-cd@lists.debian.org
    To: press@debian.org
    To: ftpmaster@ftp-master.debian.org
    To: debian-release@lists.debian.org (debian-release)
    Copy: dsa@debian.org

    This is an OpenPGP/MIME signed message (RFC 4880 and 3156) --SpNNfyrJbpwl8KKO8bP0kt2H1uTudhiA6
    Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8
    Content-Language: en-US
    Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

    Hi all,

    On 08-06-2021 21:30, Steve McIntyre wrote:
    On Tue, Jun 08, 2021 at 08:50:55PM +0200, Paul Gevers wrote:
    31 July: ** tentative ** release date

    Cool, works for me. Pencilled into my calendar now. :-)

    With less than three weeks to go until the tentative release date, I
    would love to confirm the date by now, but there is a serious issue with crucial infrastructure (cdbuilder.d.o). Apart from this issue (and what
    it means for solving the debian-installer blocking issues in time), I'm
    not aware of other blocking issues, so let's hope the teams involved can recover in time.

    We'll keep you posted as we learn more.

    Paul


    --SpNNfyrJbpwl8KKO8bP0kt2H1uTudhiA6--

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    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
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  • From Paul Gevers@21:1/5 to Paul Gevers on Sat Jul 17 22:30:01 2021
    XPost: linux.debian.maint.boot, linux.debian.devel.release
    To: debian-cd@lists.debian.org
    To: press@debian.org
    To: ftpmaster@ftp-master.debian.org
    To: debian-release@lists.debian.org (debian-release)
    Copy: dsa@debian.org

    This is an OpenPGP/MIME signed message (RFC 4880 and 3156) --nsESok2rmkttkSCHjtMUiy6B7qSXrjCEw
    Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8
    Content-Language: en-US
    Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

    Hi all,

    On 11-07-2021 21:11, Paul Gevers wrote:
    With less than three weeks to go until the tentative release date, I
    would love to confirm the date by now, but there is a serious issue with crucial infrastructure (cdbuilder.d.o). Apart from this issue (and what
    it means for solving the debian-installer blocking issues in time), I'm
    not aware of other blocking issues, so let's hope the teams involved can recover in time.

    Albeit there is some progress, we think it better for the people
    involved to now say that we will *not* release on July 31.

    Unfortunately, that means that we have to start looking for a new date
    again. Assuming what we'll learn in the upcoming week or two is good, I
    propose to already start the list below with two weeks after the
    previous date. Upcoming time is around DebConf, I can imagine it could
    even be an advantage, especially as that's on-line, let's see.

    14 August (day before DebCamp)
    21 August (last day of DebCamp)
    RT: elbrus
    28 August (DebConf)
    RT: elbrus
    4 September
    RT: elbrus
    11 September:
    RT: elbrus

    Paul


    --nsESok2rmkttkSCHjtMUiy6B7qSXrjCEw--

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    =h+7A
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    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
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  • From Steve McIntyre@21:1/5 to Paul Gevers on Sat Jul 17 23:00:02 2021
    XPost: linux.debian.maint.boot, linux.debian.devel.release

    On Sat, Jul 17, 2021 at 10:25:17PM +0200, Paul Gevers wrote:
    Hi all,

    On 11-07-2021 21:11, Paul Gevers wrote:
    With less than three weeks to go until the tentative release date, I
    would love to confirm the date by now, but there is a serious issue with
    crucial infrastructure (cdbuilder.d.o). Apart from this issue (and what
    it means for solving the debian-installer blocking issues in time), I'm
    not aware of other blocking issues, so let's hope the teams involved can
    recover in time.

    Albeit there is some progress, we think it better for the people
    involved to now say that we will *not* release on July 31.

    Unfortunately, that means that we have to start looking for a new date
    again. Assuming what we'll learn in the upcoming week or two is good, I >propose to already start the list below with two weeks after the
    previous date. Upcoming time is around DebConf, I can imagine it could
    even be an advantage, especially as that's on-line, let's see.

    14 August (day before DebCamp)

    Works for me for images team

    21 August (last day of DebCamp)
    RT: elbrus

    Awkward - wife has plans for us that evening.

    28 August (DebConf)
    RT: elbrus

    Debian UK BBQ, argh

    4 September
    RT: elbrus

    Works fine for me

    11 September:
    RT: elbrus

    That's the week of my wedding anniversary, I'll be on VAC.

    --
    Steve McIntyre, Cambridge, UK. steve@einval.com "We're the technical experts. We were hired so that management could
    ignore our recommendations and tell us how to do our jobs." -- Mike Andrews

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Donald Norwood@21:1/5 to Steve McIntyre on Sun Jul 18 02:00:02 2021
    XPost: linux.debian.maint.boot, linux.debian.devel.release

    Hi!

    On 7/17/21 4:58 PM, Steve McIntyre wrote:
    On Sat, Jul 17, 2021 at 10:25:17PM +0200, Paul Gevers wrote:
    Hi all,

    On 11-07-2021 21:11, Paul Gevers wrote:
    With less than three weeks to go until the tentative release date, I
    would love to confirm the date by now, but there is a serious issue with >>> crucial infrastructure (cdbuilder.d.o). Apart from this issue (and what
    it means for solving the debian-installer blocking issues in time), I'm
    not aware of other blocking issues, so let's hope the teams involved can >>> recover in time.

    Albeit there is some progress, we think it better for the people
    involved to now say that we will *not* release on July 31.

    Unfortunately, that means that we have to start looking for a new date
    again. Assuming what we'll learn in the upcoming week or two is good, I
    propose to already start the list below with two weeks after the
    previous date. Upcoming time is around DebConf, I can imagine it could
    even be an advantage, especially as that's on-line, let's see.

    14 August (day before DebCamp)
    Doable.

    Works for me for images team

    21 August (last day of DebCamp)
    RT: elbrus

    Awkward - wife has plans for us that evening.
    Half of the press team is available this day so it is not ideal.

    28 August (DebConf)
    RT: elbrus

    Debian UK BBQ, argh

    4 September
    RT: elbrus
    Labor day weekend in the U.S. Not a good weekend.

    Works fine for me

    11 September:
    RT: elbrus

    That's the week of my wedding anniversary, I'll be on VAC.
    Happy Anniversary!

    Could we put forth September 18th? We are good for that day without any
    issues.


    --
    --
    -
    ⢀⣴⠾⠻⢶⣦⠀
    ⣾⠁⢠⠒⠀⣿⡁ Donald Norwood
    ⢿⡄⠘⠷⠚⠋⠀ B7A1 5F45 5B28 7F38 4174
    ⠈⠳⣄⠀⠀⠀⠀ D5E9 E5EC 4AC9 BD62 7B05

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Andy Simpkins@21:1/5 to Donald Norwood on Sun Jul 18 11:20:02 2021
    XPost: linux.debian.maint.boot, linux.debian.devel.release

    On 18/07/2021 00:24, Donald Norwood wrote:
    Hi!

    On 7/17/21 4:58 PM, Steve McIntyre wrote:
    On Sat, Jul 17, 2021 at 10:25:17PM +0200, Paul Gevers wrote:
    Hi all,

    On 11-07-2021 21:11, Paul Gevers wrote:
    With less than three weeks to go until the tentative release date, I
    would love to confirm the date by now, but there is a serious issue with >>>> crucial infrastructure (cdbuilder.d.o). Apart from this issue (and what >>>> it means for solving the debian-installer blocking issues in time), I'm >>>> not aware of other blocking issues, so let's hope the teams involved can >>>> recover in time.
    Albeit there is some progress, we think it better for the people
    involved to now say that we will *not* release on July 31.

    Unfortunately, that means that we have to start looking for a new date
    again. Assuming what we'll learn in the upcoming week or two is good, I
    propose to already start the list below with two weeks after the
    previous date. Upcoming time is around DebConf, I can imagine it could
    even be an advantage, especially as that's on-line, let's see.

    14 August (day before DebCamp)
    Doable.
    Works for me
    Works for me for images team

    21 August (last day of DebCamp)
    RT: elbrus
    Awkward - wife has plans for us that evening.
    Half of the press team is available this day so it is not ideal.
    Sorry - away
    28 August (DebConf)
    RT: elbrus
    Debian UK BBQ, argh
    away at ^^

    4 September
    RT: elbrus
    Labor day weekend in the U.S. Not a good weekend.
    Works fine for me
    doable - Isy and I will be unavailable before 1300hrs UTC
    11 September:
    RT: elbrus
    That's the week of my wedding anniversary, I'll be on VAC.
    Happy Anniversary!
    Works for me

    Could we put forth September 18th? We are good for that day without any issues.
    Works for me

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Adam D. Barratt@21:1/5 to Paul Gevers on Sun Jul 18 19:30:02 2021
    XPost: linux.debian.maint.boot, linux.debian.devel.release

    On Sat, 2021-07-17 at 22:25 +0200, Paul Gevers wrote:
    14 August (day before DebCamp)
    21 August (last day of DebCamp)
    RT: elbrus

    These both look OK.

    28 August (DebConf)
    RT: elbrus

    That's a holiday weekend in the UK; I'll be visiting family and then
    the Debian UK BBQ.

    4 September
    RT: elbrus
    11 September:
    RT: elbrus

    Either of these work for me. The 18th also does if need be (I will then
    be away from Monday morning (the 20th) for a few days).

    Regards,

    Adam

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Joerg Jaspert@21:1/5 to Paul Gevers on Sun Jul 18 21:50:01 2021
    XPost: linux.debian.maint.boot, linux.debian.devel.release

    On 16197 March 1977, Paul Gevers wrote:

    Albeit there is some progress, we think it better for the people
    involved to now say that we will *not* release on July 31.

    Unfortunately, that means that we have to start looking for a new date
    again. Assuming what we'll learn in the upcoming week or two is good,
    I
    propose to already start the list below with two weeks after the
    previous date. Upcoming time is around DebConf, I can imagine it could
    even be an advantage, especially as that's on-line, let's see.

    I am away from 7th to 21st August (including both), at a place with very
    bad internet, so those are out for me.

    14 August (day before DebCamp)
    21 August (last day of DebCamp)
    RT: elbrus

    Not me.

    28 August (DebConf)
    RT: elbrus
    4 September
    RT: elbrus
    11 September:
    RT: elbrus

    Can do all three.

    --
    bye, Joerg

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  • From Sebastian Ramacher@21:1/5 to Paul Gevers on Tue Jul 20 15:20:02 2021
    XPost: linux.debian.maint.boot, linux.debian.devel.release

    On 2021-07-17 22:25:17, Paul Gevers wrote:
    Hi all,

    On 11-07-2021 21:11, Paul Gevers wrote:
    With less than three weeks to go until the tentative release date, I
    would love to confirm the date by now, but there is a serious issue with crucial infrastructure (cdbuilder.d.o). Apart from this issue (and what
    it means for solving the debian-installer blocking issues in time), I'm
    not aware of other blocking issues, so let's hope the teams involved can recover in time.

    Albeit there is some progress, we think it better for the people
    involved to now say that we will *not* release on July 31.

    Unfortunately, that means that we have to start looking for a new date
    again. Assuming what we'll learn in the upcoming week or two is good, I propose to already start the list below with two weeks after the
    previous date. Upcoming time is around DebConf, I can imagine it could
    even be an advantage, especially as that's on-line, let's see.

    14 August (day before DebCamp)
    21 August (last day of DebCamp)
    RT: elbrus
    28 August (DebConf)
    RT: elbrus
    4 September
    RT: elbrus
    11 September:
    RT: elbrus

    11 September works for me. I am going to be on VAC on 28 August and 4 September. On the other dates I can try to be around, but cannot commit.

    Cheers
    --
    Sebastian Ramacher

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  • From Paul Gevers@21:1/5 to All on Tue Jul 20 22:40:02 2021
    XPost: linux.debian.maint.boot, linux.debian.devel.release
    To: debian-cd@lists.debian.org
    To: press@debian.org
    To: ftpmaster@ftp-master.debian.org
    To: debian-release@lists.debian.org (debian-release)
    Copy: dsa@debian.org

    This is an OpenPGP/MIME signed message (RFC 4880 and 3156) --L3FZ5oRETTuqWlqOZIVB0AtRIbcVDLKDp
    Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8
    Content-Language: en-US
    Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

    Hi all,

    Current overview to check if I got things right and to hopefully trigger
    more replies. We currently don't have any day yet with all involved
    teams comfortably present, the one coming closest is 4 September.
    Somebody from ftp available on 14 august?

    14 August (day before DebCamp)
    RT: Adam
    Image: Steve, Andy
    Press: Donald
    FTP:
    21 August (last day of DebCamp)
    RT: Adam, elbrus
    Image:
    Press: 1/2 (not ideal)
    FTP:
    28 August (DebConf)
    RT: elbrus
    Image:
    Press:
    FTP: Joerg
    4 September
    RT: Adam, elbrus
    Image: Steve, Andy
    Press:
    FTP: Joerg
    11 September:
    RT: Adam, elbrus, Sebastian
    Image: Andy
    Press:
    FTP: Joerg
    18 September:
    RT: Adam, elbrus
    Image: Andy
    Press: Donald
    FTP:

    Paul


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  • From Ansgar@21:1/5 to Paul Gevers on Wed Jul 21 12:40:01 2021
    XPost: linux.debian.maint.boot, linux.debian.devel.release

    Hi,

    On Tue, 2021-07-20 at 22:35 +0200, Paul Gevers wrote:
    We currently don't have any day yet with all involved
    teams comfortably present, the one coming closest is 4 September.
    Somebody from ftp available on 14 august?

    That should be doable.

    Ansgar

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