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  • Shakespeare's Christmas, New Years, and Easter

    From bookburn@21:1/5 to All on Mon Dec 26 22:46:42 2022
    Before the change in calendars, in the 18th century, the days of celebration were different in Elizabethan England, it appears, according to the article at

    https://www.thoughtco.com/shakespeare-new-year-and-christmas-quotes-2984987

    Suggestion is that he was cynical about all that?

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From John W Kennedy@21:1/5 to bookburn on Tue Dec 27 17:01:08 2022
    On 12/27/22 1:46 AM, bookburn wrote:
    Before the change in calendars, in the 18th century, the days of celebration were different in Elizabethan England, it appears, according to the article at

    https://www.thoughtco.com/shakespeare-new-year-and-christmas-quotes-2984987

    Suggestion is that he was cynical about all that?

    The history of the celebration of Christmas in England is far more
    complex than that. During the Interregnum, Christmas was outlawed, but
    there were protests—even violence—when it was done, and when Richard Cromwell fell, Christmas was welcomed back with great rejoicing. And a
    careful reading of “A Christmas Carol” shows that, in Dickens’ mind, Christmas was celebrated with great merrymaking only a generation before.

    --
    John W. Kennedy
    Algernon Burbage, Lord Roderick, Father Martin, Bishop Baldwin,
    King Pellinore, Captain Bailey, Merlin -- A Kingdom for a Stage!

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From bookburn@21:1/5 to john.w....@gmail.com on Tue Dec 27 18:22:21 2022
    On Tuesday, December 27, 2022 at 1:01:16 PM UTC-9, john.w....@gmail.com wrote:
    On 12/27/22 1:46 AM, bookburn wrote:
    Before the change in calendars, in the 18th century, the days of celebration were different in Elizabethan England, it appears, according to the article at

    https://www.thoughtco.com/shakespeare-new-year-and-christmas-quotes-2984987

    Suggestion is that he was cynical about all that?
    The history of the celebration of Christmas in England is far more
    complex than that. During the Interregnum, Christmas was outlawed, but
    there were protests—even violence—when it was done, and when Richard Cromwell fell, Christmas was welcomed back with great rejoicing. And a careful reading of “A Christmas Carol” shows that, in Dickens’ mind, Christmas was celebrated with great merrymaking only a generation before.

    --
    John W. Kennedy
    Algernon Burbage, Lord Roderick, Father Martin, Bishop Baldwin,
    King Pellinore, Captain Bailey, Merlin -- A Kingdom for a Stage!

    Article mentions something about German acculturation in England and resistance, which may have been a factor. Not sure how the Catholic-Protestant factions had attitudes about this. Evidently, it was Easter Sunday that was remembered instead with some.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Margaret@21:1/5 to bookburn on Wed Dec 28 00:45:30 2022
    On Wednesday, 28 December 2022 at 02:22:23 UTC, bookburn wrote:
    On Tuesday, December 27, 2022 at 1:01:16 PM UTC-9, john.w....@gmail.com wrote:
    On 12/27/22 1:46 AM, bookburn wrote:
    Before the change in calendars, in the 18th century, the days of celebration were different in Elizabethan England, it appears, according to the article at

    https://www.thoughtco.com/shakespeare-new-year-and-christmas-quotes-2984987

    Suggestion is that he was cynical about all that?
    The history of the celebration of Christmas in England is far more
    complex than that. During the Interregnum, Christmas was outlawed, but there were protests—even violence—when it was done, and when Richard Cromwell fell, Christmas was welcomed back with great rejoicing. And a careful reading of “A Christmas Carol” shows that, in Dickens’ mind, Christmas was celebrated with great merrymaking only a generation before.

    --
    John W. Kennedy
    Algernon Burbage, Lord Roderick, Father Martin, Bishop Baldwin,
    King Pellinore, Captain Bailey, Merlin -- A Kingdom for a Stage!
    Article mentions something about German acculturation in England and resistance, which may have been a factor. Not sure how the Catholic-Protestant factions had attitudes about this. Evidently, it was Easter Sunday that was remembered instead with some.

    The article missed the most obvious Christmas reference in Shakespeare. Which explains why Christmas Eve is the traditional time for telling ghost stories.

    Some say that ever 'gainst that season comes
    Wherein our Saviour's birth is celebrated,
    The bird of dawning singeth all night long:
    And then, they say, no spirit dares stir abroad;
    The nights are wholesome; then no planets strike,
    No fairy takes, nor witch hath power to charm,
    So hallow'd and so gracious is the time.

    Christmas Day is a holy day for church and such and then the festivities begin after that. The Christmas season at court (with plays) begins on St Stephen's Day and lasts till Twelfth Night. (But all the way to Shrove Tuesday, on and off, for extravagant
    James.)

    January 1st is when Lizzie gets her New-Year's gifts. But Lady Day (March 25) is when the calendar year starts for Elizabethans, hence all the confusing "1596-7" dates for court performances in some books.

    When the English calendar shifts to line up with the Continent, the new year start date is moved to 6th April so the taxman doesn't lose any money for that financial year. The UK still sticks to that.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From marc hanson@21:1/5 to Margaret on Wed Dec 28 08:31:36 2022
    On Wednesday, December 28, 2022 at 3:45:31 AM UTC-5, Margaret wrote:
    On Wednesday, 28 December 2022 at 02:22:23 UTC, bookburn wrote:
    On Tuesday, December 27, 2022 at 1:01:16 PM UTC-9, john.w....@gmail.com wrote:
    On 12/27/22 1:46 AM, bookburn wrote:
    Before the change in calendars, in the 18th century, the days of celebration were different in Elizabethan England, it appears, according to the article at

    https://www.thoughtco.com/shakespeare-new-year-and-christmas-quotes-2984987

    Suggestion is that he was cynical about all that?
    The history of the celebration of Christmas in England is far more complex than that. During the Interregnum, Christmas was outlawed, but there were protests—even violence—when it was done, and when Richard Cromwell fell, Christmas was welcomed back with great rejoicing. And a careful reading of “A Christmas Carol” shows that, in Dickens’ mind,
    Christmas was celebrated with great merrymaking only a generation before.

    --
    John W. Kennedy
    Algernon Burbage, Lord Roderick, Father Martin, Bishop Baldwin,
    King Pellinore, Captain Bailey, Merlin -- A Kingdom for a Stage!
    Article mentions something about German acculturation in England and resistance, which may have been a factor. Not sure how the Catholic-Protestant factions had attitudes about this. Evidently, it was Easter Sunday that was remembered instead with
    some.
    The article missed the most obvious Christmas reference in Shakespeare. Which explains why Christmas Eve is the traditional time for telling ghost stories.

    Some say that ever 'gainst that season comes
    Wherein our Saviour's birth is celebrated,
    The bird of dawning singeth all night long:
    And then, they say, no spirit dares stir abroad;
    The nights are wholesome; then no planets strike,
    No fairy takes, nor witch hath power to charm,
    So hallow'd and so gracious is the time.

    Christmas Day is a holy day for church and such and then the festivities begin after that. The Christmas season at court (with plays) begins on St Stephen's Day and lasts till Twelfth Night. (But all the way to Shrove Tuesday, on and off, for
    extravagant James.)

    January 1st is when Lizzie gets her New-Year's gifts. But Lady Day (March 25) is when the calendar year starts for Elizabethans, hence all the confusing "1596-7" dates for court performances in some books.

    When the English calendar shifts to line up with the Continent, the new year start date is moved to 6th April so the taxman doesn't lose any money for that financial year. The UK still sticks to that.

    Hamlet act 1, scene 1

    Marcellus.
    It faded on the crowing of the cock.
    Some say that ever, 'gainst that season comes
    Wherein our Saviour's birth is celebrated,
    The bird of dawning singeth all night long;
    And then, they say, no spirit dare stir abroad,
    The nights are wholesome, then no planets strike,
    No fairy takes, nor witch hath power to charm,
    So hallow'd and so gracious is the time.

    marc

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From John W Kennedy@21:1/5 to Margaret on Wed Dec 28 16:37:55 2022
    On 12/28/22 3:45 AM, Margaret wrote:
    On Wednesday, 28 December 2022 at 02:22:23 UTC, bookburn wrote:
    On Tuesday, December 27, 2022 at 1:01:16 PM UTC-9, john.w....@gmail.com wrote:
    On 12/27/22 1:46 AM, bookburn wrote:
    Before the change in calendars, in the 18th century, the days of celebration were different in Elizabethan England, it appears, according to the article at

    https://www.thoughtco.com/shakespeare-new-year-and-christmas-quotes-2984987

    Suggestion is that he was cynical about all that?
    The history of the celebration of Christmas in England is far more
    complex than that. During the Interregnum, Christmas was outlawed, but
    there were protests—even violence—when it was done, and when Richard >>> Cromwell fell, Christmas was welcomed back with great rejoicing. And a
    careful reading of “A Christmas Carol” shows that, in Dickens’ mind, >>> Christmas was celebrated with great merrymaking only a generation before. >>>
    --
    John W. Kennedy
    Algernon Burbage, Lord Roderick, Father Martin, Bishop Baldwin,
    King Pellinore, Captain Bailey, Merlin -- A Kingdom for a Stage!
    Article mentions something about German acculturation in England and resistance, which may have been a factor. Not sure how the Catholic-Protestant factions had attitudes about this. Evidently, it was Easter Sunday that was remembered instead with
    some.

    The article missed the most obvious Christmas reference in Shakespeare. Which explains why Christmas Eve is the traditional time for telling ghost stories.

    Some say that ever 'gainst that season comes
    Wherein our Saviour's birth is celebrated,
    The bird of dawning singeth all night long:
    And then, they say, no spirit dares stir abroad;
    The nights are wholesome; then no planets strike,
    No fairy takes, nor witch hath power to charm,
    So hallow'd and so gracious is the time.

    Christmas Day is a holy day for church and such and then the festivities begin after that. The Christmas season at court (with plays) begins on St Stephen's Day and lasts till Twelfth Night. (But all the way to Shrove Tuesday, on and off, for
    extravagant James.)

    January 1st is when Lizzie gets her New-Year's gifts. But Lady Day (March 25) is when the calendar year starts for Elizabethans, hence all the confusing "1596-7" dates for court performances in some books.

    When the English calendar shifts to line up with the Continent, the new year start date is moved to 6th April so the taxman doesn't lose any money for that financial year. The UK still sticks to that.

    Only for the fiscal year. Since 1752, the civil New Year has fallen on
    January 1, as in most of the West.

    --
    John W. Kennedy
    Algernon Burbage, Lord Roderick, Father Martin, Bishop Baldwin,
    King Pellinore, Captain Bailey, Merlin -- A Kingdom for a Stage!

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From John W Kennedy@21:1/5 to bookburn on Wed Dec 28 16:27:43 2022
    On 12/27/22 9:22 PM, bookburn wrote:
    On Tuesday, December 27, 2022 at 1:01:16 PM UTC-9, john.w....@gmail.com wrote:
    On 12/27/22 1:46 AM, bookburn wrote:
    Before the change in calendars, in the 18th century, the days of celebration were different in Elizabethan England, it appears, according to the article at

    https://www.thoughtco.com/shakespeare-new-year-and-christmas-quotes-2984987 >>>
    Suggestion is that he was cynical about all that?
    The history of the celebration of Christmas in England is far more
    complex than that. During the Interregnum, Christmas was outlawed, but
    there were protests—even violence—when it was done, and when Richard
    Cromwell fell, Christmas was welcomed back with great rejoicing. And a
    careful reading of “A Christmas Carol” shows that, in Dickens’ mind, >> Christmas was celebrated with great merrymaking only a generation before.

    --
    John W. Kennedy
    Algernon Burbage, Lord Roderick, Father Martin, Bishop Baldwin,
    King Pellinore, Captain Bailey, Merlin -- A Kingdom for a Stage!

    Article mentions something about German acculturation in England and resistance, which may have been a factor. Not sure how the Catholic-Protestant factions had attitudes about this. Evidently, it was Easter Sunday that was remembered instead with
    some.

    All small-o orthodox Christians place Easter at the top. But, over the centuries, Christmas has been anything from not a holiday at all to
    second only to Easter.

    --
    John W. Kennedy
    Algernon Burbage, Lord Roderick, Father Martin, Bishop Baldwin,
    King Pellinore, Captain Bailey, Merlin -- A Kingdom for a Stage!

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)