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  • shell defaults

    From Louis Epstein@21:1/5 to All on Sat Dec 23 02:57:18 2023
    I note that the article from debugpoint.com about
    the new features of FreeBSD 14 says it has
    "elevated the root user's default shell to sh".

    So what has it been until now?
    When I am in a fsck situation in 13,
    as with previous versions,the single user
    mode prompt tells me to enter a shell or
    RETURN for sh indicating sh is already
    the default.

    I thought only the Thompson and Mashey shells
    predated sh,with csh,bash,etc. being more advanced?
    What's the "unelevated" level?

    -=-=-
    The World Trade Center towers MUST rise again,
    at least as tall as before...or terror has triumphed.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Winston@21:1/5 to Louis Epstein on Fri Dec 22 23:57:59 2023
    Louis Epstein <le@main.lekno.ws> writes:
    I note that the article from debugpoint.com about
    the new features of FreeBSD 14 says it has
    "elevated the root user's default shell to sh".

    Maybe the author prefers sh to csh? :)

    I thought only the Thompson and Mashey shells
    predated sh,with csh,bash,etc. being more advanced?

    Development of sh didn't stop, and today's sh has many
    improvements compared with the 1980's sh.

    In the end, does the installation default matter?
    If you prefer csh, use chsh to change it back.
    -WBE

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Louis Epstein@21:1/5 to Winston on Sat Dec 23 07:14:37 2023
    Winston <wbe@ubeblock.psr.com.invalid> wrote:
    Louis Epstein <le@main.lekno.ws> writes:
    I note that the article from debugpoint.com about
    the new features of FreeBSD 14 says it has
    "elevated the root user's default shell to sh".

    Maybe the author prefers sh to csh? :)

    I thought only the Thompson and Mashey shells
    predated sh,with csh,bash,etc. being more advanced?

    Development of sh didn't stop, and today's sh has many
    improvements compared with the 1980's sh.

    In the end, does the installation default matter?
    If you prefer csh, use chsh to change it back.
    -WBE

    Apparently per Wikipedia's comparison-of-shells page
    FreeBSD has been using tcsh as the root default but
    again,I thought that was way more advanced than sh,
    as an improvement on csh.

    I've been mainly a bash user for over 25 years.

    -=-=-
    The World Trade Center towers MUST rise again,
    at least as tall as before...or terror has triumphed.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Christian Weisgerber@21:1/5 to Louis Epstein on Sat Dec 23 13:52:49 2023
    On 2023-12-23, Louis Epstein <le@main.lekno.ws> wrote:

    I've been mainly a bash user for over 25 years.

    So was I, on FreeBSD, but I recently switched to sh(1), which has
    now grown sufficient features for my interactive use, without all
    of bash's additional clutter that I simply don't use.

    --
    Christian "naddy" Weisgerber naddy@mips.inka.de

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Christian Weisgerber@21:1/5 to Louis Epstein on Sat Dec 23 13:45:41 2023
    On 2023-12-23, Louis Epstein <le@main.lekno.ws> wrote:

    I note that the article from debugpoint.com about
    the new features of FreeBSD 14 says it has
    "elevated the root user's default shell to sh".

    So what has it been until now?

    /bin/csh, which is actually tcsh on FreeBSD.

    When I am in a fsck situation in 13,
    as with previous versions,the single user
    mode prompt tells me to enter a shell or
    RETURN for sh indicating sh is already
    the default.

    Single user shell != root user's shell

    --
    Christian "naddy" Weisgerber naddy@mips.inka.de

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Bob Eager@21:1/5 to Christian Weisgerber on Sat Dec 23 21:15:25 2023
    On Sat, 23 Dec 2023 13:52:49 +0000, Christian Weisgerber wrote:

    On 2023-12-23, Louis Epstein <le@main.lekno.ws> wrote:

    I've been mainly a bash user for over 25 years.

    So was I, on FreeBSD, but I recently switched to sh(1), which has now
    grown sufficient features for my interactive use, without all of bash's additional clutter that I simply don't use.

    I have always used sh for scripting (when I don't use REXX), but csh/tcsh
    for an interactive shell. And that has been the case since csh first
    appeared in the late 1970s.



    --
    Using UNIX since v6 (1975)...

    Use the BIG mirror service in the UK:
    http://www.mirrorservice.org

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Louis Epstein@21:1/5 to Christian Weisgerber on Mon Dec 25 08:16:30 2023
    Christian Weisgerber <naddy@mips.inka.de> wrote:
    On 2023-12-23, Louis Epstein <le@main.lekno.ws> wrote:

    I note that the article from debugpoint.com about
    the new features of FreeBSD 14 says it has
    "elevated the root user's default shell to sh".

    So what has it been until now?

    /bin/csh, which is actually tcsh on FreeBSD.

    When I am in a fsck situation in 13,
    as with previous versions,the single user
    mode prompt tells me to enter a shell or
    RETURN for sh indicating sh is already
    the default.

    Single user shell != root user's shell


    When one is single user does one not have root privileges?

    -=-=-
    The World Trade Center towers MUST rise again,
    at least as tall as before...or terror has triumphed.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Winston@21:1/5 to Louis Epstein on Mon Dec 25 03:24:50 2023
    On 2023-12-23, Louis Epstein <le@main.lekno.ws> wrote:
    I note that the article from debugpoint.com about
    the new features of FreeBSD 14 says it has
    "elevated the root user's default shell to sh".

    So what has it been until now?

    Christian Weisgerber <naddy@mips.inka.de> replied:
    /bin/csh, which is actually tcsh on FreeBSD.

    When I am in a fsck situation in 13,
    as with previous versions,the single user
    mode prompt tells me to enter a shell or
    RETURN for sh indicating sh is already
    the default.

    Single user shell != root user's shell

    Louis Epstein <le@main.lekno.ws> then asked:
    When one is single user does one not have root privileges?

    Sure, but single user mode doesn't do all the multiuser login
    stuff like looking at /etc/passwd to see what shell user X
    should have. Instead, it just asks you which shell you want,
    and the default is the traditional /bin/sh.
    -WBE

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Philip Paeps@21:1/5 to Winston on Sun Dec 31 12:07:22 2023
    Winston <wbe@UBEBLOCK.psr.com.invalid> wrote:
    Louis Epstein <le@main.lekno.ws> writes:
    I note that the article from debugpoint.com about
    the new features of FreeBSD 14 says it has
    "elevated the root user's default shell to sh".

    Maybe the author prefers sh to csh? :)

    I suspect the author was a large language model rather than a human.

    I thought only the Thompson and Mashey shells
    predated sh,with csh,bash,etc. being more advanced?

    Development of sh didn't stop, and today's sh has many
    improvements compared with the 1980's sh.

    Indeed. And FreeBSD's /bin/sh today has plenty of interactive features
    for day to day systems administration use.

    In the end, does the installation default matter?
    If you prefer csh, use chsh to change it back.

    I prefer to keep the system defaults on installations where I'm not the
    only admin. For my user account, I've been using zsh for over twenty
    years.

    Philip

    --
    Philip Paeps
    Senior Reality Engineer
    Alternative Enterprises

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)