• A curiosity from the eighties...

    From Shannon@21:1/5 to Bill Gunshannon on Thu Jun 13 16:33:28 2019
    On 2013-03-08, Bill Gunshannon <bill@server1.cs.uofs.edu> wrote:
    In article <khdjdb$q53$3@reader2.panix.com>,
    Cydrome Leader <presence@MUNGEpanix.com> writes:
    Bill Gunshannon <billg999@cs.uofs.edu> wrote:
    In article <7bKdncSpGrzcBrfMnZ2dnUVZ_sKdnZ2d@giganews.com>,
    drb@ihatespam.msu.edu (Dennis Boone) writes:
    Mine are older. And say IBM on the edge. :-)

    Ah, but which is less common? :)

    No flowcharting template is "common" today. Like much of the original
    programming art flowcharting is no longer in vogue.

    no flowcharting is why so much software sucks these days.

    You're preaching to the choir. I spent years trying to find out how
    what passes as Software Engineering today is better than what we used
    to do when I was a professional software developer. Doesn't matter
    that we did a lot more deskwork and design and, yes, more contact with
    the user than what they teach as SE today. As everyone knows newer
    is always better. Thank you CMU and the SEI....

    I would argue that part of the issue is that the contact with the user
    is too much. What I means is, we used to talk to the user, to find out
    what he needed, and he helped us do a lot of the things outside of our
    domain, like maybe display and input screens for his particular
    profession. But then you know how that worked.

    The issue now is the user a far different beast:
    - the user now decides how you will design it
    - the user now tell you what to write it in
    - the user tells you what it will run on, and keep in mind he often does
    not know the difference between a mainframe and an iMac
    - the user will dictate that you use C#, MondoDB, MySQL, ASP,
    JavaScript, and a host of other acronyms, without any real understand
    what the implications are
    - the user can't even be counted on to even know his own domain, which
    is among the worst of it.

    Basically the users is designing the software and somehow, from the mess
    that results, we have to code it.

    It isn't always like that, I'm exaggerating, but it very often is just
    like that and as a programmer I no longer typically have the authority
    to fix the situation.

    Where some they sell their dreams...

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