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  • 4.2.12

    From Wesley Kranitz@21:1/5 to All on Wed May 22 22:29:52 2019
    Has anyone actually got 4.2.12 to build. I have tried but get all types of errors. So after reading the Read_me file I have the following questions:

    1) the Read_me says: [hak i386/version to append .san1]

    What does that mean???

    2) It says to copy include to usr/include however the include is marked as r10 which I believe as it appears to be missing a number of .h files and some structures appears to need modiication. Does anyone know where I can find the .r12 include files.

    3) The bld script appears to need arguments, but I'm not sure what they are. Could anyone enlighten me???


    If any one can help I would be greatly appreciative.

    Wes

    PS. I'm doing this because I need floppy tape support.

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  • From Udo Munk@21:1/5 to Wesley Kranitz on Thu May 23 10:39:10 2019
    On Thursday, May 23, 2019 at 7:29:53 AM UTC+2, Wesley Kranitz wrote:
    Has anyone actually got 4.2.12 to build. I have tried but get all types of errors.

    Yes, is included on the 4.2 VM you'll find here:

    https://www.autometer.de/unix4fun/coherent/ftp/vms/
    The 4.2.12 kernel source are at /u1/src/kernel-4212 and there is a README
    for how to build the kernel from the sources.

    So after reading the Read_me file I have the following questions:

    1) the Read_me says: [hak i386/version to append .san1]

    What does that mean???

    No idea and the kernel sources I used don't have it.

    2) It says to copy include to usr/include however the include is marked as r10 which
    I believe as it appears to be missing a number of .h files and some structures appears
    to need modiication. Does anyone know where I can find the .r12 include files.

    The r12 include files are included in the source tar ball from Steve somewhere. You must be careful which header files to use, I've setup the build system with /usr/include.r10, /usr/include.r12 and /usr/include.r14 and one needs to copy one of those to /usr/include. Do not mix header files from different releases or
    you'll run into such problems.

    3) The bld script appears to need arguments, but I'm not sure what they are. Could
    anyone enlighten me???

    Try bld -? and it will tell you. Most options are obvious, the argument is a build target
    The build targets are configured in conf/target_conf, I've only setup the fha target
    properly, so use bld fha.

    PS. I'm doing this because I need floppy tape support.

    Here you'll find the floppy tape update disk for 4.2.10: https://www.autometer.de/unix4fun/coherent/ftp/distrib/Coherent-4.2.10/

    As far as I can remember it worked OK with 4.2.10 and 4.2.12 just includes the devices already.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
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  • From Wesley Kranitz@21:1/5 to Wesley Kranitz on Thu May 23 23:30:56 2019
    On Friday, May 24, 2019 at 1:20:51 AM UTC-5, Wesley Kranitz wrote:
    On Thursday, May 23, 2019 at 12:39:11 PM UTC-5, Udo Munk wrote:
    On Thursday, May 23, 2019 at 7:29:53 AM UTC+2, Wesley Kranitz wrote:
    Has anyone actually got 4.2.12 to build. I have tried but get all types of errors.

    Yes, is included on the 4.2 VM you'll find here:

    https://www.autometer.de/unix4fun/coherent/ftp/vms/
    The 4.2.12 kernel source are at /u1/src/kernel-4212 and there is a README for how to build the kernel from the sources.

    So after reading the Read_me file I have the following questions:

    1) the Read_me says: [hak i386/version to append .san1]

    What does that mean???

    No idea and the kernel sources I used don't have it.

    2) It says to copy include to usr/include however the include is marked as r10 which
    I believe as it appears to be missing a number of .h files and some structures appears
    to need modiication. Does anyone know where I can find the .r12 include files.

    The r12 include files are included in the source tar ball from Steve somewhere.
    You must be careful which header files to use, I've setup the build system with
    /usr/include.r10, /usr/include.r12 and /usr/include.r14 and one needs to copy
    one of those to /usr/include. Do not mix header files from different releases or
    you'll run into such problems.

    3) The bld script appears to need arguments, but I'm not sure what they are. Could
    anyone enlighten me???

    Try bld -? and it will tell you. Most options are obvious, the argument is a build target
    The build targets are configured in conf/target_conf, I've only setup the fha target
    properly, so use bld fha.

    PS. I'm doing this because I need floppy tape support.

    Here you'll find the floppy tape update disk for 4.2.10: https://www.autometer.de/unix4fun/coherent/ftp/distrib/Coherent-4.2.10/

    As far as I can remember it worked OK with 4.2.10 and 4.2.12 just includes the
    devices already.

    Well I got it to compile correctly. It says it's version 4.2.12.jsbach26. It gets errors when I try to access /dev/nft. I found the floppy tape update and applied it to my 4.2.10 system. That works ok and can access /dev/nft with no errors. The tape
    retentions ok, but gets the following error when I try to write to the tape:

    (4,120) Get Header Segment Failed

    The tapes are formatted and brand new in their original sealed packages. I would say it was the drive, except for the fact that I have a second drive that I know works and that also gets the same error.

    I did try bld -? . It prints {fha | fva | sc | ticom} plus some other stuff that I understand. But it doesn't explain what the difference is between the versions. Sounds like something to do with floppy's.

    I'm going to get your version and try building it.

    We will have to see.

    Wes

    Udo,

    An additional question. You wouldn't happen to know where I could find the source for the command: tape. I have the source for the driver but it would be helpful to have the source for: tape.

    Thanks

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Udo Munk@21:1/5 to Wesley Kranitz on Thu May 23 23:38:20 2019
    On Thursday, May 23, 2019 at 7:29:53 AM UTC+2, Wesley Kranitz wrote:

    1) the Read_me says: [hak i386/version to append .san1]

    What does that mean???


    In i386/version the kernel version string is defined. This is
    what you see in the boot log on the console.

    Someone hacked the file and appended .san1 to the version string.
    This was used to build special kernels for test/development system,
    to make clear that the kernel was build for some specific machine
    and not usable for general distribution. The .san1 tag doesn't
    tell me anything, not one of the tags I know we were using at MWC.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Wesley Kranitz@21:1/5 to Udo Munk on Thu May 23 23:20:50 2019
    On Thursday, May 23, 2019 at 12:39:11 PM UTC-5, Udo Munk wrote:
    On Thursday, May 23, 2019 at 7:29:53 AM UTC+2, Wesley Kranitz wrote:
    Has anyone actually got 4.2.12 to build. I have tried but get all types of errors.

    Yes, is included on the 4.2 VM you'll find here:

    https://www.autometer.de/unix4fun/coherent/ftp/vms/
    The 4.2.12 kernel source are at /u1/src/kernel-4212 and there is a README
    for how to build the kernel from the sources.

    So after reading the Read_me file I have the following questions:

    1) the Read_me says: [hak i386/version to append .san1]

    What does that mean???

    No idea and the kernel sources I used don't have it.

    2) It says to copy include to usr/include however the include is marked as r10 which
    I believe as it appears to be missing a number of .h files and some structures appears
    to need modiication. Does anyone know where I can find the .r12 include files.

    The r12 include files are included in the source tar ball from Steve somewhere.
    You must be careful which header files to use, I've setup the build system with
    /usr/include.r10, /usr/include.r12 and /usr/include.r14 and one needs to copy one of those to /usr/include. Do not mix header files from different releases or
    you'll run into such problems.

    3) The bld script appears to need arguments, but I'm not sure what they are. Could
    anyone enlighten me???

    Try bld -? and it will tell you. Most options are obvious, the argument is a build target
    The build targets are configured in conf/target_conf, I've only setup the fha target
    properly, so use bld fha.

    PS. I'm doing this because I need floppy tape support.

    Here you'll find the floppy tape update disk for 4.2.10: https://www.autometer.de/unix4fun/coherent/ftp/distrib/Coherent-4.2.10/

    As far as I can remember it worked OK with 4.2.10 and 4.2.12 just includes the
    devices already.

    Well I got it to compile correctly. It says it's version 4.2.12.jsbach26. It gets errors when I try to access /dev/nft. I found the floppy tape update and applied it to my 4.2.10 system. That works ok and can access /dev/nft with no errors. The tape
    retentions ok, but gets the following error when I try to write to the tape:

    (4,120) Get Header Segment Failed

    The tapes are formatted and brand new in their original sealed packages. I would say it was the drive, except for the fact that I have a second drive that I know works and that also gets the same error.

    I did try bld -? . It prints {fha | fva | sc | ticom} plus some other stuff that I understand. But it doesn't explain what the difference is between the versions. Sounds like something to do with floppy's.

    I'm going to get your version and try building it.

    We will have to see.

    Wes

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Udo Munk@21:1/5 to Wesley Kranitz on Fri May 24 10:06:39 2019
    On Friday, May 24, 2019 at 8:30:57 AM UTC+2, Wesley Kranitz wrote:

    An additional question. You wouldn't happen to know where I could find the source
    for the command: tape. I have the source for the driver but it would be helpful to
    have the source for: tape.

    A quick find over the complete source tar archive found:

    find . -name tape.c
    ./gtz/mwc/doc/coherent/lx/tape.c ./romana/source/4.2.x/usr/man/COHERENT.2/tape.c

    Manual pages only, have to examine the source tree manually, don't know
    the source file names for the tape command.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Udo Munk@21:1/5 to Wesley Kranitz on Fri May 24 10:01:46 2019
    On Friday, May 24, 2019 at 8:20:51 AM UTC+2, Wesley Kranitz wrote:

    Well I got it to compile correctly. It says it's version 4.2.12.jsbach26.

    OK, jsbach26 was a development system used at MWC, so you might be using
    kernel sources from one of the development systems and not the final product sources. So I would suggest to move the complete kernel sources from the VM
    to you system and build a kernel with that.

    It gets errors when I try to access /dev/nft. I found the floppy tape update and applied
    it to my 4.2.10 system. That works ok and can access /dev/nft with no errors. The tape
    retentions ok, but gets the following error when I try to write to the tape:

    (4,120) Get Header Segment Failed

    The tapes are formatted and brand new in their original sealed packages. I would say it
    was the drive, except for the fact that I have a second drive that I know works and that
    also gets the same error.

    One would have to read the ft driver source and see where this error comes from.
    I'm not familiar with this floppy tape stuff, a stayed away from this and used SCSI
    tape drives. I do remember that there were hardware issues with the drives and not anything available was working, only the tested drives/brands from the ft release notes.

    I did try bld -? . It prints {fha | fva | sc | ticom} plus some other stuff that I understand.
    But it doesn't explain what the difference is between the versions. Sounds like something
    to do with floppy's.

    This are targets configured in conf/fha_conf, conf/fva_conf and so on. Basically these
    are kernels that have one of the floppy drivers compiled in, so that such a kernel can boot
    from a floppy disk drive. Usually bld fha or fva, if I remember right sc was for the
    Future Domain/Seagate SCSI controllers, just look at the config files. Other targets
    like ticom and such were for test systems with multiport serial cards and stuff like that,
    you don't want such a kernel.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Wesley Kranitz@21:1/5 to Udo Munk on Sat May 25 09:17:45 2019
    On Friday, May 24, 2019 at 12:06:40 PM UTC-5, Udo Munk wrote:
    On Friday, May 24, 2019 at 8:30:57 AM UTC+2, Wesley Kranitz wrote:

    An additional question. You wouldn't happen to know where I could find the source
    for the command: tape. I have the source for the driver but it would be helpful to
    have the source for: tape.

    A quick find over the complete source tar archive found:

    find . -name tape.c
    ./gtz/mwc/doc/coherent/lx/tape.c ./romana/source/4.2.x/usr/man/COHERENT.2/tape.c

    Manual pages only, have to examine the source tree manually, don't know
    the source file names for the tape command.

    Udo,

    First, let me thank you for all your help. I really do appreciate it. I got virtual box up and running and got your ova's. Since I haven't used Virtual
    Box much, I just need to figure out how to get the source into the real
    world. I don't have a floppy drive on this computer, but I do have a USB floppy. Looks like I have a little reading to do...…..:-)

    Somewhere I read that the 4.2.14 source builds and boots, but doesn't run. Is that true???? Has anyone looked into why it doesn't run??? Just wondering.

    I have looked all the various coherent archives that I've downloaded, and can't find tape.c or any other tape program source. That's kind of interesting. Maybe it has a different name. Something not obvious. I will keep looking.

    Thanks again for all your help.

    Wes

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Udo Munk@21:1/5 to Wesley Kranitz on Sat May 25 10:54:57 2019
    On Saturday, May 25, 2019 at 6:17:46 PM UTC+2, Wesley Kranitz wrote:

    Udo,

    First, let me thank you for all your help. I really do appreciate it. I got virtual box up and running and got your ova's. Since I haven't used Virtual Box much, I just need to figure out how to get the source into the real world. I don't have a floppy drive on this computer, but I do have a USB floppy. Looks like I have a little reading to do...…..:-)

    You're welcome. Exchanging data is pretty easy because Virtualbox supports floppy disk images which can be dd'ed to an USB floppy drive. I also used it the other way around to create disk image files from the old diskettes I still have.

    So create an empty disk image with:
    dd of=transfer.dsk if=/dev/zero bs=512 count=2880

    Mount this disk image in Virtulbox and format it under COHERENT with
    the dos command, that is easier because any OS can read DOS formatted
    floppy disks. Then tar/gzip the sources and copy to the disk image, which
    you then can dd to the real USB floppy drive.

    Somewhere I read that the 4.2.14 source builds and boots, but doesn't run. Is that true???? Has anyone looked into why it doesn't run??? Just wondering.

    Yes, won't run. We used 4.2.12 to create 4.2.14 of course, but there were changes
    all over the place and the 4.2.12 shell won't run correct under a 4.2.14 kernel, so
    after init the system is dead.

    I have looked all the various coherent archives that I've downloaded, and can't
    find tape.c or any other tape program source. That's kind of interesting. Maybe
    it has a different name. Something not obvious. I will keep looking.

    I couldn't find the source for the tape command either.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Wesley Kranitz@21:1/5 to Udo Munk on Sun May 26 21:51:12 2019
    On Saturday, May 25, 2019 at 12:54:57 PM UTC-5, Udo Munk wrote:
    On Saturday, May 25, 2019 at 6:17:46 PM UTC+2, Wesley Kranitz wrote:


    So create an empty disk image with:
    dd of=transfer.dsk if=/dev/zero bs=512 count=2880

    Thanks for the info. However, the above doesn't work as there is no
    /dev/zero device in your vm. I'm assuming it returns zero filled bytes for however many bytes you need. I tried /dev/null but just that creates a zero length file. I'm not sure what parameters to use with mkdev to create that device as I
    don't see a device driver for that.

    Wes

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Udo Munk@21:1/5 to Wesley Kranitz on Mon May 27 01:05:15 2019
    On Monday, May 27, 2019 at 6:51:13 AM UTC+2, Wesley Kranitz wrote:

    Thanks for the info. However, the above doesn't work as there is no
    /dev/zero device in your vm. I'm assuming it returns zero filled bytes for however many bytes you need. I tried /dev/null but just that creates a
    zero length file. I'm not sure what parameters to use with mkdev to create that device as I don't see a device driver for that.

    Wes

    You need the disk image on the host system that runs Virtualbox. Then you
    mount the empty disk image on the floppy disk device and copy from the
    COHERENT VM to the disk image, which you process further on the host then.

    COHERENT doesn't have a /dev/zero, which is a device that returns an infinite stream of 0 bytes.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Wesley Kranitz@21:1/5 to Udo Munk on Mon May 27 09:21:31 2019
    On Monday, May 27, 2019 at 3:05:16 AM UTC-5, Udo Munk wrote:
    On Monday, May 27, 2019 at 6:51:13 AM UTC+2, Wesley Kranitz wrote:

    Thanks for the info. However, the above doesn't work as there is no /dev/zero device in your vm. I'm assuming it returns zero filled bytes for however many bytes you need. I tried /dev/null but just that creates a
    zero length file. I'm not sure what parameters to use with mkdev to create that device as I don't see a device driver for that.

    Wes

    You need the disk image on the host system that runs Virtualbox. Then you mount the empty disk image on the floppy disk device and copy from the COHERENT VM to the disk image, which you process further on the host then.

    COHERENT doesn't have a /dev/zero, which is a device that returns an infinite stream of 0 bytes.

    Well, you can tell I haven't done this for awhile. Been almost entirely windows.
    Returning a stream of zero bytes is what I thought it did. I did this under Cygwin and it worked fine. I'll try not to bother you with mundane questions. I'll let you know how it all goes. Thanks again.
    Wes

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Udo Munk@21:1/5 to Wesley Kranitz on Mon May 27 12:02:31 2019
    On Monday, May 27, 2019 at 6:21:32 PM UTC+2, Wesley Kranitz wrote:

    Well, you can tell I haven't done this for awhile. Been almost entirely windows.
    Returning a stream of zero bytes is what I thought it did. I did this under Cygwin and it worked fine. I'll try not to bother you with mundane questions. I'll let you know how it all goes. Thanks again.
    Wes

    I use VM's with disk images all the time since ages, is like second nature and I probably don't explain this good enough.

    On Windows you need Cygwin or the Linux subsystem for doing anything technical, like using commands like dd. After you created the image file connect it to the Virtualbox floppy disk drive, then you can access is like a real floppy disk from
    COHERENT running in the VM. After you copied files to the disk image unmount
    it again and dd to an USB floppy drive.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Wesley Kranitz@21:1/5 to Udo Munk on Tue May 28 22:28:36 2019
    On Monday, May 27, 2019 at 2:02:32 PM UTC-5, Udo Munk wrote:
    On Monday, May 27, 2019 at 6:21:32 PM UTC+2, Wesley Kranitz wrote:

    Well, you can tell I haven't done this for awhile. Been almost entirely windows.
    Returning a stream of zero bytes is what I thought it did. I did this under Cygwin and it worked fine. I'll try not to bother you with mundane questions.
    I'll let you know how it all goes. Thanks again.
    Wes

    I use VM's with disk images all the time since ages, is like second nature and
    I probably don't explain this good enough.

    On Windows you need Cygwin or the Linux subsystem for doing anything technical,
    like using commands like dd. After you created the image file connect it to the
    Virtualbox floppy disk drive, then you can access is like a real floppy disk from
    COHERENT running in the VM. After you copied files to the disk image unmount it again and dd to an USB floppy drive.

    Udo,

    2 quick questions:

    1) Am I right to assume that with the source tree's I won't
    need to reinstall the DDK.

    2) that the build directory is just the untared dist directory.

    Wes

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Udo Munk@21:1/5 to Wesley Kranitz on Tue May 28 23:22:38 2019
    On Wednesday, May 29, 2019 at 7:28:37 AM UTC+2, Wesley Kranitz wrote:

    Udo,

    2 quick questions:

    1) Am I right to assume that with the source tree's I won't
    need to reinstall the DDK.

    Right. The difference between a DDK and a kernel source tree is
    that the DDK only includes kernel objects but no sources. The
    kernel source tree includes sources for everything.

    2) that the build directory is just the untared dist directory.

    The build directory is the untared dist directory and I have
    setup the build target fha in each kernel source tree, so that
    bld fha will create a working production kernel. Also the device
    driver selection and configuration is setup for the hardware the
    virtualization provides to a guest machine.

    You can try to setup your own build directory from the distribution
    tar files, but I would suggest to use another directory and study
    how I have setup the stuff under build.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
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