• Re: Google fined $93 million for deceiving users about tracking

    From John McCue@21:1/5 to Oscar Mayer on Tue Nov 21 02:54:09 2023
    XPost: misc.phone.mobile.iphone, alt.comp.software.firefox

    Followups trimmed to: alt.comp.software.firefox

    In alt.comp.software.firefox Oscar Mayer <nobody@oscarmayer.com> wrote:
    Google fined $93 million for deceiving users about tracking

    To Google, that is just change found under the sofa's cushions :(
    Or in another way, the cost of doing business.

    If 93 Billion USD, then maybe they would stop.

    "Our investigation revealed that Google was telling its users one
    thing - that it would no longer track their location once they opted
    out - but doing the opposite and continuing to track its users'
    movements for its own commercial gain. That's unacceptable, and we're
    holding Google accountable with today's settlement," said Bonta.

    This is happening on my Android Cell even though I opp'd out,
    no surprise for me.

    It reminds me of the old "do not call lists" for telemarketers,
    all that did is give them real Phone Numbers that that can
    call from outside of US.

    <snip>

    --
    [t]csh(1) - "An elegant shell, for a more... civilized age."
    - Paraphrasing Star Wars

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  • From Oscar Mayer@21:1/5 to All on Mon Nov 20 21:38:06 2023
    XPost: misc.phone.mobile.iphone, alt.comp.software.firefox

    Google fined $93 million for deceiving users about tracking

    "Our investigation revealed that Google was telling its users one thing -
    that it would no longer track their location once they opted out - but
    doing the opposite and continuing to track its users' movements for its own commercial gain. That's unacceptable, and we're holding Google accountable
    with today's settlement," said Bonta.

    Bonta claims that Google misled consumers about how it gathered, stored,
    and used location data in a complaint filed with the proposed stipulated judgment. For instance, the complaint asserts that Google users were told
    in disclaimers that disabling the "Location History" feature would prevent Google from storing their location information.

    However, even after that move was made, Google continued to gather the
    user's location information from other sources.

    Under the new decision, Google must agree to a variety of injunctive restrictions that will safeguard the privacy rights of Californians and
    other citizens around the world. Users will now be able to see more
    information if location-related account options are enabled.

    Google will also increase the degree of openness regarding location
    tracking and publish a "Location Technologies" webpage that provides
    visitors with comprehensive information about the location data that Google gathers and how it is utilized.

    Users must continue to be vigilant and evaluate and modify their privacy settings to reflect their preferences and be constantly aware of how Google collects and uses their data.

    https://interestingengineering.com/innovation/google-fined-93-million-for-deceiving-users-about-tracking

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  • From Larry Wolff@21:1/5 to John McCue on Mon Nov 20 22:52:49 2023
    XPost: misc.phone.mobile.iphone, alt.comp.software.firefox

    On 11/21/2023 2:54 AM, John McCue wrote:

    Google fined $93 million for deceiving users about tracking

    To Google, that is just change found under the sofa's cushions :(
    Or in another way, the cost of doing business.

    If 93 Billion USD, then maybe they would stop.

    Same with Arizona's $85 Million settlement at about the same time. https://apnews.com/article/technology-business-lawsuits-arizona-440a27f1e7c2c672d3ccc727439978b4

    It follows up on a $392 Million settlement with 40 states. https://www.npr.org/2022/11/14/1136521305/google-settlement-location-tracking-data-privacy

    But just as with Apple, Google doesn't ever admit wrongdoing. https://blog.google/outreach-initiatives/public-policy/managing-your-location-data/

    So it didn't happen.

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  • From Peter@21:1/5 to Oscar Mayer on Tue Nov 21 04:00:13 2023
    XPost: misc.phone.mobile.iphone, alt.comp.software.firefox

    Oscar Mayer <nobody@oscarmayer.com> wrote:
    Google fined $93 million for deceiving users about tracking

    "Our investigation revealed that Google was telling its users one thing - that it would no longer track their location once they opted out - but
    doing the opposite and continuing to track its users' movements


    https://oag.ca.gov/system/files/attachments/press-docs/Filed%20stamped%20Google%20Complaint.pdf

    The lawsuit (pdf above) came along with a same-day settlement
    (pdf below) for $93 million to be paid to the state's general fund.

    https://oag.ca.gov/system/files/attachments/press-docs/Google%20Proposed%20Order%20FINAL%20%283%29.pdf

    It is around half a percent of Google's Q2 2023 net income of $18 billion.

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  • From david@21:1/5 to Peter on Mon Nov 20 21:19:06 2023
    XPost: misc.phone.mobile.iphone, alt.comp.software.firefox

    On 20/11/2023, Peter wrote:

    "Our investigation revealed that Google was telling its users one thing -
    that it would no longer track their location once they opted out - but
    doing the opposite and continuing to track its users' movements

    https://oag.ca.gov/system/files/attachments/press-docs/Filed%20stamped%20Google%20Complaint.pdf

    5. Google offers users three features, each with an "account level
    setting," through which Google collects, stores, and/or uses
    located-related data: Location History, Web & App Activity, and Ads Personalization. These three settings are "account level" because they can
    be enabled or disabled on a user-by-user basis within the user's account settings. Generally speaking, they are not device specific. As a result,
    for a particular Google account, Location History, Web & App Activity, and
    Ads Personalization would either be on or off, regardless of how many
    devices or apps were used to log into the account. Notably, these three settings differ from device-based settings, such as the toggle to turn on a phone's GPS or the app permissions that give particular apps access to that
    GPS data if enabled.

    6. As discussed further below, many users did not know of or understand Google's Location History and Web & App Activity settings, yet had
    unwittingly enabled them due to Google's deceptive disclosures, thereby allowing Google to track their precise location. In addition, Google misrepresented that when users disabled Ads Personalization it would stop
    using the user's location to target advertisements to those users, when in
    fact it continued to do so.

    GOOGLE DECEIVED USERS INTO ENABLING THE LOCATION HISTORY SETTING.

    7. Location History continually tracks a person's movements and the places
    they visit. When Location History is enabled, Google receives a person's updated location from their mobile phone. Google then creates a detailed record of a user's movements and place visits over time, storing this under
    the user's Maps Timeline. Google also stores information derived from
    Location History in other systems not visible to a user.

    8. Location History gives Google detailed insights into people's
    whereabouts and activities. Google can track when users arrive at and
    leave a location. Location History collects and stores such records about
    each person every single day.

    9. When a user creates a Google account, the Location History setting is supposedly off by default; however, from 2014 to 2018, Google showed users deceptive prompts when they used certain Google apps to mislead users into unwittingly enabling Location History.

    10. For example, when using Google Maps, Google showed users a pop-up that asked if the person wished to "[e]nhance [their] Google Maps experience" because "Google needs to periodically store your location to improve your search suggestions, route recommendations and more." However, by enabling
    this "enhancement," the user unknowingly turned on Location History, which allowed Google to collect and store the user's location account-wide-even outside Maps. By simply clicking on the button labelled "Yes, I'm in"
    within Google Maps, users were actually consenting to the collection and
    use of their location data 24/7 by Google. Defendant also failed to
    disclose the material fact that it was also using the location data for the wholly unrelated purpose of profiling the user for advertising purposes.

    GOOGLE MISLED USERS INTO BELIEVING THEY HAD CONTROL OVER GOOGLE'S
    COLLECTION AND USE OF THEIR LOCATION DATA.

    11. For years, Google promised its users that if they turned off the
    "Location History" setting, then Google would not store their location
    data. This assurance should already have been implied from the name of the setting (i.e., if you turn off "Location History" then naturally the
    company will not store your location history), but Google went further. It made its promise explicit in clear language on the help page for Location History that left no room for ambiguity:

    12. This statement was clear and direct, and it was also false. Even when
    a user turned Location History off, Google continued to collect and store
    that user's location data through other sources, including a user's Web &
    App Activity, which has been (and continues to be) defaulted to on when a
    user creates a Google account. The Location History help page statement is
    also false because even after a user turned off Location History, Google
    would not delete the previously collected Location History data for the
    user, but would continue to both store and use the data to serve
    geotargeted ads.

    13. Web & App Activity saves a record of a user's activities on various
    Google products and services, including a time-stamped location. As
    observed in a highly publicized AP article, with Location
    History off, Google continued recording user locations when they merely
    opened the Google Maps app, updated the daily weather on their phones, or
    even when they searched for items that had nothing at
    all to do with their location, like "chocolate chip cookies." [1]
    [1] Nakashima, AP Exclusive: Google Tracks Your Location, Like it or Not,
    AP News (Aug. 13, 2018) <https://apnews.com/article/north-america-science-technology-business-ap-top-news-828aefab64d4411bac257a07c1af0ecb>.

    14. Importantly, from around 2015 until 2019, Web & App Activity collected
    and stored precise location data, meaning the exact latitude and longitude coordinate. On any given day, a user could have had dozens of interactions with Google's services generating dozens of records of their precise
    location in Web & App Activity.

    15. Generally, most users have Web & App Activity enabled because for years Google didn't give users a choice to turn it off and Google's more recent account creation process defaulted users into enabling Web & App Activity.
    To change the default setting for Web & App Activity, users had to dig
    through a submenu during account creation. And repeatedly, Google stated
    that Web & App Activity merely "saves your activity on Google sites and
    apps" without specifying that this included location data associated with
    that activity, let alone that the company would use it for profiling and advertising.

    GOOGLE DECEIVED USERS ABOUT THEIR ABILITY TO OPT OUT OF GEOTARGETED ADS.

    16. The third account level setting is Ads Personalization. This setting governs the degree to which Google tailors advertisements on its massive advertising network to its users, including the extent to which Google uses location information to profile and target ads to consumers. But even when this setting is disabled, Google still uses people's location to geotarget
    ads at them.

    17. When users create an account, Google seemingly gives users the choice
    of whether to receive advertisements personalized to them:

    18. Users naturally assumed this means what it says: if they choose the
    option labeled "Show me ads that aren't personalized" then Google will not serve ads personalized to them. But that is not true. Even if a user
    turns off this setting, Google still uses the user's real-time location information to serve them targeted ads. Thus, contrary to the plain
    language of the setting options, users are not actually able to choose
    whether the ads they see are personalized to them.

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  • From =?UTF-8?Q?J=C3=B6rg_Lorenz?=@21:1/5 to All on Tue Nov 21 06:57:54 2023
    XPost: misc.phone.mobile.iphone, alt.comp.software.firefox

    Am 21.11.23 um 03:38 schrieb Oscar Mayer:
    Bonta claims that Google misled consumers about how it gathered, stored,
    and used location data in a complaint filed with the proposed stipulated judgment. For instance, the complaint asserts that Google users were told
    in disclaimers that disabling the "Location History" feature would prevent Google from storing their location information.

    However, even after that move was made, Google continued to gather the
    user's location information from other sources.

    Surprised?
    *Google is evil*
    Every Android user is naive. Only the switch to an iPhone or even better
    to a Linux smartphone would really improve the situation.

    The fine should have 10^2 or 10^3 times higher.

    --
    "Gutta cavat lapidem." (Ovid)

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  • From Hank Rogers@21:1/5 to hugybear@gmx.net on Tue Nov 21 06:13:14 2023
    XPost: misc.phone.mobile.iphone, alt.comp.software.firefox

    Jörg Lorenz <hugybear@gmx.net> wrote:
    Am 21.11.23 um 03:38 schrieb Oscar Mayer:
    Bonta claims that Google misled consumers about how it gathered, stored,
    and used location data in a complaint filed with the proposed stipulated
    judgment. For instance, the complaint asserts that Google users were told
    in disclaimers that disabling the "Location History" feature would prevent >> Google from storing their location information.

    However, even after that move was made, Google continued to gather the
    user's location information from other sources.

    Surprised?
    *Google is evil*
    Every Android user is naive. Only the switch to an iPhone or even better
    to a Linux smartphone would really improve the situation.

    The fine should have 10^2 or 10^3 times higher.


    That’s pretty childish, jughead.

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  • From Frank Slootweg@21:1/5 to Hank Rogers on Tue Nov 21 12:23:55 2023
    XPost: misc.phone.mobile.iphone, alt.comp.software.firefox

    Hank Rogers <Hank@nospam.invalid> wrote:
    Jörg Lorenz <hugybear@gmx.net> wrote:
    Am 21.11.23 um 03:38 schrieb Oscar Mayer:
    Bonta claims that Google misled consumers about how it gathered, stored, >> and used location data in a complaint filed with the proposed stipulated >> judgment. For instance, the complaint asserts that Google users were told >> in disclaimers that disabling the "Location History" feature would prevent >> Google from storing their location information.

    However, even after that move was made, Google continued to gather the
    user's location information from other sources.

    Surprised?
    *Google is evil*
    Every Android user is naive. Only the switch to an iPhone or even better
    to a Linux smartphone would really improve the situation.

    The fine should have 10^2 or 10^3 times higher.

    That?s pretty childish, jughead.

    Not only that, but this issue isn't about Android at all, so switching
    to iPhone or Linux or whatever isn't relevant, nor going to help.

    But I guess Apple zealots / Android bashers can't be bothered with
    'details' like that!

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  • From Oscar Mayer@21:1/5 to Frank Slootweg on Tue Nov 21 11:59:32 2023
    XPost: misc.phone.mobile.iphone, alt.comp.software.firefox

    On 21 Nov 2023 12:23:55 GMT, Frank Slootweg wrote:

    Not only that, but this issue isn't about Android at all, so switching
    to iPhone or Linux or whatever isn't relevant, nor going to help.

    It's obvious you didn't read either the original article nor the associated
    PDF as it's very much about Android and every operating system & browser.

    It's about signing into the Google Account.
    And it's about collecting personal data Google said they didn't collect.
    And the remediation & punishment thereof for doing that.

    If we had to choose what it's most about, it would directly affect anyone
    using Google Maps which is probably mostly Android and iOS devices, but
    people use Google maps on the desktop too.

    But it was more than just location data.

    It's also about the information Google gathered with the web browser
    because it's related to the Google Account that people often sign into
    using their favorite web browser.

    If there was a Chrome group, it would be relevant to them also.

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  • From Stan Brown@21:1/5 to Larry Wolff on Tue Nov 21 11:10:51 2023
    XPost: misc.phone.mobile.iphone, alt.comp.software.firefox

    On Mon, 20 Nov 2023 22:52:49 -0500, Larry Wolff wrote:
    But just as with Apple, Google doesn't ever admit wrongdoing. https://blog.google/outreach-initiatives/public-policy/managing-your-location-data/

    Virtually no corporation ever admits wrongdoing in a settlement. Such
    an admission could be used against them, in a criminal case.

    --
    Stan Brown, Tehachapi, California, USA https://BrownMath.com/
    Shikata ga nai...

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  • From Larry Wolff@21:1/5 to Stan Brown on Tue Nov 21 14:50:58 2023
    XPost: misc.phone.mobile.iphone, alt.comp.software.firefox

    On 11/21/2023 3:10 PM, Stan Brown wrote:

    But just as with Apple, Google doesn't ever admit wrongdoing.
    https://blog.google/outreach-initiatives/public-policy/managing-your-location-data/

    Virtually no corporation ever admits wrongdoing in a settlement. Such
    an admission could be used against them, in a criminal case.

    I know that, and you know that, but take a look at an Apple newsgroup and
    you will see them constantly claim Apple didn't do it because Apple paid
    half a billion dollars just because US lawyers were trying to scam them.

    There was even a criminal case against Apple which Apple settled and paid
    the criminal fine without pleading guilty (they agreed to some kind of no contest or something like that and had to pay & publish a public apology).

    The Apple people said because Apple wasn't "convicted" by a court, that the French prosecutors were only trying to extort Apple for more money.

    And, after the 30 days expired for the public apology on the Apple France
    web page, the Apple people said it didn't happen because Apple removed it.

    That's why I joked, since Google didn't admit guilt, it didn't happen. :->

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  • From Frank Slootweg@21:1/5 to Oscar Mayer on Wed Nov 22 15:36:21 2023
    XPost: misc.phone.mobile.iphone, alt.comp.software.firefox

    Oscar Mayer <nobody@oscarmayer.com> wrote:
    On 21 Nov 2023 12:23:55 GMT, Frank Slootweg wrote:

    Not only that, but this issue isn't about Android at all, so switching
    to iPhone or Linux or whatever isn't relevant, nor going to help.

    It's obvious you didn't read either the original article nor the associated PDF as it's very much about Android and every operating system & browser.

    Easy does it! You obviously did not read or did not comprehend my
    post.

    I wrote what I wrote, because I *did* read the article and Joerg
    clearly did *not*.

    It's about signing into the Google Account.

    Exactly. So - contrary to your above statement - it's *not* about
    Android - the OS -, but about the user's Google Account.

    Such a Google Account can be used on any platform, not just Android,
    hence my comment.

    And it's about collecting personal data Google said they didn't collect.
    And the remediation & punishment thereof for doing that.

    If we had to choose what it's most about, it would directly affect anyone using Google Maps which is probably mostly Android and iOS devices, but people use Google maps on the desktop too.

    Indeed, all platforms, not just Android and not just mobile.

    But it was more than just location data.

    It's also about the information Google gathered with the web browser
    because it's related to the Google Account that people often sign into
    using their favorite web browser.

    If there was a Chrome group, it would be relevant to them also.

    Thanks for confirming my point(s).

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  • From Nobody@21:1/5 to All on Wed Nov 22 17:38:22 2023
    XPost: misc.phone.mobile.iphone, alt.comp.software.firefox

    On 22 Nov 2023 15:36:21 GMT, Frank Slootweg <this@ddress.is.invalid>
    wrote:

    Oscar Mayer <nobody@oscarmayer.com> wrote:
    On 21 Nov 2023 12:23:55 GMT, Frank Slootweg wrote:

    Not only that, but this issue isn't about Android at all, so switching >> > to iPhone or Linux or whatever isn't relevant, nor going to help.

    It's obvious you didn't read either the original article nor the associated >> PDF as it's very much about Android and every operating system & browser.

    Easy does it! You obviously did not read or did not comprehend my
    post.

    I wrote what I wrote, because I *did* read the article and Joerg
    clearly did *not*.



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  • From Peter@21:1/5 to Nobody on Fri Nov 24 16:26:24 2023
    XPost: misc.phone.mobile.iphone, alt.comp.software.firefox

    Nobody <jock@soccer.com> wrote:
    I wrote what I wrote, because I *did* read the article and Joerg
    clearly did *not*.



    Jeorg/Jorg Lorenz is a moron. He only posts the first (& only) thought that comes to him the moment he sees anything on Usenet deemed juicy - where his resulting output is no better than the final results of his last meal.

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