• Re: Gorrilla glass and screen protector. What kind?

    From micky@21:1/5 to NONONOmisc07@fmguy.com on Sat Jun 10 18:13:39 2023
    In comp.mobile.android, on Sat, 10 Jun 2023 18:07:05 -0400, micky <NONONOmisc07@fmguy.com> wrote:

    I'm sure you've talked about this before, but my quesion is a little >different:

    If I have Gorilla Glass 5 for my screen, do I still need a screen
    protector?

    Do I want a film protector or tempered glass? I guess my big concern
    is whether I can put it on straight and without bubbles, and whether it
    makes tapping harder to do.

    TIA

    I should add that I carry my phone in my pocket with no keys or anything
    else that can scratch it -- I put such things in the other pocket -- and
    I've had it for 100 or 200 days without scratching it yet,

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From micky@21:1/5 to All on Sat Jun 10 18:07:05 2023
    I'm sure you've talked about this before, but my quesion is a little
    different:

    If I have Gorilla Glass 5 for my screen, do I still need a screen
    protector?

    Do I want a film protector or tempered glass? I guess my big concern
    is whether I can put it on straight and without bubbles, and whether it
    makes tapping harder to do.

    TIA

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Incubus@21:1/5 to micky on Sat Jun 10 22:19:32 2023
    On 2023-06-10, micky <NONONOmisc07@fmguy.com> wrote:
    I'm sure you've talked about this before, but my quesion is a little >>different:

    If I have Gorilla Glass 5 for my screen, do I still need a screen >>protector?

    Do I want a film protector or tempered glass? I guess my big concern
    is whether I can put it on straight and without bubbles, and whether it >>makes tapping harder to do.

    TIA

    I should add that I carry my phone in my pocket with no keys or anything
    else that can scratch it -- I put such things in the other pocket -- and
    I've had it for 100 or 200 days without scratching it yet,

    It's glass. No amount of advertising of clever names changes that.

    Just like you want an animal skin on your hands when you're hoeing the
    garden, you want glass on top of glass on a phone.

    Someone else's skin protects your skin. Same with phones.

    Until they make the screen out of something other than glass, that will
    always be the case that you will need to protect it from falls & scratches.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Joerg Lorenz@21:1/5 to All on Sun Jun 11 08:40:15 2023
    Am 11.06.23 um 00:07 schrieb micky:
    I'm sure you've talked about this before, but my quesion is a little different:

    If I have Gorilla Glass 5 for my screen, do I still need a screen
    protector?

    Do I want a film protector or tempered glass? I guess my big concern
    is whether I can put it on straight and without bubbles, and whether it
    makes tapping harder to do.

    Not needed. Buy a bumper with edges slightly higher than the level of
    the glass.

    Works here for 15 years on Androids and iPhones after I bricked two
    iPhone 3Gs.

    --
    Gutta cavat lapidem (Ovid)

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Ed Cryer@21:1/5 to micky on Sun Jun 11 09:25:23 2023
    micky wrote:
    In comp.mobile.android, on Sat, 10 Jun 2023 18:07:05 -0400, micky <NONONOmisc07@fmguy.com> wrote:

    I'm sure you've talked about this before, but my quesion is a little
    different:

    If I have Gorilla Glass 5 for my screen, do I still need a screen
    protector?

    Do I want a film protector or tempered glass? I guess my big concern
    is whether I can put it on straight and without bubbles, and whether it
    makes tapping harder to do.

    TIA

    I should add that I carry my phone in my pocket with no keys or anything
    else that can scratch it -- I put such things in the other pocket -- and
    I've had it for 100 or 200 days without scratching it yet,

    Not needed. in fact, more of a hindrance than a help. Same goes for iPad
    and other devices.

    I've been carrying mobile phones around everywhere I go for decades
    (usually in a breast-high coat pocket) without detriment of any kind.

    There are, however, some very clumsy people around. I've seen women
    reach into bags and drop phones on the ground; teenagers who love to
    throw their friends' phones around, and even pre-school kids drop cheap
    ones. But I doubt a simple screen-protector would have benefitted there.

    Ed

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From micky@21:1/5 to hugybear@gmx.ch on Sun Jun 11 08:41:20 2023
    In comp.mobile.android, on Sun, 11 Jun 2023 08:40:15 +0200, Joerg Lorenz <hugybear@gmx.ch> wrote:

    Am 11.06.23 um 00:07 schrieb micky:
    I'm sure you've talked about this before, but my quesion is a little
    different:

    If I have Gorilla Glass 5 for my screen, do I still need a screen
    protector?

    Do I want a film protector or tempered glass? I guess my big concern
    is whether I can put it on straight and without bubbles, and whether it
    makes tapping harder to do.

    Not needed. Buy a bumper with edges slightly higher than the level of
    the glass.

    That I have already. Thanks.

    Works here for 15 years on Androids and iPhones after I bricked two
    iPhone 3Gs.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From micky@21:1/5 to ed@somewhere.in.the.uk on Sun Jun 11 08:45:17 2023
    In comp.mobile.android, on Sun, 11 Jun 2023 09:25:23 +0100, Ed Cryer <ed@somewhere.in.the.uk> wrote:

    micky wrote:
    In comp.mobile.android, on Sat, 10 Jun 2023 18:07:05 -0400, micky
    <NONONOmisc07@fmguy.com> wrote:

    I'm sure you've talked about this before, but my quesion is a little
    different:

    If I have Gorilla Glass 5 for my screen, do I still need a screen
    protector?

    Do I want a film protector or tempered glass? I guess my big concern
    is whether I can put it on straight and without bubbles, and whether it
    makes tapping harder to do.

    TIA

    I should add that I carry my phone in my pocket with no keys or anything
    else that can scratch it -- I put such things in the other pocket -- and
    I've had it for 100 or 200 days without scratching it yet,

    Not needed. in fact, more of a hindrance than a help. Same goes for iPad
    and other devices.

    Sounds good to me. I think you're the first person to tell me what I
    wanted to hear.

    I've been carrying mobile phones around everywhere I go for decades
    (usually in a breast-high coat pocket) without detriment of any kind.

    There are, however, some very clumsy people around. I've seen women
    reach into bags and drop phones on the ground; teenagers who love to
    throw their friends' phones around, and even pre-school kids drop cheap
    ones. But I doubt a simple screen-protector would have benefitted there.

    This must be partly because they always have the phone in their hand,
    instead of a pocket I don't understand that.

    Have you seen the video -- I think think there are two different ones --
    of someone dropping her phone at Sea World or some such place, and the
    dolphin goes down, gets it, and brings it back up to her? It's not
    like they play Fetch with dolphins. He knew what was appropriate, by
    thinking, I guess.

    Ed

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From micky@21:1/5 to Incubus on Sun Jun 11 08:47:27 2023
    In comp.mobile.android, on Sat, 10 Jun 2023 22:19:32 -0000 (UTC),
    Incubus <u9536612@gmail.com> wrote:

    On 2023-06-10, micky <NONONOmisc07@fmguy.com> wrote:
    I'm sure you've talked about this before, but my quesion is a little >>>different:

    If I have Gorilla Glass 5 for my screen, do I still need a screen >>>protector?

    Do I want a film protector or tempered glass? I guess my big concern
    is whether I can put it on straight and without bubbles, and whether it >>>makes tapping harder to do.

    TIA

    I should add that I carry my phone in my pocket with no keys or anything
    else that can scratch it -- I put such things in the other pocket -- and
    I've had it for 100 or 200 days without scratching it yet,

    It's glass. No amount of advertising of clever names changes that.

    Just like you want an animal skin on your hands when you're hoeing the >garden, you want glass on top of glass on a phone.

    Someone else's skin protects your skin. Same with phones.

    Until they make the screen out of something other than glass, that will >always be the case that you will need to protect it from falls & scratches.

    You had me convinced until he ohers said what I wanted to hear. I will
    stop putting leaves and lawn trash in my right pocket and I will turn
    all my pockets inside out to get rid of any sand or dirt that is sitting
    at the bottom now.

    Of course, if I do scratch it, I'll regret this plan.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From AJL@21:1/5 to micky on Sun Jun 11 08:51:29 2023
    On 6/11/2023 5:47 AM, micky wrote:

    I will stop putting leaves and lawn trash in my right pocket and I
    will turn all my pockets inside out to get rid of any sand or dirt
    that is sitting at the bottom now. Of course, if I do scratch it,
    I'll regret this plan.

    How about a phone holster? There's no screen scratching and an added
    benefit is that it not only leaves the pants pocket free for more
    important junk but is also easier to answer than a pocketed ringing
    phone when sitting down. But be careful. Some cheap holsters can fall
    off your belt and/or the phone fall out. Mine costs a bit more but
    locks securely to my belt and also locks the phone in the holster
    so accidental loss is near impossible...

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Joerg Lorenz@21:1/5 to All on Sun Jun 11 18:11:28 2023
    Am 11.06.23 um 17:51 schrieb AJL:
    On 6/11/2023 5:47 AM, micky wrote:

    I will stop putting leaves and lawn trash in my right pocket and I
    will turn all my pockets inside out to get rid of any sand or dirt
    that is sitting at the bottom now. Of course, if I do scratch it,
    I'll regret this plan.

    How about a phone holster?

    That was the fashion in the late 90s and early 00s.
    Today the first thing that comes to my mind: "Elderly people can look so ridiculous".

    I'm already retired too. ;-)

    A more than 6" smartphone in a holster is not an option! For a Smith &
    Wesson it is.

    --
    Gutta cavat lapidem (Ovid)

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Frank Slootweg@21:1/5 to AJL on Sun Jun 11 17:53:49 2023
    AJL <noemail@none.com> wrote:
    On 6/11/2023 5:47 AM, micky wrote:

    I will stop putting leaves and lawn trash in my right pocket and I
    will turn all my pockets inside out to get rid of any sand or dirt
    that is sitting at the bottom now. Of course, if I do scratch it,
    I'll regret this plan.

    How about a phone holster? There's no screen scratching and an added
    benefit is that it not only leaves the pants pocket free for more
    important junk but is also easier to answer than a pocketed ringing
    phone when sitting down. But be careful. Some cheap holsters can fall
    off your belt and/or the phone fall out. Mine costs a bit more but
    locks securely to my belt and also locks the phone in the holster
    so accidental loss is near impossible...

    What (AFAIK) has not been mentioned yet, is a 'book cover'. I have
    used them for 'all' (three) my phones. (The first one was a 'flip' one,
    i.e. had the hinge at the bottom instead of on the left side, but the
    basic idea is the same.)

    They offer good/adequate protection, at least for my kind of use.

    Yes, it takes somewhat more time to pick up a phone call, but phone
    calls are *SO* last century.

    The inside normally has space for some creditcard-sized cards. So when
    I take my phone, I have all I need for most situations.

    Small downside: With the book cover, the phone does not fit well/
    easily in a holder to use for navigation while driving, so I have to
    take the phone out of the (flexible plastic) 'mounting' in the 'book'.
    That's a 'problem' for my T-Ford prototype, but more modern cars
    probably have Android Auto, so you can use the big screen for
    navigation.

    BUT, don't judge the book by its cover!

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From AJL@21:1/5 to Joerg Lorenz on Sun Jun 11 10:43:36 2023
    On 6/11/2023 9:11 AM, Joerg Lorenz wrote:
    Am 11.06.23 um 17:51 schrieb AJL:

    That [phone holster] was the fashion in the late 90s and early 00s.
    Today the first thing that comes to my mind: "Elderly people can look
    so ridiculous".

    I wear my shirt on the outside (thus a hidden holster)... ;)

    Though perhaps it's not all that hidden. I once had to lift my shirt for security when already inside Disneyland cause they thought I was packing.

    I'm already retired too. ;-)

    I live in a large retirement community and we flood the surrounding
    stores so the normal folks here are pretty already much used to us...

    A more than 6" smartphone in a holster is not an option!

    My phone (Galaxy S10+) is 6.4 inches. Lots of (stylish?) holsters
    currently available on Amazon...

    For a Smith & Wesson it is.

    My state (AZ-USA) allows open holster or concealed carry, no permit
    required. So the big decision of the day is: Gun in the pocket and phone
    in the holster or visa versa... ;)

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From The Real Bev@21:1/5 to Frank Slootweg on Sun Jun 11 12:07:07 2023
    On 6/11/23 10:53 AM, Frank Slootweg wrote:
    AJL <noemail@none.com> wrote:
    On 6/11/2023 5:47 AM, micky wrote:

    I will stop putting leaves and lawn trash in my right pocket and I
    will turn all my pockets inside out to get rid of any sand or dirt
    that is sitting at the bottom now. Of course, if I do scratch it,
    I'll regret this plan.

    How about a phone holster? There's no screen scratching and an added
    benefit is that it not only leaves the pants pocket free for more
    important junk but is also easier to answer than a pocketed ringing
    phone when sitting down. But be careful. Some cheap holsters can fall
    off your belt and/or the phone fall out. Mine costs a bit more but
    locks securely to my belt and also locks the phone in the holster
    so accidental loss is near impossible...

    What (AFAIK) has not been mentioned yet, is a 'book cover'. I have
    used them for 'all' (three) my phones. (The first one was a 'flip' one,
    i.e. had the hinge at the bottom instead of on the left side, but the
    basic idea is the same.)

    They offer good/adequate protection, at least for my kind of use.

    Yes, it takes somewhat more time to pick up a phone call, but phone
    calls are *SO* last century.

    The inside normally has space for some creditcard-sized cards. So when
    I take my phone, I have all I need for most situations.

    Small downside: With the book cover, the phone does not fit well/
    easily in a holder to use for navigation while driving, so I have to
    take the phone out of the (flexible plastic) 'mounting' in the 'book'.
    That's a 'problem' for my T-Ford prototype, but more modern cars
    probably have Android Auto, so you can use the big screen for
    navigation.

    BUT, don't judge the book by its cover!

    The pockets in women's pants are not all that functional, especially the
    ones in 'cargo shorts' which will carry a credit card and driver's
    license, a car key and maybe a lipstick. The book-cover things seem
    desirable, but would never fit in a back pocket. Why in hell NOT make
    women's jeans' front pockets longer?

    I put a faux-leather back+edge cover on mine and a matte plastic screen protector on the front. What I want is neon orange or green
    (blinkylights would be even better) so I can find it easily in my purse,
    but those colors seem to be out of fashion now. Either the protectors
    have gotten better or I've gotten more skillful, because I put the last
    one on without a single bubble. When the guy changed the battery he put
    a few scratches in the protector, but they seem to be healing themselves through some magical power. Matte is essential.

    --
    Cheers, Bev
    "Giving money and power to government is like giving whiskey
    and car keys to teenage boys." -- P.J. O'Rourke

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Joerg Lorenz@21:1/5 to All on Sun Jun 11 22:22:25 2023
    Am 11.06.23 um 19:43 schrieb AJL:
    On 6/11/2023 9:11 AM, Joerg Lorenz wrote:
    For a Smith & Wesson it is.

    My state (AZ-USA) allows open holster or concealed carry, no permit
    required. So the big decision of the day is: Gun in the pocket and phone
    in the holster or visa versa... ;)

    Carry the phone in the pocket. Even in our age it is not a pleasure to
    shoot the balls off unintentionally ... ;-)

    --
    De gustibus non est disputandum

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From micky@21:1/5 to NONONOmisc07@fmguy.com on Sun Jun 11 17:14:38 2023
    In comp.mobile.android, on Sun, 11 Jun 2023 08:45:17 -0400, micky <NONONOmisc07@fmguy.com> wrote:

    In comp.mobile.android, on Sun, 11 Jun 2023 09:25:23 +0100, Ed Cryer ><ed@somewhere.in.the.uk> wrote:

    micky wrote:
    In comp.mobile.android, on Sat, 10 Jun 2023 18:07:05 -0400, micky
    <NONONOmisc07@fmguy.com> wrote:

    I'm sure you've talked about this before, but my quesion is a little
    different:

    If I have Gorilla Glass 5 for my screen, do I still need a screen
    protector?

    Do I want a film protector or tempered glass? I guess my big concern >>>> is whether I can put it on straight and without bubbles, and whether it >>>> makes tapping harder to do.

    TIA

    I should add that I carry my phone in my pocket with no keys or anything >>> else that can scratch it -- I put such things in the other pocket -- and >>> I've had it for 100 or 200 days without scratching it yet,

    Not needed. in fact, more of a hindrance than a help. Same goes for iPad >>and other devices.

    Sounds good to me. I think you're the first person to tell me what I
    wanted to hear.

    I've been carrying mobile phones around everywhere I go for decades >>(usually in a breast-high coat pocket) without detriment of any kind.

    There are, however, some very clumsy people around. I've seen women
    reach into bags and drop phones on the ground; teenagers who love to
    throw their friends' phones around, and even pre-school kids drop cheap >>ones. But I doubt a simple screen-protector would have benefitted there.

    This must be partly because they always have the phone in their hand,
    instead of a pocket I don't understand that.

    Have you seen the video -- I think think there are two different ones --
    of someone dropping her phone at Sea World or some such place, and the >dolphin goes down, gets it, and brings it back up to her? It's not
    like they play Fetch with dolphins. He knew what was appropriate, by >thinking, I guess.

    From youtube, it seems like there is no organized playing of fetch with dolphins, no training, but sometimes they do it spontaneiously.

    https://www.google.com/search?client=firefox-b-1-d&q=play+Fetch+with+dolphins.

    What's interesting to me about this one is not the little boy and his
    playmate, but all the people in the background. I guess they are paying
    big bucks to swim with the dophines. I hope the dolphins don't mind.
    It doesn't say where this was,
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pU3dGZkRoHU
    I once went to some place like this but people were on a dock and
    sometimes the dolphins would show up and I think you could pet them but
    in the 15 minutes I was there, the dolphins all spurned me . Well I
    don't take that from anyone so I got impatient and left. This was on
    the sea and the dolphins were free to come and go to the sea and even
    the ocean, but I think they hang out there because of medical care,
    movies, and free food.

    Ed

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Bob Henson@21:1/5 to The Real Bev on Mon Jun 12 08:23:02 2023
    On 11.6.23 8:07 pm, The Real Bev wrote:
    On 6/11/23 10:53 AM, Frank Slootweg wrote:
    AJL <noemail@none.com> wrote:
    On 6/11/2023 5:47 AM, micky wrote:

    I will stop putting leaves and lawn trash in my right pocket and I
    will turn all my pockets inside out to get rid of any sand or dirt
    that is sitting at the bottom now. Of course, if I do scratch it,
    I'll regret this plan.

    How about a phone holster? There's no screen scratching and an added
    benefit is that it not only leaves the pants pocket free for more
    important junk but is also easier to answer than a pocketed ringing
    phone when sitting down. But be careful. Some cheap holsters can fall
    off your belt and/or the phone fall out. Mine costs a bit more but
    locks securely to my belt and also locks the phone in the holster
    so accidental loss is near impossible...

    What (AFAIK) has not been mentioned yet, is a 'book cover'. I have
    used them for 'all' (three) my phones. (The first one was a 'flip' one,
    i.e. had the hinge at the bottom instead of on the left side, but the
    basic idea is the same.)

    They offer good/adequate protection, at least for my kind of use.

    Yes, it takes somewhat more time to pick up a phone call, but phone
    calls are *SO* last century.

    The inside normally has space for some creditcard-sized cards. So when
    I take my phone, I have all I need for most situations.

    Small downside: With the book cover, the phone does not fit well/
    easily in a holder to use for navigation while driving, so I have to
    take the phone out of the (flexible plastic) 'mounting' in the 'book'.
    That's a 'problem' for my T-Ford prototype, but more modern cars
    probably have Android Auto, so you can use the big screen for
    navigation.

    BUT, don't judge the book by its cover!

    The pockets in women's pants are not all that functional, especially the
    ones in 'cargo shorts' which will carry a credit card and driver's
    license, a car key and maybe a lipstick. The book-cover things seem desirable, but would never fit in a back pocket. Why in hell NOT make women's jeans' front pockets longer?

    I put a faux-leather back+edge cover on mine and a matte plastic screen protector on the front. What I want is neon orange or green
    (blinkylights would be even better) so I can find it easily in my purse,
    but those colors seem to be out of fashion now. Either the protectors
    have gotten better or I've gotten more skillful, because I put the last
    one on without a single bubble. When the guy changed the battery he put
    a few scratches in the protector, but they seem to be healing themselves through some magical power. Matte is essential.


    I made my own. SWMBO gave me some leather-working tools to try to keep
    me out of mischief for an hour or two, so I sewed up a thin leather case
    that just fits the phone with a top flap that fastens down with a
    popper, and a loop on the back to go on a belt. It's a tad like the belt
    purses we used to wear to folk-club gatherings back when folk music was
    trendy. I don't suppose it would go down a storm with the ladies though
    - but it works and you don't have to search for it. I suppose a lot of
    the youngsters have handbags anyway these days, now it's becoming
    compulsory to be of a non-specific gender.

    --
    Bob,
    Tetbury, Gloucestershire, England

    If you tell the truth, you don't have to remember anything. — Mark Twain

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Ken Blake@21:1/5 to AJL on Mon Jun 12 09:44:34 2023
    On Sun, 11 Jun 2023 08:51:29 -0700, AJL <noemail@none.com> wrote:

    On 6/11/2023 5:47 AM, micky wrote:

    I will stop putting leaves and lawn trash in my right pocket and I
    will turn all my pockets inside out to get rid of any sand or dirt
    that is sitting at the bottom now. Of course, if I do scratch it,
    I'll regret this plan.

    How about a phone holster? There's no screen scratching and an added
    benefit is that it not only leaves the pants pocket free for more
    important junk but is also easier to answer than a pocketed ringing
    phone when sitting down. But be careful. Some cheap holsters can fall
    off your belt and/or the phone fall out. Mine costs a bit more but
    locks securely to my belt and also locks the phone in the holster
    so accidental loss is near impossible...


    I've tried a couple and they fell off my belt. Which one do you have
    that doesn't fall?

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From AJL@21:1/5 to Ken Blake on Mon Jun 12 17:53:14 2023
    On 6/12/23 9:44 AM, Ken Blake wrote:
    On Sun, 11 Jun 2023 08:51:29 -0700, AJL <noemail@none.com> wrote:

    How about a phone holster? There's no screen scratching and an added >>benefit is that it not only leaves the pants pocket free for more
    important junk but is also easier to answer than a pocketed ringing
    phone when sitting down. But be careful. Some cheap holsters can fall
    off your belt and/or the phone fall out. Mine costs a bit more but
    locks securely to my belt and also locks the phone in the holster
    so accidental loss is near impossible...

    I've tried a couple and they fell off my belt.

    You need a holster that has to be threaded on, not clipped over your belt.
    The only way it can fall off is for your belt to break.

    Which one do you have that doesn't fall?

    I've had my holster for years. And even if I remembered the particulars it
    probably wouldn't fit your phone. Try Amazon. Search for a holster for your
    model. There will be many, most of which use clips. But there should be
    several that thread on and thus can't fall off...

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)