• Just when you think things cannot get sillier.

    From Sylvia Else@21:1/5 to All on Wed Jul 5 12:47:12 2023
    <https://www.servicesaustralia.gov.au/sites/default/files/ms040-2107en-f.pdf>

    This is some random government admin form for Australia.

    One's email address is to be entered in paragraph 6.

    I have never before seen a requirement to enter an email address as two separate fields, with the @ provided by the form.

    I can see where this is headed. The next version of the form will expect
    one to select the last element from a drop-down list containing ".com,
    .net, etc." For sure, some suffix or other will get omitted from the
    list, and the poor user will be stuck. [*]

    Sylvia.

    [*] Of course, this is a PDF form, one can print it out, scribble on it,
    and let the government's admin people figure it out, but anyway.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
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  • From John@21:1/5 to Sylvia Else on Wed Jul 5 05:13:34 2023
    Sylvia Else <sylvia@email.invalid> writes:

    <https://www.servicesaustralia.gov.au/sites/default/files/ms040-2107en-f.pdf>

    This is some random government admin form for Australia.

    One's email address is to be entered in paragraph 6.

    I have never before seen a requirement to enter an email address as
    two separate fields, with the @ provided by the form.

    I can see where this is headed. The next version of the form will
    expect one to select the last element from a drop-down list containing
    ".com, .net, etc." For sure, some suffix or other will get omitted
    from the list, and the poor user will be stuck. [*]

    Sylvia.

    [*] Of course, this is a PDF form, one can print it out, scribble on
    it, and let the government's admin people figure it out, but anyway.

    As someone whose email is <firstname>@<first initial+lastname>.net I've
    had plenty of trouble with people who don't expect anything but gmail/yahoo/whatever after I say "at", and also get slightly concerned
    when I don't finish it all with "dot com". This has resulted in many interesting manglings of my email, with the most memorable ending in
    @aol.com long after AOL was a going concern.

    Really it seems reasonable enough and the biggest problem I see is that
    they implement it as two lines, rather than [ ]@[ ] all on one
    line. The inability to enter a bang-path email will not be a source of
    many calls to the help line, I wager.

    I see no reason why your guessed-at next version would come about, least
    of all because it would mess up people who prefer to print it out and
    scribble.


    John

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  • From Computer Nerd Kev@21:1/5 to John on Wed Jul 5 17:15:24 2023
    John <john@building-m.simplistic-anti-spam-measure.net> wrote:
    As someone whose email is <firstname>@<first initial+lastname>.net I've
    had plenty of trouble with people who don't expect anything but gmail/yahoo/whatever after I say "at", and also get slightly concerned
    when I don't finish it all with "dot com".

    I usually try to spell mine out, which either goes smoothly or
    causes so much confusion that by the end even I'm not sure what
    my email address is anymore.

    But worst by far though are websites that just say something like
    "invalid email" or "spam detected" unless you use a common email
    provider's domain (even an uncommon email provider isn't enough
    for some websites).

    This has resulted in many
    interesting manglings of my email, with the most memorable ending in
    @aol.com long after AOL was a going concern.

    To be fair, email addresses @aol.com are still in wide circulation.
    Their DMARC reports come from yahoo.com.

    --
    __ __
    #_ < |\| |< _#

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
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  • From Bob Eager@21:1/5 to Computer Nerd Kev on Wed Jul 5 11:03:06 2023
    On Wed, 05 Jul 2023 17:15:24 +1000, Computer Nerd Kev wrote:

    John <john@building-m.simplistic-anti-spam-measure.net> wrote:
    As someone whose email is <firstname>@<first initial+lastname>.net I've
    had plenty of trouble with people who don't expect anything but
    gmail/yahoo/whatever after I say "at", and also get slightly concerned
    when I don't finish it all with "dot com".

    I usually try to spell mine out, which either goes smoothly or causes so
    much confusion that by the end even I'm not sure what my email address
    is anymore.

    But worst by far though are websites that just say something like
    "invalid email" or "spam detected" unless you use a common email
    provider's domain (even an uncommon email provider isn't enough for some websites).

    I am one of those who use addresses of the form 'company@example.com',
    with 'company' being the name of the people to whom I am giving the
    address.

    A certain professional society got most upset at THEIR name being part of
    my email address, implying I was running some kind of scam. To be fair,
    they were OK once they finally understood.



    --
    Using UNIX since v6 (1975)...

    Use the BIG mirror service in the UK:
    http://www.mirrorservice.org

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Sylvia Else@21:1/5 to Computer Nerd Kev on Wed Jul 5 21:57:43 2023
    On 05-July-23 5:15 pm, Computer Nerd Kev wrote:
    John <john@building-m.simplistic-anti-spam-measure.net> wrote:
    As someone whose email is <firstname>@<first initial+lastname>.net I've
    had plenty of trouble with people who don't expect anything but
    gmail/yahoo/whatever after I say "at", and also get slightly concerned
    when I don't finish it all with "dot com".

    I usually try to spell mine out, which either goes smoothly or
    causes so much confusion that by the end even I'm not sure what
    my email address is anymore.

    But worst by far though are websites that just say something like
    "invalid email" or "spam detected" unless you use a common email
    provider's domain (even an uncommon email provider isn't enough
    for some websites).



    On the subject of alleged spam, I recently had an issue with the
    government of the Northern Territory in Australia. They were bouncing my
    emails on the basis that the server to which they would have to send
    reply emails was alleged (falsely, BTW, since I control it) to be a
    source of spam.

    This was not the server that was sending them the email, so their
    position seemed to me to be rather unreasonable. I did eventually get
    them to whitelist the address. It took them a while to work out how.

    Oh, and their initial suggested solution was that I send my emails from
    a gmail address instead - i.e. one of the world's biggest sources of spam.

    Sylvia.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Blue-Maned_Hawk@21:1/5 to All on Wed Jul 5 11:19:19 2023
    T24gNy80LzIzIDIyOjQ3LCBTeWx2aWEgRWxzZSB3cm90ZToNCj4gPGh0dHBzOi8vd3d3LnNl cnZpY2VzYXVzdHJhbGlhLmdvdi5hdS9zaXRlcy9kZWZhdWx0L2ZpbGVzL21zMDQwLTIxMDdl bi1mLnBkZj4NCj4gDQo+IFRoaXMgaXMgc29tZSByYW5kb20gZ292ZXJubWVudCBhZG1pbiBm b3JtIGZvciBBdXN0cmFsaWEuDQo+IA0KPiBPbmUncyBlbWFpbCBhZGRyZXNzIGlzIHRvIGJl IGVudGVyZWQgaW4gcGFyYWdyYXBoIDYuDQo+IA0KPiBJIGhhdmUgbmV2ZXIgYmVmb3JlIHNl ZW4gYSByZXF1aXJlbWVudCB0byBlbnRlciBhbiBlbWFpbCBhZGRyZXNzIGFzIHR3byANCj4g c2VwYXJhdGUgZmllbGRzLCB3aXRoIHRoZSBAIHByb3ZpZGVkIGJ5IHRoZSBmb3JtLg0KPiAN Cj4gSSBjYW4gc2VlIHdoZXJlIHRoaXMgaXMgaGVhZGVkLiBUaGUgbmV4dCB2ZXJzaW9uIG9m IHRoZSBmb3JtIHdpbGwgZXhwZWN0IA0KPiBvbmUgdG8gc2VsZWN0IHRoZSBsYXN0IGVsZW1l bnQgZnJvbSBhIGRyb3AtZG93biBsaXN0IGNvbnRhaW5pbmcgIi5jb20sIA0KPiAubmV0LCBl dGMuIiBGb3Igc3VyZSwgc29tZSBzdWZmaXggb3Igb3RoZXIgd2lsbCBnZXQgb21pdHRlZCBm cm9tIHRoZSANCj4gbGlzdCwgYW5kIHRoZSBwb29yIHVzZXIgd2lsbCBiZSBzdHVjay4gWypd DQo+IA0KPiBTeWx2aWEuDQo+IA0KPiBbKl0gT2YgY291cnNlLCB0aGlzIGlzIGEgUERGIGZv cm0sIG9uZSBjYW4gcHJpbnQgaXQgb3V0LCBzY3JpYmJsZSBvbiBpdCwgDQo+IGFuZCBsZXQg dGhlIGdvdmVybm1lbnQncyBhZG1pbiBwZW9wbGUgZmlndXJlIGl0IG91dCwgYnV0IGFueXdh eS4NCg0K4oCLQSB0ZXN0YW1lbnQgdG8gdGhlIGZhaWx1cmUgb2YgZWR1Y2F0aW9uIGluIGNv bXB1dGVyIGxpdGVyYWN5Lg0KDQotLSANCuKal++4jiB8IC9ibHUubcmbaW4uZMqwYWsvIHwg c2hvcnRlbnMgdG8gIkhhd2siIHwgaGUvaGltL2hpcy9oaW1zZWxmL01yLg0KYmx1ZW1hbmVk aGF3ay5naXRodWIuaW8NCkJpdGNoZXMgc3RvbGUgbXkgd2hvbGUgYXNzIOKQlPCfrZbhqrPh t7/wnbyX4beN4o+n8JKSq/CQu77go5vihonvv73ig6MgcXVvdGVkLXByaW50YWJsZSwgY2Fu J3QgDQpoYXZlIHNoaXQgaW4gVGh1bmRlcmJpcmQg8J+YqQ0KDQo=

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
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  • From Jim Jackson@21:1/5 to Computer Nerd Kev on Wed Jul 5 21:11:43 2023
    On 2023-07-05, Computer Nerd Kev <not@telling.you.invalid> wrote:
    John <john@building-m.simplistic-anti-spam-measure.net> wrote:
    As someone whose email is <firstname>@<first initial+lastname>.net I've
    had plenty of trouble with people who don't expect anything but
    gmail/yahoo/whatever after I say "at", and also get slightly concerned
    when I don't finish it all with "dot com".

    I usually try to spell mine out, which either goes smoothly or
    causes so much confusion that by the end even I'm not sure what
    my email address is anymore.

    But worst by far though are websites that just say something like
    "invalid email" or "spam detected" unless you use a common email
    provider's domain (even an uncommon email provider isn't enough
    for some websites).

    just so that this isn't seen as common - I have a personal domain and
    email and have never had a problem with people or web sites questioning
    my email address in 20 odd years.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Bob Eager@21:1/5 to Theo on Wed Jul 5 22:02:09 2023
    On Wed, 05 Jul 2023 22:23:57 +0100, Theo wrote:

    Bob Eager <news0009@eager.cx> wrote:
    I am one of those who use addresses of the form 'company@example.com',
    with 'company' being the name of the people to whom I am giving the
    address.

    A certain professional society got most upset at THEIR name being part
    of my email address, implying I was running some kind of scam. To be
    fair, they were OK once they finally understood.

    I've had that actually blocked. I think it was aliexpress@example.com
    being rejected from registering, but ali@example.com is fine.

    I was just told off over the phone, so I had a chance to respond!

    --
    Using UNIX since v6 (1975)...

    Use the BIG mirror service in the UK:
    http://www.mirrorservice.org

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Bob Eager@21:1/5 to Jim Jackson on Wed Jul 5 22:02:59 2023
    On Wed, 05 Jul 2023 21:11:43 +0000, Jim Jackson wrote:

    On 2023-07-05, Computer Nerd Kev <not@telling.you.invalid> wrote:
    John <john@building-m.simplistic-anti-spam-measure.net> wrote:
    As someone whose email is <firstname>@<first initial+lastname>.net
    I've had plenty of trouble with people who don't expect anything but
    gmail/yahoo/whatever after I say "at", and also get slightly concerned
    when I don't finish it all with "dot com".

    I usually try to spell mine out, which either goes smoothly or causes
    so much confusion that by the end even I'm not sure what my email
    address is anymore.

    But worst by far though are websites that just say something like
    "invalid email" or "spam detected" unless you use a common email
    provider's domain (even an uncommon email provider isn't enough for
    some websites).

    just so that this isn't seen as common - I have a personal domain and
    email and have never had a problem with people or web sites questioning
    my email address in 20 odd years.

    I used to get the TLD rejected, but it's been OK for some years now.

    (it's .CX)



    --
    Using UNIX since v6 (1975)...

    Use the BIG mirror service in the UK:
    http://www.mirrorservice.org

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Theo@21:1/5 to Bob Eager on Wed Jul 5 22:23:57 2023
    Bob Eager <news0009@eager.cx> wrote:
    I am one of those who use addresses of the form 'company@example.com',
    with 'company' being the name of the people to whom I am giving the
    address.

    A certain professional society got most upset at THEIR name being part of
    my email address, implying I was running some kind of scam. To be fair,
    they were OK once they finally understood.

    I've had that actually blocked. I think it was aliexpress@example.com being rejected from registering, but ali@example.com is fine.

    Theo

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Bruce Horrocks@21:1/5 to Sylvia Else on Wed Jul 5 23:20:05 2023
    On 05/07/2023 03:47, Sylvia Else wrote:
    <https://www.servicesaustralia.gov.au/sites/default/files/ms040-2107en-f.pdf>

    This is some random government admin form for Australia.

    One's email address is to be entered in paragraph 6.

    I have never before seen a requirement to enter an email address as two separate fields, with the @ provided by the form.

    I can see where this is headed. The next version of the form will expect
    one to select the last element from a drop-down list containing ".com,
    .net, etc." For sure, some suffix or other will get omitted from the
    list, and the poor user will be stuck. [*]

    Sylvia.

    [*] Of course, this is a PDF form, one can print it out, scribble on it,
    and let the government's admin people figure it out, but anyway.


    Just to be contrary, the form seems perfectly reasonable to me.

    It's obviously based on a paper form so including a printed @ to
    encourage users to clearly separate the two parts of their email seems
    no worse than including slashes to separate the elements of a date, or
    brackets to separate the area code from the telephone number.


    --
    Bruce Horrocks
    Surrey, England

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  • From Computer Nerd Kev@21:1/5 to Bob Eager on Thu Jul 6 09:16:26 2023
    Bob Eager <news0009@eager.cx> wrote:
    On Wed, 05 Jul 2023 21:11:43 +0000, Jim Jackson wrote:
    On 2023-07-05, Computer Nerd Kev <not@telling.you.invalid> wrote:
    But worst by far though are websites that just say something like
    "invalid email" or "spam detected" unless you use a common email
    provider's domain (even an uncommon email provider isn't enough for
    some websites).

    just so that this isn't seen as common - I have a personal domain and
    email and have never had a problem with people or web sites questioning
    my email address in 20 odd years.

    I used to get the TLD rejected, but it's been OK for some years now.

    (it's .CX)

    The ones that I've had rejected are .com and/or .net. Oracle Cloud
    were one example, which was surprising because you'd think they'd
    encounter a lot of people with email addresses at company domains.

    One website fails registration with a very vague error unless I use
    a particular address with the only relevant characteristic seeming
    to be that it's longer than all my others. I've got no idea what's
    going on there.

    --
    __ __
    #_ < |\| |< _#

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
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  • From Andy Burns@21:1/5 to Jim Jackson on Thu Jul 6 07:46:06 2023
    Jim Jackson wrote:

    just so that this isn't seen as common - I have a personal domain and
    email and have never had a problem with people or web sites questioning
    my email address in 20 odd years.

    I've had cases where people assume I've given them an incorrect email
    address, so they've "corrected it" e.g. I give them theircompanyname@andyburns.uk and they send to
    theircompanyname@andyburns.CO.uk

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
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  • From Bob Eager@21:1/5 to Andy Burns on Thu Jul 6 08:12:04 2023
    On Thu, 06 Jul 2023 07:46:06 +0100, Andy Burns wrote:

    Jim Jackson wrote:

    just so that this isn't seen as common - I have a personal domain and
    email and have never had a problem with people or web sites questioning
    my email address in 20 odd years.

    I've had cases where people assume I've given them an incorrect email address, so they've "corrected it" e.g. I give them theircompanyname@andyburns.uk and they send to theircompanyname@andyburns.CO.uk

    Me too. In my case, bobeager.uk (for the website too, they say it's not
    there because they use .co.uk)



    --
    Using UNIX since v6 (1975)...

    Use the BIG mirror service in the UK:
    http://www.mirrorservice.org

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Marco Moock@21:1/5 to All on Thu Jul 6 21:10:14 2023
    Am 05.07.2023 um 05:13:34 Uhr schrieb John:

    The inability to enter a bang-path email will not be a source of
    many calls to the help line, I wager.

    I think they won't be able to deliver it - they most likely don't
    support UUCP.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
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  • From Scott Dorsey@21:1/5 to mo01@posteo.de on Thu Jul 6 23:26:55 2023
    In article <u873im$10qtc$1@dont-email.me>, Marco Moock <mo01@posteo.de> wrote: >Am 05.07.2023 um 05:13:34 Uhr schrieb John:

    The inability to enter a bang-path email will not be a source of
    many calls to the help line, I wager.

    I think they won't be able to deliver it - they most likely don't
    support UUCP.

    Just route it through inhp4.hp.com and let them worry about it.
    --scott

    --
    "C'est un Nagra. C'est suisse, et tres, tres precis."

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
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  • From Mike Spencer@21:1/5 to Bob Eager on Fri Jul 7 04:08:39 2023
    Bob Eager <news0009@eager.cx> writes:

    On Thu, 06 Jul 2023 07:46:06 +0100, Andy Burns wrote:

    Jim Jackson wrote:

    just so that this isn't seen as common - I have a personal domain and
    email and have never had a problem with people or web sites questioning
    my email address in 20 odd years.

    I've had cases where people assume I've given them an incorrect email
    address, so they've "corrected it" e.g. I give them
    theircompanyname@andyburns.uk and they send to
    theircompanyname@andyburns.CO.uk

    Me too. In my case, bobeager.uk (for the website too, they say it's not
    there because they use .co.uk)

    I've had people *in Canada*, who notionally should know better, correct
    my [user]@[hostname].ca to [user]@[hostname].com. [hostname].com
    resolves and has an MX so the clue-challenged sender doesn't get any
    clue back.

    --
    Mike Spencer Nova Scotia, Canada

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  • From Spiros Bousbouras@21:1/5 to Mike Spencer on Fri Jul 7 10:56:29 2023
    On 07 Jul 2023 04:08:39 -0300
    Mike Spencer <mds@bogus.nodomain.nowhere> wrote:

    Bob Eager <news0009@eager.cx> writes:

    On Thu, 06 Jul 2023 07:46:06 +0100, Andy Burns wrote:
    I've had cases where people assume I've given them an incorrect email
    address, so they've "corrected it" e.g. I give them
    theircompanyname@andyburns.uk and they send to
    theircompanyname@andyburns.CO.uk

    Me too. In my case, bobeager.uk (for the website too, they say it's not there because they use .co.uk)

    I've had people *in Canada*, who notionally should know better, correct
    my [user]@[hostname].ca to [user]@[hostname].com.

    I can't imagine what it must be like for someone who has a
    [user]@[hostname].co email address. May as well give up on that.

    [hostname].com
    resolves and has an MX so the clue-challenged sender doesn't get any
    clue back.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
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