The same personality traits that make people react
to troll postings might make them spread unconfirmed
ideas about the meaning of "C" in "CPython".
The /core/ of CPython is written in C.
CPython is the /canonical/ implementation of Python.
The "C" in "CPython" stands for C.
Do you have any credible reference to your assertion "The "C" in
"CPython" stands for C."?
Not so "unconfirmed"!
Look at this article, I recently read: >https://www.analyticsinsight.net/cpython-to-step-over-javascript-in-developing-web-applications/
There is a sentence in ther that begins with "CPython, short for Core
Python, a reference implementation that other Python distributions are >derived from, ...".
Anyway, I wrote "IMHO".
Do you have any credible reference to your assertion "The "C" in
"CPython" stands for C."?
Paulo da Silva <p_d_a_s_i_l_v_a_ns@nonetnoaddress.pt> writes:
Do you have any credible reference to your assertion "The "C" in
"CPython" stands for C."?
Whether a source is considered "credible" is something
everyone must decide for themselves.
I can say that the overwhelming majority of results of Web
searches about this topic yields expressions of the view
that the "C" in "CPython" stands for C, "overwhelming
majority" when compared to expressions of other interpretations
of that "C", and "overwhelming majority" meaning something
like more than 90 percent.
For one example, there seems to be a book "CPython Internals"
which seems to say, according to one Web search engine:
|The C in CPython is a reference to the C programming
|language, indicating that this Python distribution is
|written in the C language.
On 21/06/2022 09.47, Roel Schroeven wrote:
...
So we have an untrustworthy site that's the only one to claim that
CPython is short for Core Python, and we have an official site that says CPython is so named because it's written in C. Hm, which one to believe?
...and so you can C that the only important part is the Python!
So we have an untrustworthy site that's the only one to claim that
CPython is short for Core Python, and we have an official site that says CPython is so named because it's written in C. Hm, which one to believe?
Paulo da Silva schreef op 20/06/2022 om 21:01:
Às 18:19 de 20/06/22, Stefan Ram escreveu:
The same personality traits that make people react
to troll postings might make them spread unconfirmed
ideas about the meaning of "C" in "CPython".
The /core/ of CPython is written in C.
CPython is the /canonical/ implementation of Python.
The "C" in "CPython" stands for C.
Not so "unconfirmed"!
Look at this article, I recently read: https://www.analyticsinsight.net/cpython-to-step-over-javascript-in-developing-web-applications/
There is a sentence in ther that begins with "CPython, short for Core Python, a reference implementation that other Python distributions are derived from, ...".
Counterpoint: https://wiki.python.org/moin/SummerOfCode/2017/python-core
says "The reference implementation of Python is CPython, so named
because it's written in C." Even in the absence of other evidence I'd
much rather trust a python.org page than a www.analyticsinsight.net page
on the subject of Python implementations.
But there's more.
Apart from www.analyticsinsight.net I can't find any website that
mentions "Core Python" as a Python implementation. That's a strong
indication that www.analyticsinsight.net is wrong on that point. Frankly
that website seems very low quality in general. In that same article
they say:
"CPython is a descendant of Pyscript built on Pyodide, a port of
CPython, or a Python distribution for the browser and Node.js that is
based on Webassembly and Emscripten."
CPython is definitely not a descendant of Pyscript! Looks like someone
found something (semi-) interesting and tried to write something
insightful about it, but without really understanding any of it. Other articles don't seem to be any better.
So we have an untrustworthy site that's the only one to claim that
CPython is short for Core Python, and we have an official site that says CPython is so named because it's written in C. Hm, which one to believe?
Às 18:19 de 20/06/22, Stefan Ram escreveu:
The same personality traits that make people react
to troll postings might make them spread unconfirmed
ideas about the meaning of "C" in "CPython".
The /core/ of CPython is written in C.
CPython is the /canonical/ implementation of Python.
The "C" in "CPython" stands for C.
Not so "unconfirmed"!
Look at this article, I recently read: https://www.analyticsinsight.net/cpython-to-step-over-javascript-in-developing-web-applications/
There is a sentence in ther that begins with "CPython, short for Core
Python, a reference implementation that other Python distributions are derived from, ...".
On Tue, 21 Jun 2022 at 08:01, dn <PythonList@danceswithmice.info> wrote:
On 21/06/2022 09.47, Roel Schroeven wrote:
...
So we have an untrustworthy site that's the only one to claim that
CPython is short for Core Python, and we have an official site that says >>> CPython is so named because it's written in C. Hm, which one to believe?
...and so you can C that the only important part is the Python!
I should have cn that coming.
Às 18:19 de 20/06/22, Stefan Ram escreveu:
The same personality traits that make people react
to troll postings might make them spread unconfirmed
ideas about the meaning of "C" in "CPython".
The /core/ of CPython is written in C.
CPython is the /canonical/ implementation of Python.
The "C" in "CPython" stands for C.
Not so "unconfirmed"!
Look at this article, I recently read: https://www.analyticsinsight.net/cpython-to-step-over-javascript-in-developing-web-applications/
There is a sentence in ther that begins with "CPython, short for Core
Python, a reference implementation that other Python distributions are derived from, ...".
Anyway, I wrote "IMHO".
Do you have any credible reference to your assertion "The "C" in
"CPython" stands for C."?
Thank you.
Às 20:01 de 20/06/22, Paulo da Silva escreveu:
Às 18:19 de 20/06/22, Stefan Ram escreveu:
The same personality traits that make people react
to troll postings might make them spread unconfirmed
ideas about the meaning of "C" in "CPython".
The /core/ of CPython is written in C.
CPython is the /canonical/ implementation of Python.
The "C" in "CPython" stands for C.
Not so "unconfirmed"!
Look at this article, I recently read: https://www.analyticsinsight.net/cpython-to-step-over-javascript-in-developing-web-applications/
There is a sentence in ther that begins with "CPython, short for Core Python, a reference implementation that other Python distributions are derived from, ...".
Anyway, I wrote "IMHO".
Do you have any credible reference to your assertion "The "C" in
"CPython" stands for C."?
Thank you.
Well ... I read the responses and they are not touching the point!
I just answered, with my opinion based on articles I have read in the
past. Certainly I could not be sure. That's why I responded as an
opinion (IMHO) and not as an assertion.
Stefan Ram responded with a, at least, not very polite post.
That's why I needed to somehow "defend" why I posted that response, and,
BTW, trying to learn why he said that the C in CPython means "written in C".
I still find very strange, to not say weird, that a compiler or
interpreter has a name based in the language it was written. But, again,
is just my opinion and nothing more.
Yes, CPython has a special place because it's the reference
implementation and the most popular, but the one thing that makes it
distinct from all the others is that it's implemented in C.
On Tue, 21 Jun 2022 at 11:13, Paulo da Silva <p_d_a_s_i_l_v_a_ns@nonetnoaddress.pt> wrote:Notice that they are, for example, Jython and not JPython.
Às 20:01 de 20/06/22, Paulo da Silva escreveu:
Às 18:19 de 20/06/22, Stefan Ram escreveu:
The same personality traits that make people react
to troll postings might make them spread unconfirmed
ideas about the meaning of "C" in "CPython".
The /core/ of CPython is written in C.
CPython is the /canonical/ implementation of Python.
The "C" in "CPython" stands for C.
Not so "unconfirmed"!
Look at this article, I recently read:
https://www.analyticsinsight.net/cpython-to-step-over-javascript-in-developing-web-applications/
There is a sentence in ther that begins with "CPython, short for Core
Python, a reference implementation that other Python distributions are
derived from, ...".
Anyway, I wrote "IMHO".
Do you have any credible reference to your assertion "The "C" in
"CPython" stands for C."?
Thank you.
Well ... I read the responses and they are not touching the point!
I just answered, with my opinion based on articles I have read in the
past. Certainly I could not be sure. That's why I responded as an
opinion (IMHO) and not as an assertion.
Stefan Ram responded with a, at least, not very polite post.
That's why I needed to somehow "defend" why I posted that response, and,
BTW, trying to learn why he said that the C in CPython means "written in C". >>
I still find very strange, to not say weird, that a compiler or
interpreter has a name based in the language it was written. But, again,
is just my opinion and nothing more.
Not sure why it's strange. The point is to distinguish "CPython" from "Jython" or "Brython" or "PyPy" or any of the other implementations.
On Tue, 21 Jun 2022 at 11:13, Paulo da Silva <p_d_a_s_i_l_v_a_ns@nonetnoaddress.pt> wrote:
Às 20:01 de 20/06/22, Paulo da Silva escreveu:
Às 18:19 de 20/06/22, Stefan Ram escreveu:
The same personality traits that make people react
to troll postings might make them spread unconfirmed
ideas about the meaning of "C" in "CPython".
The /core/ of CPython is written in C.
CPython is the /canonical/ implementation of Python.
The "C" in "CPython" stands for C.
Not so "unconfirmed"!
Look at this article, I recently read:
https://www.analyticsinsight.net/cpython-to-step-over-javascript-in-developing-web-applications/
There is a sentence in ther that begins with "CPython, short for Core
Python, a reference implementation that other Python distributions are
derived from, ...".
Anyway, I wrote "IMHO".
Do you have any credible reference to your assertion "The "C" in
"CPython" stands for C."?
Thank you.
Well ... I read the responses and they are not touching the point!
I just answered, with my opinion based on articles I have read in the
past. Certainly I could not be sure. That's why I responded as an
opinion (IMHO) and not as an assertion.
Stefan Ram responded with a, at least, not very polite post.
That's why I needed to somehow "defend" why I posted that response, and,
BTW, trying to learn why he said that the C in CPython means "written in C". >>
I still find very strange, to not say weird, that a compiler or
interpreter has a name based in the language it was written. But, again,
is just my opinion and nothing more.
Not sure why it's strange. The point is to distinguish "CPython" from "Jython" or "Brython" or "PyPy" or any of the other implementations.
Yes, CPython has a special place because it's the reference
implementation and the most popular, but the one thing that makes it
distinct from all the others is that it's implemented in C.
I could, perhaps, create my own interpreter and name it "RosuavPython"
after myself, but when something's made by a team, it's usually more
useful to pick something that is fundamental to it (Brython is
designed to be run in a browser, Jython is written in Python to make
it easy to call on Java classes, etc).
ChrisA
Às 18:19 de 20/06/22, Stefan Ram escreveu:
The same personality traits that make people react
to troll postings might make them spread unconfirmed
ideas about the meaning of "C" in "CPython".
The /core/ of CPython is written in C.
CPython is the /canonical/ implementation of Python.
The "C" in "CPython" stands for C.
Not so "unconfirmed"!
Look at this article, I recently read: https://www.analyticsinsight.net/cpython-to-step-over-javascript-in-developing-web-applications/
There is a sentence in ther that begins with "CPython, short for Core Python, a reference implementation that other Python distributions are derived from, ...".
Anyway, I wrote "IMHO".
Do you have any credible reference to your assertion "The "C" in
"CPython" stands for C."?
Thank you.
On 2022-06-21 02:33, Chris Angelico wrote:Yes, but that does not necessarily means that the C has to refer to the language of implementation. It may well be a "core" reference to
On Tue, 21 Jun 2022 at 11:13, Paulo da SilvaAnd just to make it clear, the interpreter/compiler _itself_ is still
<p_d_a_s_i_l_v_a_ns@nonetnoaddress.pt> wrote:
Às 20:01 de 20/06/22, Paulo da Silva escreveu:
Às 18:19 de 20/06/22, Stefan Ram escreveu:https://www.analyticsinsight.net/cpython-to-step-over-javascript-in-developing-web-applications/
The same personality traits that make people react
to troll postings might make them spread unconfirmed
ideas about the meaning of "C" in "CPython".
The /core/ of CPython is written in C.
CPython is the /canonical/ implementation of Python.
The "C" in "CPython" stands for C.
Not so "unconfirmed"!
Look at this article, I recently read:
There is a sentence in ther that begins with "CPython, short for Core
Python, a reference implementation that other Python distributions are >>> > derived from, ...".
Anyway, I wrote "IMHO".
Do you have any credible reference to your assertion "The "C" in
"CPython" stands for C."?
Thank you.
Well ... I read the responses and they are not touching the point!
I just answered, with my opinion based on articles I have read in the
past. Certainly I could not be sure. That's why I responded as an
opinion (IMHO) and not as an assertion.
Stefan Ram responded with a, at least, not very polite post.
That's why I needed to somehow "defend" why I posted that response, and, >>> BTW, trying to learn why he said that the C in CPython means "written
in C".
I still find very strange, to not say weird, that a compiler or
interpreter has a name based in the language it was written. But, again, >>> is just my opinion and nothing more.
Not sure why it's strange. The point is to distinguish "CPython" from
"Jython" or "Brython" or "PyPy" or any of the other implementations.
Yes, CPython has a special place because it's the reference
implementation and the most popular, but the one thing that makes it
distinct from all the others is that it's implemented in C.
called "python". "CPython" is a name/term that was applied retroactively
to that particular implementation when another implementation appeared.
I don't even want to think fo what sound a C# Python would make.
Às 03:20 de 21/06/22, MRAB escreveu:
On 2022-06-21 02:33, Chris Angelico wrote:Yes, but that does not necessarily means that the C has to refer to the language of implementation. It may well be a "core" reference to
On Tue, 21 Jun 2022 at 11:13, Paulo da SilvaAnd just to make it clear, the interpreter/compiler _itself_ is still called "python". "CPython" is a name/term that was applied retroactively
<p_d_a_s_i_l_v_a_ns@nonetnoaddress.pt> wrote:
Às 20:01 de 20/06/22, Paulo da Silva escreveu:
Às 18:19 de 20/06/22, Stefan Ram escreveu:https://www.analyticsinsight.net/cpython-to-step-over-javascript-in-developing-web-applications/
The same personality traits that make people react
to troll postings might make them spread unconfirmed
ideas about the meaning of "C" in "CPython".
The /core/ of CPython is written in C.
CPython is the /canonical/ implementation of Python.
The "C" in "CPython" stands for C.
Not so "unconfirmed"!
Look at this article, I recently read:
There is a sentence in ther that begins with "CPython, short for Core >>> > Python, a reference implementation that other Python distributions are >>> > derived from, ...".
Anyway, I wrote "IMHO".
Do you have any credible reference to your assertion "The "C" in
"CPython" stands for C."?
Thank you.
Well ... I read the responses and they are not touching the point!
I just answered, with my opinion based on articles I have read in the
past. Certainly I could not be sure. That's why I responded as an
opinion (IMHO) and not as an assertion.
Stefan Ram responded with a, at least, not very polite post.
That's why I needed to somehow "defend" why I posted that response, and, >>> BTW, trying to learn why he said that the C in CPython means "written
in C".
I still find very strange, to not say weird, that a compiler or
interpreter has a name based in the language it was written. But, again, >>> is just my opinion and nothing more.
Not sure why it's strange. The point is to distinguish "CPython" from
"Jython" or "Brython" or "PyPy" or any of the other implementations.
Yes, CPython has a special place because it's the reference
implementation and the most popular, but the one thing that makes it
distinct from all the others is that it's implemented in C.
to that particular implementation when another implementation appeared.
distinguish that implementation from others with different behaviors.
Let's say they reimplement "reference python" CPython in Rust. What is better? Change the "reference python" CPython name to RPython, for
example, or let it as CPython?
It's my opinion that it should stay as CPython.
After all who cares in which language it is implemented?
Às 03:20 de 21/06/22, MRAB escreveu:
On 2022-06-21 02:33, Chris Angelico wrote:
On Tue, 21 Jun 2022 at 11:13, Paulo da Silva
<p_d_a_s_i_l_v_a_ns@nonetnoaddress.pt> wrote:
Às 20:01 de 20/06/22, Paulo da Silva escreveu:
Às 18:19 de 20/06/22, Stefan Ram escreveu:
After all who cares in which language it is implemented?
Regards.
Paulo
Let's say they reimplement "reference python" CPython in Rust. What is better? Change the "reference python" CPython name to RPython, for
example, or let it as CPython?
This leads to the extremely important question of what would an implementation of Python, written completely in C++, be called?
Notice that they are, for example, Jython and not JPython.
indication that www.analyticsinsight.net is wrong on that point. Frankly
that website seems very low quality in general. In that same article
they say:
"CPython is a descendant of Pyscript built on Pyodide, a port of
CPython, or a Python distribution for the browser and Node.js that is
based on Webassembly and Emscripten."
CPython is definitely not a descendant of Pyscript! Looks like someone
found something (semi-) interesting and tried to write something
insightful about it, but without really understanding any of it. Other articles don't seem to be any better.
Am 20.06.22 um 22:47 schrieb Roel Schroeven:
"CPython is a descendant of Pyscript built on Pyodide, a port ofTo me, this sentence is so badly cobbled together that it could be the
CPython, or a Python distribution for the browser and Node.js that is
based on Webassembly and Emscripten."
output of a KI of some sort (GPT-3) trying to summarize stuff from the
web.
Jython *was* originally called JPython, but that was judged to be
a trademark violation and they were made to change it.
I don't know how MicroPython has escaped the same fate to date.
I don't even want to think fo what sound a C# Python would make.
What? I never heard of such a dispute. The PSF got after someone about
it? Sheesh.
I still find very strange, to not say weird, that a compiler or
interpreter has a name based in the language it was written. But, again,
is just my opinion and nothing more.
Although if it were called RPython, no doubt a new debate would
flare up over whether the "R" stands for "Rust" or "Reference"...
Not sure why it's strange. The point is to distinguish "CPython" from "Jython" or "Brython" or "PyPy" or any of the other implementations.
Yes, CPython has a special place because it's the reference
implementation and the most popular, but the one thing that makes it
distinct from all the others is that it's implemented in C.
Yes, but that does not necessarily means that the C has to refer to the language of implementation. It may well be a "core" reference to
distinguish that implementation from others with different behaviors.
Às 02:33 de 21/06/22, Chris Angelico escreveu:
On Tue, 21 Jun 2022 at 11:13, Paulo da SilvaNotice that they are, for example, Jython and not JPython.
<p_d_a_s_i_l_v_a_ns@nonetnoaddress.pt> wrote:
Às 20:01 de 20/06/22, Paulo da Silva escreveu:
Às 18:19 de 20/06/22, Stefan Ram escreveu:
The same personality traits that make people react
to troll postings might make them spread unconfirmed
ideas about the meaning of "C" in "CPython".
The /core/ of CPython is written in C.
CPython is the /canonical/ implementation of Python.
The "C" in "CPython" stands for C.
Not so "unconfirmed"!
Look at this article, I recently read:
https://www.analyticsinsight.net/cpython-to-step-over-javascript-in-developing-web-applications/
There is a sentence in ther that begins with "CPython, short for Core
Python, a reference implementation that other Python distributions are >>>> derived from, ...".
Anyway, I wrote "IMHO".
Do you have any credible reference to your assertion "The "C" in
"CPython" stands for C."?
Thank you.
Well ... I read the responses and they are not touching the point!
I just answered, with my opinion based on articles I have read in the
past. Certainly I could not be sure. That's why I responded as an
opinion (IMHO) and not as an assertion.
Stefan Ram responded with a, at least, not very polite post.
That's why I needed to somehow "defend" why I posted that response, and, >>> BTW, trying to learn why he said that the C in CPython means "written in C".
I still find very strange, to not say weird, that a compiler or
interpreter has a name based in the language it was written. But, again, >>> is just my opinion and nothing more.
Not sure why it's strange. The point is to distinguish "CPython" from
"Jython" or "Brython" or "PyPy" or any of the other implementations.
There is also Cython that is a different thing.
And YES. You have the right to not feel that as strange.
This leads to the extremely important question of what would an implementation of Python, written completely in C++, be called?
C++Python
CPython++
C+Python+
DPython
SeaPython?
SeeSeaSiPython
I don't even want to think fo what sound a C# Python would make.like R, are also partially based on C in similar ways.
OK, my apologies to all. Being an interpreted language, it makes sense for a good part of the interpreter to include parts made in other languages and also add-on libraries in even older languages like FORTRAN. Quite a few languages, including some
Let's say they reimplement "reference python" CPython in Rust. What is better? Change the "reference python" CPython name to RPython, for
example, or let it as CPython?
My problem with that idea is, believe it or not, that it is too negative. What youmeant to be seen as a dash is a minus sign to me. And both C and C++ not onlyhave both a pre and post autoincrement variable using ++x and x++, they also haveautodecrement operators using a minus sign such as --x and x-- and it can getpretty weird trying to figure out if some code is legal, let alone what it does, withoutparentheses. I mean what the heck does this do?
y = x++-++x
On 2022-06-21, Chris Angelico <ros...@gmail.com> wrote:
Not sure why it's strange. The point is to distinguish "CPython" from "Jython" or "Brython" or "PyPy" or any of the other implementations.I've been using CPython (and reading this list) for over 20 years, and there's no doubt in my mind that the C in CPython has always been
Yes, CPython has a special place because it's the reference
implementation and the most popular, but the one thing that makes it distinct from all the others is that it's implemented in C.
interpreted by 99+ percent of the Python community as meaning the implementation language.
Sort of like ckermit <https://www.kermitproject.org/> was the original implementation of Kermit written in C. At the time, the other popular implementations (for DOS, IBM, etc.) were written in assembly.
On 2022-06-21 03:52, Avi Gross via Python-list wrote:
CincPython?
This leads to the extremely important question of what would an
implementation of Python, written completely in C++, be called?
C++Python
CPython++
C+Python+
DPython
SeaPython?
SeeSeaSiPython
Python+=1
Let's say they reimplement "reference python" CPython in Rust. What is
better? Change the "reference python" CPython name to RPython, for
example, or let it as CPython?
The C implementation would still be called CPython, and the new >implementation might be called RPython, or RustyPython, or whatever.
The names are independent of which one is currently blessed as the
reference implementation.
Let's say they reimplement "reference python" CPython in Rust. What is
better? Change the "reference python" CPython name to RPython, for
example, or let it as CPython?
The C implementation would still be called CPython, and the new >implementation might be called RPython, or RustyPython, or whatever.
The names are independent of which one is currently blessed as the
reference implementation.
David,
I am curious why you are undertaking the effort to take a language already decades old and showing signs of being a tad rusty into a language
that suggests further oxidation.
More seriously, I am interested in what this can gain and the intended
user
base. I studied Rust for a while and it has it's features but have had no opportunity to use it. Is it expected to make a faster version of Python,
or enable better connections to libraries and so on?
What I mean is that if you are planning on making it pass all tests for python functionality, are you also adding unique features or ... ?
My preference is to have names that fully include what they are about.
So the name "python" would be left intact rather than mangled, even if
the name itself happens to be totally meaningless. So may I suggest
something like """rustic-python""" ?
-----Original Message-----
From: David J W <ward.davidj@gmail.com>
To: python-list@python.org
Sent: Thu, Jun 23, 2022 10:29 am
Subject: Re: "CPython"
Let's say they reimplement "reference python" CPython in Rust. What is
better? Change the "reference python" CPython name to RPython, for
example, or let it as CPython?
The C implementation would still be called CPython, and the new >implementation might be called RPython, or RustyPython, or whatever.
The names are independent of which one is currently blessed as the >reference implementation.
I am at the pre planning stages of making a Rust implementation of the
Python virtual machine and to avoid ambiguity I've been working with Rython as the name. I tried looking for a Monty Python themed name but the good ones seem to be taken.
Otherwise as for a timeline, solo I figure it's going to take me a couple years to get something that actually passes cpython's python unit-tests.
--
https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Let's say they reimplement "reference python" CPython in Rust. What is
better? Change the "reference python" CPython name to RPython, for
example, or let it as CPython?
The C implementation would still be called CPython, and the new >implementation might be called RPython, or RustyPython, or whatever.
The names are independent of which one is currently blessed as the
reference implementation.
I studied Rust for a while and it has it's features but have had no opportunity to use it. Is it expected to make a faster version of
Python, or enable better connections to libraries and so on?
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