• The PL/I Family

    From Robin Vowels@21:1/5 to All on Thu Aug 4 16:37:07 2022
    http://teampli.net/plifamily.html

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  • From Wolfman Jack@21:1/5 to Robin Vowels on Fri Aug 5 03:59:15 2022
    The link to PLUM is dead.

    On Friday, August 5, 2022 at 1:37:08 AM UTC+2, Robin Vowels wrote:
    http://teampli.net/plifamily.html

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  • From John W Kennedy@21:1/5 to Robin Vowels on Tue Aug 9 17:52:59 2022
    On 8/4/22 7:37 PM, Robin Vowels wrote:
    http://teampli.net/plifamily.html

    BRUIN /was/ distributed with CMS, but it’s far more similar to BASIC
    than to PL/I. https://usermanual.wiki/m/8f03e3390fa44cee401a987c285272e33c4c8c38355ea6e470fdbbf5d093ce9b.pdf
    The idea that BRUIN is a PL/I-like language seems to be a
    misinterpretation of the early statement that it was hoped that the
    combination of BRUIN and PL/I would cover most university needs apart
    from actual computer science.

    FAPL (Format and Protocol Language) was a language based on PL/I that
    was originally used for more precisely documenting SNA (IBM’s Systems
    Network Architecure). However, when the DPPX operating system (for small 8100-series computers, later ported to small 370s) came out, a compiler
    was built for FAPL to create the DPPX SNA stack.

    Late in the 1960s, OS/360 and DOS/360 and their descendants changed from Assembler to PL/I as a gross syntactic model for option strings and
    command languages. Compare the PARM= strings of the F-Compiler to the Optimizing Compiler, IEHPROGM to IDCAMS, or JCL to TSO commands, all
    with a systematic change from optionname=value to optionname(value).

    --
    John W. Kennedy
    Algernon Burbage, Lord Roderick, Father Martin, Bishop Baldwin,
    King Pellinore, Captain Bailey, Merlin -- A Kingdom for a Stage!

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  • From Peter Flass@21:1/5 to John W Kennedy on Wed Aug 10 07:35:28 2022
    John W Kennedy <john.w.kennedy@gmail.com> wrote:
    On 8/4/22 7:37 PM, Robin Vowels wrote:
    http://teampli.net/plifamily.html

    BRUIN /was/ distributed with CMS, but it’s far more similar to BASIC
    than to PL/I. https://usermanual.wiki/m/8f03e3390fa44cee401a987c285272e33c4c8c38355ea6e470fdbbf5d093ce9b.pdf

    The idea that BRUIN is a PL/I-like language seems to be a
    misinterpretation of the early statement that it was hoped that the combination of BRUIN and PL/I would cover most university needs apart
    from actual computer science.

    FAPL (Format and Protocol Language) was a language based on PL/I that
    was originally used for more precisely documenting SNA (IBM’s Systems Network Architecure). However, when the DPPX operating system (for small 8100-series computers, later ported to small 370s) came out, a compiler
    was built for FAPL to create the DPPX SNA stack.

    Late in the 1960s, OS/360 and DOS/360 and their descendants changed from Assembler to PL/I as a gross syntactic model for option strings and
    command languages. Compare the PARM= strings of the F-Compiler to the Optimizing Compiler, IEHPROGM to IDCAMS, or JCL to TSO commands, all
    with a systematic change from optionname=value to optionname(value).


    Interesting, thanks John. I guess I need to update the page.

    --
    Pete

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  • From Robin Vowels@21:1/5 to bearlyabus...@gmail.com on Tue Aug 23 23:21:54 2022
    On Thursday, August 11, 2022 at 12:35:29 AM UTC+10, bearlyabus...@gmail.com wrote:

    Interesting, thanks John. I guess I need to update the page.

    The Q1/Lite micro had a subset of PL/I.

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  • From John Cowan@21:1/5 to John W. Kennedy on Mon Sep 5 13:22:32 2022
    On Tuesday, August 9, 2022 at 5:53:04 PM UTC-4, John W. Kennedy wrote:

    The idea that BRUIN is a PL/I-like language seems to be a
    misinterpretation of the early statement that it was hoped that the combination of BRUIN and PL/I would cover most university needs apart
    from actual computer science.

    Or perhaps from a misreading of the statement in the BRUIN manual that
    BRUIN was derived from PIL (Pittsburgh Interactive Language). It actually looks

    --
    IF IF = THEN THEN THEN = ELSE ELSE ELSE = IF;

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  • From John W Kennedy@21:1/5 to John Cowan on Tue Sep 6 14:51:36 2022
    On 9/5/22 4:22 PM, John Cowan wrote:
    On Tuesday, August 9, 2022 at 5:53:04 PM UTC-4, John W. Kennedy wrote:

    The idea that BRUIN is a PL/I-like language seems to be a
    misinterpretation of the early statement that it was hoped that the
    combination of BRUIN and PL/I would cover most university needs apart
    from actual computer science.

    Or perhaps from a misreading of the statement in the BRUIN manual that
    BRUIN was derived from PIL (Pittsburgh Interactive Language). It actually looks

    (posting unfinished?)

    That seems credible. I can’t find anything definite on PIL, but it was apparently based on JOSS, and a quick look at JOSS shows that BRUIN is a
    near relation.


    --
    IF IF = THEN THEN THEN = ELSE ELSE ELSE = IF;

    --
    John W. Kennedy
    Algernon Burbage, Lord Roderick, Father Martin, Bishop Baldwin,
    King Pellinore, Captain Bailey, Merlin -- A Kingdom for a Stage!

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  • From John Cowan@21:1/5 to John W. Kennedy on Tue Sep 6 12:18:17 2022
    On Tuesday, September 6, 2022 at 2:51:43 PM UTC-4, John W. Kennedy wrote:

    Or perhaps from a misreading of the statement in the BRUIN manual that BRUIN was derived from PIL (Pittsburgh Interactive Language). It actually looks
    (posting unfinished?)

    Yes, somehow I trashed my last few words, "like JOSS/FOCAL/MUMPS". I hate having to use a trackpad.

    --
    IF IF = THEN THEN THEN = ELSE ELSE ELSE = IF;

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  • From Peter Flass@21:1/5 to John W Kennedy on Tue Sep 6 12:33:55 2022
    John W Kennedy <john.w.kennedy@gmail.com> wrote:
    On 9/5/22 4:22 PM, John Cowan wrote:
    On Tuesday, August 9, 2022 at 5:53:04 PM UTC-4, John W. Kennedy wrote:

    The idea that BRUIN is a PL/I-like language seems to be a
    misinterpretation of the early statement that it was hoped that the
    combination of BRUIN and PL/I would cover most university needs apart
    from actual computer science.

    Or perhaps from a misreading of the statement in the BRUIN manual that
    BRUIN was derived from PIL (Pittsburgh Interactive Language). It actually >> looks

    (posting unfinished?)

    That seems credible. I can’t find anything definite on PIL, but it was apparently based on JOSS, and a quick look at JOSS shows that BRUIN is a
    near relation.


    I guess I’ll just delete BRUIN from the list. I couldn’t find much information on BRUIN, but I thought it sounded like it was an interactive subset of PL/I, like CPL (IBM’s or DEC’s). A lot of the old stuff is just gone now, leaving nothing but a trace in the literature.


    --
    IF IF = THEN THEN THEN = ELSE ELSE ELSE = IF;




    --
    Pete

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  • From Robin Vowels@21:1/5 to bearlyabus...@gmail.com on Tue Sep 6 21:34:58 2022
    On Wednesday, September 7, 2022 at 5:33:56 AM UTC+10, bearlyabus...@gmail.com wrote:
    .
    I guess I’ll just delete BRUIN from the list. I couldn’t find much information on BRUIN, but I thought it sounded like it was an interactive subset of PL/I, like CPL (IBM’s or DEC’s). A lot of the old stuff is just
    gone now, leaving nothing but a trace in the literature.
    .
    Perhaps you could you add Optimising PL/I for CDC Cyber and Cyber 76?

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  • From Peter Flass@21:1/5 to Robin Vowels on Wed Sep 7 06:50:17 2022
    Robin Vowels <robin.vowels@gmail.com> wrote:
    On Wednesday, September 7, 2022 at 5:33:56 AM UTC+10, bearlyabus...@gmail.com wrote:
    .
    I guess I’ll just delete BRUIN from the list. I couldn’t find much
    information on BRUIN, but I thought it sounded like it was an interactive
    subset of PL/I, like CPL (IBM’s or DEC’s). A lot of the old stuff is just
    gone now, leaving nothing but a trace in the literature.
    .
    Perhaps you could you add Optimising PL/I for CDC Cyber and Cyber 76?


    That page is supposed to be languages based on or resembling PL/I, not
    actual PL/I compilers. Is there any documentation on CDC PL/I? There was
    also a UNIVAC 1100 PL/I (I know because I had a job porting some code to Linux), but unfortunately the only documentation I have is a reference
    card.

    --
    Pete

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  • From Robin Vowels@21:1/5 to bearlyabus...@gmail.com on Mon Oct 3 00:17:08 2022
    On Wednesday, September 7, 2022 at 11:50:18 PM UTC+10, bearlyabus...@gmail.com wrote:
    Robin Vowels <robin....@gmail.com> wrote:
    On Wednesday, September 7, 2022 at 5:33:56 AM UTC+10, bearlyabus...@gmail.com wrote:
    .
    I guess I’ll just delete BRUIN from the list. I couldn’t find much
    information on BRUIN, but I thought it sounded like it was an interactive >> subset of PL/I, like CPL (IBM’s or DEC’s). A lot of the old stuff is just
    gone now, leaving nothing but a trace in the literature.
    .
    Perhaps you could you add Optimising PL/I for CDC Cyber and Cyber 76?

    That page is supposed to be languages based on or resembling PL/I, not actual PL/I compilers. Is there any documentation on CDC PL/I?
    .
    I'll see what I can find.

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  • From Robin Vowels@21:1/5 to Robin Vowels on Mon Oct 3 00:20:28 2022
    On Wednesday, August 24, 2022 at 4:21:55 PM UTC+10, Robin Vowels wrote:
    On Thursday, August 11, 2022 at 12:35:29 AM UTC+10, bearlyabus...@gmail.com wrote:

    Interesting, thanks John. I guess I need to update the page.
    .
    The Q1/Lite micro had a subset of PL/I.
    .
    I've scanned the PL/I manual for this machine.
    If anyone fancies a copy, please drop me a line.

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  • From Robin Vowels@21:1/5 to Robin Vowels on Tue Oct 4 07:09:58 2022
    On Wednesday, August 24, 2022 at 4:21:55 PM UTC+10, Robin Vowels wrote:
    On Thursday, August 11, 2022 at 12:35:29 AM UTC+10, bearlyabus...@gmail.com wrote:

    The Q1/Lite micro had a subset of PL/I.
    .
    This site has manuals and good photos:
    .
    http://www.peel.dk/Q1/

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