• ANSI x3.21-1967?

    From Stewart Russell@21:1/5 to Van Snyder on Mon Jul 26 09:25:59 2021
    On Wednesday, May 20, 2009 at 5:01:06 p.m. UTC-4, Van Snyder wrote:
    Does anybody have a copy of ANSI x3.21-1967, now known as ANSI INCITS 21-1967?

    Nothing like a timely answer, but the Internet Archive does, as "Federal Information Processing Standards Publication: rectangular holes in twelve-row punched cards" — https://archive.org/details/federalinformati13nati/mode/2up , aka FIPS PUB 13.

    A typical punched card *hole* was 3.175 mm tall and 1.397 mm wide. The only available IBM card stock specification¹ suggests it was 161.1 gsm ("99 pound basis weight") so each chad had a mass of 0.000715 g.

    ¹: http://ibm-1401.info/CardStockSpecifications.html

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  • From gah4@21:1/5 to Stewart Russell on Mon Jul 26 11:20:28 2021
    On Monday, July 26, 2021 at 9:26:03 AM UTC-7, Stewart Russell wrote:

    (snip)

    Nothing like a timely answer, but the Internet Archive does,
    as "Federal Information Processing Standards Publication: rectangular holes in twelve-row punched cards" —
    https://archive.org/details/federalinformati13nati/mode/2up , aka FIPS PUB 13.

    A typical punched card *hole* was 3.175 mm tall and 1.397 mm wide.
    The only available IBM card stock specification¹ suggests it was 161.1 gsm ("99 pound basis weight") so each chad had a mass of 0.000715 g.

    The Living Computer Museum has an 029 keypunch, and when they were open
    (before Covid restrictions) I punched a Fortran 2008, and later a Fortran 2013 program on one. I believe the latter used a DO CONCURRENT statement.
    (And both were fixed-form, as you might expect on cards.)

    Maybe the only Fortran 2013 program ever punched on cards.

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  • From Thomas Koenig@21:1/5 to gah4@u.washington.edu on Mon Jul 26 19:56:08 2021
    gah4 <gah4@u.washington.edu> schrieb:

    Maybe the only Fortran 2013 program ever punched on cards.

    Probably, since Fortran 2013 is not a very widely used language :-)

    (I assume you meant Fortran 2018, and what you wrote is probably
    true for that as well)

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  • From steve kargl@21:1/5 to All on Mon Jul 26 20:45:45 2021
    gah4 wrote:

    On Monday, July 26, 2021 at 9:26:03 AM UTC-7, Stewart Russell wrote:

    (snip)

    Nothing like a timely answer, but the Internet Archive does,
    as "Federal Information Processing Standards Publication: rectangular holes in twelve-row punched cards" —
    https://archive.org/details/federalinformati13nati/mode/2up , aka FIPS PUB 13.

    A typical punched card *hole* was 3.175 mm tall and 1.397 mm wide.
    The only available IBM card stock specification¹ suggests it was 161.1 gsm >> ("99 pound basis weight") so each chad had a mass of 0.000715 g.

    The Living Computer Museum has an 029 keypunch, and when they were open (before Covid restrictions) I punched a Fortran 2008, and later a Fortran 2013
    program on one. I believe the latter used a DO CONCURRENT statement.
    (And both were fixed-form, as you might expect on cards.)

    Maybe the only Fortran 2013 program ever punched on cards.


    I doubt that it is the only Fortran 2018 [sic] program ever to be
    punched onto cards. Why? Well, with very few exceptions a
    valid Fortran 77 code is a valid Fortran 2018 code. I know I used
    punched cards in the 1981/82 time frame. I still have a deck
    for computing one's biorythm someplace in my trove of old stuff.

    --
    steve

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  • From gah4@21:1/5 to steve kargl on Mon Jul 26 17:00:13 2021
    On Monday, July 26, 2021 at 1:45:48 PM UTC-7, steve kargl wrote:

    (snip)

    I doubt that it is the only Fortran 2018 [sic] program ever to be
    punched onto cards. Why? Well, with very few exceptions a
    valid Fortran 77 code is a valid Fortran 2018 code. I know I used
    punched cards in the 1981/82 time frame. I still have a deck
    for computing one's biorythm someplace in my trove of old stuff.

    OK, more specifically, not compatible with previous standards.

    Or maybe the first DO CONCURRENT statement punched on a card.

    The museum is now closed, and it seems uncertain what the
    future will be, so now I don't have a place to punch more cards.

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  • From gah4@21:1/5 to All on Mon Jul 26 16:54:05 2021
    On Wednesday, May 20, 2009 at 6:05:42 PM UTC-7, mecej4 wrote:

    I have often wondered if there was some standard that covered the practice of putting an oblique
    ink stripe on the side of a deck to help keep the cards in order.
    That was the analog version of radix sorting, was it not?

    To make the analog radix sort, you would need more than one diagonal line.

    One that, as you say, goes diagonal over the whole deck.
    Others that go diagonal at sharper angles, multiple passes over the whole deck. The first one might not be good enough to separate nearby cards, where the second
    one would be able to do that.

    You might also have one horizontal line over the deck, and a different one for different
    decks. You never know, more than one might fall on the floor at the same time.

    OK, my favorite card deck story. One time, someone put a leaf in my card deck. (Well, more than one, but I got the rest out.) The 2501 card reader pulls the card one
    direction, (9 edge direction), ready to read, and then the other way to actually read.
    Card and leaf managed the first step, but not the second. There is a little door,
    and then you lift up a plastic guard. I took out the leaf, made sure no-one was
    looking, and continued on. No problems after that.

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  • From gah4@21:1/5 to Stewart Russell on Mon Jul 26 17:06:28 2021
    On Monday, July 26, 2021 at 9:26:03 AM UTC-7, Stewart Russell wrote:

    (snip)

    A typical punched card *hole* was 3.175 mm tall and 1.397 mm wide.
    The only available IBM card stock specification¹ suggests it was 161.1 gsm ("99 pound basis weight") so each chad had a mass of 0.000715 g.

    One estimate is that the upper range of the mass of SARS-CoV-2 virions
    in an infected person is 100 ug, maybe only 1 ug.

    https://www.pnas.org/content/118/25/e2024815118

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  • From Jeff Ryman@21:1/5 to Van Snyder on Mon Jul 26 21:45:46 2021
    On Wednesday, May 20, 2009 at 2:01:06 PM UTC-7, Van Snyder wrote:
    Does anybody have a copy of ANSI x3.21-1967, now known as ANSI INCITS 21-1967?
    ANSI will sell me one for $30.00. INCITS claims not to have a copy on file.
    A question it could answer came up informally at the last Fortran committee meeting, so I had hoped INCITS would send me one. No dice.
    --
    Van Snyder | What fraction of Americans believe
    Van.S...@jpl.nasa.gov | Wrestling is real and NASA is fake?
    Any alleged opinions are my own and have not been approved or
    disapproved by JPL, CalTech, NASA, the President, or anybody else.

    My best punched card story (somewhat off topic):
    One evening around the middle of February 2008 I went to a Mexican fast food restaurant near where we lived in Las Vegas after leaving the hospital where my wife had just endured a nine-hour surgery because I was tired and didn't want to cook. While
    waiting for my order I got into a conversation with another patron who was also waiting. Somehow the conversation turned to computers and it happened both of us had used punch cards "back in the day." The other patron (a woman) and her husband had both
    served in the Army in the middle to late 1960s at which time he was stationed in Vietnam and she someplace in the continental United States. Both worked in what was called "data processing" in those ancient days. To send each other intimate information
    without anyone else reading their correspondence they typed love letters to each other on punch cards without the printing turned on, then sent the card decks to each other in official mail between the two data processing units. Upon receiving a card
    deck each of them would run the deck through a printer or duplicate the deck with printing turned on to reveal the message. I thought it was rather clever.

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  • From Robin Vowels@21:1/5 to Stewart Russell on Thu Jul 29 01:29:52 2021
    On Tuesday, July 27, 2021 at 2:26:03 AM UTC+10, Stewart Russell wrote:
    On Wednesday, May 20, 2009 at 5:01:06 p.m. UTC-4, Van Snyder wrote:
    Does anybody have a copy of ANSI x3.21-1967, now known as ANSI INCITS 21-1967?
    Nothing like a timely answer, but the Internet Archive does, as "Federal Information Processing Standards Publication: rectangular holes in twelve-row punched cards" — https://archive.org/details/federalinformati13nati/mode/2up , aka FIPS PUB 13.

    A typical punched card *hole* was 3.175 mm tall and 1.397 mm wide. The only available IBM card stock specification¹ suggests it was 161.1 gsm ("99 pound basis weight") so each chad had a mass of 0.000715 g.

    ¹: http://ibm-1401.info/CardStockSpecifications.html

    IBM wasn't the only maker of punch cards. Thicknesses differed.
    The ICL cards were thicker than IBM ones.

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