I have several boxes still running Win10. They perform well, very
safely, and I'd like to keep Win10, but, but MS will soon stop support.
I tried out a stand-alone version of Tiny 11 on one of them, and it
seemed ok. Good speed, updates come from MS, a bit bigger than tiny but
smaller than the full 11.
My worry is that MS take no responsibility for 11; it's NTDEV's baby.
For how long? Possible answer; Until it proves non-profitable, at which
point they could simply drop it.

My tentative plan is to stay with Win10 as long as possible, and then
install Tiny 11 if it's still flourishing.

All comments and suggestions will be welcome, except those simply saying
"Get Linux, get Linux".

Ed

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Ed Cryer wrote:

I have several boxes still running Win10. They perform well, very
safely, and I'd like to keep Win10, but, but MS will soon stop support.
I tried out a stand-alone version of Tiny 11 on one of them, and it
seemed ok. Good speed, updates come from MS, a bit bigger than tiny but smaller than the full 11.
My worry is that MS take no responsibility for 11; it's NTDEV's baby.
For how long? Possible answer; Until it proves non-profitable, at which
point they could simply drop it.

My tentative plan is to stay with Win10 as long as possible, and then
install Tiny 11 if it's still flourishing.

All comments and suggestions will be welcome, except those simply saying
"Get Linux, get Linux".

Do you use any of these boxes to run a business? If so, what does your business insurance say about keeping such computers properly up-to-date
in order to maintain cover against software failure or malware attack?
Probably you should do what your insurers advise.

Do you have to support paying customers who use Windows 11? If so you
should probably have at least one computer running W11.

I'm retired and I still use Windows 7 Pro. The only support from M$ is
that they keep their "Malicious Software Removal Tool" updated. I have
an antivirus program installed. I have a "standard user" account for
everyday work, and a separate "Administrator" account for use when
necessary. I don't let anybody else use the computer. There's no
indication that Win7 will "stop working"; however some applications
(e.g. Google Chrome) no longer keep themselves fully updated.

So if you're happy with Windows 10 I would keep it. The hardware may
fail before the software stops working.

--
Graham J

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On 6/18/24 06:45 AM, Graham J wrote:

Ed Cryer wrote:

I have several boxes still running Win10. They perform well, very safely, and I'd like to keep
Win10, but, but MS will soon stop support.
I tried out a stand-alone version of Tiny 11 on one of them, and it seemed ok. Good speed, updates
come from MS, a bit bigger than tiny but smaller than the full 11.
My worry is that MS take no responsibility for 11; it's NTDEV's baby. For how long? Possible
answer; Until it proves non-profitable, at which point they could simply drop it.

My tentative plan is to stay with Win10 as long as possible, and then install Tiny 11 if it's
still flourishing.

All comments and suggestions will be welcome, except those simply saying "Get Linux, get Linux".

Do you use any of these boxes to run a business?  If so, what does your business insurance say about
keeping such computers properly up-to-date in order to maintain cover against software failure or
malware attack? Probably you should do what your insurers advise.

Do you have to support paying customers who use Windows 11?  If so you should probably have at least
one computer running W11.

I'm retired and I still use Windows 7 Pro.  The only support from M$ is that they keep their
"Malicious Software Removal Tool" updated.  I have an antivirus program installed.  I have a
"standard user" account for everyday work, and a separate "Administrator" account for use when
necessary.  I don't let anybody else use the computer.  There's no indication that Win7 will "stop
working"; however some applications (e.g. Google Chrome) no longer keep themselves fully updated.

So if you're happy with Windows 10 I would keep it.  The hardware may fail before the software stops
working.

Not bad logic. If it isn't broke, don't fix it.

I on the other hand upgraded just to keep up with the Joneses. My wife got a new laptop with W11 on
it. 🙃 Also, I feel there is nothing in W11 that is unbearable. Hell, I want every OS to be fixed
and working. Guess I'll never live to see that, even Linux has it bugs. It's just the lesser of
two evils IMHO.
--
Linux Mint 21.3, Cinnamon 6.0.4, Kernel 5.15.0-112-generic
Al

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On 6/18/2024 6:01 AM, Ed Cryer wrote:

I have several boxes still running Win10. They perform well, very
safely, and I'd like to keep Win10, but, but MS will soon stop support.
I tried out a stand-alone version of Tiny 11 on one of them, and it
seemed ok. Good speed, updates come from MS, a bit bigger than tiny but smaller than the full 11.
My worry is that MS take no responsibility for 11; it's NTDEV's baby.
For how long? Possible answer; Until it proves non-profitable, at which
point they could simply drop it.

My tentative plan is to stay with Win10 as long as possible, and then
install Tiny 11 if it's still flourishing.

All comments and suggestions will be welcome, except those simply saying
"Get Linux, get Linux".

There's not much sense worrying about hurricanes that might come
two years from now.

The official EOL is 1 1/2 years away. There's a good chance that
will be extended. So at minimum you have 2 years before you
need to think about Windows security patches. And the vast majority
of security problems are not with Windows, unless you run unsafe
things like Remote Desktop.

Win11 is officially Win10.0, just as Win10 is. As near as I can
tell they've just made settings more convoluted and added round
corners in order to give the GPU some work to do. (Though I'd be
curious to know if anyone is aware of a truly critical addition to
Win11 that's not in Win10.) My sense is that Win11 is mainly a
marketing transition to usher in more spying, less control, and
so-called AI.

With Active Desktop, Microsoft sprinkled browser
windows around Explorer and proclaimed that they'd entered the
Internet age. It looks to me like Copilot and other gimmicks will
be Microsoft's claim to be at the leading edge of the "AI revolution".

I was running XP until recently. We still have an XP machine
and a Win7 machine in the house. I don't allow Win10 or 11
to update because I don't trust MS not to break things. I've
never had any kind of malware. Though my ladyfriend got
duped into buying fake AV awhile back. She panicked when a
website popup told her she was infected and she called the
phone # onscreen

Updates used to be something to look forward to. Now they're just
an ominous storm. "What?! Where's the menu?!" It amazes me how
passive most people are. They watch with mild curiosity as MS
foists AI crap on their taskbar, shows ads, starts recording their
desktop.... Where will people draw the line with THEIR
computer that THEY paid for?

--- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
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On 6/18/2024 6:01 AM, Ed Cryer wrote:

I have several boxes still running Win10. They perform well, very safely, and I'd like to keep Win10, but, but MS will soon stop support.
I tried out a stand-alone version of Tiny 11 on one of them, and it seemed ok. Good speed, updates come from MS, a bit bigger than tiny but smaller than the full 11.
My worry is that MS take no responsibility for 11; it's NTDEV's baby. For how long? Possible answer; Until it proves non-profitable, at which point they could simply drop it.

My tentative plan is to stay with Win10 as long as possible, and then install Tiny 11 if it's still flourishing.

All comments and suggestions will be welcome, except those simply saying "Get Linux, get Linux".

Ed

Using a spare hard drive, do a test install now, with the spare
drive by itself, and check the W11 activation status after installation

Administrator terminal:

slmgr /dlv

... "License status: Licensed"

If you think W11 is viable on the box, test it now. Then,
erase the drive, do an install on the next machine.

# From the Command Prompt in Troubleshooting on the installer DVD...

diskpart
list disk # since only the spare drive is in the machine, no chance of mistakes
select disk 0 #
clean
exit # You can run X:\setup.exe from the Command prompt, to start the install.

Then the fleet is ready for W11, if that's what you want later.
You can do an install in two years time, for the "permanent"
install you have planned. You don't need to make backup copies
of all the spare drive images.

But, I would arrange the free upgrade now, for later.

At the end of the run, your spare drive is erased again.
The activation info and the machine hash, are stored on the
Microsoft server.

The T&C could change at any time for W11 in future,
so we cannot predict how viable anything will be
in the future.

If learning about alternatives is cheap, then
learn about alternatives. I've been using two
platforms, since about 1990 or so. The Sparc at work,
had Softwindows. The Mac G4 had Connectix Virtual PC
(with Windows on it), plus Fink. My P2B-s had FreeBSD.
And so on.

Learning about two OSes, is all part of a maintenance
strategy. You don't go in a boat, without a
life preserver -- a computer is no different :-)

If all the copies of Windows in the room, take a shit
because of an exploit, I can still "dial out".

Paul

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Paul wrote:

On 6/18/2024 6:01 AM, Ed Cryer wrote:

I have several boxes still running Win10. They perform well, very safely, and I'd like to keep Win10, but, but MS will soon stop support.
I tried out a stand-alone version of Tiny 11 on one of them, and it seemed ok. Good speed, updates come from MS, a bit bigger than tiny but smaller than the full 11.
My worry is that MS take no responsibility for 11; it's NTDEV's baby. For how long? Possible answer; Until it proves non-profitable, at which point they could simply drop it.

My tentative plan is to stay with Win10 as long as possible, and then install Tiny 11 if it's still flourishing.

All comments and suggestions will be welcome, except those simply saying "Get Linux, get Linux".

Ed

Using a spare hard drive, do a test install now, with the spare
drive by itself, and check the W11 activation status after installation

Administrator terminal:

slmgr /dlv

... "License status: Licensed"

If you think W11 is viable on the box, test it now. Then,
erase the drive, do an install on the next machine.

# From the Command Prompt in Troubleshooting on the installer DVD...

diskpart
list disk # since only the spare drive is in the machine, no chance of mistakes
select disk 0 #
clean
exit # You can run X:\setup.exe from the Command prompt, to start the install.

Then the fleet is ready for W11, if that's what you want later.
You can do an install in two years time, for the "permanent"
install you have planned. You don't need to make backup copies
of all the spare drive images.

But, I would arrange the free upgrade now, for later.

At the end of the run, your spare drive is erased again.
The activation info and the machine hash, are stored on the
Microsoft server.

The T&C could change at any time for W11 in future,
so we cannot predict how viable anything will be
in the future.

If learning about alternatives is cheap, then
learn about alternatives. I've been using two
platforms, since about 1990 or so. The Sparc at work,
had Softwindows. The Mac G4 had Connectix Virtual PC
(with Windows on it), plus Fink. My P2B-s had FreeBSD.
And so on.

Learning about two OSes, is all part of a maintenance
strategy. You don't go in a boat, without a
life preserver -- a computer is no different :-)

If all the copies of Windows in the room, take a shit
because of an exploit, I can still "dial out".

Paul

Thanks Paul.

The PC Health Check program says Win11 won't go in for two reasons; 1.
TPM 2.0 not installed, 2. The CPU not acceptable. How can I even begin
to install Win11? Surely it'll simply fail very early on.

Ed

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On Wed, 19 Jun 2024 09:19:29 +0100, Ed Cryer wrote:

The PC Health Check program says Win11 won't go in for two reasons; 1.
TPM 2.0 not installed, 2. The CPU not acceptable. How can I even begin
to install Win11? Surely it'll simply fail very early on.

Win11 installs in a virtualbox VM nicely, even though the host
system doesn't support it. Gofigure?

--- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
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mechanic wrote:

On Wed, 19 Jun 2024 09:19:29 +0100, Ed Cryer wrote:

The PC Health Check program says Win11 won't go in for two reasons; 1.
TPM 2.0 not installed, 2. The CPU not acceptable. How can I even begin
to install Win11? Surely it'll simply fail very early on.

Win11 installs in a virtualbox VM nicely, even though the host
system doesn't support it. Gofigure?

OK, but that won't register me with MS; which is what Paul is aiming at.

Ed

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On 6/19/2024 9:00 AM, Ed Cryer wrote:

mechanic wrote:

On Wed, 19 Jun 2024 09:19:29 +0100, Ed Cryer wrote:

The PC Health Check program says Win11 won't go in for two reasons; 1.
TPM 2.0 not installed, 2. The CPU not acceptable. How can I even begin
to install Win11? Surely it'll simply fail very early on.

Win11 installs in a virtualbox VM nicely, even though the host
system doesn't support it. Gofigure?

OK, but that won't register me with MS; which is what Paul is aiming at.

Ed

rufus.ie # A consultant in Ireland, makes a nice piece of software.

Has a program that places Windows 11 ISO on a USB stick.
After the main preparation stage is finished, the dialog
after that has tick boxes for defeating hardware checks
on Windows 11.

Your install media should install as easily as Windows 10 now.

Administrator Terminal:

slmgr /dlv # Check it activated, later, after
# a couple reboots of Windows 11 new install.

Paul

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Paul wrote:

On 6/19/2024 9:00 AM, Ed Cryer wrote:

mechanic wrote:

On Wed, 19 Jun 2024 09:19:29 +0100, Ed Cryer wrote:

The PC Health Check program says Win11 won't go in for two reasons; 1. >>>> TPM 2.0 not installed, 2. The CPU not acceptable. How can I even begin >>>> to install Win11? Surely it'll simply fail very early on.

Win11 installs in a virtualbox VM nicely, even though the host
system doesn't support it. Gofigure?

OK, but that won't register me with MS; which is what Paul is aiming at.

Ed

rufus.ie # A consultant in Ireland, makes a nice piece of software.

Has a program that places Windows 11 ISO on a USB stick.
After the main preparation stage is finished, the dialog
after that has tick boxes for defeating hardware checks
on Windows 11.

Your install media should install as easily as Windows 10 now.

Administrator Terminal:

slmgr /dlv # Check it activated, later, after
# a couple reboots of Windows 11 new install.

Paul

If I understand you rightly, Paul, all I have to do is download Win11
and Rufus; run Rufus and tick all the Legacy boxes, and I can then
install from the USB stick it creates over a Win10 system. And that will
give me a fully legit Win11, registered with MS and working well.

Pardon me stating it so boldly and baldly. I find it hard to believe it
will work so easily.

Ed

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On 6/20/2024 4:49 AM, Ed Cryer wrote:

If I understand you rightly, Paul, all I have to do is download Win11 and Rufus; run Rufus and tick all the Legacy boxes, and I can then install from the USB stick it creates over a Win10 system. And that will give me a fully legit Win11, registered

with MS and working well.

Pardon me stating it so boldly and baldly. I find it hard to believe it will work so easily.

Ed

I think the W11 I was using today for the EasyBCD demo,
was installed that way. Installing Windows 11 in VirtualBox
should not work (no TPM). Yet, I've got a W11 VM, and there is
only one way it got there. Rufus. I've stopped installing
newer versions of VirtualBox, and do not use version 7.

I have a bog standard Windows 11 in VMWare Workstation,
as it has SWTPM to emulate a TPM and fool windows. I did not
use Rufus for that one. I also don't run that one very often.
VMWare *forces* you to encrypt your virtual machine,
a practice I detest (it wastes disk space to be doing that,
encrypted materials cannot be compressed). A lot of my
VirtualBox machines, they're compressed before being
stored on the SSD.

With rolling release software, and dynamic behavior, I cannot
predict for each user, what is going to happen. I think it
will work for you. Make sure you have a backup, for easy rollback
in any case. One of the reasons I try to keep the C: drive
small, is to encourage the making of backups here.

Paul

--- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
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On 20/06/2024 09:49, Ed Cryer wrote:

Paul wrote:

On 6/19/2024 9:00 AM, Ed Cryer wrote:

mechanic wrote:

On Wed, 19 Jun 2024 09:19:29 +0100, Ed Cryer wrote:

The PC Health Check program says Win11 won't go in for two reasons; 1. >>>>> TPM 2.0 not installed, 2. The CPU not acceptable. How can I even begin >>>>> to install Win11? Surely it'll simply fail very early on.

Win11 installs in a virtualbox VM nicely, even though the host
system doesn't support it. Gofigure?

OK, but that won't register me with MS; which is what Paul is aiming at. >>>
Ed

rufus.ie                       # A consultant in Ireland, makes a nice
piece of software.

Has a program that places Windows 11 ISO on a USB stick.
After the main preparation stage is finished, the dialog
after that has tick boxes for defeating hardware checks
on Windows 11.

Your install media should install as easily as Windows 10 now.

    Administrator Terminal:

    slmgr /dlv                  # Check it activated, later, after
                                # a couple reboots of Windows 11 new
install.

   Paul

If I understand you rightly, Paul, all I have to do is download Win11
and Rufus; run Rufus and tick all the Legacy boxes, and I can then
install from the USB stick it creates over a Win10 system. And that will
give me a fully legit Win11, registered with MS and working well.

Pardon me stating it so boldly and baldly. I find it hard to believe it
will work so easily.

It does, because I've used it for just that purpose.


--
Regards
wasbit

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On 20/06/2024 17:45, Newyana2 wrote:

  If you go to MS there's a whole song and dance about
getting the ISO. If you want to download it you have to
spoof that you're not on Windows.

Have you always been a liar? Windows 11 can be downloaded directly from Microsoft website. No need to "spoof" anything or anybody unless you
always wanted to be a liar and a scammer.

You must be a dodgy plumber or builder who goes around scamming customers.

<https://www.microsoft.com/software-download/windows11> <https://i.imgur.com/FR2YcHO.png>

--- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
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Ed Cryer wrote:

Paul wrote:

On 6/19/2024 9:00 AM, Ed Cryer wrote:

mechanic wrote:

On Wed, 19 Jun 2024 09:19:29 +0100, Ed Cryer wrote:

The PC Health Check program says Win11 won't go in for two reasons; 1. >>>>> TPM 2.0 not installed, 2. The CPU not acceptable. How can I even begin >>>>> to install Win11? Surely it'll simply fail very early on.

Win11 installs in a virtualbox VM nicely, even though the host
system doesn't support it. Gofigure?

OK, but that won't register me with MS; which is what Paul is aiming at. >>>
Ed

rufus.ie                       # A consultant in Ireland, makes a nice
piece of software.

Has a program that places Windows 11 ISO on a USB stick.
After the main preparation stage is finished, the dialog
after that has tick boxes for defeating hardware checks
on Windows 11.

Your install media should install as easily as Windows 10 now.

    Administrator Terminal:

    slmgr /dlv                  # Check it activated, later, after
                                # a couple reboots of Windows 11 new
install.

   Paul

If I understand you rightly, Paul, all I have to do is download Win11 and Rufus; run Rufus and tick all the Legacy boxes, and I can then install from the USB stick it creates over a Win10 system. And that will give me a fully legit Win11, registered with MS and working well.

Pardon me stating it so boldly and baldly. I find it hard to believe it
will work so easily.

Ed

It did for me when I installed it about 5 months ago over my existing win
10 on a Dell 790 desktop built in 2012. Smooth as silk. Before hand, I had converted the drives to GPS, and switched to UEFI, etc. The machine has no
TPM, an old processor, etc.

--- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
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On 6/20/2024 4:49 AM, Ed Cryer wrote:

If I understand you rightly, Paul, all I have to do is download Win11
and Rufus; run Rufus and tick all the Legacy boxes, and I can then
install from the USB stick it creates over a Win10 system. And that will
give me a fully legit Win11, registered with MS and working well.

Pardon me stating it so boldly and baldly. I find it hard to believe it
will work so easily.

I downloaded an ISO and installed it over 10. I copied
C drive on my laptop, set it up as a second OS, and had
11 overwrite that. Now I have 10 and 11. (I wanted 11
for testing software.) No glitches.

I recommend this:
github.com/AveYo/MediaCreationTool.bat

If you go to MS there's a whole song and dance about
getting the ISO. If you want to download it you have to
spoof that you're not on Windows. This script tool lets
you pick any version of 10 or 11 and lets you save the ISO.
I also used it to download Win10 20H2, with which I was
able to update Win7 after that offer expired.

It's nice to actually have the ISO files. You can then
back them up and you can also mount them if you need a file.

--- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
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Paul wrote:

On 6/20/2024 4:49 AM, Ed Cryer wrote:

If I understand you rightly, Paul, all I have to do is download Win11 and Rufus; run Rufus and tick all the Legacy boxes, and I can then install from the USB stick it creates over a Win10 system. And that will give me a fully legit Win11, registered

with MS and working well.

Pardon me stating it so boldly and baldly. I find it hard to believe it will work so easily.

Ed

I think the W11 I was using today for the EasyBCD demo,
was installed that way. Installing Windows 11 in VirtualBox
should not work (no TPM). Yet, I've got a W11 VM, and there is
only one way it got there. Rufus. I've stopped installing
newer versions of VirtualBox, and do not use version 7.

I have a bog standard Windows 11 in VMWare Workstation,
as it has SWTPM to emulate a TPM and fool windows. I did not
use Rufus for that one. I also don't run that one very often.
VMWare *forces* you to encrypt your virtual machine,
a practice I detest (it wastes disk space to be doing that,
encrypted materials cannot be compressed). A lot of my
VirtualBox machines, they're compressed before being
stored on the SSD.

With rolling release software, and dynamic behavior, I cannot
predict for each user, what is going to happen. I think it
will work for you. Make sure you have a backup, for easy rollback
in any case. One of the reasons I try to keep the C: drive
small, is to encourage the making of backups here.

Paul

Well, blow me, it all worked; and very smoothly.
Here's what I did. I decided to install over a Win10 system, in order to
see how all resident programs and stuff would be affected.
The box is an old Acer Aspire X3300, about 15 years old; 4GB DDR3 RAM.
And I did it all in a corner of my living-room, while England were
playing Denmark in the Euro2024 football on our large-screen TV.
1. Full backup with Macrium.
2. Download MediaCreation Tool from MajorGeeks; Rufus from its own website.
3. Run Rufus, choose MBR, choose no TPM 2.0 and ignore CPU details.
3. In Win10 load USB stick and execute setup.
4. After install check all resident programs (there are many, 15 years
of accumulation on a box that came with Win7, got updated to Win10) and,
as far as I can tell, they all work. A bit slow on such limited RAM
(plus, IIRC, a CPU that has only one core).
5 Check "slmgr /dlv", and get a lovely licence displayed, all legit and registered.

So, then, that's it. I'll soon restore the Win10 which I prefer, and
sleep easy. Until, maybe, MS release Win12. And I can't help but wonder
why they're allowing this degradation of Win11 after such stringent
demands several years ago. Was it just to drive everybody out to buy new hardware? And what about Tiny 11? MS have passed out Win11 to anybody
who'll take it. They must have something up their sleeves to trip us all up.

Ed

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On 18/06/2024 12:01, Ed Cryer wrote:

I have several boxes still running Win10. They perform well, very
safely, and I'd like to keep Win10, but, but MS will soon stop support.
I tried out a stand-alone version of Tiny 11 on one of them, and it
seemed ok. Good speed, updates come from MS, a bit bigger than tiny but smaller than the full 11.
My worry is that MS take no responsibility for 11; it's NTDEV's baby.
For how long? Possible answer; Until it proves non-profitable, at which
point they could simply drop it.

My tentative plan is to stay with Win10 as long as possible, and then
install Tiny 11 if it's still flourishing.

All comments and suggestions will be welcome, except those simply saying
"Get Linux, get Linux".

Ed

We have 4 W10 pc's which are not upgradable to W11. We will keep our W10
pc's as long as possible.
What is the problem? No updates anymore? And so what?

Fokke

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On 20/06/2024 21:38, Fokke Nauta wrote:

On 18/06/2024 12:01, Ed Cryer wrote:

I have several boxes still running Win10. They perform well, very
safely, and I'd like to keep Win10, but, but MS will soon stop support.
I tried out a stand-alone version of Tiny 11 on one of them, and it
seemed ok. Good speed, updates come from MS, a bit bigger than tiny
but smaller than the full 11.
My worry is that MS take no responsibility for 11; it's NTDEV's baby.
For how long? Possible answer; Until it proves non-profitable, at
which point they could simply drop it.

My tentative plan is to stay with Win10 as long as possible, and then
install Tiny 11 if it's still flourishing.

All comments and suggestions will be welcome, except those simply
saying "Get Linux, get Linux".

Ed

We have 4 W10 pc's which are not upgradable to W11. We will keep our
W10 pc's as long as possible.
What is the problem? No updates anymore? And so what?

The problem is you don't understand that Ed Cry has retired and now he
is mostly a hobbyist. He spends his time downloading Windows Operating
System from a Russian  guy's github repo called "Tiny 11". He then goes
to MajorGeek to download "MediaCreation Tool" because he doesn't trust Microsoft's Official Download link. He then goes to Rufus to download a
useless tool which in most part does everything a MediaCreation Tool
would do. How daft can you get then this?

To install Windows 11 on an unsupported machine requires nothing fancy.
I posted a method to create an  unattend.xml file but copy this at the
root of the flash drive and proceed normally.

However, you don't have to create the xml file because the installation
ISO file has a program called "setupprep.exe" and this program will
upgrade any windows 10 machine without complaining about anything.
People needs to learn to think for themselves but users on this
newsgroup are "gung ho" about third party websites - some Chinese and
some Russians but not Microsoft or Google. They don't trust them because
they are used to Russian or Chinese ways of doing things. If something
goes wrong, they'll blame Microsoft.

--- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
* Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)

On 6/20/2024 1:03 PM, Simon GAHHH Creator wrote:

On 20/06/2024 17:45, Newyana2 wrote:

  If you go to MS there's a whole song and dance about
getting the ISO. If you want to download it you have to
spoof that you're not on Windows.

Have you always been a liar? Windows 11 can be downloaded directly from Microsoft website. No need to "spoof" anything or anybody unless you
always wanted to be a liar and a scammer.

You must be a dodgy plumber or builder who goes around scamming customers.

<https://www.microsoft.com/software-download/windows11> <https://i.imgur.com/FR2YcHO.png>

Windows 11 arrives in two formats.

1) User receives MediaCreationTool.
User "asks for media for another computer".
Software does a series of downloads, assembles a 7-OS ISO disc image.

2) User connects via an OS that cannot execute MediaCreationTool properly (.NET).
User is instead, given the URL of an 11-OS disc image.
The disk image is so large, it needs a dual-layer DVD if you
want to actually burn a DVD.

While there is a web page that offers materials freely,
what you receive is a function of the kind of OS your
browser is running on at the time. They sniff the available
info, to decide whether (1) or (2) is possible.

It is possible to take a 7-OS or 11-OS ISO image file,
and "cook it" to make a 1-OS DVD. Such a DVD image
may be small enough to fit on single layer DVD blanks.

If you're using a USB stick for hosting the ISO (rufus.ie),
then relatively speaking, the space it takes is less important.
Whereas with DVDs, not everyone stocks single layer and
dual layer blanks.

Paul

--- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
* Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)

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--- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
* Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)

On 20/06/2024 23:45, Jack wrote:

<cut>

The problem is you don't understand that Ed Cry has retired and now he
is mostly a hobbyist. He spends his time downloading Windows Operating
System from a Russian  guy's github repo called "Tiny 11". He then goes
to MajorGeek to download "MediaCreation Tool" because he doesn't trust Microsoft's Official Download link. He then goes to Rufus to download a useless tool which in most part does everything a MediaCreation Tool
would do. How daft can you get then this?

To install Windows 11 on an unsupported machine requires nothing fancy.
I posted a method to create an  unattend.xml file but copy this at the
root of the flash drive and proceed normally.

So you mean that I would be able to update my W10 pc's to W11, although
this is officially not possible? How does it work?

However, you don't have to create the xml file because the installation
ISO file has a program called "setupprep.exe" and this program will
upgrade any windows 10 machine without complaining about anything.
People needs to learn to think for themselves but users on this
newsgroup are "gung ho" about third party websites - some Chinese and
some Russians but not Microsoft or Google. They don't trust them because
they are used to Russian or Chinese ways of doing things. If something
goes wrong, they'll blame Microsoft.

Fokke

--- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
* Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)

On 21/06/2024 12:44, Fokke Nauta wrote:

So you mean that I would be able to update my W10 pc's to W11,
although this is officially not possible? How does it work?

Just mount the Official Windows 11 ISO and note the drive letter for
this virtual drive. It is virtual because you have mounted it in Windows explorer. When you know the drive letter (say F: for this discussion)
you only need to type this in the elevated command prompt:

F:\Sources\setupprep.exe /product server

Just follow the online instructions and your Windows 10 will be upgraded
to Windows 11. Please note you must have at least 8GB of Ram to work
with Windows 11 otherwise it will be a very slow process and frustrating!

Also, ignore the fact that it says "Server". It is not the server that
is installed. The product installed is either Professional or Home
depending on your Windows 10 version. The official Microsoft Window 11 ISO file contains all the different products and the system license decides what
to install.

Hope this helps. Always make a full image of the drive when you are
first using this method because mistakes could happen for the first time.

--- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
* Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)

On 6/21/2024 7:44 AM, Ed Cryer wrote:

I've been playing around with this Win11 system on such lowly hardware, and I swear it performs as well as Win10 does. In fact, now that it's settled down after full initialisation, it seems even faster in some areas.
How secure is it? Well, it's getting all MS updates, it's running Windows firewall and Windows Defender.

So what about the missing TPM 2 and the CPU refusal? OK, but they're also missing when it runs Win10. So is it the case that Win11 has a security hole that requires those items when Win10 doesn't? Or is Win10 just as vulnerable to certain attacks?

Ed

Win10 had options that were not turned on.

Win11 tries to turn on those options.

But Win11, if you move the disk to another machine,
you can tell it is disabling subsystems where there
is no hardware support. In a sense, given an "incentive",
Windows 11 can roughly boot up in almost the same
state as Windows 10.

If you had Secure Boot enabled, if you moved that disk
to another machine, I doubt it would boot. It's when
you installed in the non-desired state, that the OS
is more agreeable to being moved. You could be CSM boot,
UEFI boot, or UEFI+Secure boot (maybe an OEM laptop is
delivered with that last option). My laptop isn't even UEFI,
so it only does CSM (legacy) boot.

*******

As for the "feeling of speed", to some extent computers
are smothered by "scroll throttles". The GUI is slowed
down, so that powerful machines and weak machines, appear
to respond to input in the same way. This tends to
"equalize" their behavior. This works best, if the GUI
is hardware-accelerated, so that the scroll throttle
represents most-all of the delay.

That's the GUI aspect.

But if we're benchmarking, I am running SuperPI and you
are running it, we will get different times for execution.
Both machines will be compute-bound (running a single
thread of execution as fast as possible), and no effort
should be made by the OS, to equalize those runs. I have
a core on the machine, that barely makes it to 5GHz,
and your machine may have a lower turbo than that. There
could be some Intel machines that get closer to 6GHz now
so my machine is hardly a champ.

https://www.cpuid.com/softwares/cpu-z.html (ZIP, English, for portable version)

If you use Task Manager, and before SuperPI starts its run
(the SuperPI GUI is up, but you haven't issued a command yet),
you change "Affinity" to running the process only on Core 0, then
in the CPU-Z main pane, the CPU clock speed reported, is the
clock speed used for your SuperPI run (only measures Core 0).
This is handy for your single-threaded benchmarks.

[Picture]

https://i.postimg.cc/j59L6Yqs/task-manager-affinity-W11-run.jpg

And that's where the various CPU options make a difference.
Sometimes, the amount of cache influences the speed,
and definitely the CPU clock rate affects the results.

Of the two modern AMD processors I've got, one has twice
the cache of the other, and there is yet another processor
that has three times the amount of cache (a so-called "gamer"
processor). The more cache, the greater the opportunity
to cheat on SuperPI.

Paul

--- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
* Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)

On 21/06/2024 19:54, Jack wrote:

On 21/06/2024 12:44, Fokke Nauta wrote:

So you mean that I would be able to update my W10 pc's to W11,
although this is officially not possible? How does it work?

Just mount the Official Windows 11 ISO and note the drive letter for
this virtual drive. It is virtual because you have mounted it in Windows explorer. When you know the drive letter (say F: for this discussion)
you only need to type this in the elevated command prompt:

F:\Sources\setupprep.exe /product server

Just follow the online instructions and your Windows 10 will be upgraded
to Windows 11. Please note you must have at least 8GB of Ram to work
with Windows 11 otherwise it will be a very slow process and frustrating!

Also, ignore the fact that it says "Server". It is not the server that
is installed. The product installed is either Professional or Home
depending on your Windows 10 version. The official Microsoft Window 11 ISO file
contains all the different products and the system license decides what
to install.

Hope this helps. Always make a full image of the drive when you are
first using this method because mistakes could happen for the first time.

Thanks.
I'm curious.
You mean that I can upgrade W10 pc's to W11, even that MS says it's
impossible? And how about the Bios problems?

Fokke

--- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
* Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)