• powercfg weirdness [was: Re: Bitlocker weirdness]

    From Philip Herlihy@21:1/5 to All on Sat Mar 16 10:24:34 2024
    In article <MPG.405e9e5633ff3813989ab5@news.eternal-september.org>, Philip Herlihy wrote...

    In article <ustvec$1e302$1@dont-email.me>, ...w¡ñ§±¤ñ wrote...

    Philip Herlihy wrote on 3/13/24 4:12 PM:

    The machine is a Dell XPS 13. Partitions (in Disk Management) are (rounded):
    500MB EFI System partition
    225GB OS
    852MB now Unallocated after my meddling
    10GB Recovery Partition
    1GB Recovery Partition

    ...

    There's another glitch with this machine. The user (not content with transporting the machine with the power plug inserted and banging hell out of the power socket - repaird) has evidently left it plugged in 24/7 (when not bouncing it off door-frames). So the battery has about 90s life in it from an indicated 100% charge.

    I've realised that unless it's left "on charge" for many minutes then when it's logged-in the "Critical Power" event kicks in (at 2%) and hibernates the thing. I turned that off, but then decided it was safer to leave that mechanism in place to avoid possible corruption. But I'd like to increase the 'Critical' level from 2% to (maybe?) 7%. I find the Control Panel applet simply ignores attempted changes, and I have to use powercfg with some GUID weirdness to achieve this. As I said, I'm getting too old for this s***...

    --

    Phil, London

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Paul@21:1/5 to Philip Herlihy on Sat Mar 16 08:50:39 2024
    On 3/16/2024 6:24 AM, Philip Herlihy wrote:
    In article <MPG.405e9e5633ff3813989ab5@news.eternal-september.org>, Philip Herlihy wrote...

    In article <ustvec$1e302$1@dont-email.me>, ...w¡ñ§±¤ñ wrote...

    Philip Herlihy wrote on 3/13/24 4:12 PM:

    The machine is a Dell XPS 13. Partitions (in Disk Management) are (rounded):
    500MB EFI System partition
    225GB OS
    852MB now Unallocated after my meddling
    10GB Recovery Partition
    1GB Recovery Partition

    ...

    There's another glitch with this machine. The user (not content with transporting the machine with the power plug inserted and banging hell out of the power socket - repaird) has evidently left it plugged in 24/7 (when not bouncing it off door-frames). So the battery has about 90s life in it from an
    indicated 100% charge.

    I've realised that unless it's left "on charge" for many minutes then when it's
    logged-in the "Critical Power" event kicks in (at 2%) and hibernates the thing.
    I turned that off, but then decided it was safer to leave that mechanism in place to avoid possible corruption. But I'd like to increase the 'Critical' level from 2% to (maybe?) 7%. I find the Control Panel applet simply ignores attempted changes, and I have to use powercfg with some GUID weirdness to achieve this. As I said, I'm getting too old for this s***...


    There is mention here, that the schema can be reset, and maybe
    after that you could try again to set it.

    https://superuser.com/questions/1341383/how-to-stop-computer-from-entering-sleep-under-critical-battery-trigger-met-mi

    There is also a picture of the settings section, in the article.
    Since the field can be set to weird values, it almost implies
    somehow that this is adaptive ? And adjusts itself ? Otherwise,
    how would one individual report his was set to 86%.

    https://i.stack.imgur.com/I93RH.png

    There is a chip inside the battery pack, which at a minimum
    contains a tiny flash memory. And the charge history of the
    pack is recorded in there. The OS reads the chip when the
    OS boots, and it keeps the table in RAM, and writes it back
    out at some point. And since the chip has a "serial number",
    this allows the battery pack itself, to carry a summary
    of its life history. One of the parameters, is how many
    charge cycles it has gone through.

    Some laptops, have a charge controller (chip on laptop mobo)
    that can be set to "only charge to 80%" and this significantly
    reduces the impact on the battery from the "user plugs in
    24/7" case. That hasn't always been there, so not all laptops
    have that. The setting may be in a separate application,
    added to the C: drive.

    What it's doing, is removing Phase 2 from the
    battery charge process. The charger only does CC to get
    to 80%, instead of the CC-CV to get to 100%. The CV or
    Constant Voltage phase is known as "topping up" and squeezes
    the last bit of charge into the battery, from 80% to 100%.
    The time spent at 100% charge (or 4.2V per cell), is what
    damages the pack. Once at 100% and the charger has switched
    off, the battery starts to relax at that point, and drops
    back to 3.7V on its own. Car batteries behave a bit like
    that too. In terms of relaxing. One difference is, you
    can "float" a car battery at 13.5V instead of allowing it
    to relax to 12.6V or so, whereas you cannot float a Lithium
    cell. When a lithium cell is full, it's full.

    The lithium cell would have to drop significantly, before
    another charge cycle starts. The charger cannot start at
    3.7V, because the pack is still full at that point. It
    would need a bit of hysteresis and maybe start charging
    again at 3.5V or so. Even if sleeping, it should not
    be "on-charge" constantly, and it should be taking
    a break once in a while. But the number of charge cycles,
    if left plugged in, it still probably quite high.

    Paul

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Philip Herlihy@21:1/5 to All on Sat Mar 16 20:25:35 2024
    In article <ut44iv$2t8ii$1@dont-email.me>, Paul wrote...

    On 3/16/2024 6:24 AM, Philip Herlihy wrote:
    In article <MPG.405e9e5633ff3813989ab5@news.eternal-september.org>, Philip Herlihy wrote...

    In article <ustvec$1e302$1@dont-email.me>, ...w¡ñ§±¤ñ wrote...

    Philip Herlihy wrote on 3/13/24 4:12 PM:

    The machine is a Dell XPS 13. Partitions (in Disk Management) are (rounded):
    500MB EFI System partition
    225GB OS
    852MB now Unallocated after my meddling
    10GB Recovery Partition
    1GB Recovery Partition

    ...

    There's another glitch with this machine. The user (not content with transporting the machine with the power plug inserted and banging hell out of
    the power socket - repaird) has evidently left it plugged in 24/7 (when not bouncing it off door-frames). So the battery has about 90s life in it from an
    indicated 100% charge.

    I've realised that unless it's left "on charge" for many minutes then when it's
    logged-in the "Critical Power" event kicks in (at 2%) and hibernates the thing.
    I turned that off, but then decided it was safer to leave that mechanism in place to avoid possible corruption. But I'd like to increase the 'Critical'
    level from 2% to (maybe?) 7%. I find the Control Panel applet simply ignores
    attempted changes, and I have to use powercfg with some GUID weirdness to achieve this. As I said, I'm getting too old for this s***...


    There is mention here, that the schema can be reset, and maybe
    after that you could try again to set it.

    https://superuser.com/questions/1341383/how-to-stop-computer-from-entering-sleep-under-critical-battery-trigger-met-mi

    There is also a picture of the settings section, in the article.
    Since the field can be set to weird values, it almost implies
    somehow that this is adaptive ? And adjusts itself ? Otherwise,
    how would one individual report his was set to 86%.

    https://i.stack.imgur.com/I93RH.png

    There is a chip inside the battery pack, which at a minimum
    contains a tiny flash memory. And the charge history of the
    pack is recorded in there. The OS reads the chip when the
    OS boots, and it keeps the table in RAM, and writes it back
    out at some point. And since the chip has a "serial number",
    this allows the battery pack itself, to carry a summary
    of its life history. One of the parameters, is how many
    charge cycles it has gone through.

    Some laptops, have a charge controller (chip on laptop mobo)
    that can be set to "only charge to 80%" and this significantly
    reduces the impact on the battery from the "user plugs in
    24/7" case. That hasn't always been there, so not all laptops
    have that. The setting may be in a separate application,
    added to the C: drive.

    What it's doing, is removing Phase 2 from the
    battery charge process. The charger only does CC to get
    to 80%, instead of the CC-CV to get to 100%. The CV or
    Constant Voltage phase is known as "topping up" and squeezes
    the last bit of charge into the battery, from 80% to 100%.
    The time spent at 100% charge (or 4.2V per cell), is what
    damages the pack. Once at 100% and the charger has switched
    off, the battery starts to relax at that point, and drops
    back to 3.7V on its own. Car batteries behave a bit like
    that too. In terms of relaxing. One difference is, you
    can "float" a car battery at 13.5V instead of allowing it
    to relax to 12.6V or so, whereas you cannot float a Lithium
    cell. When a lithium cell is full, it's full.

    The lithium cell would have to drop significantly, before
    another charge cycle starts. The charger cannot start at
    3.7V, because the pack is still full at that point. It
    would need a bit of hysteresis and maybe start charging
    again at 3.5V or so. Even if sleeping, it should not
    be "on-charge" constantly, and it should be taking
    a break once in a while. But the number of charge cycles,
    if left plugged in, it still probably quite high.

    Paul

    Thanks, Paul. The battery is utterly knackered, clearly. I've tried to increase the Critical Battery Level as described in the article, but the changes simply don't 'stick', reverting to 2%. There is an option to do this using Powercfg.exe and some GUIDS (bizzarely) which I haven't tried at this point. I think I'll leave it - if I increase the CBL then the hibernation trigger may kick in more readily even when connected to power, and (based on experimentation) turning on the power, booting but then waiting 5m before logging in seems to avoid it. I just hope 2% of 90s run-time is enough to hibernate and avoid corruption if the power is disturbed.

    --

    Phil, London

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)