I recall a few months ago someone posting some links to refurbished
systems for sale that I thought we're pretty reasonable. I have finally talked my MIL into getting a desktop system instead of the laptop she
has, and would appreciate any recommendations for where to look for something.
I will be doing the buying, and don't want a new system for her,
especially since she doesn't want to learn Windows 11 at almost 80 years old. She just doesn't need that.
Any reputable sites would be welcomed.
TIA
I recall a few months ago someone posting some links to refurbished
systems for sale that I thought we're pretty reasonable. I have finally talked my MIL into getting a desktop system instead of the laptop she
has, and would appreciate any recommendations for where to look for something.
I will be doing the buying, and don't want a new system for her,
especially since she doesn't want to learn Windows 11 at almost 80 years
old. She just doesn't need that.
sticks wrote:
I recall a few months ago someone posting some links to refurbished
systems for sale that I thought we're pretty reasonable. I have finally
talked my MIL into getting a desktop system instead of the laptop she
has, and would appreciate any recommendations for where to look for
something.
I will be doing the buying, and don't want a new system for her,
especially since she doesn't want to learn Windows 11 at almost 80 years
old. She just doesn't need that.
Check out Micro Center: https://www.microcenter.com/category/4294967292,519/refurbished-desktops
It looks like most of them are W10.
Paul in Houston TX <Paul@Houston.Texas> wrote:
sticks wrote:
I recall a few months ago someone posting some links to refurbished
systems for sale that I thought we're pretty reasonable. I have finally >>> talked my MIL into getting a desktop system instead of the laptop she
has, and would appreciate any recommendations for where to look for
something.
I will be doing the buying, and don't want a new system for her,
especially since she doesn't want to learn Windows 11 at almost 80 years >>> old. She just doesn't need that.
Check out Micro Center:
https://www.microcenter.com/category/4294967292,519/refurbished-desktops
It looks like most of them are W10.
Just be careful when buying a refurb that an OS is included. Also note
which version of the OS is included, and if you'll get the license
sticker, and a standalone license (not one sliced out from a volume
license). Not all of them (when I pick the local store to me) include
an OS, and not all that do are Windows 10. Microcenter has a lot of
Dells and HPs. Likely those came from companies that scrap their old corporate workstations with new ones. Some companies will wipe the
drives as a security measure, so it'll be up to you to install the OS including all the mobo and other hardware drivers.
From my local Microcomputer store, they have 31 refurbs. 1 has Win 10
Home, 26 have Win 10 Pro (likely scrapped corporate workstations), and 1
has Win 11 Pro, leaving 3 with no OS. You absolutely must ascertain an Windows license is included, and how the OS is installed (you might get
just a Dell recovery CD that is usable on only some Dell models, and
assumes the license on the sticker is a standalone license and not for a volume license).
If you want someplace where you can return the system, make sure you
bought from a local computer shop, and check their return policies.
Even if they allow free returns (no restocking fee), they likely will
not cover any return shipping cost. Check how long you have for
returns. Microcenter allows 15 days which sounds like a lot until after
you buy, get home, put together, troubleshooting any problems,
repackage, and take back to the store. Local electronics salvage or recycling shops are not where you get refurbished or working systems.
Those are where you find parts that you'll have to determine if usable.
Find computer retailers that have a refurb inventory.
The salesmen are eager to sell. However, for a return, you'll likely
get the attitude "you should've been expert in knowing what you bought".
I recall a few months ago someone posting some links to
refurbished systems for sale that I thought we're pretty reasonable.
I have finally talked my MIL into getting a desktop system
instead of the laptop she has, and would appreciate any
recommendations for where to look for something.
I will be doing the buying, and don't want a new system for her,
especially since she doesn't want to learn Windows 11 at almost
80 years old. She just doesn't need that.
Any reputable sites would be welcomed.
TIA
I've been seeing these HP EliteDesk 800 G1 around, and think they would be a good fit for the MIL. I realize theseFirst: What is "MIL"?
don't have built in wi-fi
sticks wrote:
I recall a few months ago someone posting some links to refurbished
systems for sale that I thought we're pretty reasonable. I have
finally talked my MIL into getting a desktop system instead of the
laptop she has, and would appreciate any recommendations for where to
look for something.
I will be doing the buying, and don't want a new system for her,
especially since she doesn't want to learn Windows 11 at almost 80
years old. She just doesn't need that.
Any reputable sites would be welcomed.
TIA
Check out Micro Center: https://www.microcenter.com/category/4294967292,519/refurbished-desktops
It looks like most of them are W10.
I have never bought a refurb or on sale deal there but other wise I get
all my comp parts from them because I can drive there and get the part.
That way AM-Fed-UP-PS won't be able to leave it on the front walkway in
the rain for a day.
I recall a few months ago someone posting some links to refurbished systems for sale that I thought we're pretty
reasonable. I have finally talked my MIL into getting a desktop system instead of the laptop she has, and would
appreciate any recommendations for where to look for something.
I will be doing the buying, and don't want a new system for her, especially since she doesn't want to learn Windows 11
at almost 80 years old. She just doesn't need that.
Any reputable sites would be welcomed.
TIA
sticks <wolverine01@charter.net> wrote:
I recall a few months ago someone posting some links to refurbished
systems for sale that I thought we're pretty reasonable. I have finally
talked my MIL into getting a desktop system instead of the laptop she
has, and would appreciate any recommendations for where to look for
something.
I will be doing the buying, and don't want a new system for her,
especially since she doesn't want to learn Windows 11 at almost 80 years
old. She just doesn't need that.
Is her laptop broken? Has she placed additional requirements on what it
will run that mandates a faster computer, or more memory, or more disk
space or faster drives, or more USB ports, or what? Is the OS an old
and unsupported version that she is having problems installing new
software (or is that your job, and you need a later OS version for
software compatibility)? What is the driving essentials mandating she
get a new, and different, computer? Consumers often buy new cars (or
newer used cars) because they contrive the requirements when there
really aren't any. They get a new car because they want a new car.
Who does the sysadmin function on her laptop, and now her new/refurb
desktop? You? If so, what happens in 3 years when Win 10 support dies?
Who does the image backups, and how often? Will you have all the
drivers needed to run on the old OS for that hardware? Something is
pushing the need for newer hardware, but retaining an old OS. The first wasn't mentioned. The second is avoiding unfamiliarity.
I can't see her doing e-mail, web browsing, letter writing, and other
typical end-user tasks really mandates new hardware for her. If the unidentified laptop is over 5 years old, probably time to get a new
battery. If the laptop's monitor has become too small for her aging
eyes, get a monitor to hook up to the laptop, and probably also get a keyboard and mouse (and a powered USB hub) to get her off the crappy
laptop's keyboard and touchpad.
Remember that no matter how lofty sounding the term, refurbished still
means used.
I know it would be considered heresy here, but for about half the cost
of a Win10 refurb w/monitor and keyboard (my Microcenter lists just 1
for $600), you could get her a new Chromebook. All depends on what she
does with her computer, and what software she considers critical, if
any. A lot of users way over-buy for how they will really use a
computer.
If her old laptop is somehow broken, Microcenter also has laptop
refurbs. Since you say she doesn't want to learn a new version of
Windows (11), Microcenter has Win10 laptop refurbs, too. If the old
laptop isn't broken, why does she need new hardware (desktop PC) that possibly isn't any better than her old laptop, or might be better in benchmarks, but won't help with how she uses the computer? What bang
for the buck will she actually attain with a refurb desktop PC? Just
because it's a desktop doesn't mandate she will find it is better for
her.
She has a broom and dustpan that have worked for her for many years.
What's a battery-powered vacuum going to give her other than the
nuisance of having to empty a dust cup to inhale the dust, having to
recharge the battery, and scare her cat (and where the broom and dustpan worked well for sweeping up the cat litter versus cordless vacuums that
can barely pick up cat litter)? Newer doesn't mandate better despite
the sales mantra consumers are exposed to all the time from marketers.
What's bad about her old laptop? She isn't the one pushing to replace
it. You are. Is it really you who wants her to have a better desktop,
so you can use it? Instead of the old hand saw, give your wife a new
miter saw with roller stand. Guess who that gift is really for.
Oh, to add to Paul's suggestion for Microcenter (and whether they have a retail store within driving distance to you), you can get refurbs from Newegg, too.
https://www.newegg.com/p/pl?N=100019095%204016
We don't know where you are. I'm in the USA. You could be over in
Europe. So suggestions from respondents for where they are could be irrelevant to where you are.
For a local retailer selling refurbs, try an online search on
"refurbished desktop computer <yourcity>". For those with web sites,
check those to see if they sell refurbs, how those compare to buying
new, their return policy, and exactly how an OS license is included.
On 1/1/2024 9:28 PM, sticks wrote:
I recall a few months ago someone posting some links to
refurbished systems for sale that I thought we're pretty reasonable.
I have finally talked my MIL into getting a desktop system
instead of the laptop she has, and would appreciate any
recommendations for where to look for something.
I will be doing the buying, and don't want a new system for her,
especially since she doesn't want to learn Windows 11 at almost
80 years old. She just doesn't need that.
Any reputable sites would be welcomed.
TIA
It's actually a complicated topic, as the choices are not
all equal, and the results may be quite unexpected for you.
I've continually learned, from buying stuff for family,
that my glossy view of the world, does not match their
view of what "success" is.
*******
Are you looking for a Win7 platform ? Windows Update works
without a fight, for a Skylake processor.
That leaves Windows 10 as a still-supported OS, that runs on a
decent selection of processors. Refurbisher rules generally
force the individual doing the refurb, to some version of OS
they may not want to be putting on the PC. With the need for
a TPM and the desire for MBEC support, it may be more difficult
for Microsoft to be offering only Win11 Refurb media for those
companies refurbishing PCs.
Refurbished PCs are carried in a number of "bazaar" stores.
For example, Staples is a bazaar seller online (carries little
stock of its own, relatively speaking). Best Buy, I think their
online section is also "baaaar" format. The items are not
in the store, and they can be drop-shipped to you from some
small outfit in the same country. Walmart might have Chinese
sellers in their "bazaar".
A refurb should have 8GB of RAM, as a minimum. You want standards
which are still supported. DDR3 production stopped in March, leaving
DDR4 or DDR5 as easily available with wide selection. For example,
I wanted to put some SODIMMs in my laptop, but being a twit, I'm
too late to get a couple DDR3 ones. Stock is cleaned out, nobody
stockpiled DDR3.
A refurb will "come with a 320GB WD Blue". This is not a plum, and
may have been in the machine while on lease. Small store refurbishers
will put items like this in the machine. Windows 10 works a bit better
with an SSD, and will make a better first impression with one. SSD prices will be rising this year, buy early, buy often. I warned people last
year, to put a spare SSD in their sock drawer for when they need
one at a decent price. The prices are already rising (NAND production
was throttled around third quarter last year).
The integrated graphics on modern machines, are good enough, and might
still be within support. For example, my Optiplex 780, the integrated graphics in there, no longer have good enough drivers, and Win10
will only upgrade itself to 21H2. To install 22H2, I needed to put
a vid card from the junk room in it. Your refurb today, should
easily be better than the 780, and no driver problem to be expected.
Machines with integrated graphics, may have a DisplayPort and an HDMI
port on the back. The monitor you purchase, will at minimum have an
HDMI. I recommend also having a VGA port, and if the crap does not
behave itself, you slap an HDMI to VGA adapter into the cable
chain, to make the monitor work. On the order of $20 for that.
I got an Acer monitor at Staples for a bit over $100, and it had
HDMI and VGA on the back. The HDMI is "picky" about sources, the
VGA always works. My fleet of active adapters, is how I solve problems
like that. So if it black screens when you first get it, you'll need
to look at an alternate "from-to" solution for the cabling.
Keyboard and mouse ? Microsoft is getting out of the kbd/mouse business.
That means no "stable/mainstream items". The stock at the computer store
was "weird". $150 keyboards only a teenager would like, $25 keyboards
of unknown parentage. I was afraid to go look in the mouse section,
to see what cruft is left there.
Good luck,
Paul
On 1/2/24 09:50 AM, sticks wrote:
I've been seeing these HP EliteDesk 800 G1 around, and think theyFirst:Â What is "MIL"?
would be a good fit for the MIL. I realize these don't have built in
wi-fi
Second: I too don't see wifi but the CPU lists "Intel My WiFi
Technology". Not sure what the disconnect is. I thought wi-fi was a given, especially with 10/100/1000 nic.
On 1/1/24 09:28 PM, sticks wrote:
I recall a few months ago someone posting some links to refurbishedMy wife got a new PC lately and it came with Windows 11. She jumped
systems for sale that I thought we're pretty reasonable. I have
finally talked my MIL into getting a desktop system instead of the
laptop she has, and would appreciate any recommendations for where to
look for something.
I will be doing the buying, and don't want a new system for her,
especially since she doesn't want to learn Windows 11 at almost 80
years old. She just doesn't need that.
Any reputable sites would be welcomed.
TIA
from Win10 and Word 2007 to Win 11 and Word 2021. One hell of a leap.
She isn't a wiz at PCs and @ 77yrs, she can't remember tiny details
unless repeated often. Not senile but not her forte. But she learned, leaning on my advice and help. She's quite good at it now.
First:Â What is "MIL"?
On 1/2/2024 9:17 AM, Big Al wrote:
On 1/1/24 09:28 PM, sticks wrote:
I recall a few months ago someone posting some links to refurbished systems for sale that I thought we're prettyMy wife got a new PC lately and it came with Windows 11. She jumped from Win10 and Word 2007 to Win 11 and Word 2021.
reasonable. I have finally talked my MIL into getting a desktop system instead of the laptop she has, and would
appreciate any recommendations for where to look for something.
I will be doing the buying, and don't want a new system for her, especially since she doesn't want to learn Windows
11 at almost 80 years old. She just doesn't need that.
Any reputable sites would be welcomed.
TIA
One hell of a leap. She isn't a wiz at PCs and @ 77yrs, she can't remember tiny details unless repeated often. Not
senile but not her forte. But she learned, leaning on my advice and help. She's quite good at it now.
Good for her!
I'm sure the MIL after an hour using it probably would not even know what operating system she has. But since she is
adamant she doesn't want Win 11, that's not a fight I want to have. Hell I do have one laptop disk with a working win
11 system on it, but I don't use it and have it running Win 10 instead. I suppose I should pop it in every once and a
while to get familiar with the OS.
But it does bring to mind the question of whether anyone has a good site that explains the differences or benefits of
the two (10-11).
Big Al wrote:
First: What is "MIL"?
Mother In Law
On 1/1/2024 9:12 PM, Paul in Houston TX wrote:
sticks wrote:
I recall a few months ago someone posting some links to refurbished
systems for sale that I thought we're pretty reasonable. I have
finally talked my MIL into getting a desktop system instead of the
laptop she has, and would appreciate any recommendations for where to
look for something.
I will be doing the buying, and don't want a new system for her,
especially since she doesn't want to learn Windows 11 at almost 80
years old. She just doesn't need that.
Any reputable sites would be welcomed.
TIA
Check out Micro Center:
https://www.microcenter.com/category/4294967292,519/refurbished-desktops
It looks like most of them are W10.
I have never bought a refurb or on sale deal there but other wise I
get all my comp parts from them because I can drive there and get the
part.
That way AM-Fed-UP-PS won't be able to leave it on the front walkway
in the rain for a day.
OK, I'm adding Microcenter to the list.
Prices are not too bad. I've been seeing these HP EliteDesk 800 G1
around, and think they would be a good fit for the MIL. I realize these don't have built in wi-fi, but other than that this would be a huge jump
from where she's at now and probably all she needs. Something like this:
<https://www.microcenter.com/product/611905/hp-elitedesk-800-g1-desktop-computer-(refurbished)>
I'm sure the MIL after an hour using [Windows 11] probably would not even know
what operating system she has. But since she is adamant she doesn't
want Win 11, that's not a fight I want to have. Hell I do have one
laptop disk with a working win 11 system on it, but I don't use it and
have it running Win 10 instead. I suppose I should pop it in every once
and a while to get familiar with the OS.
But it does bring to mind the question of whether anyone has a good
site that explains the differences or benefits of the two (10-11).
I also have used craigslist and ebay in the past. This post is coming
from the $50 craigslist box in my heated garage. I would do that again
if the local guys had anything respectable, but right now there is
little in the way of desktops I see any reason to look at. Lots of
crappy laptops, though.
She bought this laptop probably around 10 years ago. I had just
finished setting up the FIL with his laptop and her older desktop
(XP) broke down. She couldn't wait for me to help her in choosing
because she can't go a day without one without experiencing serious withdrawal. It was a windows 7 machine, that I upgraded to win 10,
imaged, and helped get her email and browser set up.
Wi-fi radio is most likely turning to toast (going there now to put a
usb receiver temporarily)
Her laptop has the small soft battery inside and not easily removable,
that is completely junk.
Restarting took quite some time to get to a screen, like a half hour
or so.
She used desktops for years and knows the difference. They just
decided having laptops would somehow be simpler for them, not taking
into consideration the pain in the ass they are to work on, get parts
for, and the slower speeds from desktop hardware.
I've been seeing these HP EliteDesk 800 G1 around, and think they
would be a good fit for the MIL. I realize these don't have built in
wi-fi, but other than that this would be a huge jump from where she's
at now and probably all she needs. Something like this:
<https://www.microcenter.com/product/611905/hp-elitedesk-800-g1-desktop-computer-(refurbished)>
But it does bring to mind the question of whether anyone has a good site
that explains the differences or benefits of the two (10-11).
sticks wrote on 1/1/24 7:28 PM:recommendations for where to look for something.
I recall a few months ago someone posting some links to refurbished systems for sale that I thought we're pretty reasonable. I have finally talked my MIL into getting a desktop system instead of the laptop she has, and would appreciate any
With Win10 ending in Oct 2025, your best choices are Linux or Windows 11.
I will be doing the buying, and don't want a new system for her, especially since she doesn't want to learn Windows 11 at almost 80 years old. She just doesn't need that.
Any reputable sites would be welcomed.
TIA
sticks wrote:recommendations for where to look for something.
On 1/1/2024 9:12 PM, Paul in Houston TX wrote:
sticks wrote:
I recall a few months ago someone posting some links to refurbished systems for sale that I thought we're pretty reasonable. I have finally talked my MIL into getting a desktop system instead of the laptop she has, and would appreciate any
probably all she needs. Something like this:
I will be doing the buying, and don't want a new system for her, especially since she doesn't want to learn Windows 11 at almost 80 years old. She just doesn't need that.
Any reputable sites would be welcomed.
TIA
Check out Micro Center:
https://www.microcenter.com/category/4294967292,519/refurbished-desktops >>> It looks like most of them are W10.
I have never bought a refurb or on sale deal there but other wise I get all my comp parts from them because I can drive there and get the part.
That way AM-Fed-UP-PS won't be able to leave it on the front walkway in the rain for a day.
OK, I'm adding Microcenter to the list.
Prices are not too bad. I've been seeing these HP EliteDesk 800 G1 around, and think they would be a good fit for the MIL. I realize these don't have built in wi-fi, but other than that this would be a huge jump from where she's at now and
<https://www.microcenter.com/product/611905/hp-elitedesk-800-g1-desktop-computer-(refurbished)>
We don't know what your MIL will use the comp for but keep in mind that graphics are basic and the machine is for business and is not a gamer.
No intense graphics gaming for your MIL.
In my experience, having Wifi default in desktops is fairly recent or high end. Instead of USB to wifi and if the 4x slot is available, I would get a PCIe wifi card. That's one less protocol conversion needed.
Also, personally, I don't care about getting the latest and greatest O/S. My gamer is W7 and should be good for many more years. The work laptop is W10 and should be good for many years... unless my employer changes requirements.
Is that 100MB/sec or 100Mb/sec? The former is approximately Gigabit speed and I'd be very happy!
https://www.digitalcitizen.life/tp-link-archer-tx3000e-review/--Jeff Barnett
...w¡ñ§±¤ñ wrote on 1/2/24 11:32 AM:
sticks wrote on 1/1/24 7:28 PM:
I recall a few months ago someone posting some links to refurbishedWith Win10 ending in Oct 2025, your best choices are Linux or Windows 11.
systems for sale that I thought we're pretty reasonable. I have
finally talked my MIL into getting a desktop system instead of the
laptop she has, and would appreciate any recommendations for where to
look for something.
I will be doing the buying, and don't want a new system for her,
especially since she doesn't want to learn Windows 11 at almost 80
years old. She just doesn't need that.
Any reputable sites would be welcomed.
TIA
Issues aside with Linux or Windows...
Event though the intended device is for an elderly person(almost 80),
my point...why purchases any device(refurbed) with Win10 having less than
2 yrs of support to replace a current laptop(supposedly running Win10 but aged and with apparent performance issues).
- Is the refurb to be replaced again or upgraded to Win11 in 2 yrs with Win11(it wouldn't make sense to purchase a Win10 refurb in 2026).
- Is the resistance to Win11 really valid, or is it skewed based on perception or input. Win11 can be tweaked to look like Win10(but not
really necessary if on properly configures the Start Screen and TaskBar
with only the apps and programs an 80 yr might/will use.
While Linux would not be my choice if buying a device for someone less
than a decade older than I when they've been using Windows since(as
noted) XP...
=> Windows 11 still appears to be the most logical choice regardless of
a refurb or new device...and a desktop may not be the best choice
either(why limit an aging person to use a device in one single location!)
sticks <wolverine01@charter.net> wrote:
But it does bring to mind the question of whether anyone has a good site
that explains the differences or benefits of the two (10-11).
Online search on "windows 11 compare windows 10".
https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/compare-windows-11-home-vs-pro-versions
https://techcommunity.microsoft.com/t5/windows-11/windows-11-vs-windows-10-a-comprehensive-comparison-of-features/m-p/3760255
https://www.techtarget.com/whatis/feature/Windows-11-vs-Windows-10-What-are-the-differences
and lots more online comparing 10 and 11.
Something else to consider is if she might want to now or later run
Android apps on her Windows desktop (without having to use an Android emulator, like Bluestacks). She might like an app on her smartphone,
sticks <wolverine01@charter.net> wrote:
Big Al wrote:
First:Â What is "MIL"?
Mother In Law
Mothers have to love you. Mothers-in-law you have to cajole into liking
you. Hmm, who is paying for the desktop refurb?
sticks <wolverine01@charter.net> wrote:
I've been seeing these HP EliteDesk 800 G1 around, and think they
would be a good fit for the MIL. I realize these don't have built in
wi-fi, but other than that this would be a huge jump from where she's
at now and probably all she needs. Something like this:
<https://www.microcenter.com/product/611905/hp-elitedesk-800-g1-desktop-computer-(refurbished)>
You could look at getting a USB dongle for wifi.
"...w¡ñ§±¤ñ " <winstonmvp@gmail.com> wrote:
...w¡ñ§±¤ñ wrote on 1/2/24 11:32 AM:
sticks wrote on 1/1/24 7:28 PM:
I recall a few months ago someone posting some links to refurbishedWith Win10 ending in Oct 2025, your best choices are Linux or Windows 11. >>>
systems for sale that I thought we're pretty reasonable. I have
finally talked my MIL into getting a desktop system instead of the
laptop she has, and would appreciate any recommendations for where to
look for something.
I will be doing the buying, and don't want a new system for her,
especially since she doesn't want to learn Windows 11 at almost 80
years old. She just doesn't need that.
Any reputable sites would be welcomed.
TIA
Issues aside with Linux or Windows...
Event though the intended device is for an elderly person(almost 80),
my point...why purchases any device(refurbed) with Win10 having less than
2 yrs of support to replace a current laptop(supposedly running Win10 but
aged and with apparent performance issues).
- Is the refurb to be replaced again or upgraded to Win11 in 2 yrs with >> Win11(it wouldn't make sense to purchase a Win10 refurb in 2026).
- Is the resistance to Win11 really valid, or is it skewed based on
perception or input. Win11 can be tweaked to look like Win10(but not
really necessary if on properly configures the Start Screen and TaskBar
with only the apps and programs an 80 yr might/will use.
While Linux would not be my choice if buying a device for someone less
than a decade older than I when they've been using Windows since(as
noted) XP...
=> Windows 11 still appears to be the most logical choice regardless of >> a refurb or new device...and a desktop may not be the best choice
either(why limit an aging person to use a device in one single location!)
While Windows 10 support from Microsoft ends in Oct 2025, that doesn't
mean the OS becomes immediately obsolete or unusable. Windows 10 came
out in 2016, but I used Windows 7 until 2019 (and totally skipped Win8).
I didn't switch just because Microsoft came out with a new version.
My expectation is that I will use Windows 10 long after its support has ended. A lot of software deprecates its use under old versions of
Windows, but that is typically around 4 years. So, I'll likely be using Windows 10 until about 2029. That's 6 years away, not 2. With
Microsoft flopping around on good versions of Windows (WinXP: yes,
WinVista: no, Win7: yes, Win8: no, Win10: eh, so-so, Win11: not much
bang for the buck or effort), by then we'll get to see what Microsoft
does with Windows 12. Those that have stayed with Windows 10 may not
leap to Windows 11 just because it exists, but wait until Windows 12, or maybe even 13 (which they'll probably skip, like they did with 9, so 13
will be called 14). For users, a lot depends on when other software
departs old versions of an OS. The OS is just the plate on which the
cake sits. It is not the be-all or end-all to users. It's what the
users can run on the OS. That's the point of a general-purpose OS.
Rather than tout a new version, better is to compile a matrix of
differences to compare the 2, and then check which, if any, differences
are really important to you, not what Microsoft marketers want to push.
User Interface
Win11: Fluent Design with new Start Menu and Taskbar
Win10: Classic Start Menu and Taskbar
Glitz change with no real benefit. Microsoft has long adhered to the strategy that making something look different just must be better. Conclusion: No real benefit to users, adds a superfluous learning curve.
A change in GUI does not mandate better experience, and why many users
use Start10, OpenShell, and other alternatives to return to a familiar
GUI.
System Requirements
Win11: 64-bit Processor with 2 cores, 4GB RAM, and 64GB Storage
Win10: 64-bit Processor with 1 GHz clock speed, 2GB RAM, and 20GB HDD
Fatter disk footprint for Win11. Higher CPU reqs whether the apps will
be better to the user.
Conclusion: Same ol' mindset of trying to make usable hardware
disposable. No benefit to existing computer users.
Widgets
Win11: Integrated Widgets for quick access to information
Win10: No integrated Widgets
Yeah, Microsoft yanked them due to security vulnerabilities. Now
they're back despite users really haven't needed any.
Conclusion: Who dropped Win10 because of no widgets? No one.
Virtual Desktops
Win11: Improved virtual desktops with snap layouts and new animations
Win10: Virtual desktops with limited functionality
Conclusion: Microsoft is always late with these type of features. There
are much better 3rd-party VDs available, and for quite a while.
Touch Controls
Win11: Improved touch controls for touch devices
Win10: Limited touch controls
Conclusion: Fluff if you don't have nor use a touch screen.
Gaming Performance
Win11: Improved gaming performance with Auto HDR and DirectStorage
Win10: Similar gaming performance to Windows 11
Conclusion: No benefit.
Microsoft Store
Win11: Redesigned Microsoft Store with support for Android apps
Win10: Traditional Microsoft Store
Conclusion: Only of value if you have apps on your Android smart phone
you would like on your Windows host. Win32 apps are far more robust
than UWP apps, and are more robust than Android apps. For what you
could run under Windows, anything Android is a downgrade.
Security
Win11: Enhanced security features with Windows Hello and TPM 2.0
Win10: Similar security features to Windows 11
Conclusion. No benefit. Many users disable Hello, anyway. TPM is not a requirement for Win10, but is for Win11, so Win11 forces hardware
upgrades.
Multitasking
Win11: Snap Layouts and Snap Groups for improved multitasking
Win10: Basic multitasking capabilities
Conclusion: More fluff which many users disable. Also, 3rd-party
software has been able to snap groups for a long time (e.g., Stardock's Object Desktop). Again, Microsoft trying to catch up.
Task Manager
Win11: Updated Task Manager with more details and options
Win10: Similar Task Manager to Windows 11
Conclusion: No benefit. While not completely replacing Task Manager, SysInternal Process Explorer makes a good choice, plus it can work with VirusTotal to check on untoward processes.
File Explorer
Win11: Redesigned File Explorer with a new layout and features
Win10: Traditional File Explorer with limited features
Conclusion: If you feel the need for a better File Explorer, look to 3rd-party alternatives.
Start Menu
Win11: New Start Menu design with pinned and recommended apps
Win10: Classic Start Menu with limited features
Conclusion: Change for the sake of change with no real benefit. Use OpenShell to revert.
Cortana
Win11: Separated from search and no longer integrated into the taskbar
Win10: Integrated into the taskbar
Conclusion: Microsoft dropped Cortana to replace with Bing AI which is
an Edge-C feature. AI just gets in the way making inappropriate
guesses.
Updates
Win11: Automatic updates with fewer interruptions and improved control
Win10: Similar update process to Windows 11
Conclusion: And still Microsoft ignores their consumer base who actually
want to wrest control away from Microsoft, and decide if and when to
update or upgrade.
Compatibility
Win11: Improved compatibility with new hardware and software
Win10: Improved compatibility with existing hardware and software
Conclusion: A future benefit after hardware and software becomes viewed
as "old".
Nope, not much value in switching from Windows 10 you already have to a no-bang-for-the-buck Windows 11. Yes, Windows 10 support dies in 2025,
but when has discontinued support mandated immediate obsolescence? The
OP's mother-in-law, the OP, I, and many other users will still find
Windows 10 quite usable for another decade. Instead of putty, primer,
and paint to make siding look different, we're still waiting for
Microsoft to give us new siding; i.e., something *substantial* to
provide impetus for change.
The OP's MIL bought her laptop about 10 years ago. She might be getting
a new desktop soon, so new hardware, but same OS (Windows 10). So what
if in another 10 years she wants a new computer with new hardware and whatever OS is available then. If you work in a enterprise-level
company providing software and support to corporate customers, you'll
know that many are using ancient operating systems. Consumers are
simply easier targets to con into paying for upgrades when not needed.
sticks <wolverine01@charter.net> wrote:
She bought this laptop probably around 10 years ago. I had just
finished setting up the FIL with his laptop and her older desktop
(XP) broke down. She couldn't wait for me to help her in choosing
because she can't go a day without one without experiencing serious
withdrawal. It was a windows 7 machine, that I upgraded to win 10,
imaged, and helped get her email and browser set up.
For whatever web browser she uses, does it update itself? Some sites
refuse to work or reduce their content when old versions of web browsers visit them. Some will look at just the version of the web browser while
some will test the functions of the web browser to ensure it will
support the Javascript and HTML code in their web docs. Not sure what "booted off" means unless it is the following wifi issue.
Wi-fi radio is most likely turning to toast (going there now to put a
usb receiver temporarily)
A USB dongle was my first thought. Go into the OS, disable the old NIC hardware in devmgmt.msc, and go forward with the USB wifi dongle, but be
sure it isn't blocked or too far away from the wifi router or wifi
access point.
However, since it is a laptop, overheating may be the cause. Lint and
dust are thermal insulators. May need to dismantle the laptop case to
use compressed air to blow out the dust. If it gets too hot inside, the
CPU will throttle itself to reduce its workload and how much heat it generates.
Her laptop has the small soft battery inside and not easily removable,
that is completely junk.
Hmm, in the laptops that I've worked on, the battery is a module that
snaps in and out of a recess inside the case under an access cover. Is
this a laptop, or notebook? Make and model? Might be a Youtube video
on it that you could use to figure out how to replace the battery, or
just disconnect it (although sometimes the battery is used as a
capacitor, so the computer won't power up without a battery).
Restarting took quite some time to get to a screen, like a half hour
or so.
Sounds like the corruption is user sourced. She's doing something to
cause the extended boot time, like installing software and allowing
anything to add itself as a startup program, installing crap software,
or even installing malware. When she logs into a Windows account, is it
an admin or user account? Might need to put her on a user (normal)
account which restricts her from installing anything. You'll have to be on-call to do that for her just to protect her from herself.
She used desktops for years and knows the difference. They just
decided having laptops would somehow be simpler for them, not taking
into consideration the pain in the ass they are to work on, get parts
for, and the slower speeds from desktop hardware.
Decent laptops cost more than similar performing desktops. Ever
consider building the desktop yourself?
Like Paul mentions, if you intend to save cost by getting a refurb, get
from a local store where you can ask questions about returns and OS
license. Prices can vary a lot even on the same make and model, so shop around for best price, but consider, too, from where you buy.
I don't recall the make and model off hand, but it is not accessible
from any of the outside covers. You have to take it all apart, and the battery looks like a couple AA batteries wrapped together. I suppose
the ones we're used to seeing are basically the same thing, only they
get put in a case and are accessible. It was the first time I had seen
one like that.
That's how I used to do it. I think they used to sell "bare bones"
setups that had a motherboard and processor, and you could add on from
there. I saw a little while back that method has gotten pretty
expensive if you're trying to stay cutting edge. IMO, the values isn't
there anymore and you can't beat the savings from what the big guys can
do because of volume.
I checked out amazon and they too seem to have quite a bit of these
refurbs. Actually, they seem to have the best prices too. Still looking.
Based on your reasoning to continue to use Win10 post EOL support, you
would let your near 80 yr old MIL operate a device without maximum
available security.
Also remember the audience: the OP looking to upgrade the hardware for
his 80-year old MIL. He's looking at refurbs to save on cost. He's not going to save much if he buys a Win10 setup, and then have to buy a
Win11 license. A lot more refurbs come with Win10, and fewer with
Win11. Companies haven't yet en masse disposed of their leased
workstations running Win11.
If the OP can afford a higher priced Win11 refurb, like another $100,
and would like to try OpenShell or other tricks to make Win11 look more
like Win10 to placate his MIL,
but be prepared the MIL
may complain she didn't get what she wanted. Despite your aspirations
for Win11, the MIL has already dictated she wants Win10. Therein lies
the major filter on what refurb the OP will get. You might try to get
more than what the customer wants, but don't ignore what they want.
This is one where the 'tough love' questions should be asked(to the
MIL)
1. Are you planning on living more than 2 yrs.
2. If so do you want to continue to use an unsupported o/s on a
reburbished Windows 10 device for everything you do on the
device(internet, email).
3. If so, do you wish to no longer receive security updates for
Windows 10 on a reburbished device since they will cease in Oct 2025.
4. If so, knowing the details and understanding of the answers to 1,
2,and 3 do you wish a refurbished device that can not be upgraded to
Win11 or a refurbished Win10 device that can be upgraded(freely with no additional cost) to Windows 11 after #2 and #3 become reality.
5. Do you want a 'desktop' device that will and can only be accessed in
one single fixed location in your residence.
I agree with your later (snipped) point that a Win11-*capable* (*not*
one which *comes with* Win11) refurb is probably more costly than a non-Win11-capable Win10 refurb, but AFAIK your argument of needing a
Win11 license is not correct, because AFAIK the upgrade from Win10 to
Win11 is free (I think Winston just confirmed this).
The Open-Shell Menu looks not like the stock Win10 Start Menu at all,
so I don't see how using Open-Shell Menu on Win11 would help.
Frank Slootweg <this@ddress.is.invalid> wrote:
I agree with your later (snipped) point that a Win11-*capable* (*not*
one which *comes with* Win11) refurb is probably more costly than a non-Win11-capable Win10 refurb, but AFAIK your argument of needing a
Win11 license is not correct, because AFAIK the upgrade from Win10 to
Win11 is free (I think Winston just confirmed this).
Can the OP freely move from Win11 to Win10 should his MIL complain she
didn't get the Win10 she wanted? Moving forward might be free. Does Microsoft still offer the downgrade option for free?
The Open-Shell Menu looks not like the stock Win10 Start Menu at all,
so I don't see how using Open-Shell Menu on Win11 would help.
I've never used GUI shells. I figure if I get a particular OS version
then its GUI is with what I want to become familiar. I'm used to
learning curves, so no big deal for me. However, to help others I want
to be familiar with the native GUI of that version of the OS, not try to interpolate between a fixed-up GUI and the default GUI.
https://www.dedoimedo.com/images/computers-years/2021-1/open-shell-win11-icon.png
https://www.dedoimedo.com/images/computers-years/2021-1/open-shell-win11-menu-color.png
Nope, none of those selections look like the Win10 Start menu. Looks
like they more simulate the Win7 or WinXP cascading Start menus, and no
tiles panel.
I didn't see options to show the tiles panel. I don't
know if the Skins option modifies the layout to look more like Win10.
Guess OpenShell harkens back to its ancestral ClassShell which was to
give an old look to the Start menu, but tiles aren't considered
"classic". I did see the Fluent Metro skin might add tiles (https://github.com/bonzibudd/Fluent-Metro).
So much for trying to use OpenShell make Win11 look like Win10. Start10 looks like it has a Tiles view mode. Their Start menu config options
have a "Windows 10 style" that looks to have a tile panel. OpenShell
(just like ClassicShell) is FOSS, but Start11 costs $7 (per device).
It's parent product, I believe, is ObjectDesktop ($35), or ObjectDesktop includes Start11 along without other components; however, I dislike subscriptionware (for ObjectDeskopt - looks like Start11 is perpetual).
Since the OP's MIL requires Win10, guess the safest choice for the OP is going with Win10 on his MIL's new computer.
VanguardLH wrote on 1/3/24 8:17 PM:
winston <winstonmvp@gmail.com> wrote:
Based on your reasoning to continue to use Win10 post EOL support, you
would let your near 80 yr old MIL operate a device without maximum
available security.
Yep. I don't hide behind the security card as an excuse to get a newer
version of Windows that *promises* more nebulous security (whether I
want it or not). And, of course, we users have to hope Microsoft
doesn't yet come out with another update whether for the OS or drivers
that isn't corruptive as malware.
Also remember the audience: the OP looking to upgrade the hardware for
his 80-year old MIL. He's looking at refurbs to save on cost. He's not >> going to save much if he buys a Win10 setup, and then have to buy a
Win11 license. A lot more refurbs come with Win10, and fewer with
Win11. Companies haven't yet en masse disposed of their leased
workstations running Win11.
Win10 can be used on a computer with TPM2. Win11 ups the hardware
requirement, so those refurbs may not qualify.
https://support.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/enable-tpm-2-0-on-your-pc-1fd5a332-360d-4f46-a1e7-ae6b0c90645c
Those without a TPM module may still work with Windows 11 if their BIOS
has the Intel PTT (Platform Trust Technology) firmware to perform the
functions of the TPM module. However, that means the OP will have to
delve into each candidate refurb to see it is has a TPM module (and it
is installed), or has the Intel PTT firmware in the BIOS.
CPU requirements are also upped for Windows 11. Those Win10 refurbs
that let the OP reduce cost may not qualify for Win11. It will be the
OP that decides if the higher cost of Win11 refurbs is of value over a
lower cost Win10 refurb.
If the OP can afford a higher priced Win11 refurb, like another $100,
and would like to try OpenShell or other tricks to make Win11 look more
like Win10 to placate his MIL, then go for it, but be prepared the MIL
may complain she didn't get what she wanted. Despite your aspirations
for Win11, the MIL has already dictated she wants Win10. Therein lies
the major filter on what refurb the OP will get. You might try to get
more than what the customer wants, but don't ignore what they want.
:)
This is one where the 'tough love' questions should be asked(to the MIL)
1. Are you planning on living more than 2 yrs.
2. If so do you want to continue to use an unsupported o/s on a
reburbished Windows 10 device for everything you do on the
device(internet, email).
3. If so, do you wish to no longer receive security updates for Windows
10 on a reburbished device since they will cease in Oct 2025.
4. If so, knowing the details and understanding of the answers to 1,
2,and 3 do you wish a refurbished device that can not be upgraded to
Win11 or a refurbished Win10 device that can be upgraded(freely with no additional cost) to Windows 11 after #2 and #3 become reality.
5. Do you want a 'desktop' device that will and can only be accessed in
one single fixed location in your residence.
winston <winstonmvp@gmail.com> wrote:
The OP says he will save an image backup after getting the refurb to
allow restoring to that state. Having to restore months or years away
back to an install-time image means losing every change made since along
with any data (likely the MIL, or even the OP, won't save data files on
a different partition [on a different drive] than for the OS and apps).
Seems the OP should schedule backups at regular intervals that require
no user intervention. The OP could restore to something recent instead
of restoring to an ancient image.
sticks <wolverine01@charter.net> wrote:
I don't recall the make and model off hand, but it is not accessible
from any of the outside covers. You have to take it all apart, and the
battery looks like a couple AA batteries wrapped together. I suppose
the ones we're used to seeing are basically the same thing, only they
get put in a case and are accessible. It was the first time I had seen
one like that.
A couple AA batteries strapped together regardless of chemistry would
not be sufficient to power a laptop when mobile. Maybe you were looking
at the CMOS battery.
That's how I used to do it. I think they used to sell "bare bones"
setups that had a motherboard and processor, and you could add on from
there. I saw a little while back that method has gotten pretty
expensive if you're trying to stay cutting edge. IMO, the values isn't
there anymore and you can't beat the savings from what the big guys can
do because of volume.
I checked out amazon and they too seem to have quite a bit of these
refurbs. Actually, they seem to have the best prices too. Still looking.
Did you include the shipping cost from Amazon? Some folks pay to
subscribe to the Prime service tier, but I don't order enough from them
to qualify the expense of Prime ($15/mo) against shipping for the few
times per years I place orders with them. There is a checkbox "Free
shipping by Amazon", but, just like with Prime, they've already added shipping cost, so it's the pretense of free shipping.
You could visit a local shop or their web site to see what they have for refurbs, note which make and models you like, check if Amazon has the
same or equivalent refurb, and perhaps negotiate with the local store to
get close to the Amazon price.
To be fair, the laptop being replaced was itself a replacement from an
old XP system. They kept complaining about various things and
problems they were having. It took some time to explain that their
XP system was unable to do lots of things and run software in the
current environment. It was like pulling teeth to get them on a newer version. The laptop was originally Win7 and they used that for
years. It was probably around two years ago I convinced them to
upgrade to win 10. Same process of explaining why I thought the
change would be good for them and getting that blank stare in return.
It took me quite some time myself to upgrade to win 10. I found
most of the complaints without merit, and figured they could handle
the switch.
I don't know. Getting install media used to be simple/possible, but
the requirements seemi to have changed lately. Probably Winston can
tell. Anyway, Win11 to Win10 wasn't your argument, but Win10 to Win11.
Exactly, so I don't see why you thought Open-Shell Menu would be a
suitable replacement for the stock Windows 10 Start Menu.
It's unlikely that any of these are closely similar to the stock
Windows 10 Start Menu, so they are no solution for sticks' MIL.
sticks <wolverine01@charter.net> wrote:
To be fair, the laptop being replaced was itself a replacement from an
old XP system. They kept complaining about various things and
problems they were having. It took some time to explain that their
XP system was unable to do lots of things and run software in the
current environment. It was like pulling teeth to get them on a newer
version. The laptop was originally Win7 and they used that for
years. It was probably around two years ago I convinced them to
upgrade to win 10. Same process of explaining why I thought the
change would be good for them and getting that blank stare in return.
It took me quite some time myself to upgrade to win 10. I found
most of the complaints without merit, and figured they could handle
the switch.
When you saturate the market, you can invigorate sales only by adding
more features. I remember when the VCR sales stalled, because everyone
that wanted one already had one. They didn't break down often enough to cover business costs to run a manufacturing plant for them. So, they
started adding more features: scheduled recording, slo-mo and
frame-by-frame viewing, dual-tape or tape+disc machines, front load
instead of top load, and so on. Sales were based on adding gimmicks
beyond the basic features. Marketing tries to convince consumers they
just must have the added non-essentials they claim are essential.
But do you, er, does the MIL really need more than the laptop? See my
reply to Frank on what you could do to speed up the laptop, and improve ergonomics with a better monitor, keyboard, and mouse. Is the old
laptop really the problem, or that it never got upgrades and tweaks to improve responsiveness, and better user experience with the I/O devices?
1. Restore and earlier Win10 saved image(e.g. Macrium or other 3rd party imaging tool)
winston <winstonmvp@gmail.com> wrote:
1. Restore and earlier Win10 saved image(e.g. Macrium or other 3rd party
imaging tool)
I like that idea best for the OP.
- Buy a Win10 refurb that can run Win11 (e.g., make sure TPM2 or BIOS
Intel PTT are available).
- Capture the license string (several software tools) rather than rely
on a sticker on the case, but keep both if different.
- Save a full image backup of Win10 setup.
- Upgrade to Win11, apply all Windows updates, and driver updates.
- Save a full backup image of Win11 setup.
- Tweak Win11 to make more Win10-like; e.g., move Start menu to left of
Taskbar, use Start11 with Win10 theme w/Pinned panel that looks like
Tiles panel of Win10 Start menu; http://tinyurl.com/8jxara2z).
- See if the MIL will accept the tweaked Win11 setup.
- If not, restore to Win10 image.
However, unsure sticks wants to go through all that. Might try it
myself, though.
On 1/5/2024 2:11 PM, VanguardLH wrote:
winston <winstonmvp@gmail.com> wrote:
1. Restore and earlier Win10 saved image(e.g. Macrium or other 3rd party >>> imaging tool)
I like that idea best for the OP.
- Buy a Win10 refurb that can run Win11 (e.g., make sure TPM2 or BIOS
Intel PTT are available).
- Capture the license string (several software tools) rather than rely
on a sticker on the case, but keep both if different.
- Save a full image backup of Win10 setup.
- Upgrade to Win11, apply all Windows updates, and driver updates.
- Save a full backup image of Win11 setup.
- Tweak Win11 to make more Win10-like; e.g., move Start menu to left of
Taskbar, use Start11 with Win10 theme w/Pinned panel that looks like
Tiles panel of Win10 Start menu; http://tinyurl.com/8jxara2z).
- See if the MIL will accept the tweaked Win11 setup.
- If not, restore to Win10 image.
However, unsure sticks wants to go through all that. Might try it
myself, though.
I do like it, actually. I've been looking at systems that can run 11,
but have 10 installed. It is a little work finding out if they qualify,
but doable.
The research I've done on 11 requirements, particularly TPM2, have
raised a question or two. It seems most things produced after 2016
would have it, though might not be setup in the bios. That narrows down
the list of possible systems. My laptop, for example, has a drive that
has 11 loaded, but I have not yet checked to see if it actually does get updates to the operating system. One of the things I read was that the registry tweak you can do to trick it into thinking it has TPM2 can
often lead to a loaded Windows 11, that fails to update. I shall have
to see about that.
I recall a few months ago someone posting some links to refurbished
systems for sale that I thought we're pretty reasonable. I have finally talked my MIL into getting a desktop system instead of the laptop she
has, and would appreciate any recommendations for where to look for something.
I will be doing the buying, and don't want a new system for her,
especially since she doesn't want to learn Windows 11 at almost 80 years old. She just doesn't need that.
Any reputable sites would be welcomed.
TIA
On 1/1/2024 9:28 PM, sticks wrote:
I recall a few months ago someone posting some links to refurbished
systems for sale that I thought we're pretty reasonable. I have
finally talked my MIL into getting a desktop system instead of the
laptop she has, and would appreciate any recommendations for where to
look for something.
I will be doing the buying, and don't want a new system for her,
especially since she doesn't want to learn Windows 11 at almost 80
years old. She just doesn't need that.
Any reputable sites would be welcomed.
TIA
If it hasn't been mentioned, give a look here: https://discountelectronics.com/locations/
Their mail order is prompt, and the people are helpful. One year guarantee.
On 1/1/2024 9:28 PM, sticks wrote:
I recall a few months ago someone posting some links to refurbished
systems for sale that I thought we're pretty reasonable. I have
finally talked my MIL into getting a desktop system instead of the
laptop she has, and would appreciate any recommendations for where to
look for something.
I will be doing the buying, and don't want a new system for her,
especially since she doesn't want to learn Windows 11 at almost 80
years old. She just doesn't need that.
Any reputable sites would be welcomed.
TIA
If it hasn't been mentioned, give a look here: https://discountelectronics.com/locations/
Their mail order is prompt, and the people are helpful. One year guarantee.
On 1/8/2024 7:07 AM, Karen wrote:
On 1/1/2024 9:28 PM, sticks wrote:
I recall a few months ago someone posting some links to refurbished
systems for sale that I thought we're pretty reasonable. I have
finally talked my MIL into getting a desktop system instead of the
laptop she has, and would appreciate any recommendations for where to
look for something.
I will be doing the buying, and don't want a new system for her,
especially since she doesn't want to learn Windows 11 at almost 80
years old. She just doesn't need that.
Any reputable sites would be welcomed.
TIA
If it hasn't been mentioned, give a look here:
https://discountelectronics.com/locations/
Their mail order is prompt, and the people are helpful. One year guarantee.
"Discount Electronics sells more used and refurbished computers than any other company. We have thousands of Dell, HP and Lenovo desktops, both
used and refurbished. All of our desktop computer include a one-year
warranty direct from Discount Electronics. So, no matter whether you
call them refurbished or used, desktops, computers, towers or PCs, we
have you covered. No charge for shipping"
I've been looking at systems that can run 11,
but have 10 installed. It is a little work finding out if they qualify,
but doable.
The research I've done on 11 requirements, particularly TPM2, have
raised a question or two. It seems most things produced after 2016
would have it, though might not be setup in the bios. That narrows down
the list of possible systems. My laptop, for example, has a drive that
has 11 loaded, but I have not yet checked to see if it actually does get updates to the operating system. One of the things I read was that the registry tweak you can do to trick it into thinking it has TPM2 can
often lead to a loaded Windows 11, that fails to update. I shall have
to see about that.
I ended up getting her a Dell OptiPlex 7040, with 6th gen i5, 32 GB of
DDR4 ram, a new 1TB NVMe M.2 SSD, a spinning 2TB HDD, AX200 Built in
WIFI 6 & Bluetooth 5.2, and a new 20" monitor with built-in speakers.
The whole cost was right at $290. I think between the cpu and the 32 GB
ram, she's gonna be very happy for now.
sticks <wolverine01@charter.net> wrote:
I ended up getting her a Dell OptiPlex 7040, with 6th gen i5, 32 GB of
DDR4 ram, a new 1TB NVMe M.2 SSD, a spinning 2TB HDD, AX200 Built in
WIFI 6 & Bluetooth 5.2, and a new 20" monitor with built-in speakers.
The whole cost was right at $290. I think between the cpu and the 32 GB
ram, she's gonna be very happy for now.
Where did you find that one? Included the monitor?
Oops, nevermind. Found:
http://dl.dell.com/topicspdf/optiplex-7040-desktop_owners-manual_en-us.pdf
which says it supports TPM 1.2. Windows 11 requires TPM 2.0. Windows
12 is expected to have the same requirement. So, she'll be using Win10
on that box until she gets another computer.
Hopefully she has her own powered speakers. Those in the monitor are
poor. Not even worth using as a mid-channel.
On 1/8/2024 12:36 PM, VanguardLH wrote:
sticks <wolverine01@charter.net> wrote:
I ended up getting her a Dell OptiPlex 7040, with 6th gen i5, 32 GB of
DDR4 ram, a new 1TB NVMe M.2 SSD, a spinning 2TB HDD, AX200 Built in
WIFI 6 & Bluetooth 5.2, and a new 20" monitor with built-in speakers.
The whole cost was right at $290. I think between the cpu and the 32 GB >>> ram, she's gonna be very happy for now.
Where did you find that one? Included the monitor?
2 separate purchases. The box a refurb, the monitor was new.
Oops, nevermind. Found:
http://dl.dell.com/topicspdf/optiplex-7040-desktop_owners-manual_en-us.pdf >>
which says it supports TPM 1.2. Windows 11 requires TPM 2.0. Windows
12 is expected to have the same requirement. So, she'll be using Win10
on that box until she gets another computer.
I'm fairly certain the reg hacks could get it by on both the TPM2 and
the CPU requirements. I'll try it out on my laptop with a 2nd gen CPU
and which I am unsure of the the TPM capabilites of yet. But like I
said, it really is irrelevant now if it does work, cause there is no
point in upgrading if Microsoft won't let you do security updates in the future.
Hopefully she has her own powered speakers. Those in the monitor are
poor. Not even worth using as a mid-channel.
She's been using the laptop speakers for years, so whatever the monitor comes with will be at least as good, if not better than what she is used to. Plus, she's older and doesn't crank it up like I do. 8-)
I had actually forgotten about needing sound when I first looked and
bought a monitor without speakers. I know I could have gotten a cheap
set of desktop speakers, but figured I'd keep it as simple for her as possible, so I cancelled the one I had bought the night before and found
one that had built-in speakers.
| Sysop: | Keyop |
|---|---|
| Location: | Huddersfield, West Yorkshire, UK |
| Users: | 297 |
| Nodes: | 16 (2 / 14) |
| Uptime: | 11:02:34 |
| Calls: | 6,666 |
| Files: | 12,213 |
| Messages: | 5,336,375 |
