I have a 4TB Seagate hard drive. I've been using it trouble-free for
more than a year, plugged into the USB port of my router, and accessible
on the network. Suddenly it's displaying as red under Win10, and
strangely claiming to have 1.66TB free out of 1.63TB. However, it
functions as normal. I can read and write to it ok. And when I plug it
into the PC everything looks AOK.
I've taken screenshots; https://www.dropbox.com/s/v6fpi8tce3u7bhj/Router-USB.jpg?dl=0 https://www.dropbox.com/s/0jjnnh4cse8indn/PC-USB.jpg?dl=0

Ed

--- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
* Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)

Ed Cryer wrote:

I have a 4TB Seagate hard drive. I've been using it trouble-free for
more than a year, plugged into the USB port of my router, and accessible
on the network. Suddenly it's displaying as red under Win10, and
strangely claiming to have 1.66TB free out of 1.63TB. However, it
functions as normal. I can read and write to it ok.

Sounds like your router can't properly handle such a large* disc, what's
the router? Under the circumstances I wouldn't keep writing to it while connected that way. Maybe re-partition as 2x2TB or 4x1TB see if it's
happier?



[*] I know 4TB isn't especially large.

--- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
* Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)

On 2/22/2023 8:31 AM, Ed Cryer wrote:

I have a 4TB Seagate hard drive. I've been using it trouble-free for
more than a year, plugged into the USB port of my router, and accessible
on the network. Suddenly it's displaying as red under Win10, and
strangely claiming to have 1.66TB free out of 1.63TB. However, it
functions as normal. I can read and write to it ok. And when I plug it
into the PC everything looks AOK.
I've taken screenshots; https://www.dropbox.com/s/v6fpi8tce3u7bhj/Router-USB.jpg?dl=0 https://www.dropbox.com/s/0jjnnh4cse8indn/PC-USB.jpg?dl=0

Ed

Might help to right click on drive in Explorer, select Tools, and run
and Error Check.

--- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
* Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)

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--- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
* Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)

Zaidy036 wrote:

Might help to right click on drive in Explorer, select Tools, and run
and Error Check.

But you can't chkdsk an SMB share ...

--- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
* Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)

On 2/22/2023 10:14 AM, Andy Burns wrote:

Zaidy036 wrote:

Might help to right click on drive in Explorer, select Tools, and run
and Error Check.

But you can't chkdsk an SMB share ...

then temporarily move to USB or another direct PC connection?

--- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
* Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)

On 2/22/2023 11:02 AM, Zaidy036 wrote:

On 2/22/2023 10:14 AM, Andy Burns wrote:

Zaidy036 wrote:

Might help to right click on drive in Explorer, select Tools, and run
and Error Check.

But you can't chkdsk an SMB share ...

then temporarily move to USB or another direct PC connection?

Maybe help in today's issue: <https://askbobrankin.com/heres_how_to_optimize_your_hard_drive.html?awt_a=6HSL&awt_l=5LcwN&awt_m=IycZoB1vT8P6SL&utm_content=ezff>

--- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
* Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)

Ed Cryer <ed@somewhere.in.the.uk> wrote:

I have a 4TB Seagate hard drive. I've been using it trouble-free for
more than a year, plugged into the USB port of my router, and
accessible on the network. Suddenly it's displaying as red under
Win10, and strangely claiming to have 1.66TB free out of 1.63TB.
However, it functions as normal. I can read and write to it ok. And
when I plug it into the PC everything looks AOK. I've taken
screenshots;
https://www.dropbox.com/s/v6fpi8tce3u7bhj/Router-USB.jpg?dl=0 https://www.dropbox.com/s/0jjnnh4cse8indn/PC-USB.jpg?dl=0

The second screenshot shows a local drive with 1.66 TB free of 3.63 TB
for the partition assigned drive letter E:. Your first screenshot shows
a networked drive (notice the different device icon, an IP address, and
drive letter Z:). If this the same drive, you are accessing 2 ways: one
as a local drive on the host where it is connected, and two as a
networked drive from a different host where the drive is mapped, or
you're using some other non-described method of networking from the
other host to this drive.

Have you tried disconnecting the networked drive from the non-local
host, and remapping or reconnecting to it?

Titles for your screenshots show when looking at the drive as a local
device that it's connected via USB to that host, and that you move the
drive to a USB port on the router when you want to connect to via
network. In a subsequent reply (to Andy), you mention a "BT Hub6"
router.

https://www.bt.com/help/broadband/learn-about-broadband/different-types-of-bt-hub

Guess the Hub 6 is a new product.

https://www.bt.com/help/broadband/getting-set-up/user-guides-and-manuals-for-bt-hubs

No Hub 6 product there, either, so I looked at the manuals for the Hub 4
and 5 products. While they picture a USB port in the cable modem in the
user manuals, there is no description for its use. You sure the USB hub
in the router is to attached a networked USB hub?

I had a router with a USB port, but it's use was not to network a USB
drive. As I recall (never used it), it was attaching a USB drive used
for reading firmware update files.

https://www.bt.com/help/contact-bt/technical-support

Might have to go there to ask them the purpose of the USB port on the
router. If they've recently pushed a firmware update to the router,
like it got re-provisioned along with a firmware update, could be a bug
in the update.

You said it's been working for a year. As a local USB drive on a
computer as the host, or while connecting to the USB port on the router?

--- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
* Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)

VanguardLH wrote:

Ed Cryer <ed@somewhere.in.the.uk> wrote:

I have a 4TB Seagate hard drive. I've been using it trouble-free for
more than a year, plugged into the USB port of my router, and
accessible on the network. Suddenly it's displaying as red under
Win10, and strangely claiming to have 1.66TB free out of 1.63TB.
However, it functions as normal. I can read and write to it ok. And
when I plug it into the PC everything looks AOK. I've taken
screenshots;
https://www.dropbox.com/s/v6fpi8tce3u7bhj/Router-USB.jpg?dl=0
https://www.dropbox.com/s/0jjnnh4cse8indn/PC-USB.jpg?dl=0

The second screenshot shows a local drive with 1.66 TB free of 3.63 TB
for the partition assigned drive letter E:. Your first screenshot shows
a networked drive (notice the different device icon, an IP address, and
drive letter Z:). If this the same drive, you are accessing 2 ways: one
as a local drive on the host where it is connected, and two as a
networked drive from a different host where the drive is mapped, or
you're using some other non-described method of networking from the
other host to this drive.

Have you tried disconnecting the networked drive from the non-local
host, and remapping or reconnecting to it?

Titles for your screenshots show when looking at the drive as a local
device that it's connected via USB to that host, and that you move the
drive to a USB port on the router when you want to connect to via
network. In a subsequent reply (to Andy), you mention a "BT Hub6"
router.

https://www.bt.com/help/broadband/learn-about-broadband/different-types-of-bt-hub

Guess the Hub 6 is a new product.

https://www.bt.com/help/broadband/getting-set-up/user-guides-and-manuals-for-bt-hubs

No Hub 6 product there, either, so I looked at the manuals for the Hub 4
and 5 products. While they picture a USB port in the cable modem in the
user manuals, there is no description for its use. You sure the USB hub
in the router is to attached a networked USB hub?

I had a router with a USB port, but it's use was not to network a USB
drive. As I recall (never used it), it was attaching a USB drive used
for reading firmware update files.

https://www.bt.com/help/contact-bt/technical-support

Might have to go there to ask them the purpose of the USB port on the
router. If they've recently pushed a firmware update to the router,
like it got re-provisioned along with a firmware update, could be a bug
in the update.

You said it's been working for a year. As a local USB drive on a
computer as the host, or while connecting to the USB port on the router?

You say potato; I say potato.
(:-
I appreciate your willingness to help, and I don't want to be churlish.
But there's such a wide gap opened up here that I don't know how to
close it without extended talk that would probably lead us into other misunderstandings.
Two nations divided by a common language. Who said or wrote that? George Bernard Shaw? Or William Faulkner?

BT Hub 6's have been around here for more than 4 years. I have two; one
in the drawer as a spare. They work extremely well; and BT's network reliability and speed is well proven in this neighbourhood (notice the "u").

This 4TB HD of mine passes all tests. No indexing errors, no sign of
data corruption, fully accessible wherever I plug it in. But all of a
sudden it's been red-coloured by Windows 10; the usual sign that it's
getting full.

I have noticed an unlikely coincidence in the reported figures.
1.66TB free of 1.63TB
1.66TB free of 3.63TB
Now then, Mr Holmes, let's apply Occam's Razor here. Let's make a stab
at the simplest explanation; one that complies most closely with known
facts and empirical reason.
Whence cometh that change from 1.63TB to 3.63TB? I don't know, but that
seems to be the heart of the problem here. The router is reporting "1.", Windows is reacting to that with its redness, because compared with the
"used amount" that indicates "getting pretty full".

Ed

E pluribus unum, sed quid unum?

--- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
* Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)

On 22/02/2023 13:31, Ed Cryer wrote:

I have a 4TB Seagate hard drive. I've been using it trouble-free for
more than a year, plugged into the USB port of my router, and accessible
on the network. Suddenly it's displaying as red under Win10, and
strangely claiming to have 1.66TB free out of 1.63TB. However, it
functions as normal. I can read and write to it ok. And when I plug it
into the PC everything looks AOK.
I've taken screenshots; https://www.dropbox.com/s/v6fpi8tce3u7bhj/Router-USB.jpg?dl=0 https://www.dropbox.com/s/0jjnnh4cse8indn/PC-USB.jpg?dl=0

Ed

What state is it in if you connect it straight to a PC again?

--
Brian Gregory (in England).

--- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
* Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)

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Cg==

--- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
* Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)

Ed Cryer wrote:

.

Two nations divided by a common language. Who said or wrote that? George Bernard Shaw? Or William Faulkner?

Don't tell me it was Mark Twain. I know from my reading on the Net that
Mark Twain said just about everything else witty worth saying, but not
this. He attended so many celibratory dinners that he could have said
almost anything.
Mark Twain gave us the shifty kid who knows how to get other kids to
whitewash his aunt's fence. And then he hit upon the ultimate American
hero in Huck Finn; a wastrel raif on the tides of life who helps runaway
black slaves, while sailing along the river of human hypocrisy.

But you'll find all this in previous British literature.

Ed

--- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
* Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)

On Wed, 22 Feb 2023 21:24:48 +0000, Ed Cryer <ed@somewhere.in.the.uk>
wrote:

Ed Cryer wrote:

.

Two nations divided by a common language. Who said or wrote that? George
Bernard Shaw? Or William Faulkner?

Don't tell me it was Mark Twain

Supposedly Shaw.

I know from my reading on the Net that
Mark Twain said just about everything else witty worth saying, but not
this.

My favorite: Stopping smoking is easy. I've done it a thousand
times.

He attended so many celibratory dinners that he could have said
almost anything.

And don't forget Yogi Berra (When you come to a fork in the road, take
it), Oscar Wilde (To lose one parent, Mr. Worthing, may be regarded as
a misfortune; to lose both looks like carelessness), and Groucho Marx
(I refuse to join any club that would have me as a member).

Mark Twain gave us the shifty kid who knows how to get other kids to >whitewash his aunt's fence. And then he hit upon the ultimate American
hero in Huck Finn; a wastrel raif on the tides of life who helps runaway >black slaves, while sailing along the river of human hypocrisy.

But you'll find all this in previous British literature.

Ed

--- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
* Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)

Ed Cryer <ed@somewhere.in.the.uk> wrote:

VanguardLH wrote:

Ed Cryer <ed@somewhere.in.the.uk> wrote:

I have a 4TB Seagate hard drive. I've been using it trouble-free for
more than a year, plugged into the USB port of my router, and
accessible on the network. Suddenly it's displaying as red under
Win10, and strangely claiming to have 1.66TB free out of 1.63TB.
However, it functions as normal. I can read and write to it ok. And
when I plug it into the PC everything looks AOK. I've taken
screenshots;
https://www.dropbox.com/s/v6fpi8tce3u7bhj/Router-USB.jpg?dl=0
https://www.dropbox.com/s/0jjnnh4cse8indn/PC-USB.jpg?dl=0

The second screenshot shows a local drive with 1.66 TB free of 3.63 TB
for the partition assigned drive letter E:. Your first screenshot shows
a networked drive (notice the different device icon, an IP address, and
drive letter Z:). If this the same drive, you are accessing 2 ways: one
as a local drive on the host where it is connected, and two as a
networked drive from a different host where the drive is mapped, or
you're using some other non-described method of networking from the
other host to this drive.

Have you tried disconnecting the networked drive from the non-local
host, and remapping or reconnecting to it?

Titles for your screenshots show when looking at the drive as a local
device that it's connected via USB to that host, and that you move the
drive to a USB port on the router when you want to connect to via
network. In a subsequent reply (to Andy), you mention a "BT Hub6"
router.

https://www.bt.com/help/broadband/learn-about-broadband/different-types-of-bt-hub

Guess the Hub 6 is a new product.

https://www.bt.com/help/broadband/getting-set-up/user-guides-and-manuals-for-bt-hubs

No Hub 6 product there, either, so I looked at the manuals for the Hub 4
and 5 products. While they picture a USB port in the cable modem in the
user manuals, there is no description for its use. You sure the USB hub
in the router is to attached a networked USB hub?

I had a router with a USB port, but it's use was not to network a USB
drive. As I recall (never used it), it was attaching a USB drive used
for reading firmware update files.

https://www.bt.com/help/contact-bt/technical-support

Might have to go there to ask them the purpose of the USB port on the
router. If they've recently pushed a firmware update to the router,
like it got re-provisioned along with a firmware update, could be a bug
in the update.

You said it's been working for a year. As a local USB drive on a
computer as the host, or while connecting to the USB port on the router?

You say potato; I say potato.

<I snipped the diatribe.>

In one case, you're looking at the potato in your hand. In another,
you're looking through a telescope at someone holding a mirror to
reflect an image of a potato.

Works when attached locally. Doesn't work when networking through a
router. Seems you already narrowed the problem to the router.

If you have another host on your intranetwork, you could test the
networking portion by attaching the USB drive to another computer, sharing/mapping it, and then trying to access it from another computer.
I suspect you'll learn little from that experiment.

Have you tried a smaller USB drive on the router's USB port, like one
under 2 TB for one partition that spans the drive?

Does the internal web server in the router let you access the drive on
its USB port to look at its contents and capacity? The online manuals
said nothing about the screens/pages available in the router's internal
web server.

--- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
* Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)

On 2/22/2023 8:31 AM, Ed Cryer wrote:

I have a 4TB Seagate hard drive. I've been using it trouble-free for more than a year, plugged into the USB port of my router, and accessible on the network. Suddenly it's displaying as red under Win10, and strangely claiming to have 1.66TB free out of

1.63TB. However, it functions as normal. I can read and write to it ok. And when I plug it into the PC everything looks AOK.

I've taken screenshots; https://www.dropbox.com/s/v6fpi8tce3u7bhj/Router-USB.jpg?dl=0 https://www.dropbox.com/s/0jjnnh4cse8indn/PC-USB.jpg?dl=0

Ed

"It is said to be based on the BT Hub 5. If so, then it will be using smb1.
It also seems that (for the Hub 5 at least) the maximum size of HDD it
can support and share is 2TB.

My router is the BT Hub 6, one of the few I know of that has a usb3 port.
It still only supports SMB1 though."

You can smell the cruft from here. Naughty router.

*******

What you don't want to happen, is blow something up while that bar is *RED*.

Obviously, something illogical (and physical in nature) is happening.

The router has just snipped 2TB off the envelope size, without so much
as a by-your-leave.

*******

"Vulnerabilities for OpenWrt Kamikaze 7.09 (Linux 2.6.22)" <=== BT Hub 6 internal OS

I suspect that ident is wrong, but it is probably *some* release of OpenWrt. Some PCI compliance scan, made that determination. Perhaps when you're logged to the router, it reports revision details. Not that it matters.

*******

Here is what I would do:

1) Transfer all files to another drive.
Verify that the transfer was successful (check file sizes, quantity of files).

The router seems to recognize GPT, otherwise it would not be able to mount
the file system.

Windows seems to see a GPT partition disk, because only GPT would have 3.63GB claimed. You need GPT for big disk drives.

You might try shrinking the partition (while connected to Windows), to 1.95TB. That way, whether the drive is plugged into the router, or the drive is plugged into a PC desktop, the partition size will stop writes past that point. When you
copy the files back, some of them will not fit (not enough space).

The purpose of doing this, is so the router does not have any bad
decisions to make. What the router should do, is stop writing when it
gets to physical address 2,000,000,000,000. That is tricky to do, because
maybe a piece of the $MFT is out there. If the partition stops at 1,950,000,000,000
then we're not hitting the router issue.

All I can say is, DON'T write any more from the router, until
you resize the partition. Don't use it on the router, until the
Windows side shows it is happy. I would not try a CHKDSK, until
the information is copied off first. If the copy operation freezes
or misbehaves, there will be "good times ahead" for sure :-/

The router is the villain here, as near as I can figure. While the
housing could be old and cranky, and have a really low limit, I somehow
doubt this is the case. But you never know.

The lowest enclosure limit I have here, is my Oxsemi Firewire is limited
to 137GB, and so there would be address rollover and corruption if I fit
a 160GB drive in the enclosure. I tried to flash it up, but it's the
earlier revision of OxSemi chip and cannot be corrected (has no 48 bit LBA support).

Paul

--- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
* Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)

On 2/22/2023 11:23 AM, Zaidy036 wrote:

On 2/22/2023 11:02 AM, Zaidy036 wrote:

On 2/22/2023 10:14 AM, Andy Burns wrote:

Zaidy036 wrote:

Might help to right click on drive in Explorer, select Tools, and run and Error Check.

But you can't chkdsk an SMB share ...

then temporarily move to USB or another direct PC connection?

Maybe help in today's issue: <https://askbobrankin.com/heres_how_to_optimize_your_hard_drive.html?awt_a=6HSL&awt_l=5LcwN&awt_m=IycZoB1vT8P6SL&utm_content=ezff>

The issue is with the OS in the router.

It's OpenWrt apparently. And BT Hub 5 and BT Hub 6 seem
to have a 2.0TB limitation, when technical limitations
tend to be 2.2TB (2.0TiB).

The router seems to be "wishing away" the excess. The router
seems to recognize GPT (which just doesn't seem possible if
it pretends to have a 2.0TB limitation). But it is mounting the
partition, so it figured out where the file system header is
located.

With Linux, you don't even need a partition table, to mount
a file system. If you know the offset, where the header
sector is located, you can use -o loop to mount the thing.
It also accepts giant-sized offsets, so you can make Linux
mount a partition above 2.2TB (like even if the drive was
MBR you should be able to access a partition above 2.2TB.

But nobody is going to fit a router with the necessary logic
to automate such hackery. I've done these by hand, but you have
to be damn careful if you want to avoid corruption. TestDisk
is all the time finding phantom header sectors, so I know
the risk is real of me making the same mistake.

The partition needs to be resized to 1.95TB, less than the 2.00TB
router limit. In this way, neither the windows PC or the router,
will be running off the end and corrupting something. Since
the partition now has 2.00TB of files, some files have to be removed.
For safety, a manual backup (not a Macrium) needs to be made
first, in case latent faults await CHKDSK blowing up the disk.
A Robocopy would be sufficient for this. If it jams up,
much more work awaits (and it must all be done on the PC desktop,
not while connected to the router).

Paul

--- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
* Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)

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--- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
* Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)

Paul wrote:

The issue is with the OS in the router.

It's OpenWrt apparently. And BT Hub 5 and BT Hub 6 seem
to have a 2.0TB limitation, when technical limitations
tend to be 2.2TB (2.0TiB).

Though some of the BT homehub/smarthubs are capable of being reflashed
with openWRT, pretty sure that's not what they run by default, I used to
use a HH5a.

The partition needs to be resized to 1.95TB, less than the 2.00TB
router limit. In this way, neither the windows PC or the router,
will be running off the end and corrupting something.

That was why I suggested the O/P should *stop* writing to the disc while
it's shared by the router, or something's going to get lost, then split
it into two or more partitions.

--- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
* Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)

On 2/23/2023 7:05 AM, Andy Burns wrote:

Paul wrote:

The issue is with the OS in the router.

It's OpenWrt apparently. And BT Hub 5 and BT Hub 6 seem
to have a 2.0TB limitation, when technical limitations
tend to be 2.2TB (2.0TiB).

Though some of the BT homehub/smarthubs are capable of being reflashed with openWRT, pretty sure that's not what they run by default, I used to use a HH5a.

The partition needs to be resized to 1.95TB, less than the 2.00TB
router limit. In this way, neither the windows PC or the router,
will be running off the end and corrupting something.

That was why I suggested the O/P should *stop* writing to the disc while it's shared by the router, or something's going to get lost, then split it into two or more partitions.

My rule of thumb for situations like this is:

"Never allow a partition to span a limiting behavior."

So this would be a bad thing.

+--------------+---------------+---------------+ Partition 2 writes
| 1 | 2 | 3 | could cause Partition 1
+--------------+---------------+---------------+ to have its header overwritten
^ on an address rollover.
|
Weirdness here

Partition 1 is relatively safe, if Partition 1 existed by itself.

However, if Partition 2 gets mounted, an address rollover
can overwrite the header of Partition 1.

*******

In this case, the rough edges have been ground down. Either the device
knows how to mount the high partitions, or, it doesn't. Usually,
since access is denied to high addresses, it can't even access the
file system header on Partition 2.

+--------------+--------+---------------+---------------+ No *known* stumbles with
| 1 |unalloc | 2 | 3 | this config. But you never
+--------------+--------+---------------+---------------+ know, with bad software/firmware
^
|
Weirdness here

I've not run into a case where this causes a problem. I had to deal
with this behavior on Win2K SP2 (28bit LBA). I was locked to that
version, while working on an FPGA.

+--------------+--------+---------------+ Part.2 can be seen in Windows
| 1 |unalloc | 2 | Part.2 can't be seen via router
+--------------+--------+---------------+
^
|
Weirdness here

+--------------+------------------------+ Unconditionally safe
| 1 | unalloc |
+--------------+------------------------+
^
|
Weirdness here

Paul

--- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
* Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)

On 2/23/2023 5:10 AM, Ed Cryer wrote:

Thanks, Paul.

I'll follow your advice.
Copy out, repartition 2 x 2TB, copy back.

Ed

Since I don't understand what the router is on about,
I don't know the real level of risk.

One thing I try to encourage, is when people build
RAIDs having sizes known to cause problems, to test
the array first with throwaway files, just to make
sure the partition is not going to corrupt when
it passes 2.2TB. If you can fill the partition full,
and there are no address rollover failures, then when
you copy the real files onto it, you have some idea
how safe it is.

*******

The first partition should not be exactly 2.0TB,
and should be set a tiny bit below that. So maybe
1.95TB .

fsutil fsinfo ntfsinfo E:
NTFS Volume Serial Number : 0x8a04733a04732879
NTFS Version : 3.1
LFS Version : 2.0
Total Sectors : 1,430,335,487 (682.0 GB) <=== sectors

1,430,335,487 * 512 bytes/sector = 732,331,769,344 bytes

And that is less than 1,950,000,000,000 bytes

just to give an example of "checking your work" :-)

FSUTIL will work, if it runs in an Administrator terminal.

The "envelope" of the file system, is a little larger than
the file system itself. And the envelope is in the
partition table. Now, try and find a utility that dumps
the envelope size.

I'm going to have to find a recipe to make a filesystem
with a significant mismatch between filesystem details
and envelope, to see if any utility does a good job.
The filesystem size is normally a tiny bit smaller than
the envelope, usually a fraction of a cylinder (~8MB) in
the difference. But on a "resize accident", like when using
shrink in Disk Management, you can find a significant difference
when that happens.

After you've copied your files off the 4TB drive, while
hooked up directly to Windows box, you can try a CHKDSK
from the command line, so you can check for any comments
it has to make.

************************ CHKDSK from admin Terminal ******************

chkdsk /f S:

The type of the file system is NTFS.
Volume label is SHARED.

Stage 1: Examining basic file system structure ...
2048 file records processed.
File verification completed.
Phase duration (File record verification): 104.66 milliseconds.
0 large file records processed.
Phase duration (Orphan file record recovery): 0.27 milliseconds.
0 bad file records processed.
Phase duration (Bad file record checking): 0.41 milliseconds.

Stage 2: Examining file name linkage ...
1 reparse records processed.
2246 index entries processed.
Index verification completed.
Phase duration (Index verification): 341.18 milliseconds.
0 unindexed files scanned.
Phase duration (Orphan reconnection): 0.42 milliseconds.
0 unindexed files recovered to lost and found.
Phase duration (Orphan recovery to lost and found): 0.50 milliseconds.
1 reparse records processed.
Phase duration (Reparse point and Object ID verification): 0.88 milliseconds.

Stage 3: Examining security descriptors ...
Security descriptor verification completed.
Phase duration (Security descriptor verification): 9.04 milliseconds.
99 data files processed.
Phase duration (Data attribute verification): 0.25 milliseconds.

Windows has scanned the file system and found no problems.
No further action is required.

715167743 KB total disk space.
357473252 KB in 1688 files.
580 KB in 101 indexes.
0 KB in bad sectors.
89823 KB in use by the system.
65536 KB occupied by the log file.
357604088 KB available on disk.

4096 bytes in each allocation unit.
178791935 total allocation units on disk.
89401022 allocation units available on disk.
Total duration: 461.14 milliseconds (461 ms).
************************ end CHKDSK from admin Terminal ******************

Paul

--- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
* Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)

On Thu, 23 Feb 2023 04:33:10 -0500, Paul <nospam@needed.invalid> wrote:

The partition needs to be resized to 1.95TB, less than the 2.00TB
router limit. In this way, neither the windows PC or the router,
will be running off the end and corrupting something. Since
the partition now has 2.00TB of files, some files have to be removed.
For safety, a manual backup (not a Macrium) needs to be made
first, in case latent faults await CHKDSK blowing up the disk.
A Robocopy would be sufficient for this. If it jams up,
much more work awaits (and it must all be done on the PC desktop,
not while connected to the router).

You say 'not a Macrium' backup, but I would trust Macrium's "Create a
File and Folder backup" feature. I've never had a problem with that. I
trust it's verification feature, specifically.

In this case, I would avoid Macrium's cloning & imaging options, and
perhaps that's what you meant.

--- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
* Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)

On 2/23/2023 7:29 PM, Char Jackson wrote:

On Thu, 23 Feb 2023 04:33:10 -0500, Paul <nospam@needed.invalid> wrote:

The partition needs to be resized to 1.95TB, less than the 2.00TB
router limit. In this way, neither the windows PC or the router,
will be running off the end and corrupting something. Since
the partition now has 2.00TB of files, some files have to be removed.
For safety, a manual backup (not a Macrium) needs to be made
first, in case latent faults await CHKDSK blowing up the disk.
A Robocopy would be sufficient for this. If it jams up,
much more work awaits (and it must all be done on the PC desktop,
not while connected to the router).

You say 'not a Macrium' backup, but I would trust Macrium's "Create a
File and Folder backup" feature. I've never had a problem with that. I
trust it's verification feature, specifically.

In this case, I would avoid Macrium's cloning & imaging options, and
perhaps that's what you meant.

The situation is tentative.

We don't know what kind of damage the router has done to
the partition.

The drive should no longer be used on the router, until
all issues are resolved. Anything we do now, should be
tethered to the PC which at least claims the partition
is 3.63TB long.

The reason I am recommending to NOT use CHKDSK first,
is we don't know what a mess is in there, and CHKDSK could
make it worse if the damage is illogical damage.

The methods used on the disk, are akin to data recovery.
we use "ordinary copy tools" in an attempt to elicit as
much info as we can on a file by file basis, to spot a
damage pattern. Maybe the copy won't complete. Maybe
some of the copied files will have a zero size.

If the $MFT or a portion of it ($MFT fragmentation) was
near the 2TB boundary, a portion of the $MFT could have
stopped receiving updates.

The thing is, the policy of the router is illogical.
The treatment of the partition is buggered. There is
no way to predict what is broken in there right now,
unless we can find a technical article by the fools at
BT, who can explain exactly what the hell they thought
they were doing.

This is not a traditional address rollover bug. This
is not a problem seen before. You can't just "stop
responding half way up a partition". Like what the actual fuck.

If you're writing code, the solution is simple.

if partition-too-big then {
dont-mount-the-fucking-thing
}

if you must implement a barrier, then there is a
series of if-then-else clauses necessary for logical handling.
Anything the router cannot handle, it should not mount.

You could easily write code with safer behavior than that
which has been provided.

Why should a customer have to sit around guessing
at what the damage pattern is from this firmware ?

Maybe these idiots could send their code out to be
audited by actual software professionals ??? Maybe
that would work.

Paul

--- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
* Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)

On 2/26/2023 6:39 AM, Ed Cryer wrote:

https://www.dropbox.com/s/10bx9hfzsypwxuz/Router-USB-doctored.jpg?dl=0

All done; and fully chkdsk-ed.

Ed

Good work :-)

I hope some day we can find out why the router
didn't corrupt something and what it's doing when
it does stuff like that.

My router has a logging feature, where you specify an IP address
and it can send the log to that node. That's one way to get
a bit more info about what the router is doing. The machine that
used to receive the logs, is no longer running, so my setup is
"broke" right now.

Paul

--- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
* Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)

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Cg==

--- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
* Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)

On Sun, 26 Feb 2023 07:04:57 -0500, Paul <nospam@needed.invalid> wrote:

My router has a logging feature, where you specify an IP address
and it can send the log to that node. That's one way to get
a bit more info about what the router is doing. The machine that
used to receive the logs, is no longer running, so my setup is
"broke" right now.

That's called syslog, and there are free syslog servers for all of the
major platforms. On Windows, I use the Kiwi syslog server from
solarwinds but there are a handful of others.

https://www.solarwinds.com/free-tools/kiwi-free-syslog-server

--- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
* Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)