Avon, g00r00, others --

It worked! For at least now, I modified ENiG to send a standard MSGID *only for
NetMail export* and got my response from fsxNet.

g00r00: I'd really like to understand why Synchronet's MSGID works when it sends NetMail. The last I checked, they used the same format ENiG was using, and it was OK, but maybe something is just slightly enough different? If you have any ideas, or examples of Sync MSGID's with NetMail working or not, I'd love to hear it. Most of the FTN stuff ENiG does is compliant, but the MSGID's for at least EchoMail are nice to have in the Sync format if I can get away with it :)

Thanks again for your help everyone. I can now either wrap up 0.0.8-alpha and move to the next, or add in some additional NetMail bells and whistles... hrmm....










--- ENiGMA 1/2 v0.0.8-alpha (linux; x64; 6.11.3)
* Origin: Xibalba -+- xibalba.l33t.codes:44510 (21:1/121)

It worked! For at least now, I modified ENiG to send a standard MSGID *only for
NetMail export* and got my response from fsxNet.

Glad you got it working!

I was under the impression that the MSGID is optional, I wonder what
would happen if you sent a netmail without a MSGID at all.

Did you try sending a Netmail to a Synchronet system with your other
MSGID format?

Andrew

--- MagickaBBS v0.7alpha (SunOS/i86pc)
* Origin: Sunset BBS - Work node (21:1/125.1)

On Tuesday, January 9th apam was heard saying...

I was under the impression that the MSGID is optional, I wonder what would happen if you sent a netmail without a MSGID at all.

I'd have to double check about it being optional in a NetMail. What I don't yet
know/understand is why it's relevent for a "from" address in a NetMail - e.g. the INTL has to / from information.


On Tuesday, January 9th apam was heard saying...

Did you try sending a Netmail to a Synchronet system with your other MSGID format?

I haven't tried that yet, good idea



--- ENiGMA 1/2 v0.0.8-alpha (linux; x64; 6.11.3)
* Origin: Xibalba -+- xibalba.l33t.codes:44510 (21:1/121)

On 01/09/18, NuSkooler pondered and said...

I was under the impression that the MSGID is optional, I wonder what would happen if you sent a netmail without a MSGID at all.

I'd have to double check about it being optional in a NetMail. What I don't yet know/understand is why it's relevent for a "from" address in a NetMail - e.g. the INTL has to / from information.

I don't know if it is, but I would be very surprised if it was.

On Tuesday, January 9th apam was heard saying...

Did you try sending a Netmail to a Synchronet system with your other MSGID format?

Thats a good idea Andrew :)

Best, Paul


`I'm not expendable, I'm not stupid, and I'm not going' - Kerr Avon, Blake's 7

--- Mystic BBS v1.12 A37 2017/12/30 (Windows/32)
* Origin: Agency BBS | Dunedin, New Zealand | agency.bbs.nz (21:1/101)

I'd have to double check about it being optional in a NetMail. What I don't yet
know/understand is why it's relevent for a "from" address in a NetMail - e.g. the INTL has to / from information.

I'm going to take a wild stab in the dark and say perhaps it was done
this way in mystic to have a method for obtaining the origin address that worked in both netmail and echomail.

Of course that is just a guess.

I think you're supposed to get the Originating address from the INTL
kludge in netmail and the origin line in echomail.

Anyway, I have no clue why mystic would work with synchronet netmail and
not yours, that's the real mystery :)

I'm a bit of a newbie with fidonet, thats what you get when you fork an existing mailer instead of writing your own :P

Andrew



--- MagickaBBS v0.7alpha (Linux/x86_64)
* Origin: Exotica BBS - telnet://exoticabbs.com:2023/ (21:1/125)

Avon said....

On 01/09/18, NuSkooler pondered and said...

I was under the impression that the MSGID is optional, I wonder

what

would happen if you sent a netmail without a MSGID at all.

I'd have to double check about it being optional in a NetMail. What I don't yet know/understand is why it's relevent for a "from" address

in a

NetMail - e.g. the INTL has to / from information.

I don't know if it is, but I would be very surprised if it was.

I just looked up http://ftsc.org/docs/fts-0009.001

I don't know if that's the most recent one or not, but that says it's optional.

This FTS (FidoNet(r) Technical Standard) specifies an optional
standard for the FidoNet community. Implementation of the
protocols defined in this document is not mandatory, but all
implementations of these protocols are expected to adhere to this
standard. Distribution of this document is unlimited.

So according to that document, MSGIDs and REPLYIDs are optional, but if
they exist then they must be like the document describes.

And they describe the format that Mystic and others use, not the synchronet format.

There must be more documents that describe the syncronet format later, i
don't know, there so many documents that are just proposals and what not
i get lost in it lol

Andrew

--- MagickaBBS v0.7alpha (Linux/x86_64)
* Origin: Exotica BBS - telnet://exoticabbs.com:2023/ (21:1/125)

On 01/09/18, NuSkooler said the following...

I was under the impression that the MSGID is optional, I wonder what would happen if you sent a netmail without a MSGID at all.

I think he may be on to something. I don't remember if Synchronet uses MSGID
in netmail or not. More on this later..

I'd have to double check about it being optional in a NetMail. What I don't yet know/understand is why it's relevent for a "from" address in a NetMail - e.g. the INTL has to / from information.

MSGID is mainly used for dupe detection. So it would only really need a
unique ID from the sender (from) in order to make sure it's not duplicated within a 3 year period or something like that. However, this may be the same reason as to why it's not necessary in netmail.

Yours and Synchronet's form of MSGID seems to have a MUCH longer than 3 year retention for duplicate messages.

I haven't tried that yet, good idea

I did a little digging in the short time I had, and it looks like netmail mentions use of INTL, FMPT, and TOPT, but I don't see much reference to MSGID whatsoever, as that's usually mentioned with echomail.

I've written a test netmail from my Synchronet BBS to my hub system running
HPT and Golded where I can view the kludges nicely.. said netmail from Synchronet does *NOT* contain a MSGID. So it's safe to say that netmail
doesn't require it and if you cut it out of netmail completely, you won't
have to change your current MSGID format.

Regards,
Nick

--- Mystic BBS v1.12 A38 2018/01/01 (Linux/64)
* Origin: _thePharcyde telnet://bbs.pharcyde.org (Wisconsin) (21:1/200)

On 01/10/18, apam said the following...

I'm going to take a wild stab in the dark and say perhaps it was done
this way in mystic to have a method for obtaining the origin address that worked in both netmail and echomail.

MSGID is in no way, shape, or form supposed to be used for obtaining origin addresses. In netmail, the INTL kludge is used, and in echomail, the origin line is used.

I think you're supposed to get the Originating address from the INTL kludge in netmail and the origin line in echomail.

Yes, and sorry for not reading the entire message before posting. But I'm not backspacing! ;)

Anyway, I have no clue why mystic would work with synchronet netmail and not yours, that's the real mystery :)

Synchronet doesn't contain MSGID in netmail, I just tested.

Regards,
Nick

--- Mystic BBS v1.12 A38 2018/01/01 (Linux/64)
* Origin: _thePharcyde telnet://bbs.pharcyde.org (Wisconsin) (21:1/200)

Glad you got it working!

I was under the impression that the MSGID is optional, I wonder what
would happen if you sent a netmail without a MSGID at all.

It would work fine without one in both echomail and netmail as it is not a requirement for either, and many messages that source from QWK will commonly lack a "reply" ID. It screws up message linking though, which is annoying.

The entire purpose of the MSGID is to:

1) ID the sender
2) Provide a unique ID of the message

If you include a MSGID in a private message with an invalid address, Mystic will refuse it. If you leave it off, thats fine, too. Its not that its missing or not, its that its wrong.

--- Mystic BBS v1.12 A39 2018/01/08 (Windows/32)
* Origin: Sector 7 [Mystic BBS WHQ] (21:1/108)

So according to that document, MSGIDs and REPLYIDs are optional, but if they exist then they must be like the document describes.

And they describe the format that Mystic and others use, not the synchronet format.

There must be more documents that describe the syncronet format later, i don't know, there so many documents that are just proposals and what not
i get lost in it lol

No, there is no other documentation for the other format, not even a proposal. This is something made up by Synchronet of which the FTS committee has
said "please stop doing that!"

It doesn't seem to have much of an effect on echomail. With Mystic it broke the "Reply via Netmail" function and of course it will get refused to invalid addressing if its included in a private message.

MSGID isn't needed or particularly useful in Netmail anyway, so just leaving
it out of Netmail would resolve the issue with any systems that might care.

--- Mystic BBS v1.12 A39 2018/01/08 (Windows/32)
* Origin: Sector 7 [Mystic BBS WHQ] (21:1/108)

On Wednesday, January 10th Accession was heard saying...

I did a little digging in the short time I had, and it looks like netmail mentions use of INTL, FMPT, and TOPT, but I don't see much reference to MSGID whatsoever, as that's usually mentioned with echomail.
I've written a test netmail from my Synchronet BBS to my hub system running HPT and Golded where I can view the kludges nicely.. said netmail from Synchronet does *NOT* contain a MSGID. So it's safe to say that netmail doesn't require it and if you cut it out of netmail completely, you won't have to change your current MSGID format.

Awesome, thank you for looking into this! I'll try without MSGID in NetMail at all tonight and see how it goes.



--- ENiGMA 1/2 v0.0.8-alpha (linux; x64; 6.11.3)
* Origin: Xibalba -+- xibalba.l33t.codes:44510 (21:1/121)

Awesome, thank you for looking into this! I'll try without MSGID in NetMail at all tonight and see how it goes.

Not sure if you missed it but I suggested this to you a couple days ago. If you remove the MSGID it will work for sure, I've tested it. Also in A39 Mystic will be able to handle it either way.

It'll still bitch if you supply a bad address in a netmail message, but
Mystic will properly parse the address so it'll work in your case.

You may also want to test with routed netmails too if you haven't yet... both coming from a system through your system to the destination, and vice versa.

--- Mystic BBS v1.12 A39 2018/01/08 (Windows/32)
* Origin: Sector 7 [Mystic BBS WHQ] (21:1/108)

NuSkooler wrote to All on 01-09-18 22:23 <=-

Avon, g00r00, others --

It worked! For at least now, I modified ENiG to send a standard MSGID *only for
NetMail export* and got my response from fsxNet.

g00r00: I'd really like to understand why Synchronet's MSGID works when
it sends NetMail. The last I checked, they used the same format ENiG
was using, and it was OK, but maybe something is just slightly enough different? If you have any ideas, or examples of Sync MSGID's with
NetMail working or not, I'd love to hear it. Most of the FTN stuff ENiG does is compliant, but the MSGID's for at least EchoMail are nice to
have in the Sync format if I can get away with it :)

Thanks again for your help everyone. I can now either wrap up
0.0.8-alpha and move to the next, or add in some additional NetMail
bells and whistles... hrmm....

Is MSGID even required in Netmail? I thought only OrigAddr and DestAddr were required.








--

Bill

Telnet: tequilamockingbirdonline.net
Web: bbs.tequilamockingbirdonline.net
FTP: ftp.tequilamockingbirdonline.net:2121
IRC: irc.tequilamockingbirdonline.net Ports: 6661-6670 SSL: +6697
Radio: radio.tequilamockingbirdonline.net:8010/live


... Look Twice... Save a Life!!! Motorcycles are Everywhere!!!
--- MultiMail/Win32 v0.50
* Origin: TequilaMockingbird Online - Badlands of NJ (21:2/141)

Accession wrote to NuSkooler on 01-10-18 06:01 <=-

I did a little digging in the short time I had, and it looks like
netmail mentions use of INTL, FMPT, and TOPT, but I don't see much reference to MSGID whatsoever, as that's usually mentioned with
echomail.

I've written a test netmail from my Synchronet BBS to my hub system running HPT and Golded where I can view the kludges nicely.. said
netmail from Synchronet does *NOT* contain a MSGID. So it's safe to say that netmail doesn't require it and if you cut it out of netmail completely, you won't have to change your current MSGID format.

Here is the header from a netmail sent via sbbsecho...

C:\HUSKY>pktinfo -c htick.cfg -h 00180001.cut
PktInfo/w32-mvcdll 1.9.0-cur 30-06-15

Pkt-Name: 00180001.cut
OrigAddr: 24:100/1.0
DestAddr: 24:24/1.0
pkt created: Wed Jan 10 21:16:54 2018
pkt Password:
prodCode: 12ff
prodRevision 3.3
----------------------------------------
Msg: 100/1 -> 20/2
Written at 10 Jan 18 21:15:14
From: Bill McGarrity
To: Nick Andre
Subject: Re: REGION20.CTL
Attr: pvt loc

[snip]

?Via 24:100/1 @20180111.021654.UTC SBBSecho 3.03-Win32 r3.66


--

Bill

Telnet: tequilamockingbirdonline.net
Web: bbs.tequilamockingbirdonline.net
FTP: ftp.tequilamockingbirdonline.net:2121
IRC: irc.tequilamockingbirdonline.net Ports: 6661-6670 SSL: +6697
Radio: radio.tequilamockingbirdonline.net:8010/live


... Look Twice... Save a Life!!! Motorcycles are Everywhere!!!
--- MultiMail/Win32 v0.50
* Origin: TequilaMockingbird Online - Badlands of NJ (21:2/141)

Re: AreaFix Response!
By: Accession to NuSkooler on Wed Jan 10 2018 06:01:22

Hiya Nick...

--

Bill

Telnet: tequilamockingbirdonline.net
Web: bbs.tequilamockingbirdonline.net
FTP: ftp.tequilamockingbirdonline.net:2121
IRC: irc.tequilamockingbirdonline.net Ports: 6661-6670 SSL: 6697
Radio: radio.tequilamockingbirdonline.net:8010/live
--- SBBSecho 3.03-Win32
* Origin: TequilaMockingbird Online - Badlands of NJ (21:2/141)

Hiya Nick...

** waves at Bill & Nick ** :)

Best, Paul


`I'm not expendable, I'm not stupid, and I'm not going' - Kerr Avon, Blake's 7

--- Mystic BBS v1.12 A37 2017/12/30 (Windows/32)
* Origin: Agency BBS | Dunedin, New Zealand | agency.bbs.nz (21:1/101)

Re: Re: AreaFix Response!
By: Avon to Bill McGarrity on Thu Jan 11 2018 16:07:27

** waves at Bill & Nick ** :)

LOL Paul....

There was actually much more to that message but it seems the 'paste' didn't take. Was just about Frontdoor's FM editor that DOES add a @MSGID to it's netmail and Synchronet tosses it just fine.

Enjoy!!

--

Bill

Telnet: tequilamockingbirdonline.net
Web: bbs.tequilamockingbirdonline.net
FTP: ftp.tequilamockingbirdonline.net:2121
IRC: irc.tequilamockingbirdonline.net Ports: 6661-6670 SSL: 6697
Radio: radio.tequilamockingbirdonline.net:8010/live
--- SBBSecho 3.03-Win32
* Origin: TequilaMockingbird Online - Badlands of NJ (21:2/141)

On 01/10/18, Bill McGarrity pondered and said...

** waves at Bill & Nick ** :)

LOL Paul....

There was actually much more to that message but it seems the 'paste' didn't take. Was just about Frontdoor's FM editor that DOES add a
@MSGID to it's netmail and Synchronet tosses it just fine.

I thought it may be a secret message, you need to send two packets to the tosser and knock twice :)

Best, Paul


`I'm not expendable, I'm not stupid, and I'm not going' - Kerr Avon, Blake's 7

--- Mystic BBS v1.12 A37 2017/12/30 (Windows/32)
* Origin: Agency BBS | Dunedin, New Zealand | agency.bbs.nz (21:1/101)