• trying to get the hang of opx

    From August Abolins@2:221/1.58 to All on Tue Apr 2 18:11:00 2019
    Hello!


    2nd official *new* message, using W)rite at the AreaList menu.

    How do you re-edit the same message after it has been "Saved"?
    Regards,
    SysOp

    --- OpenXP 5.0.36
    * Origin: Aug'sPoint (2:221/1.58)
  • From Mikhail Stakhanov@1:1/0 to August Abolins on Wed Apr 3 01:38:38 2019
    Здравствуйте, August!

    Ответ на сообщение August Abolins (2:221/1.58) к All, написанное 02 апр 19 в 18:11:

    Hello!


    2nd official *new* message, using W)rite at the AreaList menu.

    How do you re-edit the same message after it has been "Saved"?
    in golded alt+c.

    Всего наилучшего, Mikhail
    --- GoldED+/W32-MINGW 1.1.5-b20120519
    * Origin: Жить надо так, чтобы тебя помнили даже сволочи (c) Ф.
  • From August Abolins@2:221/1.58 to Mikhail Stakhanov on Tue Apr 2 21:30:00 2019
    Hello Mikhail!

    ** 03.04.19 - 01:38, Mikhail Stakhanov wrote to August Abolins:

    Здравствуйте, August!

    Ответ на сообщение August Abolins (2:221/1.58) к All, написанное 02 апр 19 в 18:11:


    2nd official *new* message, using W)rite at the AreaList menu.
    How do you re-edit the same message after it has been "Saved"?

    in golded alt+c.

    Всего наилучшего, Mikhail
    -+- GoldED+/W32-MINGW 1.1.5-b20120519
    + Origin: Жить надо так, чтобы тебя помнили даже сволочи (c) Ф. (2:5020/932.1)

    OpenXP (which I have incorrectly refered to as "opx" in the subject -
    sorry, my dyslexia is showing!), seems to use very cryptic keystrokes to accomplish things. But Alt+C is not one of them! <g>

    This program may not fit my expectations. :( But I am imagining that I *could* still warm up to the console-like appearance and operations. I
    don't mind figuring-out how to operate this beast. I am sure that process spawns the growth of new synapses/neurons - which is a good thing! ;)

    This thing makes me think of the "Mr. Robot" (a reference to a popular TV serial).

    My all-time offline readers from the past were Fleetstreet (OS/2) and SemPoint (Windows)

    Regards,
    ../|ug

    --- OpenXP 5.0.36
    * Origin: Aug'sPoint (2:221/1.58)
  • From mark lewis@1:3634/12.73 to August Abolins on Tue Apr 2 22:39:46 2019

    On 2019 Apr 02 18:11:00, you wrote to All:

    How do you re-edit the same message after it has been "Saved"?

    maybe be reading that message and hit the [E]dit or [C]hange key if there is one...

    Regards,
    SysOp

    you might want to take a look at your signature, too ;)

    )\/(ark

    Always Mount a Scratch Monkey
    Do you manage your own servers? If you are not running an IDS/IPS yer doin' it wrong...
    ... So he says to the Shapeshifter waitress, "Keep the change."
    ---
    * Origin: (1:3634/12.73)
  • From August Abolins@2:221/1.58 to mark lewis on Tue Apr 2 23:51:00 2019
    Hello mark!

    ** 02.04.19 - 22:39, mark lewis wrote to August Abolins:

    How do you re-edit the same message after it has been "Saved"?

    maybe be reading that message and hit the [E]dit or [C]hange key if there is one...

    Nope. Still a mystery to me. Maybe Martin will step in at some point.


    Regards,
    SysOp

    you might want to take a look at your signature, too ;)

    DONE. One step at a time. See below. Good enough.

    Next, I might look into the quoting options. By default it is just the ">" char. Not sure if I want the First Last initials look.


    oxp is clean and simple in operation. It really brings back a feeling
    from the late 90's though.



    Regards,
    ../|ug

    --- OpenXP 5.0.36
    * Origin: /|ug's Point, ONT, CANADA (2:221/1.58)
  • From mark lewis@1:3634/12.73 to August Abolins on Wed Apr 3 00:21:56 2019

    On 2019 Apr 02 23:51:00, you wrote to me:

    you might want to take a look at your signature, too ;)

    DONE. One step at a time. See below. Good enough.

    :)

    Next, I might look into the quoting options. By default it is just the
    ">" char. Not sure if I want the First Last initials look.

    you should... it is the defacto FTN quoting standard... especially if it adds new ">" to the right of existing ones which is another defacto FTN quoting standard... i've been manually fixing them in many of our posts back and forth...

    oxp is clean and simple in operation. It really brings back a feeling from the late 90's though.

    that's as it should be -=B-)

    )\/(ark

    Always Mount a Scratch Monkey
    Do you manage your own servers? If you are not running an IDS/IPS yer doin' it wrong...
    ... Work is a fine thing if it doesn't take too much of your spare time.
    ---
    * Origin: (1:3634/12.73)
  • From August Abolins@2:221/360 to mark lewis on Wed Apr 3 09:09:11 2019
    In a post between "mark lewis : August Abolins", on 4/3/2019 12:21 AM

    Next, I might look into the quoting options. By default it is just the ">" char. Not sure if I want the First Last initials look.

    you should... it is the defacto FTN quoting standard... especially if
    it adds new ">" to the right of existing ones which is another
    defacto FTN quoting standard... i've been manually fixing them in
    many of our posts back and forth...

    I dunno. TB won't do it (unless there is a working Add-On that does it?).

    Besides, if the conversation is between two persons, it is easy to recognize which person wrote what.

    It is commendable of you to fix the lines and add the initials. (I have done that too.) But it's really not necessary for every line.

    If it is a very large block, why not save some work and do something like:

    ML wrote: "it is the defacto FTN quoting standard... especially if
    it adds new ">" to the right of existing ones which is another
    defacto FTN quoting standard... i've been manually fixing them in
    many of our posts back and forth..."


    adverb: defacto

    1. in fact, or in effect, whether by right or not.

    I would think of the "FL >" initials method more of as a "common standard".

    But just the brackets is fine for me. TB does a fairly decent replacement of the >>'s with vertical ||'s and is just as easy to deal with.

    In fact, oxp adds colour to the different levels of ">>", so actual initials aren't really necessary. The colour makes things very clear who said what.

    Nothing wrong with a little variety, eh? <g>


    oxp is clean and simple in operation. It really brings back a feeling from the late 90's though.

    that's as it should be -=B-)

    Well, I've certainly got a lot of variety between TB, Winpoint and OpenXP, don't I? :/

    --- Thunderbird 2.0.0.24 (Windows/20100228)
    * Origin: - nntp://rbb.fidonet.fi - Lake Ylo - Finland - (2:221/360)
  • From Martin Foster@2:310/31.3 to August Abolins on Wed Apr 3 13:55:00 2019
    Hello August!

    On 02.04.19 at 18:11, August Abolins wrote to All:

    2nd official *new* message, using W)rite at the AreaList menu.

    How do you re-edit the same message after it has been "Saved"?

    - Message/Unsent/Show
    - Message/Unsent/Edit

    Regards,
    Martin

    --- OpenXP 5.0.36
    * Origin: Bitz-Box - Bradford - UK (2:310/31.3)
  • From mark lewis@1:3634/12.73 to August Abolins on Wed Apr 3 12:34:12 2019

    On 2019 Apr 03 09:09:10, you wrote to me:

    Next, I might look into the quoting options. By default it is just
    the ">" char. Not sure if I want the First Last initials look.

    you should... it is the defacto FTN quoting standard... especially if
    it adds new ">" to the right of existing ones which is another
    defacto FTN quoting standard... i've been manually fixing them in
    many of our posts back and forth...

    I dunno. TB won't do it (unless there is a working Add-On that does
    it?).

    there is not... the FTN way is totally alien and more advanced than what the 'net offers...

    Besides, if the conversation is between two persons, it is easy to recognize which person wrote what.

    true but you cannot tell that when you come along later and read the same thread weeks later... especially if there's no initials and even moreso if someone has trimmed out the attributions or someone's editor didn't put attributions in in the first place...

    It is commendable of you to fix the lines and add the initials. (I

    thanks...

    have done that too.) But it's really not necessary for every line.

    it is if you answer inline like we do instead of top or bottom posting...

    If it is a very large block, why not save some work and do something
    like:

    ugh...

    adverb: defacto

    1. in fact, or in effect, whether by right or not.

    I would think of the "FL >" initials method more of as a "common
    standard".

    it was but back in the '90s, the quoting format in FTNs changed so that you could actially tell the level of quotes lines have been through...

    But just the brackets is fine for me. TB does a fairly decent
    replacement of the >>'s with vertical ||'s and is just as easy to deal with.

    that's just a visual thing when reading... the ">" are still used and can be seen if you edit a draft... i've had to fix some that were quite ugly and then there's the ones where a blank line at the end of a text block gets a quote mark on it and the reply starts on the same line as that empty quote... that makes it look like there is no reply and the reply text is wrongly attributed to the person quoted...

    In fact, oxp adds colour to the different levels of ">>", so actual initials aren't really necessary. The colour makes things very clear who said what.

    no, not who... only the different levels of quoting... TimED, GoldED, and likely MsgED do the same... it helps to break the quoted parts out...

    Nothing wrong with a little variety, eh? <g>

    nope :)

    oxp is clean and simple in operation. It really brings back a
    feeling from the late 90's though.

    that's as it should be -=B-)

    Well, I've certainly got a lot of variety between TB, Winpoint and
    OpenXP, don't I? :/

    yup :)

    )\/(ark

    Always Mount a Scratch Monkey
    Do you manage your own servers? If you are not running an IDS/IPS yer doin' it wrong...
    ... I like thick manuals .... they make better doorstops!
    ---
    * Origin: (1:3634/12.73)
  • From August Abolins@2:221/1.58 to mark lewis on Wed Apr 3 19:50:00 2019
    Hello mark!


    Besides, if the conversation is between two persons, it is easy to
    recognize which person wrote what.

    true but you cannot tell that when you come along later and read the same thread weeks later... especially if there's no initials and even moreso if someone has trimmed out the attributions or someone's editor didn't put attributions in in the first place...

    Well...there is always the thread tree to refer to see the participate
    chain.


    But just the brackets is fine for me. TB does a fairly decent
    replacement of the >>'s with vertical ||'s and is just as easy to deal AA>> with.

    that's just a visual thing when reading... the ">" are still used and can be seen if you edit a draft...

    Ah.. yes, I forgot about that. The >'s are still there when switching to
    a courier font for example.


    i've had to fix some that were quite ugly and
    then there's the ones where a blank line at the end of a text block gets a quote mark on it and the reply starts on the same line as that empty
    quote... that makes it look like there is no reply and the reply text is wrongly attributed to the person quoted...

    Yes.. sometimes a little fixing is required. But I look for
    opportunities to minimize quoted text if it is not relevant in the current reply so that there is less fixing required. ;)

    Regards,
    ../|ug

    --- OpenXP 5.0.36
    * Origin: /|ug's Point, ONT, CANADA (2:221/1.58)
  • From August Abolins@2:221/1.58 to Martin Foster on Wed Apr 3 20:40:00 2019
    Hello Martin!

    How do you re-edit the same message after it has been "Saved"?

    - Message/Unsent/Show
    - Message/Unsent/Edit


    That might be a good addition to the Q&A section of your guide.

    Regards,
    ../|ug

    --- OpenXP 5.0.36
    * Origin: /|ug's Point, ONT, CANADA (2:221/1.58)
  • From August Abolins@2:221/1.58 to mark lewis on Wed Apr 3 22:21:00 2019
    Hello mark!

    Next, I might look into the quoting options. By default it is just AA>>>> the ">" char. Not sure if I want the First Last initials look.

    you should... it is the defacto FTN quoting standard... especially if ml>>> it adds new ">" to the right of existing ones which is another
    defacto FTN quoting standard... i've been manually fixing them in
    many of our posts back and forth...

    The above "quote" is for you. ;)

    (Accomplished with oxp config. Maybe there should be a space after the
    ">" ?)

    ... the FTN way is totally alien and more advanced
    than what the 'net offers...

    "advanced" ?? Hmmm.. It's certainly "different". I personally like the initials method. It leaves no doubt as to the author of the text. But I also believe it's not entirely necessary (as mentioned and explained previously).


    ..you cannot tell that when you come along later and read the same
    thread weeks later... especially if there's no initials and even moreso if ml>someone has trimmed out the attributions or someone's editor didn't put ml>attributions in in the first place...

    ..and the whole thing hinges on the use of full and proper FN LN for the whole thing to work. I don't think Policy 4 states that real or any kind
    of two-part name with FN LN is even required.

    Were you ever a member of Compuserve and the discussion areas?

    I liked the way their offline reader/editor handled block quotes Very
    simple with just an opening "intials tag >" at the beginning of a block,
    and a closing "< initials tag" at the end. This left the block to re-flow
    as required.

    Regards,
    ../|ug

    --- OpenXP 5.0.36
    * Origin: /|ug's Point, ONT, CANADA (2:221/1.58)
  • From August Abolins@2:221/1.58 to mark lewis on Wed Apr 3 22:48:00 2019
    Hello mark!

    This one's for you.

    )\/(ark
    ... I like thick manuals .... they make better doorstops!

    Adjusted quote function to add an extra space after "initials> "

    Regards,
    ../|ug

    --- OpenXP 5.0.36
    * Origin: /|ug's Point, ONT, CANADA (2:221/1.58)
  • From mark lewis@1:3634/12.73 to August Abolins on Thu Apr 4 11:48:32 2019

    On 2019 Apr 03 22:21:00, you wrote to me:

    Next, I might look into the quoting options. By default it is just
    the ">" char. Not sure if I want the First Last initials look.

    you should... it is the defacto FTN quoting standard... especially
    if it adds new ">" to the right of existing ones which is another
    defacto FTN quoting standard... i've been manually fixing them in
    many of our posts back and forth...

    The above "quote" is for you. ;)

    :) it looks good :)

    (Accomplished with oxp config. Maybe there should be a space after
    the ">" ?)

    no... only the last one or else you end up eating a space after each ">" for no good reason... that also takes away from what can be presented on each quoted line... plus the nice compact form looks much better :)

    ... the FTN way is totally alien and more advanced than what the 'net
    offers...

    "advanced" ?? Hmmm.. It's certainly "different". I personally like
    the initials method. It leaves no doubt as to the author of the text.

    yup, and that's the main point...

    But I also believe it's not entirely necessary (as mentioned and
    explained previously).

    there's a consistancy thing, too... i remember on RIME/PCRelay, the quoting stuff was a lot different... most of it was, as i recall, wrapped in boxes with the attribution in the top of the box... i had several that i used at that time... some even had 3D shadows... ANSI was used quite regularly, too...

    eg: ASCII boxed quoting (can't do ""high ascii"" here)

    ----- snip -----

    +--- august abolins wrote: ------------------------------------+
    | "advanced" ?? Hmmm.. It's certainly "different". I |#
    | personally like the initials method. It leaves no doubt as |#
    | to the author of the text. |#
    +--------------------------------------------------------------+#
    ################################################################

    my response would be here...

    +--- august abolins wrote: ------------------------------------+
    | But I also believe it's not entirely necessary (as mentioned |#
    | and explained previously). |#
    +--------------------------------------------------------------+#
    ################################################################

    more response here...

    ----- snip -----

    it was pretty and fairly easy to read but when folks started adding all kinds of colors, that took away from being able to concentrate on what was being written...

    ..you cannot tell that when you come along later and read the same
    thread weeks later... especially if there's no initials and even
    moreso if someone has trimmed out the attributions or someone's
    editor didn't put attributions in in the first place...

    ..and the whole thing hinges on the use of full and proper FN LN for
    the whole thing to work. I don't think Policy 4 states that real or
    any kind of two-part name with FN LN is even required.

    it is certainly nothing to do with Policy... policy is for the network... not the traffic carried other than commercial and spam/unwanted traffic...

    Were you ever a member of Compuserve and the discussion areas?

    i used compuserve for a very little while... never really liked it... especially since it was on a Model 100 with only a 40 character wide screen and i think 10 lines tall...

    I liked the way their offline reader/editor handled block quotes Very simple with just an opening "intials tag >" at the beginning of a
    block, and a closing "< initials tag" at the end. This left the block
    to re-flow as required.

    yeah, i've seen that format, too... it was OK but it was still easy to lose parts... oh well... it also has to do with what one is used to, too... just like trying out other software with different key bindings, one can get used to it and become quite proficient...

    )\/(ark

    Always Mount a Scratch Monkey
    Do you manage your own servers? If you are not running an IDS/IPS yer doin' it wrong...
    ... Alexander the Grape... He Concord the world.
    ---
    * Origin: (1:3634/12.73)
  • From mark lewis@1:3634/12.73 to August Abolins on Thu Apr 4 12:18:54 2019

    On 2019 Apr 03 22:48:00, you wrote to me:

    Hello mark!

    This one's for you.

    )\/(ark
    ... I like thick manuals .... they make better doorstops!

    Adjusted quote function to add an extra space after "initials> "

    ok... what's it look like when quoted a second or third time?

    ml>>>> something i said...

    OR

    ml> > > > something i said...

    ??

    )\/(ark

    Always Mount a Scratch Monkey
    Do you manage your own servers? If you are not running an IDS/IPS yer doin' it wrong...
    ... Are you using all your geese? There are geeseless folks in Nigeria!!
    ---
    * Origin: (1:3634/12.73)
  • From August Abolins@2:221/1.58 to mark lewis on Thu Apr 4 20:06:00 2019
    Hello mark!

    ** 04.04.19 - 11:48, mark lewis wrote to August Abolins:

    .... i remember on RIME/PCRelay, the quoting stuff was a lot
    different... most of it was, as i recall, wrapped in boxes with the attribution in the top of the box... i had several that i used at that time... some even had 3D shadows... ANSI was used quite regularly,
    too...

    it was pretty and fairly easy to read but when folks started adding
    all kinds of colors, that took away from being able to concentrate on
    what was being written...

    I remember seeing those on some BBS message areas! It seemed to be a yearning to dress-up the wonderful world of text messaging - some how.

    It never appealed to me. I too felt it as a distraction. The flashing
    ANSI was the worst.


    ..and the whole thing hinges on the use of full and proper FN LN for
    the whole thing to work. I don't think Policy 4 states that real or
    any kind of two-part name with FN LN is even required.

    it is certainly nothing to do with Policy... policy is for the network... not the traffic carried other than commercial and spam/unwanted traffic...

    My bad. I think I was thinking of an echopol somewhere? Or, was it just
    a common expectation in fidonet echo participation via the moderator/
    rules?


    Were you ever a member of Compuserve and the discussion areas?

    i used compuserve for a very little while... never really liked it... especially since it was on a Model 100 with only a 40 character wide
    screen and i think 10 lines tall...

    Outch. 10 lines tall? Messaging would seem totally awkward.

    Compuserve offered a robo-call program that would call up, collect the messages from the areas you were interested in, send off any of your
    messages or email, and disconnect. Then the same program was used to read/edit/compose.


    Regards,
    ../|ug

    --- OpenXP 5.0.36
    * Origin: /|ug's Point, ONT, CANADA (2:221/1.58)
  • From August Abolins@2:221/1.58 to mark lewis on Thu Apr 4 20:15:00 2019
    Hello mark!

    ** 04.04.19 - 12:18, mark lewis wrote to August Abolins:

    Adjusted quote function to add an extra space after "initials> "

    ok... what's it look like when quoted a second or third time?

    something i said...

    OR

    something i said...


    The result above is Quote-Reply. It seems to *remove" the originally
    spaced out "> > > > " that you had. I'd say that's perfectly fine, and efficient.

    Regards,
    ../|ug

    --- OpenXP 5.0.36
    * Origin: /|ug's Point, ONT, CANADA (2:221/1.58)
  • From mark lewis@1:3634/12.73 to August Abolins on Fri Apr 5 00:17:20 2019

    On 2019 Apr 04 20:06:00, you wrote to me:

    ..and the whole thing hinges on the use of full and proper FN LN for
    the whole thing to work. I don't think Policy 4 states that real or
    any kind of two-part name with FN LN is even required.

    it is certainly nothing to do with Policy... policy is for the
    network... not the traffic carried other than commercial and
    spam/unwanted traffic...

    My bad. I think I was thinking of an echopol somewhere? Or, was it
    just a common expectation in fidonet echo participation via the
    moderator/ rules?

    there was an echopol that was written which Z1 rejected quite soundly... at least one other zone did accept it but they only use bits and pieces of it when it suits them... i'm not sure about the other zones, though...

    Were you ever a member of Compuserve and the discussion areas?

    i used compuserve for a very little while... never really liked it...
    especially since it was on a Model 100 with only a 40 character wide
    screen and i think 10 lines tall...

    Outch. 10 lines tall? Messaging would seem totally awkward.

    that and the cost is why i didn't stay any longer than i did...

    Compuserve offered a robo-call program that would call up, collect the messages from the areas you were interested in, send off any of your messages or email, and disconnect. Then the same program was used to read/edit/compose.

    hummm...

    )\/(ark

    Always Mount a Scratch Monkey
    Do you manage your own servers? If you are not running an IDS/IPS yer doin' it wrong...
    ... When will it end? When will the global recoil kick in?
    ---
    * Origin: (1:3634/12.73)
  • From August Abolins@2:221/1.58 to mark lewis on Fri Apr 5 02:19:00 2019
    Hello mark!

    ** 05.04.19 - 00:17, mark lewis wrote to August Abolins:


    Were you ever a member of Compuserve and the discussion areas?

    ..the cost is why i didn't stay any longer than i did...

    Compuserve offered a robo-call program that would call up, collect the AA>> messages from the areas you were interested in, send off any of your
    messages or email, and disconnect. Then the same program was used to
    read/edit/compose.

    hummm...

    That was the *only* way that I ever tolerated using it. The cost per each connection + the per minute rates could add up quickly.

    I tried to limit my use to 4 calls per week, but I kept track of the total minutes my pocket book could bear.

    I loved the pro quality of info from the messages and the helpful
    courteous attitude from other members (unlike what I seem to be
    encountering in another echo at this time.) :(

    The last few days have been quite a whirlwind in learning the ropes of
    opx. Still more to learn. Thanks for your input and comments every now
    and then.

    Regards,
    ../|ug

    --- OpenXP 5.0.36
    * Origin: /|ug's Point, ONT, CANADA (2:221/1.58)