Now that we have "allow8bit 1" as an option in our modern MakeNl configs, how many of you chose not to use it? I.e. not to allow characters above the old ASCII seven bit restriction.

It would be interesting to know where the eight bit option is held back, because obviously it still is, despite the developer's attempt to remove that archaic restriction.

Zone wise, region wise, net wise, hub wise, whatever.

RFC.



..

--- Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; sv-SE; rv:1.9.1.16) Gecko/20101125
* Origin: news://eljaco.se (2:203/2)

Hello Bj�rn,

On Monday May 27 2019 18:07, you wrote to All:

Now that we have "allow8bit 1" as an option in our modern MakeNl
configs, how many of you chose not to use it? I.e. not to allow
characters above the old ASCII seven bit restriction.

I use it.

It would be interesting to know where the eight bit option is held back,

Among others: YOU!

because obviously it still is, despite the developer's attempt to
remove that archaic restriction.

A project called the UTF nodelist has been running for about half a decade in Z2. You have been invited to participate several times, but you declined. You are in a good position being the RC for Scandinavia where sysop names and cities are spelled with non ASCII characters. But you won't play.

So stop whining.

Instead connect to the DAILYUTF file echo (available here) and see what happens.


Cheers, Michiel

--- GoldED+/W32-MSVC 1.1.5-b20170303
* Origin: http://www.vlist.org (2:280/5555)

MvdV> A project called the UTF nodelist has been running for about half a
MvdV> decade in Z2.

Do you seriously believe that people would start using your local UTF nodelist, not supported by any known nodelist to mailer compiler, just to get what we already can get with the present global setup?

You really are in dire need of a big chunk of FTN reality check, Michiel.



..

--- Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; sv-SE; rv:1.9.1.16) Gecko/20101125
* Origin: news://eljaco.se (2:203/2)

MvdV> You are in a good position being the RC for Scandinavia where sysop
MvdV> names and cities are spelled with non ASCII characters. But you won't play.

I know, and as the responsible RC I try to be, I've been trying to play for many years now. And now, finally, all it takes is for Ward to add that elusive "allow8bit 1" to his MakeNl config -- but somehow he still refuses to do that.

And I sense that you have something to do with that with your beloved UTC nodelist that nobody needs.

But my question was most of all directed at all the *Cs not involved with the R28/R29 war going on.



..

--- Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; sv-SE; rv:1.9.1.16) Gecko/20101125
* Origin: news://eljaco.se (2:203/2)

Hello Bj�rn!

27 May 19 18:07, you wrote to All:

Now that we have "allow8bit 1" as an option in our modern MakeNl configs, how many of you chose not to use it? I.e. not to allow characters above the old ASCII seven bit restriction.

It would be interesting to know where the eight bit option is held back, because obviously it still is, despite the developer's attempt to remove that archaic restriction.

Zone wise, region wise, net wise, hub wise, whatever.

That has to wait until we decide what codepage is to be used.

May I propose that every Region uses the codepage, that best fits the
characters used in the region. ;)

The code page name is to be put in the systemname field of the Region host. ;)

There is a Nodelist encoded in UTF-8. Only R28 and R56 have contributed.

Kees

--- GoldED+/LNX 1.1.5--b20180707
* Origin: As for me, all I know is that, I know nothing. (2:280/5003.4)

Hello Bj�rn,

On Monday May 27 2019 19:04, you wrote to me:

MvdV>> A project called the UTF nodelist has been running for about
MvdV>> half a decade in Z2.

Do you seriously believe that people would start using your local
UTF nodelist, not supported by any known nodelist to mailer compiler,

1) It is not a local project. Iy is a Z2 wide project supported by the ZC2,

2) AFAIK any 8 bit transparent nodelist to mailer compiler just compiles it.


Cheers, Michiel

--- GoldED+/W32-MSVC 1.1.5-b20170303
* Origin: http://www.vlist.org (2:280/5555)

Hello Bj�rn!

27 May 19 19:04, you wrote to Michiel van der Vlist:

MvdV>> A project called the UTF nodelist has been running for about half a
MvdV>> decade in Z2.

Do you seriously believe that people would start using your local UTF nodelist, not supported by any known nodelist to mailer compiler, just to get what we already can get with the present global setup?

You really are in dire need of a big chunk of FTN reality check, Michiel.

Just like makenl-ng, the Nodelist compilers don't care.

I have an experimental dailylist where all ae oe and ue in R24 are converted
to the corresponding characters with diaresis. Also the ringel S is taken
care of.

Region 40 names and locations are converted to Hebrew.
Region 42 names and locations are written properly
Region 45, 46 and 50 names and locations are backported to Cyrillic, where
sensible.

It all works, problems are at the presentation layer unless the can handle
UTF-8.

Why have I tried all this, it was a challenge.

It also failed to convince me, that in my environment more than 7 bit encoding
is not worth the trouble. In most cases, when it cannot be presented in
ASCII, I cannot read it anyway.

Kees

--- GoldED+/LNX 1.1.5--b20180707
* Origin: As for me, all I know is that, I know nothing. (2:280/5003.4)

And now, finally, all it takes is for Ward to
add that elusive "allow8bit 1" to his MakeNl config -- but somehow he
still refuses to do that.

For me to refuse that, you probably must've asked it.

I do not recal having received such a request "ever"...

But my question was most of all directed at all the *Cs not involved
with the R28/R29 war going on.

So there's a R28/R29 war going on?

If so it must be the most boring war ever because I'm not aware, neither is RC28 nor RC29 ... Please enlighten us ...

\%/@rd

--- D'Bridge 3.99
* Origin: Do not meddle in the affairs of wizards (2:292/854)

So there's a R28/R29 war going on?

If so it must be the most boring war ever because I'm not aware, neither is RC28 nor RC29 ... Please enlighten us ...

In March 2002 R29 was merged into R28 in the ongoing effort in zone 2 to reduce the number of regions.

Then, 15 years later, October 2017 (almost exactly 30 years after it's original creation), R29 was once again it's own region. From the outside it sure looks like a civil war, where some were seeking independence from the 15yo union. Why? Please enlighten us...

Source:

http://nodehist.fidonet.org.ua/?address=2%3A29%2F0

Thank you Pavel Gulchouck @ 2:463/68 for this fantastic service!



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--- Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; sv-SE; rv:1.9.1.16) Gecko/20101125
* Origin: news://eljaco.se (2:203/2)

That has to wait until we decide what codepage is to be used.

Once upon a time, up in the northernmost part of Europe, there was a constant struggle about what codepage to use. We had PC, Amiga and Mac owners who all pushed for their hardware installed code page.

Eventually we got CP850, and it was the perfect compromise. It had all the characters normally used in Swedish, and most other west European languages, in place. And later on, when Windows came into play, their Amiga-ish encoding also fit perfectly well.

So, what code page do you think would be best?


..

--- Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; sv-SE; rv:1.9.1.16) Gecko/20101125
* Origin: news://eljaco.se (2:203/2)

From the outside
it sure looks like a civil war, where some were seeking independence from the 15yo union. Why? Please enlighten us...

"You" have stated for a fact there is war between R28 and R29. I don't notice it ... Kees and Wilfred are excellent counsels if I need some information, Michiel has assisted me in the IPv6 enabling of this node.

So what are you talking about? What are your verifiable clues there is a state of war?

If you don't have a verifiable clue then keeping quiet is a virtue.

\%/@rd

--- D'Bridge 3.99
* Origin: Do not meddle in the affairs of wizards (2:292/854)

From the outside
it sure looks like a civil war, where some were seeking independence from
the 15yo union. Why? Please enlighten us...

If you don't have a verifiable clue then keeping quiet is a virtue.

On the other hand, when someone *have* a clue, keeping quiet is *not* a virtue.

Feel free to answer this simple question:

Why did you suddenly increase the number of regions, when so many of us (e.g. R20, R21, R22 and R23 merging into the single R20) did our best to reduce it?



..

--- Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; sv-SE; rv:1.9.1.16) Gecko/20101125
* Origin: news://eljaco.se (2:203/2)

Feel free to answer this simple question:

Why did you suddenly increase the number of regions, when so many of
us (e.g. R20, R21, R22 and R23 merging into the single R20) did our best
to reduce it?

Because a request was received to do so.

\%/@rd

--- D'Bridge 3.99
* Origin: Do not meddle in the affairs of wizards (2:292/854)

Hello Bj�rn!

28 May 19 12:36, you wrote to me:

Once upon a time, up in the northernmost part of Europe, there was a constant struggle about what codepage to use. We had PC, Amiga and Mac owners who all pushed for their hardware installed code page.

Eventually we got CP850, and it was the perfect compromise. It had all the characters normally used in Swedish, and most other west European languages, in place. And later on, when Windows came into play, their Amiga-ish encoding also fit perfectly well.

So, what code page do you think would be best?

Your solutions apparently fits the Scandinavian country, but that is not
the majority of Fidonet. The encoding of the of the Nodelist is a matter of
the whole of Fidonet.

For the Whole of Fidonet the least common denominator is still 7bit ascii.
The other side of the spectrum is UTF-8. But fidonet is not tuned to multi-
byte characters.

Kees

--- GoldED+/LNX 1.1.5--b20180707
* Origin: As for me, all I know is that, I know nothing. (2:280/5003.4)

So, what code page do you think would be best?

Your solutions apparently fits the Scandinavian country,

I can only repeat what I wrote in the FIDONEWS echo just a few days ago:

"Ah well, CP 850 is the primary code page and default OEM code page in many countries, including various English-speaking locales (e.g. in the United Kingdom, Ireland, and Canada)."

Are you saying that your country is not included?

Or that it does not include almost all countries in the western world?

Yes, I know that it can't handle Cyrillic, Arabic, Chinese, Korean, Japanese and a lot of other languages, but will you claim that it does not cover the vast majority of countries actively taking part of the international Fidonet?



..

--- Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; sv-SE; rv:1.9.1.16) Gecko/20101125
* Origin: news://eljaco.se (2:203/2)

Hello Bj�rn!

28 May 19 13:32, you wrote to me:

"Ah well, CP 850 is the primary code page and default OEM code page in many countries, including various English-speaking locales (e.g. in the United Kingdom, Ireland, and Canada)."

Are you saying that your country is not included?

I would not know, you are talking about what is customary in the MS world.
I do not know what happens there. As I said, I have used Latin-1 for at least
the last 18 to 20 years.

Or that it does not include almost all countries in the western
world?

Yes, I know that it can't handle Cyrillic, Arabic, Chinese, Korean, Japanese and a lot of other languages, but will you claim that it does

not

cover the vast majority of countries actively taking part of the international Fidonet?

If your favorite code page is so well fitting, why is it not mandatory in
English speaking Fidonet? And if it is not there, why should it be for the
Nodelist.

Kees

--- GoldED+/LNX 1.1.5--b20180707
* Origin: As for me, all I know is that, I know nothing. (2:280/5003.4)

Hello Kees,

On Tuesday May 28 2019 12:55, you wrote to Bj�rn Felten:

Your solutions apparently fits the Scandinavian country, but that is
not the majority of Fidonet. The encoding of the of the Nodelist is a matter of the whole of Fidonet.

And nit just that: CP850 does NOT fit the current majority of Fidonet.

For the Whole of Fidonet the least common denominator is still 7bit ascii. The other side of the spectrum is UTF-8.

So having two sets of nodelists one on each side of the spectrum is a reasonable compromise would you not say?

But fidonet is not tuned to multi- byte characters.

Fidonet is a chraracter encoding agnostic transport medium. It is the presentation layer of the user interface - strictly speaking not part of Fidonet - that has restrictions. The frgree of srestrictions depend on the implementation. Implementatiosn with less restrictions are slowy surfacing.


Cheers, Michiel

--- GoldED+/W32-MSVC 1.1.5-b20170303
* Origin: http://www.vlist.org (2:280/5555)

If your favorite code page is so well fitting, why is it not mandatory

in

English speaking Fidonet?

Who would make it, and how? And why? The code page is all about presentation. Fidonet is a network. As such it does not care shit what data it transports. Net neutrality has always been important for Fidonet, the network.

I know that Fidonet is usually confused with the mail that it transports. Exactly like Internet is confused with the WWW.

Now it's too late to teach everyone the difference and how the OSI layer works, because nobody cares any more. All that they, save for a few remaining hardcore techies, care about is how what they receive is presented.



..

--- Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; sv-SE; rv:1.9.1.16) Gecko/20101125
* Origin: news://eljaco.se (2:203/2)

Hello Bj�rn!

28 May 19 14:36, you wrote to me:

If your favorite code page is so well fitting, why is it not
mandatory in
English speaking Fidonet?

Who would make it, and how? And why? The code page is all about presentation. Fidonet is a network. As such it does not care shit what data it transports. Net neutrality has always been important for Fidonet, the network.

I know that Fidonet is technology and does not care what it transports,
but when using the same encodings for different presentatios, without
indicating what encoding is used, it is useless. When I connect to R50
echo and ignore the codepage, I get a lot of rubbish on my screen.
There is help, there is information in the message, that tells me how
to convert the message to readable glyphs. Not so in the Nodelist.

I know that Fidonet is usually confused with the mail that it transports. Exactly like Internet is confused with the WWW.

Now it's too late to teach everyone the difference and how the OSI layer works, because nobody cares any more. All that they, save for a few remaining hardcore techies, care about is how what they receive is presented.

All great words, but it does not change the fact, that the presentation
layer has to present the same characters for all users. You either use
an encoding that encompasses all characters, or you have consensus on
how a subset is encoded. If it is neccessary to define a codepage,
existing or new to not turn Fidonet into a Tower of Babel, so be it,
then that has to become a part of Fidonet ftn technology.

If all that is required to satisfy the proper writing of your calling name,
others may question if it is worth te effeort.

In your case it is about Bj�rn, Bjorn, Bjoern and Bj?rn. That is peanuts to
what the sysops in the eastern countries have to enjure.


Kees

--- GoldED+/LNX 1.1.5--b20180707
* Origin: As for me, all I know is that, I know nothing. (2:280/5003.4)

That is peanuts to what the sysops in the eastern countries have to

enjure.

So you are too joining Michiel's quest for the Russian sysops?

Do you really think they haven't already make substantial contributions to the Fidonet, using Latin characters? From my horizon I see a lot of that, without trying to get Cyrillic characters into the international Fidonet community. YMMV...



..

--- Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; sv-SE; rv:1.9.1.16) Gecko/20101125
* Origin: news://eljaco.se (2:203/2)

Hello Bj�rn,

On Monday May 27 2019 19:27, you wrote to me:

MvdV>> You are in a good position being the RC for Scandinavia where
MvdV>> sysop names and cities are spelled with non ASCII characters.
MvdV>> But you won't play.

I know, and as the responsible RC I try to be, I've been trying to
play for many years now.

You have been trying to order a dish that is not on the menu.

And now, finally, all it takes is for Ward to add that elusive
"allow8bit 1" to his MakeNl config -- but somehow he still refuses to
do that.

Ward is running a MakeNl config with "allow8bit 1". Just not the way you want. Presently there are two flavours of nodelists distributed by the ZC2. There is the classic ASCII only flavour for those who can not or do not want to deal with non-ASCII in the nodelist. The other one is the UTF-8 version. It provides an equal opportunity for all Fidonet participants to have their data in their native language and native character set in the nodelist.

A CP850 version for the Western World only is not on the menu.

So you can either play along and join the UFT-8 nodelist project, or keep sulking and remain empty handed.

Oh c'mon don't be so pig headed. Just join the UTF-8 project. In the unlikely case that you need any help, I am sure you can find my Fidonews articles where I documented it.

And I sense that you have something to do with that with your
beloved UTC nodelist that nobody needs.

Your antenna is misaligned.

But my question was most of all directed at all the *Cs not
involved with the R28/R29 war going on.

There is no link between the UTF-8 nodelist project and any presumed 28/R29 war.


Cheers, Michiel

--- GoldED+/W32-MSVC 1.1.5-b20170303
* Origin: http://www.vlist.org (2:280/5555)

MvdV> Ward is running a MakeNl config with "allow8bit 1".

And you know this for a fact? How? To me he told me that he never heard about it before I brought it to his attention. Once again.

Alas, we'll see in the next nodelist where I once again am trying it, after having tried it for three years with my 2:203/6 entry:

http://nodehist.fidonet.org.ua/?address=2%3A203%2F6

Once again many thanks to Pavel Gulchouck 2:463/68

If my 2:203/208 is flagged ;E we know if you speak the truth.


..

--- Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; sv-SE; rv:1.9.1.16) Gecko/20101125
* Origin: news://eljaco.se (2:203/2)

If my 2:203/208 is flagged ;E we know if you speak the truth.

Correction: if it has some question marks instead of the proper characters I submitted in it.




..

--- Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; sv-SE; rv:1.9.1.16) Gecko/20101125
* Origin: news://eljaco.se (2:203/2)

http://nodehist.fidonet.org.ua/?address=2%3A203%2F6

Once again many thanks to Pavel Gulchouck 2:463/68

Do you have relatives from Dutch origin?

\%/@rd

--- D'Bridge 3.99
* Origin: Do not meddle in the affairs of wizards (2:292/854)

Hello Bj�rn,

On Tuesday May 28 2019 13:32, you wrote to Kees van Eeten:

Are you saying that your country is not included?

Some characters are missing. The concatenated 'ij' that takes the place of the 'y' in the Dutch alfabet is missing in CP850. Pi is missing. The Euro sign is missing.

Or that it does not include almost all countries in the western world?

"Western wold" is a bit vague. Does that include Poland? I'd say yes, as it is part of the EU. The Polish accented 'c' is missing. Is Greece part of the western world. It is part of the EU. Many greek characters are missing in CP850.

Yes, I know that it can't handle Cyrillic, Arabic, Chinese, Korean, Japanese and a lot of other languages,

Arabic, Chinese, Korean an those lots of others are not much of a problem as there aren't any Fdionet participant with that as theior native language. Not any more anyway.

but will you claim that it does not cover the vast majority of
countries actively taking part of the international Fidonet?

It is not the number of countries that matters, but rather the number of participant. That Cyrillic is not covered and claiming that is not a problem is an insult towards our fellow Fidoians in the East.


Cheers, Michiel

--- GoldED+/W32-MSVC 1.1.5-b20170303
* Origin: http://www.vlist.org (2:280/5555)

MvdV> That Cyrillic is not covered and claiming that is not a problem is an
MvdV> insult towards our fellow Fidoians in the East.

Here we go again. Who made you the spokesperson for the Russians?


..

--- Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; sv-SE; rv:1.9.1.16) Gecko/20101125
* Origin: news://eljaco.se (2:203/2)

Hello Bj�rn,

On Tuesday May 28 2019 16:18, you wrote to me:

MvdV>> Ward is running a MakeNl config with "allow8bit 1".

And you know this for a fact?

Yes.

How?

Every day, around 00:14 my local time, I receive a nodelist from Ward that has bytes with the highest bit set.

To me he told me that he never heard about it before I brought it to
his attention. Once again.

No my problem.

Alas, we'll see in the next nodelist where I once again am trying
it, after having tried it for three years with my 2:203/6 entry:

Perhaps you are not following the proper procedure? IIRC I have explained the proper procedure in a Fidonews article. My memory is notoriously inreliable...


Cheers, Michiel

--- GoldED+/W32-MSVC 1.1.5-b20170303
* Origin: http://www.vlist.org (2:280/5555)

Hello Bjrn Felten!

28 May 19 22:39:59, Bjrn Felten wrote to Michiel van der Vlist:

MvdV>> That Cyrillic is not covered and claiming that is not a problem is an
MvdV>> insult towards our fellow Fidoians in the East.

Here we go again. Who made you the spokesperson for the Russians?

����⨭.


Michiel


--- goAtEd-windows/386 1.0.5-154-a1826692
* Origin: (2:280/5555)

Hello Bjorn,

So, what code page do you think would be best?

Your solutions apparently fits the Scandinavian country,

And all other countries using CP850.

I can only repeat what I wrote in the FIDONEWS echo just a few days ago:

"Ah well, CP 850 is the primary code page and default OEM code page
in many countries, including various English-speaking locales (e.g. in
the United Kingdom, Ireland, and Canada)."

That started when Windiows 3.1 came in, somerwhere around 1989.
Before that many DOS systems still used CP437,
and even today UniCorn BBS at Dos 5 is still CP437.
At that time starting in 1991 it was strictly forbidden to use High ASCII, i.e. characters above 128 in almost every Echo Mail message Area.
Indeed 7 bit ASCII was and still is the most common denominator.
Since 1987 Acorn RISC OS machines use Latin 1.
So when I want to read High ASSCII in the correct way I had to use the BBS machine in stead of de RISC OS Point system.
Or change the charset at the RiscPC to IBM ;-(.

Are you saying that your country is not included?
Or that it does not include almost all countries in the western world?

CP850 is NOT covering all connected systems worldwide.

Yes, I know that it can't handle Cyrillic, Arabic, Chinese, Korean, Japanese and a lot of other languages, but will you claim that it does
not cover the vast majority of countries actively taking part of the international Fidonet?

As I cant't read these languages, I still do not use their codepages.
For me High Ascii is most of the time garbage, and only the Next key is
my way out. You can say it is spam ;-(.

Henri.

---
* Origin: Connectivity is the Future; UniCorn BBS 31 26 4425506 (2:280/1208)

Hello Bjorn,

In March 2002 R29 was merged into R28 in the ongoing effort in zone 2
to reduce the number of regions.
Then, 15 years later, October 2017 (almost exactly 30 years after
it's original creation), R29 was once again it's own region.
From the outside it sure looks like a civil war, where some were seeking independence from the 15yo union. Why? Please enlighten us...

If I am informed well, R29 wantend to have MOB nodes in their segment,
but the then current RC did not want to insert them as they were not connectable by others, so should have the PVT flag,
or better moved to a point list, as they have the connectivity of a Point.
To overcome this, a new RC29 was created to get the new MOB nodes listed. Strictly these MOB nodes are not official NodeList compliant to FTSC documents as someone wrote:
-- non Pvt node has no connect info --
That's the only reason this split took place, and every body happy again.
A remarkably fact is that there are currently no R29 MOB nodes in the
FidoNet NodeList.

Henri.

---
* Origin: Computing Apart Together (2:280/1208)

If I am informed well, R29 wantend to have MOB nodes in their segment,
but the then current RC did not want to insert them as they were not connectable by others, so should have the PVT flag,
or better moved to a point list, as they have the connectivity of a

Point.

To overcome this, a new RC29 was created to get the new MOB nodes listed. Strictly these MOB nodes are not official NodeList compliant to FTSC documents

as someone wrote:
-- non Pvt node has no connect info --
That's the only reason this split took place, and every body happy again. A remarkably fact is that there are currently no R29 MOB nodes in the FidoNet NodeList.

Thanks a million Henri for this information -- that Ward for some odd reason refused to give us.



..

--- Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; sv-SE; rv:1.9.1.16) Gecko/20101125
* Origin: news://eljaco.se (2:203/2)

Thanks a million Henri for this information -- that Ward for some odd reason refused to give us.

And Henri was notoriously wrong ... hearing drums but missing a few beats...

\%/@rd

--- D'Bridge 3.99
* Origin: Do not meddle in the affairs of wizards (2:292/854)

Thanks a million Henri for this information -- that Ward for some odd
reason refused to give us.

And Henri was notoriously wrong ... hearing drums but missing a few beats...

And as usual, feel free to enlighten us and correct Henri's version of it. Don't hold back, give it to us!

Give us the true story about how the MOB listed nodes didn't make it into the R28 segment, but you had to revive the old R29 segment in order to get them included in the nodelist.




..

--- Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; sv-SE; rv:1.9.1.16) Gecko/20101125
* Origin: news://eljaco.se (2:203/2)

On 31/05/2019 21:19, 2:203/2 wrote:

And Henri was notoriously wrong ... hearing drums but missing a few
beats...

And as usual, feel free to enlighten us and correct Henri's version
of it. Don't hold back, give it to us!

Give us the true story about how the MOB listed nodes didn't make it into the R28 segment, but you had to revive the old R29 segment in order to get them included in the nodelist.

Please enlighten a confused colonial - WTF is a "MOB listed node"?

--

Gang warily
David

--- Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 6.1; rv:31.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/31.8.0
* Origin: Bucca, Qld, Australia (3:640/305)

On 2019 Jun 01 10:56:50, you wrote to Bj�rn Felten:

Please enlighten a confused colonial - WTF is a "MOB listed node"?

MOBile -- a node in a FTN that is operated from a MOBile device.

)\/(ark

Always Mount a Scratch Monkey
Do you manage your own servers? If you are not running an IDS/IPS yer doin' it wrong...
... And now, the maraschino cherry fondue. Now, this is extremely nasty.
---
* Origin: (1:3634/12.73)

On 1/06/2019 13:43, mark lewis -> David Drummond wrote:

Please enlighten a confused colonial - WTF is a "MOB listed node"?

MOBile -- a node in a FTN that is operated from a MOBile device.

Oh! I didn't realise we entertained that method...

--

Gang warily
David

--- Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 6.1; rv:31.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/31.8.0
* Origin: Bucca, Qld, Australia (3:640/305)

Hi! David,

On 06/01/2019 04:15 PM, you wrote mark lewis:

Please enlighten a confused colonial - WTF is a "MOB listed node"?

MOBile -- a node in a FTN that is operated from a MOBile device.

Oh! I didn't realise we entertained that method...

I haven't followed this closely enough but I think it's being tested in Z2, only. As I think about it now, my mind is unraveling spirally in consideration of whether such nodes are points or private nodes. I forget how they're playing it.

Cheers,
Paul.

--- Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Linux i686; rv:31.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/31.4.0
* Origin: If you can't say it in 50 characters, then don't blo

MOBile -- a node in a FTN that is operated from a MOBile device.

Oh! I didn't realise we entertained that method...

I haven't followed this closely enough but I think it's being tested in Z2, only. As I think about it now, my mind is unraveling spirally in consideration of whether such nodes are points or private nodes. I

forget

how they're playing it.

It's mainly used by some, with now the zone wars gone, to fight some other type of war and failing to notice the potential. Mainly people with a poolitical axe to grind with me and grabbing every opportubity to do so...

Ward
--- AfterShock/Android 1.6.8
* Origin: Baby-Glacier (2:292/854.1)

Hi! Ward,

On 06/01/2019 06:32 PM, yo wrote:

MOBile -- a node in a FTN that is operated from a MOBile device.

Oh! I didn't realise we entertained that method...

I haven't followed this closely enough but I think it's being
tested in Z2, only. As I think about it now, my mind is unraveling
spirally in consideration of whether such nodes are points or
private nodes. I forget how they're playing it.

It's mainly used by some, with now the zone wars gone, to fight some
other type of war and failing to notice the potential. Mainly people
with a poolitical axe to grind with me and grabbing every opportubity to do so...

My reply attempted two things: to allay his fear that there was something of import that had happened in zone 3 without him being aware; and, an expression of guilt that I didn't know enough to really help him.

Is the explanation is in the Z2 nodelist version preamble?

Cheers,
Paul.

--- Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Linux i686; rv:31.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/31.4.0
* Origin: I only started a BBS to save on the phone bill. (3:640/1384.125)

Paul,

Is the explanation is in the Z2 nodelist version preamble?

Good question.

There is at least one developer working on a true mobile package on an Android platform. The end idea somewhere is that nodes WILL be mobile, that in the not-forseeable future PC-type computers will be a thing of the past.

The technology at this moment is immature still but I refuse to reject it.

"MOB" is an idea that needs to grow and given the space to develop (or crash). We do have some people whom can be called the nodelist-police or the nitt-pickers, the comma-screwers, the keyboard warriors who know it all grabbing whatever excuse to sound important.

It's because of them that I adopted my approach that I will reply twice in a thread and then drop it. After 2 cycles it serves no purpose to continue.

Little known, many many moons ago when some people hesitantly mentioned "IP" there was a ZC vehemently arguing against, that Fido had to stay virgin-dedicated to PSTN... Bob Satti, he tried to strangle IP and I told him to go take a hike. Introduced it into the Z2-nodelist. I got tonnes of hate meaages because of that. Later when Pvt/Unpublished was entered (first in Z2 again) the mob called for my impeachment because it was not in-line with what the holy council had decided somewhere in the 1980-ies.

Then I was dismayed to find a message by Moufarrege thanking Bob Satti for the wisdom to allow IP in the nodelist ... heck, he hated it and got the thing shoved down his throat kicking and screaming ...

Paul, on the surface things are not always what they seem in reality.

We've now got one of the most competent people in the ZC chair in Z1 ... you should've seen how he was tarred and feathered by someone in the closed FTSC conference ... Maybe it comes with the job ...

One of the things which I practice when someone wants to push something across my desk is to deal with it in netmail. If you do it in echomail then you're just showing-off or wielding a political battle-axe and it is "no" from the start.

\%/@rd

--- D'Bridge 3.99
* Origin: Do not meddle in the affairs of wizards (2:292/854)

Hello Ward,

There is at least one developer working on a true mobile package on an Android platform.

Good idea.

The end idea somewhere is that nodes WILL be mobile,
that in the not-forseeable future PC-type computers will be a thing of
the past.

Also ok.

The technology at this moment is immature still but I refuse to reject
it.

Of course new technology may have a chance.

"MOB" is an idea that needs to grow and given the space to develop (or crash).

I donot see what the flag U,MOB services as a purpose?
With IP is does not matter where the system actually operates.
I.e. the location does not matter anymore as once in de POTS time was.
When there is no connect info,
no one can drop Direct Crash NetMail at such MOB systems.
I.e. it should be flagged and listed as PVT.
If it has a diable phonenumber or an connectable ip-adres or hostname,
it is reachable, and only then no PVT flag needed.
Those connect info should be stable everywhere the system moves too.
I.e. in a camper or on a ship moving around the world.
It does not matter what kind of transmission (WiFi/3G/4G/satellite) is used. The only wish is, be contactable at least during ZMH.
The fact that the system is Mobile does not schoove that ZMH duty away.
It is de basis of all FTN sytems everywhere.

We do have some people whom can be called the nodelist-police or
the nitt-pickers, the comma-screwers, the keyboard warriors who know it
all grabbing whatever excuse to sound important.

The only point of those people is to keep de NodeList as clean as possible.
Are you happy when you want to call someone and (s)he does not tell you the number changed?

It's because of them that I adopted my approach that I will reply twice
in a thread and then drop it. After 2 cycles it serves no purpose to continue.

There is no reason why it should not be discussed in public.

Little known, many many moons ago when some people hesitantly mentioned "IP" there was a ZC vehemently arguing against, that Fido had to stay virgin-dedicated to PSTN... Bob Satti, he tried to strangle IP and I
told him to go take a hike. Introduced it into the Z2-nodelist. I got tonnes of hate meaages because of that. Later when Pvt/Unpublished was entered (first in Z2 again) the mob called for my impeachment because it was not in-line with what the holy council had decided somewhere in the 1980-ies.

The same happened when ISDN was introduced.
It is and always was an utopy to try to connect to every system in de NodeList,
because there are often imcompatible connection methods.
But why not try to get as much compatability as possible?

Henri.

---
* Origin: Computing Apart Together (2:280/1208)

Hello Ward,

MOBile -- a node in a FTN that is operated from a MOBile device.

Oh! I didn't realise we entertained that method...

@Paul; Look for the U,MOB flag.

@Ward; What have I to do different than normal to connect to such a Node?
Is there already a FTSC proposal?
I am not against new techniques,
but only want to know how to get in contact if I wanted to.
Now the only way is routed NetMail, not Direct Crashable private mail.

I haven't followed this closely enough but I think it's being tested in PQ>> Z2, only. As I think about it now, my mind is unraveling spirally in
consideration of whether such nodes are points or private nodes.
I forget how they're playing it.

It seems a bit secret, because there is no connection info listed ;-(.

It's mainly used by some, with now the zone wars gone, to fight some
other type of war

That's your coloured opinion.

and failing to notice the potential.

Of course it can have potential,
but why are all that U,MOB nodes gone in R29?
At least that gives daubts ;-(.

Mainly people with a poolitical axe to grind with me

It has nothing to do with politics or you personal,
but only technical reasons.
The pure technical remark from another sysop is very claer:
-- Non Pvt node has no connect info --

and grabbing every opportubity to do so...

You are still too easyally annoyed, i.e. to long toes?

--- AfterShock/Android 1.6.8

Ah, you are using thet Mobile software too.
Is it an idea to write something about it in the FidoNews?
If you want to promote that new technic, it should be made more public.

* Origin: Baby-Glacier (2:292/854.1)

Thank you for answering a private netmail, while you were at your boat.
That opens perspectives for others to start going FTN mobile too, I hope.
There are more traveling sysops with a pointsystem.

Henri.

---
* Origin: Computing Apart Together (2:280/1208)

On 1/06/2019 19:01, Paul Quinn -> Ward Dossche wrote:

It's mainly used by some, with now the zone wars gone, to fight some
other type of war and failing to notice the potential. Mainly people
with a poolitical axe to grind with me and grabbing every opportubity to
do so...

My reply attempted two things: to allay his fear that there was
something of import that had happened in zone 3 without him being aware; and, an expression of guilt that I didn't know enough to really help him.

I wasn't afraid that I'd missed out on something (I don't have the mobile bandwidth/volume to support a node, and no plan to increase it) rather I just hadn't thought of doing FIDONET by mobile.

--

Gang warily
David

--- Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 6.1; rv:31.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/31.8.0
* Origin: Bucca, Qld, Australia (3:640/305)

Hi! Henri,

On 02 Jun 19 01:53, you wrote to Ward Dossche:

_ml_>>>>> MOBile -- a node in a FTN that is operated from a MOBile

device.

Oh! I didn't realise we entertained that method...

@Paul; Look for the U,MOB flag.

I already had an saw nothing. At your prompting I tried again on this morning's Z2 daily: 2x nodes & 2x 'pvt' listings. No apparent contact info... it could be hiding. Thank you.

Cheers,
Paul.

... I don't work here. I'm a consultant.
--- GoldED+/LNX 1.1.5-b20130515
* Origin: Quinn's Rock - Live from Paul's Xubuntu desktop! (3:640/1384)

Hi! David,

On 02 Jun 19 13:28, you wrote to me:

I wasn't afraid that I'd missed out on something (I don't have the
mobile bandwidth/volume to support a node, and no plan to increase it) rather I just hadn't thought of doing FIDONET by mobile.

Weird shit, hey.

Cheers,
Paul.

... Shiny. Let's be bad guys...
--- GoldED+/LNX 1.1.5-b20130515
* Origin: Quinn's Rock - Live from Paul's Xubuntu desktop! (3:640/1384)

I just hadn't thought of doing FIDONET by mobile.

It's limited in possibilities at the moment but possible. There are 2 packages that run on Android doing the trick. My 2:292/854.1 is one on a tablet. It also runs from a phone but I guess the screens are very tiny then.

\%/@rd

--- D'Bridge 3.99
* Origin: Do not meddle in the affairs of wizards (2:292/854)

Paul,

I already had an saw nothing. At your prompting I tried again on this morning's Z2 daily: 2x nodes & 2x 'pvt' listings. No apparent contact info... it could be hiding. Thank you.

Kees Van Eeten has an interesting story about nodes in the nodelist ... "with" contact info ... which collapsed years ago, still in the nodelist, cannot be contacted. Nobody seems to care ... Henri Derksen doesn't get upset.

He only gets upset about a node without contact info, whom he didn't know about in the first place until someone else with an axe to grind started stirring shit, a node Henri never would poll direct in the first place.
When netmailing me even Henri also routes via his host at 2:280/5003 ...

Politics, Paul .... and the desire to pee against a tall enough tree. He's not the only one. In the meantime Fidonet keeps fading because of fundamentalism.

Hot day today. I'm making myself scarce.

\%/@rd

--- D'Bridge 3.99
* Origin: Do not meddle in the affairs of wizards (2:292/854)

Politics, Paul .... and the desire to pee against a tall enough tree.
He's not the only one. In the meantime Fidonet keeps fading because of fundamentalism.

You are *not* paranoid, Ward. They really *are* out there to get you.



..

--- Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; sv-SE; rv:1.9.1.16) Gecko/20101125
* Origin: news://eljaco.se (2:203/2)

Hi! Ward,

On 02 Jun 19 11:02, you wrote to me:

Hot day today. I'm making myself scarce.

We had a warmer than usual day. Late autumn/early winter, so temps still fluctuate. 21C max; morning forecast for 12C. Tue, Wed AM temps forecast for single digit. Yikes!

Cheers,
Paul.

... Emergency repair procedure #1: Kick it.
--- GoldED+/LNX 1.1.5-b20130515
* Origin: Quinn's Rock - Live from Paul's Xubuntu desktop! (3:640/1384)

Ward,

Are there any real benefits to running it on a tablet other than convience?

Terry

On Jun 02, 2019 11:00am, Ward Dossche wrote to David Drummond:

I just hadn't thought of doing FIDONET by mobile.

It's limited in possibilities at the moment but possible. There are 2 packages that run on Android doing the trick. My 2:292/854.1 is one on
a tablet. It also runs from a phone but I guess the screens are very
tiny then.

\%/@rd

--- D'Bridge 3.99
* Origin: Do not meddle in the affairs of wizards (2:292/854)

Terry - 3:640/1231 (tfb-bbs.org)

... Platinum Xpress & Wildcat!..... Nice!!!!
--- Platinum Xpress/Win/WINServer v7.0
* Origin: The File Bank BBS! (3:640/1321)

Hi Terry,

Are there any real benefits to running it on a tablet other than convience?

I run it on my phone for some time now, i found it a lot easy to run it on a phone then on a PC as almost everthing works now on a phone and i use my PC less and less then before....

Greetings,

Rudi

--- BBBS/Li6 v4.10 Toy-4
* Origin: X-TReMe BBS (2:292/140)

Terry,

Are there any real benefits to running it on a tablet other than
convience?

The size of the screen ... readability.

\%/@rd

--- D'Bridge 3.99
* Origin: Do not meddle in the affairs of wizards (2:292/854)

Rudi,

I run it on my phone for some time now, i found it a lot easy to run it
on a phone then on a PC as almost everthing works now on a phone and i
use my PC less and less then before....

You cannot run Aftershock on a PC.

\%/@rd

--- D'Bridge 3.99
* Origin: Do not meddle in the affairs of wizards (2:292/854)

Hi Rudi,

I should have been more specific.

1. So does it connect to a hub and download mail?

2. If so, is mail stored on the phone?

3. What doesn't work?

I run a Wildcat BBS and using a tablet (android or apple) to login and read / reply mail is fine but it's not so good with a smart phone due to the screen resolution. If there were specific screens for phones it would help.

Thanks,

Terry

On Jun 02, 2019 03:18pm, Rudi Timmermans wrote to TERRY ROATI:

Hi Terry,

Are there any real benefits to running it on a tablet other than
convience?

I run it on my phone for some time now, i found it a lot easy to run it
on a phone then on a PC as almost everthing works now on a phone and i
use my PC less and less then before....

Greetings,

Rudi

--- BBBS/Li6 v4.10 Toy-4
* Origin: X-TReMe BBS (2:292/140)

Terry - 3:640/1231 (tfb-bbs.org)

... Platinum Xpress & Wildcat!..... Nice!!!!
--- Platinum Xpress/Win/WINServer v7.0
* Origin: The File Bank BBS! (3:640/1321)

Hi Ward,

You cannot run Aftershock on a PC.

You are wrong you can run it with an Android emulator on a PC there are emulators. Like for example Anbox....

I dont mean on a PC i mean i use my PC less and use my Phone more then my PC.

Rudi

--- BBBS/Li6 v4.10 Toy-4
* Origin: X-TReMe BBS (2:292/140)

Hi Terry,

1. So does it connect to a hub and download mail?

Yes it do.

2. If so, is mail stored on the phone?

Yes it store the echomail/netmail into a sql database on your phone or sd card.

3. What doesn't work?

For now the incomming part is limit as for example incomming would not toss automatic but only on next poll, but this would be change after new updates comming out.

You can not add shedule poll and need to poll manual on your hub.

This are the 2 main stuff that's not completed yet.

When you poll manual everything works like it should be.

Rudi

--- BBBS/Li6 v4.10 Toy-4
* Origin: X-TReMe BBS (2:292/140)

Rudi,

You are wrong you can run it with an Android emulator on a PC there are emulators. Like for example Anbox....

I was under the distinct impression it couldn't be done, but when you say so, I'll believe it.

\%/@rd

--- D'Bridge 3.99
* Origin: Do not meddle in the affairs of wizards (2:292/854)

Appreciate the update, sounds perfect for points and countries / people who can't afford a PC.

On Jun 03, 2019 06:57am, Rudi Timmermans wrote to TERRY ROATI:

Hi Terry,

1. So does it connect to a hub and download mail?

Yes it do.

2. If so, is mail stored on the phone?

Yes it store the echomail/netmail into a sql database on your phone or
sd card.

3. What doesn't work?

For now the incomming part is limit as for example incomming would not toss automatic but only on next poll, but this would be change after
new updates comming out.

You can not add shedule poll and need to poll manual on your hub.

This are the 2 main stuff that's not completed yet.

When you poll manual everything works like it should be.

Rudi

--- BBBS/Li6 v4.10 Toy-4
* Origin: X-TReMe BBS (2:292/140)

... Platinum Xpress & Wildcat!..... Nice!!!!
--- Platinum Xpress/Win/WINServer v7.0
* Origin: The File Bank BBS! (3:640/1321)

HI Terry,

Appreciate the update, sounds perfect for points and countries / people who can't afford a PC.

Well it can also use as a node like i do for example.

But it's indeed a verry nice app. ;)

Rudi

--- BBBS/Li6 v4.10 Toy-4
* Origin: X-TReMe BBS (2:292/140)

Rudi,

What is the minimum version of android it requires?

I think I have an old android tablet I may try it on.

Where do I get the App.

Thanks.

Terry

On Jun 03, 2019 11:47am, Rudi Timmermans wrote to TERRY ROATI:

HI Terry,

Appreciate the update, sounds perfect for points and countries / people
who
can't afford a PC.

Well it can also use as a node like i do for example.

But it's indeed a verry nice app. ;)

Rudi

--- BBBS/Li6 v4.10 Toy-4
* Origin: X-TReMe BBS (2:292/140)

Terry - 3:640/1231 (tfb-bbs.org)

... Platinum Xpress & Wildcat!..... Nice!!!!
--- Platinum Xpress/Win/WINServer v7.0
* Origin: The File Bank BBS! (3:640/1321)

Hi Terry,

I'm Anatoly his beta tester of AfterShock app.

What is the minimum version of android it requires?

Well it should work from 2.3 and up ...

I think I have an old android tablet I may try it on.

Cool ;)

Where do I get the App.

Here:

https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.asvcorp.aftershock&hl=en

Greetings,

Rudi

--- BBBS/Li6 v4.10 Toy-4
* Origin: X-TReMe BBS (2:292/140)

Hello Ward,

I already had an saw nothing. At your prompting I tried again on this PQ>> morning's Z2 daily: 2x nodes & 2x 'pvt' listings. No apparent contact PQ>> info... it could be hiding. Thank you.

Kees Van Eeten has an interesting story about nodes in the nodelist ... "with" contact info ... which collapsed years ago, still in the
nodelist, cannot be contacted.

I follow all these messages about that subject.

Nobody seems to care ...

The ones who care, are not the *C's who have the power to correct it.

Henri Derksen doesn't get upset.

Of course I do not like that garbage in de NodeList.
It does not help when I write about it, because I am just a leaf node,
and the words from a host like Kees van Eeten have more power.
And besides that, there are at least 2 more participants wining about it.
Why should I also write about it? It does not give new info already present.

He only gets upset about a node without contact info,

Your horizon about what I get upset of is to small.
I donot tell you all the items I do not like, or are against the rules.
Trying to get everything corrected at the same time does not get place.

whom he didn't know about in the first place

Wrong assumption.

until someone else with an axe to grind started stirring shit,

Violation NodeList rules is indeed shit, not the messenger who reports it.
And the name of that messenger should not make a difference.

a node Henri never would poll direct in the first place.

That doesnot matter, every listed node should be contactable during ZMH, excepted the ones who are listed Hold or Down.

But at this moment I have some technical issues about connecting, routing and crashing, because my POTS is not usable with a defect RS232 card inn the PC, and at the IP machine, I only have a mailer, not a maileditor, tosser, scanner etc. Both systems are under construction now, that's why I routed that private netmail in stead of direct crashing.

When netmailing me even Henri also routes via his host at 2:280/5003 ...

I did not know crashing was mandatory?
The writer declares how the message will be delivered,
i.e. direct, crash, routed, or only during ZMH, or even on hold.
The receiver has no say in it, simple he?
If you really wanted it crash, you also could have asked it.
But I am fairly sure my Host does not read netmail from and to others he is not part of the sender or receiver.

Politics,

Keeping the nodelist clean and conform the rules has nothing to do with politics, but are only technical.

Hot day today. I'm making myself scarce.

Indeed hot outside.
In my home it is relatively cool, i.e. 25.7 oC in this computerroom.
Only when it is more than 3 day above 30 oC, inside temps are the same as outside. So good isolation makes getting the same temp much slower.

I went outside with a hat to make a walk alongside inland tugs in Vianen.
It's not good to stay the whole day inside the house, before or behind computers ;-).
Nowadays I have to walk or cycle at least 30 minutes every day.

Henri.

---
* Origin: Default is your fault, take UniCorn BBS (2:280/1208)

Hello David,

I wasn't afraid that I'd missed out on something (I don't have the
mobile bandwidth/volume to support a node, and no plan to increase it)

Let's count.
What I got in 24h at june 2 2019 was only 80 kB EchoMail.
That's very little for both a fixed or a mobile system.

rather I just hadn't thought of doing FIDONET by mobile.

You could think about it when on the move with your lovely pickup camper.
I have choosen to not be connectable on the move when I am sailing,
so no InterNet and no FidoNet on board the ships I sail with and sleep at.

With the information I now have, U,MOB is only possible as a PVT Node
or a Point.
You may think about it.
The package is called AfterShock, but donot ask me the details, as I donot have them. A good search engine can be your friend.

Henri.

---
* Origin: Default is your fault, take UniCorn BBS (2:280/1208)

On 3/06/2019 01:28, Henri Derksen -> David Drummond wrote:

I wasn't afraid that I'd missed out on something (I don't have the
mobile bandwidth/volume to support a node, and no plan to increase it)

Let's count.
What I got in 24h at june 2 2019 was only 80 kB EchoMail.
That's very little for both a fixed or a mobile system.

Much of Australia is NOT covered by mobile connections - and I am inclined to tour those places.

Even here where I live the reception is very poor.

rather I just hadn't thought of doing FIDONET by mobile.

You could think about it when on the move with your lovely pickup camper. I have choosen to not be connectable on the move when I am sailing,
so no InterNet and no FidoNet on board the ships I sail with and sleep

at.

With the information I now have, U,MOB is only possible as a PVT Node
or a Point.
You may think about it.
The package is called AfterShock, but donot ask me the details, as I
donot have them. A good search engine can be your friend.

I had the impression that Aftershock was a message reader, not a full blown FTN node.


--

Gang warily
David

--- Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 6.1; rv:31.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/31.8.0
* Origin: Bucca, Qld, Australia (3:640/305)

Even here where I live the reception is very poor.

Receptions without alcohol are not my thing anyway.

\%/@rd

--- D'Bridge 3.99
* Origin: Do not meddle in the affairs of wizards (2:292/854)

On 6/06/2019 01:50, Ward Dossche -> David Drummond wrote:

Even here where I live the reception is very poor.

Receptions without alcohol are not my thing anyway.

Not been consuming alcohol of late - but I don't think that affects the 4G reception.

--

Gang warily
David

--- Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 6.1; rv:31.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/31.8.0
* Origin: Bucca, Qld, Australia (3:640/305)

02 Jun 19 11:00, you wrote to David Drummond:

I just hadn't thought of doing FIDONET by mobile.

It's limited in possibilities at the moment but possible. There are 2 packages that run on Android doing the trick. My 2:292/854.1 is one on a tablet. It also runs from a phone but I guess the screens are very tiny then.

I've been experimenting with Termux over the weekend. It's a free Ubuntu-like terminal for Android devices, where "apt install" command familiar to Debian and Ubuntu users can be used.

https://termux.com/

"apt install build-essential" will then allow you to build C/C++ programs on your tablet or phone.

You can also run Python 3.7, Python 2.7 and Ruby apps.

apt install python
apt install python2
apt install ruby

"apt install dropbear" then "dropbear" will run an SSH server on the device (listening on port 8022) allowing you to connect to the Termux shell remotely.

With Git and Subversion clients available it's possible to do a source checkout of various common Fido apps.

It turns out BinkD will compile from source in Termux without much trouble.

Building the Husky programs (HPT primarily) takes a bit of patching, but they will eventually build.

Despite its complexity, GoldED+ also builds, though I've not tried running it yet.

With a small patch, timEd will also build.

Whether any of the above is actually usable on a tablet or phone on a daily basis remains to be seen, but it's interesting and fairly remarkable that any of it works at all.

--- GoldED+/BSD 1.1.5-b20180707
* Origin: Blizzard of Ozz, Melbourne, Victoria, Australia (3:633/267)

Hi David,

I've been experimenting with Termux over the weekend. It's a free

Ubuntu-like

terminal for Android devices, where "apt install" command familiar to Debian and Ubuntu users can be used.

https://termux.com/

Nice work ;) But i would prefer to stay with AfterShock for now as this do the thing...

Greetings,

Rudi

--- BBBS/Li6 v4.10 Toy-4
* Origin: X-TReMe BBS (2:292/140)

Hello andrew!

09 Jun 19 23:22, you wrote to Ward Dossche:

I've been experimenting with Termux over the weekend. It's a free Ubuntu-like terminal for Android devices, where "apt install" command familiar to Debian and Ubuntu users can be used.

https://termux.com/

"apt install build-essential" will then allow you to build C/C++ programs on your tablet or phone.

Sounds good. My phone is to old ;( Recent Androids seen to have access to
a Linux like development mode as well.

I am still not shure what to do. Buy a Tablet or a new netbook and
dump Win10 in favour of Linux.

Running Linux apps on Windos, as MS is getting ready for, is out of the
question, as a matter of principle.

Kees

--- GoldED+/LNX 1.1.5--b20180707
* Origin: As for me, all I know is that, I know nothing. (2:280/5003.4)

On 06-09-19 23:22, andrew clarke wrote to Ward Dossche <=-

I've been experimenting with Termux over the weekend. It's a free Ubuntu-like terminal for Android devices, where "apt install" command familiar to Debian and Ubuntu users can be used.

https://termux.com/

That's pretty cool. Will be interesting to see what installs and what doesn't.

"apt install build-essential" will then allow you to build C/C++
programs on your tablet or phone.

You can also run Python 3.7, Python 2.7 and Ruby apps.

apt install python
apt install python2
apt install ruby

"apt install dropbear" then "dropbear" will run an SSH server on the device (listening on port 8022) allowing you to connect to the Termux shell remotely.

That will simplify things in some ways.

With Git and Subversion clients available it's possible to do a source checkout of various common Fido apps.

It turns out BinkD will compile from source in Termux without much trouble.

Building the Husky programs (HPT primarily) takes a bit of patching,
but they will eventually build.

Despite its complexity, GoldED+ also builds, though I've not tried
running it yet.

Would be good to have a library of what builds and what doesn't, as well as any
needed patches.

With a small patch, timEd will also build.

Whether any of the above is actually usable on a tablet or phone on a daily basis remains to be seen, but it's interesting and fairly
remarkable that any of it works at all.

Time will tell, but certainly interesting.


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