• Morphos: Is it a copy of another os?

    From Stephen Walsh@39:901/280 to All on Sun Apr 24 17:09:05 2011
    Hello everybody.


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    = COMP.SYS.AMIGA.MORPHOS () ===================================================
    Msg : 8 of 8
    From : Tin Lunchbox <no@spam.thx> 23 Apr 11 08:26:34
    To :
    Subj : Former Amiga Engineer Defends his Allegation that MorphOS includes "Sto =============================================================================== Subject: Former Amiga Engineer Defends his Allegation that MorphOS includes "Stolen Code"

    Dave Haynie is a such an important figure in the development of the
    Amiga, the 68k classic computer. It was from the community and third
    party developers of the Amiga whence MorphOS came. Jay Miner was the
    King on the Amiga chessboard, and Dave Haynie is perhaps one of the
    knights.

    He deserves much respect, a lot for the 3000 especially, but not so
    much as to overlook unsubstantiated, unexplained allegations of code
    theft against "the MorphOS people." He has suggested this before more
    than once, and made the allegation most recently on 17 April on
    Amigaworld.net.

    Prompted by a MorphOS team member, Dave finally came out and said the
    basis of his suspicions. What had been whispers and pieces he put it
    on the table finally. Dave Haynie wrote on Amigaworld.net (thanks Amigaworld.net) 21-Apr-2011 6:43:19:

    "The MorphOS project came from Phase V... after Phase V ended, former
    employees started up BPlan (eg, "Plan B"), who eventually merged with
    a couple folks from Thendic France to form Genesi.

    Now, I do not have direct personal knowledge of all MorphOS sources.
    But back when Phase 5 was working on their "C Exec" and other things,
    starting to re-create AmigaOS themselves in the mid-1990s, I was
    working with Andy Finkel at Amiga Technologies. The Phase 5 guys were
    really after AT to use tome of their stuff (and pay them, natch). Andy
    did a code review of the C Kernel, and found it was copied from
    AmigaOS source code. In fact, even the comments were copied, assembler
    to C.

    Maybe MorphOS is clean, maybe not. Maybe no one actually knows. But
    that's such a transgression, I wouldn't trust anyone involved in Phase
    5, or any code that can be traced back to Phase 5."

    And then on 21-Apr-2011 6:54:30

    "They still don't understand clean room development. If you have seen
    the Amiga source code, you cannot produce a legally separate
    work-alike. So any copied comments are absolute proof that the code is
    dirty. And they're not rejecting my claim, if you go back into those
    linked documents, that the comments were copied.

    Point in fact -- I just don't care about MorphOS. It's not AmigaOS, it
    might as well be Windows for all I care. If you like it, I'm pretty
    certain at this point no new legal entanglements are going to happen.
    If the MorphOS people would like to swear in public that not a line of
    code or comment is copied from the AmigaOS sources or derived from the
    Phase 5 code (fruits of a poisonous tree, in legal terms), I will not
    mention MorphOS again."

    To back up his allegations --if he has done that-- Dave Haynie had to
    talk about what another Amiga knight or bishop or rook Andy Finkel
    confided in him. Dave doesn't claim to have seen anything personally,
    it was what he says former Amiga engineer/software manager Finkel told
    him.

    What can be made of this? It is a better thing to have these
    allegations firm and public. Better than whispers and murmurs, which
    they were previously. The event in question took place long time ago,
    and there was certainly a context and details there, which are
    difficult for us to reconstruct and comprehend now. From various
    things I've read, Phase 5 may or may not have had some Amiga source
    code. But this doesn't mean it hadn't been given to Phase 5 by an
    authorized person, and it does not mean Phase 5 stole it. I disagree
    with Dave Haynie, who goes by the nickname "hazydave," that once one
    has seen source code, one may never produce a legally separate
    work-alike. That is an absolute position Dave takes, not an hazy one.
    I do not think the law can be expressed so simply and so absolutely,
    but I do not know. It would take a complex evaluation and factfinding
    by attornies to make intelligent evaluations about this.

    For me it doesn't cast any doubt on the honesty of any MorphOS
    developer. It is just an allegation by someone who didn't even see any suspicious code himself, only says another saw it. As well, even if
    the allegation were 100% accurate, there might be a good explanation
    for it. As well, that code from well over a decade ago was prior to
    MorphOS, and may or may not have evolved into part of MorphOS. There
    are just too many unknown factors to fault anyone.


    === Cut ===


    Stephen

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  • From Benny Pedersen@39:14/0 to Stephen Walsh on Sat Apr 30 05:02:36 2011
    Hello Stephen!

    24 Apr 2011 17:09, Stephen Walsh wrote to All:

    MorphOS, and may or may not have evolved into part of MorphOS. There
    are just too many unknown factors to fault anyone.
    === Cut ===

    thanks for the forward, shame its was not a1000 that had mmu implemented in exec.library, and later we now have mmu.library implemented servarial years to late.

    as a old c devs i lost intrest in amiga when commodore stopped supporting there developpers, not matter what archs it was for

    my cbm dev number is etd022


    Regards Benny

    ... there can only be one way of life, and it works :)

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  • From Stephen Walsh@39:901/281 to Benny Pedersen on Sun May 1 13:08:39 2011

    On Saturday April 30 2011, Benny Pedersen said to Stephen Walsh:

    thanks for the forward, shame its was not a1000 that had mmu
    implemented in exec.library, and later we now have mmu.library
    implemented servarial years to late.

    Virtual memory wasn't a thing back then like it is now.

    as a old c devs i lost intrest in amiga when commodore stopped
    supporting there developpers, not matter what archs it was for

    The writing was on the wall a long time before they went belly up and
    floated on the top of the bowel.



    -- Stephen --

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